maybe someone wants to chime in with some possible advice/or food for thought.//

You got a lot going on there, but just having a look at your runs, it seems like you never go below a 155 heart rate, and usually hit a 170 or so every run. Unless you max is 230, I would say if you are going to run your way out of bad patches, maybe see what a sub 130HR run looks like? Perhaps train that blow up Ironman pace, just in case you need it one day...(-;

That's my thought too. Seems generally run down, and possibly getting close to overtrained.

Slow down....back down the volume a bit, give yourself some time to recover.

I'm 50 years old. My measured max hr is 186. My lthr is 174. I spent last year running at 155. I'm now running at 145, AND about 1 mpm faster. If I drop back to last year's pace, I'm running in the low 130s.

Like Monty said, I'm guessing you are building a lot of fatigue, and never giving yourself a chance to really recover. One day here or there doesn't cut it.

You did a HM, you felt like shit... And instead of taking a day or three off... You doubled down and went for a run the very next day. You just keep digging a deeper and deeper hole. And you are running too fast on other days to recover.

Slow down... Like Monty said... Keep your hr low. Dunno where your threshold is.... But, I'd drop down by at least 10bpm maybe 15. Low 140s. I'd also drop the volume by 25% or so. Give yourself time to fully recover. Week... Maybe two. Once you start feeling good... Give it several days more. Then report back. :=)

Hey Leavitt,

It's possible that you didn't sync during that time. There is a broader date range sync for that, which will go back 120 days (it's just under the main Synchronize with Strava Now button). Try that. If you still don't see them, double check that when you did the 120-day sync, you didn't see a message about them being private or anything. Other than that, it ought to pick them up.

Thanks,

-Eric

Ya know, the Exercise Log could have a screen that looks like this. I actually really like this format. Whaddaya say?

-Eric

Thanks, Haha... Ironman is where I want to eventually go to, but have a few years and goals I will need to earn before I choose to make that my reality.

I find HR to be kind of funny and not really indicative of my effort/feel, so I collect the data, but I don't apply it to my runs. Oddly, 2 years ago when I got my first Garmin my HR was almost max over 180, so now, I thought it was pretty low. My first Marathon I did not train appropriately, was told not to let my HR go above 167, and at the end I felt like hmm... that is all? I felt like I cheated, I was not in pain, I was just done, it was very unrewarding. Anyways, It is helpful food for thought. I do think, running an Ironman Marathon and a solo Marathon have different HR possibilities before a blow up.

I will concur that I should take my easy days, probably easier, I suppose sometime, the weather is just nice and I forget, and just embrace the day; but it is leading to overall fatigue.

Thank you, yes the HR as I replied to Monty is interesting, some run my effort is much higher and my HR lower, but because its colder or I ate more or less, or say I drank too much, it reads at various levels. I do think the data is good to have and apply, but my efforts just don't always match up; but taking it easier is absolutely something I should work on.

Although, the volume is why I am doing this. I have never hit my cardio wall. At the end of any race, I am never gassed. I look around and see all these people giving it there all and at the finish line they are done. Meanwhile, I am like well that is done, reflect on where I could have made more time, then am already thinking about what I need to do to get better. I discovered last year, I did not really know how to get uncomfortable. I was doing my first OLY of the season, I actually felt great internally but I could not tap into it. My engine was trapped by my body. I realized my mind and body did not know how to cop with biking before running, so I started loading myself up in training, the next race I did, transitioning from bike to run was way more effortless. At this point I have not been training with true intensity, I can go as slow or fast as my body wants, with the idea that by running myself down now, later, when I do my bigger tapper, I will be that much stronger, and fresher. It is a big hope, but that was the idea behind the low amount of rest days.

Low intensity, High volume would make me stronger, so that maybe my engine and body could finally become one, and I'd get to the finish line feeling like I actually had nothing else to give and nothing holding me back.

Volume, will stay, for a few more weeks, but I will give a slower pace/even lesser effort a chance on my lighter days.

Thank you!!

Out this morning for a very cold 10k. Between poor footing and wearing what felt like 20lbs of clothing to deal with the cold it took me 54 minutes to do 10k! Brings me to 666km .... ominous! Better do a second run today to move off that number.

I find HR to be kind of funny and not really indicative of my effort/feel, so I collect the data, but I don't apply it to my runs.//

But that is your problem, your PE is what is wonky, what you feel is not always where you want to be. And yes, the marathon you did was too slow, but that was because you listened to someone who told you something that was just wrong. You probably are on the high end of heart rates, so you can work at higher numbers, but the same % as everyone else to max..Thats what you learn about yourself by using HR in workouts and races over time..


But really, the lower HR is suggested you run at for real recovery runs is just to put you on the right path. I guess you all have all the fancy gadgets, so I could have also said just run 9 to 10 minute miles. But I dont use that over HR because what if you were running in 105 degree temps? A 9 minute mile might be at race pace going up a hill in the desert. But your HR will reflect that, and you can adjust, not matter how you might"feel"..


And a funny thing I learned early on in my career, there really is two speeds you have to train if you find yourself stuck. I trained to run around 6 flat pace and under for most races, but if I blew up I found I could not run an 8 minute mile very effective, because I never trained at that pace. They are two entirely different strides and the faster one just does not help that slower one, so over time I found it instructive to be ready for blow up paces, whatever they were..

1. I don't know my Max HR, I should probably figure that out.
2. I do have fancy gadgets, but I am very old school in my thought I suppose, I do look back over things but I have to admit, I am more of the "athlete" heart than the data person that intelligently applies the info; I am trying to improve that. None of this stuff was important growing up, you run, you get better, so that is what I did. Now I understand there is more to it.
3. You are correct, I have to admit, the days I "feel" like crap, and my pace is slower, its like hell, the stride is so much less efficient. I know sometimes when I may be exerting a higher effort pace wise, it is actually easier stride/rhythm just feels more natural. I think that is a solid point. I think I will absolutely incorporate this more on my low volume days.

I will admit that some of my low volume days, I will go out with my bf who is much fitter than myself, and we will run his low effort, which means I am not running as low of an effort as I should. This is the most valuable part I am learning as I look back. Thank you again for your assistance.

1. I don't know my Max HR, I should probably figure that out. //

Thats not too hard, you just need a ballpark within a few beats. You can do a test, or just use recent races with your HR's in those to reverse engineer them to get a theoretical max.


And no one is more old school than me, but I have found in running and cycling HR to be very instructive, especially if you are a self coached athlete. If not, then your coach should be using them too anyway, so I accept that you have taken the first of the 12 steps.. (-;


"You are correct, I have to admit",

I'd suggest that you'd likely be better able to tap into whatever high intensity potential you have by running less volume but adding in hard intervals. You say you can't seem to get uncomfortable: if you ran your easy days properly easy then added some really stinkin' hard running - and I mean just a few minutes per week (3 x 400m intervals where you had a goal time that was challenging for you to meet to start with, after a good, easy warmup?) - you'd learn how to make it hurt. To keep things even safer, do some hill repeats to start with. Warm up very easy for 10-15mins, then pick a steep hill - one that has you gasping for air by the time you reach the top - and run up it. Jog easy back down, then run back up again. Start with just a handful of repeats, and add another each week.

If you want to learn how to go hard, meandering along for hours isn't going to help you. 80% of your running should still be easy - as you admit, likely easier than you're doing now - but at least 1% should make you feel like your heart is going to punch its way out of your chest while you struggle not to vomit up a lung.

Then again I'm just a slow ultra dork, so what do I know?

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__________________________________________________________
ill advised racing inc.

Thank you, I have done speed work in the past. For the last 13 years, I had only ran when I felt like it. I am in my second year of building my legs to endure some mile. Last year I started by running 6 days a week, rain or shine. I had only ever done that maybe for 3-4 months at a time in my youth. December I got sick, January was my down in the dumps month but rebounded just in time for my first fully trained for marathon (although my 3rd attempt to structure such). After that injury from bike crash but did my 1st 70.3 anyways, rebounded from that then an overuse injury because I thought I could just jump right back in it. Needless to say, I know speed work would make me faster, it will absolutely find ways to gas you; but if your muscles are not ready for it, it can derail you, and if I don't run because I am injured. I do not get faster. I am on the old lady plan. Build, then I will layer in the sprinkles. I am using races at the moment as my speed testing, and on Thursday are what I believe people to call my tempo runs. I have found my engine to be stronger than my body, I am giving it a chance to catch up. Thus, why also, after I do my marathon in April, I will be switching gears to Sprint/OLY distance Tri's so I can work on speed.

I am looking at April as a end to my actual base for a Marathon- because I only did volume to get there, the years that follow, should have a greater potential to get faster because of the speed work I added in. I need my body to have the endurance. At least that is how I am choosing to approach it. Slow gains, verses fast risked gains. I want to do this for a while, not just for a year or two.

But your not wrong if I was looking only to gas myself you'd be spot on; and no doubt, I can get a lot more out of myself if I choose a different approach. Thanks!

While I was leisurely strolling around UPenn/Jefferson Hospital portion of The Gayborhood yesterday, I spotted several runners, a handful of cyclists/messengers, and three skateboarders doing their thing, in the 20-degree/10-ish wind-chill of a bright Philly mid-morning. They were bundled "just enough" to perform, yet maintained a defiant underdressed badassery compared to the parka'd and pullovered pedestrians on the sidewalks

Since I was "back home" for most of the day, a wave of nostalgia swept over me

I said to myself 'Self. Y'know, we used to be that idiot' [Also, the idiot on TV News running or biking in a blizzard, or surfing in a hurricane]

We didn't have Polar Vortex, or named Winter Storms. We just had "real fucking cold" and "that fucking blizzard of ..."

We didn't even have Global Warming/Climate Change yet, as far as we knew

I remember running the temperature [or pretty close to it, i thought; I didn't have a TV then, so whatever weather I got was on the radio on my way to or from work] on a 7 miler back & forth to UPenn in the dark after work

'What happened to us?'

OK, yeah. I moved back to South Jersey and joined a gym, so running exclusively outdoors wasn't a necessity

But still ...

****

I was still in a funk about this when I woke up this morning

I was working from home, and awaiting some kind of ETA on D'Wife's release

Then I saw a runner go by the local morning show's studio window

"Fuck it. We're going"

---

"What's your claim?" - Ben Gravy
"Your best work is the work you're excited about" - Rick Rubin

Bluestack, regarding treadmill vs road:

Last Fri: 5.01mi treadmill tempo @ 6:53 / mile

Sun: 12k hilly road race (7.41 mi) @ 6:54

Wed: 4.75 mi treadmill tempo @ 6:39

Today Friday: was supposed to do treadmill, but switched to road to meet friends for post run social: 4.8mi @ 6:42.

So no difference for me treadmill (1* grade) vs road. Maybe more mental torture on TM , but less worry about being hit by cars

I more or less agree,except I found that I needed to increase the inclination to 2.0* to get the same hr and pace as road (for same air temp).

Halfway. 51 runs in 50 days. Just ticked over 300 miles.

More importantly, I have run *every* day. I have run when I have woken up "tired". I have run when I have woken with "sore" legs. Previously I would have had a day off for either of those reasons.
Not now. I am in the challenge and I need to run consistently every day.

My resting HR is down 5 beats. My HR during my runs has dropped ~15-20 beats.
8k is my consistent daily run.
Now is the time to build my long runs at the weekend - 20k today, aiming for another 20k tomorrow.

Building for a 6 hour race race late March (it will either be the last day of the challenge or just after), then an 80k ultra in May.

Am I becoming a runner? :->

Well done. I have missed 5 days, due to family commitments. I've made up for them, and then some.... But still... Not. every. day.

I'm still happy that I haven't skipped just cuz I didn't feel like it.

I don't track rhr, but my plain ole running hr is down by 10 bpm, and I can now run through a bad patch and out of it. The benefits are real.

Good luck in your races!

Challenge is halfway there. Pretty cool to see 700+ in it and 400+ somewhat active.

My first half has been both a write off and a success. It's a write off because I only have 13 legal runs done for the challenge, although I achieved it by more like 30 really short runs. I also missed a solid 3 weeks due to tweaking my back on my second XC skis outing after the first one was really good (went out for 20K!!!!).

In any case, last week I was in Cancun for a swim camp (did 42K in 6 days), but also got out for 3 beach jogs that I kind of used for physio on a short surface to work my range of motion as its easy on my fickle disk. Sinice I have come home my treadmill shuffles have turned into jogs which have really turned into runs from which I am getting fitness. Let's see how all this progresses, but I will make my goal 10/10 for the last 10 days of the challenge and it's possible that 25/25 is in the cards.

I've only ran something like 75K so far in the challenge and I've swam something like 180K in the same time!

rest day here - first one in ages - loving it.

---

maybe she's born with it, maybe it's chlorine
If you're injured and need some sympathy, PM me and I'm very happy to write back.
disclaimer: PhD not MD

I think I'd loose my mind on a full rest day... Especially on a weekend. Heck, I tried NOT to double yesterday.... After about 30 minutes of sitting still I couldn't contain myself, and hit the tm for 30 easy minutes.

thanks for the advice! got it all squared away! 40/50 so far! and strava and the log are matching!

thanks again

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Ask me how much I love my Kiwami LD Aero Trisuit

50/50. The thing for me is not overtaxing any one swim,bike, or run. And plenty of sleep!

52/50 - I'm really not distinguishing myself with either distance or pace but this is already further than I thought I'd get. I'm telling myself to stick to the 'loud whisper' discipline.. I have skipped some strength sessions because I couldn't find the motivation and worse, I seem to have forgotten where my pool is. Bike sessions(also all indoor) are getting done, thank goodness. This challenge seems to be both easier and harder than I thought it would be...

They're not something I do often. Very, very ocasionally I want one.

---

maybe she's born with it, maybe it's chlorine
If you're injured and need some sympathy, PM me and I'm very happy to write back.
disclaimer: PhD not MD

congrats on the terrific swimming distance Dev!

I'm pretty happy with where I am. 49 runs in 50 days-better than I expected.
Set a run PR in Jan-most miles in over 1.5 years (134 miles; 22.5 hrs) along with solid bike miles (465 miles; 27.5 hrs)

Feb will be tougher now that I have to do that SWIM thing so I don't drown and die in Spain...

Congrats to all participants on making the half way point!! Stay strong and steady.