Marriage has a 50% divorce rate.

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The Triathlon Squad

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Couples that train together stay together.

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#WeAreTheForge #BlackGunsMatter

"Look, will you guys at leats accept that you are a bunch of dumb asses and just trust me on this one? Please?" BarryP 7/30/2012

Wait a minute! Ironmen divorce at the same rate as non-Ironmen??? I thought we were special ...

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If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went. - Will Rogers

Emery's Third Coast Triathlon | Tri Wisconsin Triathlon Team | Push Endurance | GLWR

I could see it either way.

X2. The only time I was married, I found out too late that I was in trouble when I realized his idea of exercise was drinking coffee :-(

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DFL > DNF > DNS

When I got married we had both just quit smoking and neither of us exercised at all. About 5 years into my marriage is when I started running seriously and went on to longer and longer distances. For the first couple years he would come to my important races then his last race he attended was IMCdA in 2008. Our divorce was final in March.

I think any time one spouse is very passionate about something and the other isn't fully bought into it there are problems. He is big into guitar/mandoline/uke and singing. I'd go to open mike nights, etc. Drove him wherever he asked me to. Spent more time in music stores than I care to think about. But it still wasn't something I was as passionate about as he is.

It isn't just Ironman. Ironman can teach people they are tougher than they thought and maybe that is enough to get them out of a dead marriage. But a lot of things can do that. Training 20 hours a week would only highlight whatever problems already existed.

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Jen

"In order to keep a true perspective on one's importance, everyone should have a dog that worships him and a cat that will ignore him." - Dereke Bruce

Common problem for triathletes.

I prefer to say that marriage has a 50% successful stay-together rate.

(I know it's the same thing but more of a half-full kind of feeling.)

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Take a short break from ST and read my blog:
http://tri-banter.blogspot.com/

Wednesday will be 20 years married, 12 years as an "IronMan." She was real supportive the first 4-5 years, when I was compulsive and competitive. But I didn't have any other (too) bad habits, and generally was either sleeping, working, training, or spending time with her and the kids. But even "when I qualified for Kona" (love working that in anywhere possible), I never trained more than 12-13 hours/week - unless I took a day off work. Now, it's all about the teenagers...and what they have going on. I wouldn't want to miss a lacrosse game, swim meet, or trip to Starbucks for a 6-hour bike ride. Overall, I feel (pat myself on the back) that IronMan / Endurance events has and continues to benefit our family greatly. It keeps my head straight, and helps me live in a balanced way that is good for my family. My wife has done one triathlon in her life, and is mainly a walker and tennis player. Once a year, we all go to a tri in the mountains - I'm long past they entire family (or she) needs to be at one of my races. Anyhow, I'm sure nowdays she's just tired of me saying "I'm just fat, old, slow, and hairy." So I'm working on that - motivated (originally) by LA's comeback (gasp!!). Did I mention that I once qualified for Kona? It was the same year I qualifed for Boston.

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Damn, that's a cold ass honkey.

Take the 50% divorce rate for marriage, then apply the 50% divorce rate or Ironman to those that stay married.

In other words, people doing ironman are splitting in half the success they began with only 50% possibility.

But, I am more interested in WHO asked for divorce. The spouse, or the ironman.

I think a huge factor in that study would be the age of the married couple, and how long they have been married. I think the question is which came 1st?... ironman training? or a marital problem? For me its the old " chicken or the egg" question.

In my case, I think we started drifting apart before ironman training came into play. We got married in our early 20's, had 3 kids by 28, worked 60hrs a week and raised the kids...and when they went off to college I realized I didnt have much in common with my wife anymore. We still get along, we dont fight, have great sex...love each other like old friends but we arent "crazy in love" like we were 25 yrs ago.

I think the void in my life started before I filled it with triathlon...its a healthy midlife crisis for me...not sure where my marriage will be in 5yrs but ill still be training :)

I don't see the perspective of having to have the spouse follow along to races or participate in other hobbies. A married person is allowed to have their own life and in a secure marriage the spouse shouldn't be so needy as to have to have the other participate in all their activities. It's nice once in a while yes. Necessary? No.

OTOH, bitching about the spouses hobbies and inhibiting participation is a big No No. Been going strong 22 years of marriage this way.

He is very special :0)

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__________________________________________________
Official Polar Ambassador
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Could not agree more! I'm extremely fortunate that my wife shares my passion for multi-sports (she's a triathlete, and although I do tri's as well, I do consider myself a duathlete first and foremost). On a sunny day, I see my neighbors out laboring in the yard (and most guys do look miserable...), yet, we rather let the flowerbeds fall apart and go for a long nice ride, together of course! We might be the only couple that works on the yard only when it rains... life style choice, yes, but that wouldn't work if we didn't do it together.

I've had some pretty big "bucket list" races and during my training for those, my wife has reduced her training volume so she could take on a larger portion of the house work. Right now, she's training for 1/2IM in January, so I've reduced my volume to take on the brunt of the house work, allowing her more time to train.

... and who said triathlon is not a team sport?! :-)

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"Suddenly the thought struck me. My floor is someone elses ceiling"-Nils Ferlin

This thread certainly has potential, but I'll add that there is perhaps a slight difference between men and women in terms of what we want from our spouse in terms of traithlon participation (or maybe it is me).

When I was training for IMC in 1991, I started dating my wife. I was also working full time and doing a business degree at night school. I put the cards on the table and said, "This is the way it is.....don't try to change me". Back then she also did some of the sports but not to the same degree, but I think she always got that being active was an extension of my personality. When my son was born, I obviously had to curtail the training activity and over time figured out how to make it less intrusive on family life, but like all couples it was a source of friction, but over time we found a sweet spot.

I don't need my spouse to workout with me, rather I'm happy she lets me do my thing with great backing. When I am out training, like when I was in the armed forces, it is like hanging out with my "unit" (rather than with my family) and the guys I train with become the extended family (and I like it that way). We both have our interests and balance each other off, with our strengths adding to family life and our weaknesses being overcome by the strengths of the other (or the occaisional prodding, but that's part of being married).

So all that to say, I don't think that most guys need to train with spouses, in fact, they probably get more enjoyment training with the guys (rather than hanging around the bar with them and getting drunk). We get boys night out but we're doing something productive too :-)....oh yeah, and so much for "don't try to change me"....21 years later, I've hopefully changed for the better, so the trick is you want him to believe he is not being changed and change him along the way and soften him up without him knowing it :-) (maybe I should have put that in the womens forum....)

....and in the end neither spouse will be able to do this sport. Our relationships have to be about more than the sport, because when it ends, then you have nothing left. In the mean time, support each other in what makes us excited and who we are.

Why are you upset with statistics? Odds ratio is 1.

All of this could be litigated by smarter decision making

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Official Polar Ambassador
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This^^^^!

19 years in and this is our approach.

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What I do: http://app.strava.com/athletes/345699

x3.....just behind you guys at 18 and we're on the same program (not perfect but it seemingly works for many) :-)

If a marriage fails because of one of the people's exercise habits then there is an underlying problem that would have ended in a failed marriage regardless.

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Rick, "Retired" hobbyist athlete
Trying to come back slowly from acute A-Fib

Let me start off and say I have been with my wife for more than 22 years it's all I know. That being said I have raced mt bikes in college and have been a gym rat since 1995. My wife couldn't care less how my races go or training and I really don't expect her to because I race for me and my health. Where the problem comes in is time and money. Bikes/gear and races cost money and with three kids there really is never enough to go around. My wife wouldn't care if I bought a new M5 but god forbid I get a P5 (you know we all want one) . So all I really have to say is that I still have no idea how to navigate this subject.

BTW - Patriots fan - season tickets 4k plus superbowl every other year (had to throw that in) 5k
- Golf wow this one is expensive 120 a round 20 weeks plus the yearly trip with the guys 10k
-Baseball see above (patriots)
- Hockey fan OMG expensive 40+ home games 100 per plus beer and food ouch

All of the above are typical weekend hobbies that have little to no health benefits unlike trainning for a TRI

I use this forum to vent so thank you!!!!

What Paulo said. Ironman racer = just as likely to get divorced as anyone else in the population, but at least they will have something to keep them occupied if they do. Choose wisely.

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Brad Stulberg
Author, Peak Performance
http://www.BradStulberg.com

Einstein got divorced, are you saying you are smarter than Einstein? :-)

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"if you chose it, it's not really pain"

Yeah - I'm not married! (...but I did just get engaged...haha)

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Brad Stulberg
Author, Peak Performance
http://www.BradStulberg.com

....Also, I couldn't agree more with what devashish laid out. I don't like to pimp my writing around on the forum, but I did write a somewhat recent piece for Xtri on this topic, so I figured I would share it on this thread. http://greaterthanendurance.blogspot.com/...b-interview-and.html

I am always transparent when commenting on threads like this because you guys are older and wiser than me, but this was interesting to say the least. When I was interviewing for jobs last winter most employers *loved* the multisport slant; more powerful on my resume than having worked at McKinsey (no joke). That said, when one hospital system asked me if I was planning on getting divorced, I was completely thrown off. Didn't end up taking that job...

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Brad Stulberg
Author, Peak Performance
http://www.BradStulberg.com

racing doesn't kill mariages..... leaving your wife home with 4kids that are being absolute hellions does!

doesn't matter WHAT you are doing if the end result is a pissed off wife left at home.

......and this is why i drink beer and sit around a campfire with my wife and kids instead of getting those long rides and runs in.


Tim

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Tim

The othe 50% end in death.

I got into triathlon to keep me busy enough so I did not do something stupid like getting married again.

My experience, after 30 years of marriage, is if folks do not find things they share, then when the kids leave for college, a much larger percentage of folks are getting divorced now. (At least that is what I am reading in articles now). I also strongly believe that any activity that is so self focused, whether it is IM training, lots of work hours, etc. may end up bad at the end. I got married for we, not me. I got married because it was better to compromise the me things to do the we things especially with family.

I am right now at Disneyland with my Granddaughter. My wife asked if I wanted to bring my bike or running shoes. I said no, I need to save my energy chasing around my granddaughter so she, my wife, and my daughter and husband can enjoy the park. This will be the first time in about a year I will not be exercising for me for 5 days. (Now I am carrying around my garmin since I am interested in how many miles per day we will walk).

I wife goes to basically all my races that I have done the last 15 years. She helps at all the races and it has become a major social activity for us.

I just cannot relate to the folks who say they need there long bike rides by themselves on the weekends. For the folks who are married around 20 years, you are heading into the next big test when the kids go off to college, and one finds out if you still enjoy doing things with your spouse. For the ones who get divorced, it sure messes up the future family stuff when the grandkids come, IMO.

So, off to see Mickey and Mini for 3 full days.

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Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

Boom Nutrition code 19F4Y3 $5 off 24 pack box | Bionic Runner | PowerCranks | Velotron | Spruzzamist

Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep

I didn't read what AndyPants said in that other thread, but my Ironman journey definitely changed me too, and I was the spouse that asked for the divorce.

I decided to do a sprint tri after watching the Sydney olympics - I was just over 30, with a new baby, and fat. The gold medal winner had just had a baby 10 months ago, so I identified with her to some degree, and thought if she could win a gold medal, I could at least get off my fat ass. Prior to that, there had been nearly no regular physical activity since college. Looking back, I think I was going through a depressed period in my 20's and early 30's. Whether I can thank the exercised induced endorphins, the structure of training, the time allowed to take for myself, I was able to slowly climb out. As the fog lifted and I became more involved and more fit and moving up to longer distances, my husband stayed stagnant. He was supportive at first but then got sick of it, whether because of the time spent or because he could tell I was changing inside as well as outside, I don't know. Or maybe I wasn't changing, maybe I was just growing up, becoming more clear on who I was, who he was, and what was good for me.

6 years later and my 1st Ironman finish complete, the turning point for me was an anniversary party for my best friend and her Ironman husband (who was one of my training partners). The host asked us to go around the room and say what we loved best about our spouse. Every wife in that room seemed to have something special to say about her husband - he is passionate, he is loyal, he is goal-oriented, he is warm and caring, he is a good provider, he is a good father, etc. I excused myself to go to the rest room before the question came around to me, and I hid in there for a while, because all I could think to say was that my husband was funny. He wasn't any of those things, but he sure was funny! It was like a cold glass of water dumped on my head. From that day on I couldn't look at him the same way without finding something inadequate. 2 years later, by then a 2 time IM, I told him "I can't do this anymore."

He blames Ironman for the divorce, but I can't imagine what my life would be like if I had stayed on that unhealthy, depressed path.

  
If I put into my marriage what I put into my training, we would be continuous honeymooners.


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This! We've been together 19 years or so (not sure when we got married) and I got into IM last year. So far we're going strong and our issues (we all have them) have nothing to do with training. Key is to keep communication open and BE open, trust and care. Does he say incredibly STUPID and hurtful stuff? Hell yes. But I know his mouth to brain filter is totally absent and he does not mean to come off the way he does so I respond to his heart instead of his mouth. Though there are times I give him hell for his mouth (and he takes it because he knows I'm right).

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http://harvestmoon6.blogspot.com
https://www.caringbridge.org/visit/katasmit

Been married 36 years: empty-nesters and financially comfortable.

My wife and I each have our own unique hobbies and interests. She is supportive of my training and racing mostly because she sees the resultant health benefits.

But she has only has attended two races that I can think of in the past eight years. It really doesn't bother me that she isn't actively supportive of my triathlon activities; I really don't need her support to validate my interest in the sport.

And quite frankly, triathlon isn't really a great spectator sport and I think it would be inconsiderate to expect her to get up before dawn to attend my races just to be bored the whole time.

Her biggest complaint about my triathlon participation has been the piles of old race shirts and running shoes that I've accumulated over the years that take up space in the closet.


Out of consideration, I do try to train at times that don't interfere with other common activities. I'm a morning person and get up early to train both during the week and on weekends. She likes to sleep in on the weekends which allows me to get up early and get a run or ride in before she rolls out of bed at 9AM.

Somehow it has worked over the years. I think that mutual respect had a lot to do with it, plus we're best friends in addition to being married. If we were ever to split up it wouldn't have anything to do with my participation in triathlon.

Mark

My experience, after 30 years of marriage, is if folks do not find things they share, then when the kids leave for college, a much larger percentage of folks are getting divorced now.

True.

There is a large wave of tale-end of the baby-boom people who have been married, have "stayed together for the kids" then ounce they are empty-nesters they get divorced very soon after the last kid goes off to college or leaves the family home. In fact, on college campuses there is a cottage industry of counselors having to deal with, the kids of these parents, who are now terribly guilt ridden, now realizing there parents, lived perhaps many many years through a loveless marriage, just for them. Also, because role-modelling in the home is so potent and powerful, these kids also may have odd or different ideas of what is a great, close and intimate relationship, depending on how good or bad their parents acting abilities are.

Few married couples getting divorced consider the impacts on their children. Depending on what happens, they can be either heavily or subtly impacted, with some pretty serious long term ramifications.

Here's four scenarios:

1. Happily married couple, everything 100% good staying together forever. Typically and as one would suspect, this gives kids the best opportunity.

2. The amicable divorce, where lines of communication are always good, kids needs in the divorce are always put first - kids fair almost as good in this situation as in #1

3. The bad divorce - where the bitterness, and bad communication just go on and on and on, even years after the divorce - there has been noted and significant issues with many kids from this scenario.

4. The Stick-It-Out-For-The-Kids option: Sounds good on paper, but as noted above, role-modeling is a powerful influencer and learning situation for kids. They pick up on everything and see everything going on in the home. Unless you both are Academy Award winning actors, some not-so-good messaging and role-modelling will be picked up on. The kids will think that your contrived idea of a marriage is normal. If they have been fooled, then you get the trauma-delayed impact noted above in college or shortly after they leave home!

I have been working on #2 for many years. It has not been easy. It's had it's challenges. I've had to relearn a lot of things and lean a lot about myself. Set many things aside, delay and put-off many others. And first and foremost, keep the needs of my son, always in the forefront of what I do. Over the long term it's been worth it for him, and for me.

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Steve Fleck @stevefleck | Blog

[Couples that train together stay together.

Could not agree more!
]

Says who? Do you have stats available other than n=1 to backup your statement?

Fred.

It isn't just Ironman. Ironman can teach people they are tougher than they thought and maybe that is enough to get them out of a dead marriage. But a lot of things can do that.

I agree with Jen's statement ^^ Sometimes we stay in relationships because we are too afraid or insecure to leave. Once we discover how strong we truly are, it may give us the push we need to get out of a stale relationship. They say the journey is everything and I believe that it isn't just a journey about finding your physical strength but also about discovering more about ourselves than we knew. And then seeing the truth in our lives.

Nicely worded piece of literature there Mr.Paul.
I reckon you could ork as a marriage counsellor on the side :)

Terry

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"You are never too old to set another goal or to dream a new dream" - Les Brown
"Discipline is the bridge between goals and accomplishment" - Jim Rohn

Steve, I liked this post a lot. I'm in the #2 slot myself, though remarried for nearly 8 years as part of a 10 year old relationship.

I'm also the child of divorced parents, and one thing I would add is that both for myself and every single other child of divorced parents that I know, our parents' divorce was a source of personal strength and "character building" for us. It forced early emotional maturation, greater independence, and a recognition that you cannot just rely on your parents for everything (sometimes, for anything). I firmly believe that I would a lesser person than I am had my parents not divorced.

My own amicable divorce was made a lot easier by two things. One was the profound insight that forgiveness really benefits the foregiver more than the forgiven - it was such a relief to get over my anger and resentment at my daughter's mother, and made me so much happier. The other was to understand how a quote from Margaret Mead applied to my own life. She was on a TV show in the early 1970's and the rather younger interviewer commented on her "three failed marriages". She stopped the interviewer by saying "no, that's not right". "Well, it says here that you've ... ". "No, I had three very successful marriages". We live longer, and have so much more potential for personal change in this modern world - its a truly exceptional relationship that can last as long as we expect them to these days. I've joked with my wife that modern marriages vows should be structured more along the lines of "till death do us part, or some other momentous personal transformation makes this no longer a sensible arrangement for any of us" :)

In my case, athletic activity had nothing to do with the divorce, and in fact sharing it has been a fairly central part of both my marriages so far. My first wife and I rode bikes together (we met doing so, in fact), and my current wife did her first Ironman based on the conviction that I would teach her how to ride ("race") a bike.

I understand that the "Couples who train together stay together" works for some (though where do kids fit in there?) but for us it's nice for each of us to have our own space part of the time. I like to think of it as a healthy flexible partnership rather than 24/7 dependency.

I've only very rarely had my fam with me at races, cuz I know they're boring as hell to "watch"; mostly just standing around waiting, with only brief glimpses of action. Of course it'd be nice for me to see them at the finish, but making them put up with the rest of it would be even more selfish than the time I already take away for training.

Here's another view. I feel somewhat unbiased because I have not done a triathlon since the 1900's but I still love to keep up-to-date on what's happening.

I am going to over-generalize to make my point, but I think this is fairly accurate...

• The number of triathlete's that are type A personalities compared to the general population is quite high. Type A personalities are often focused on themselves more than they are on others. This does not go well will many marriages, friendships etc.
• Triathlete's seem to see themselves as better than others by training a crazy number of hours per week and thinking that they are healthier than others because of it. The simple fact is that this excess is more counter productive to ones health than moderate exercise combined with a healthy diet and sleep regime. The me, me, me attitude can be a turn off to be around.
• Further to the me, me, me behavior, I always get a kick out of eavesdropping on many AG'ers conversations. It is amazing how good they believe they are and how much better they believe they are compared to others. Somehow, doing an Olympic distance event or an IM and taking 50% longer than the pros gives them bragging rights in society. I can only imagine what kind of spouse they would have to have to accommodate that personality.

Just a different view.

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Adrian in Vancouver

This exactly for us. Spouse does not go to races and would never ask her too. She supports the training as she knows it makes me happy, and mutual respect of each others' interests is paramount (not participation) and do it at times that does not interfer with "out time" which includes dinners, date nights, walks, etc. Works great for us. Also helps we are now empty nesters and more free time for us.

Ding!
Ding!
Ding!

BINGO!
We have a winner!


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.....~_.o^,....(...)./.(...)......._/\...

It really doesn't matter does it? When a door closes new ones open; opportunities!!

After reading this thread, I was surprised that nobody mentioned how a divorce affects your kids (for couples that do have kids), and how that should factor into your decision. It's not just about ironman and exercising. Your decision to get divorced has the greatest affect on the kids (although I've never been divorced so I can't say that with 100% certainty). I'm 25 and my parents got divorced several years ago while I was in college. I'm used to it at this point, but it still sucks and I wish it never happened. It totally screws up family relationships, not just between you and your spouse. Think about that before you get divorced.

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my strava

Did you read post #35?

It would seem to apply directly to you!

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Steve Fleck @stevefleck | Blog

My wife and I had been doing tris together for many years until I retired from racing this year but we still bike together regularly and she's still racing. All I can say is its nice to have a spouse into the same things you are (we also scuba dive together) but is not the deal maker in a relationship. I've seen relationships were both were triathletes but the couple still split up.

Good points, I didn't see your response before replying. I hit the reply button this morning when I got to work, but never got around to writing anything until later on. Good to see that some people are considering the impacts.

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my strava

Personally I don't think there is a link between divorce rate and Ironman training / racing. All that IM does is provide a trigger (perhaps fuse is a better metaphor) to something that has already started. If you didn't do IM, something else would be the trigger point.

Couples drift apart for many reasons, and my experience has been that it is not usually one thing that does it but a lot of things that build up over time.

Oh, I think our 40th anniversary is next year. Six kids, (2 adopted to delay empty nest syndrome) and now 8 Grandkids. You may have noticed the wording. The "Aniversary Number" is unimportant to both of us, it just is. My son started getting into Triathlons a couple of years ago, I did 3 Sprints this year and have committed to a half next year. My wife comes out to Tris if they are in town, that's it. And is not interested in training at all. For my birthday this past weekend she presented me with a scrapbook of pictures and memorabilia from my Tris this summer (I really need to remember to look like I'm having fun). So, I get support. Sure, you could say that with me doing a few sprints that I'm not into the training regime some of you are but over the years my "hobbies" have consumed a lot of resources (Financial and time wise). Let's see, Motorcycles including long trips (Mexico to Canada) and breaking a collar bone othe race track, RC controlled planes and Helicopters (fly on weekends, fix during the week), hiking the West Coast Trail & others (hours of self supported 2 and 3 day weekends in the mountains and training in the evenings), doing an MBA while working full time, hockey (playing, coaching and reffing all at the same time), skiing (weekends and some week nights) and others - you get the idea though, all time consuming with associated costs. My wife wasn't interested in any of these other than I did get her hiking for a bit. She prefers quilting, sewing, bird watching, and other similar activities.

Anyway, the point is that, in our relationship, we both do things that we like to do (I don't understand why anyone would like gardening, I'd rather slit my wrists lengthwise). We go out for coffee on the weekends, do stuff with the Grandkids together, sometimes walk, watch some TV, trips to Mexico sometimes but we are not that dependent upon each other for entertainment or self-esteem.

N+1 I suppose.

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BC Don
Pain is temporary, not giving it your all lasts all Winter.

This isn't an indictment against anyone in particular, but rather against every one, myself included, in a nation where only half of us will stay married:


I know there are a lot of accomplished triathletes here on slowtwitch. A whole lot of real hard asses who would not quit an ironman if you chopped one of their legs off half-way through the run. They will train for a year to target one 8 to15 hour event (depending on how good you really are). It means you are tough, and driven, generally speaking.


As I read this thread this is the part I can't understand. If you're such a fighter, why don't you fight for your marriage, like you fight for a Kona Spot? Why don't you expend that same energy to make your marriage awesome, not just okay, but awesome? Do you value your half-assed age group 3rd place more than you value the person that promised, swore an oath, before God and your best friends, to love and cherish until death do you part? Did you not take that commitment any more seriously than your 6 am group ride? After all aren't you the person that told yourself you can do anything, and then proved it. Here is the real truth about Ironman and Divorce. You're not divorced because you're enlightened, or fit, or a new person, or you spend too much time on a treadmill. You are divorced because when the going got tough you and your spouse didn't HTFU and stick to your commitment and decide to make it better. You were satisfied to say, "oh, we went our separate ways" and that to me is not very tough or driven at all, that is a quitter.


Love is not a happy feeling, or great sex, or mutual adoration (although it can encompass all those things), first and foremost it's a commitment. The commitment you made when you got married, for richer or poorer, in sickness and in health. If you think you're so f***ing tough how about proving it by working to make your marriage better every day, just like you do your power numbers and your swim stroke. That's a memory you can cherish in 20 years, and its a lot warmer at night than a $5 plaque and a worn out race number.

As Ben Franklin once said, "Keep your eyes wide open before marriage, and half-shut afterwards."

I am not sure if you were directing this at me, or not.

I agree with you in principal - marriage takes work and we should be doing everything we can to make it work over the long term. After all, that's what we said in the vows, right!

However, in practice and in real life, it obviously does not work out that way. I agree with you that many couples throw in the towel way too soon and we seem to be in a time and age when everything is disposable - marriages to. If you don't like what you have, just chuck it and get something shiny and new! But sometimes after all is said and done, and you have tried and done everything you can, things still get off the rails . . . what then?

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Steve Fleck @stevefleck | Blog

How's it working for her over the long term?

How's it working for her over the long term?

In what way?

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Steve Fleck @stevefleck | Blog

Fleck,

No, I wasn't replying to you specifically. You were just the last person on the thread to post when I started writing my reply so I hit the reply button on your post. Like I said in wasn't an indictment against anyone in particular but rather us, the 50%culture, as a whole. I know that marriages, like all relationships can deteriorate to being seemingly impossible (kind of like an Ironman, also seemingly impossible). I was just disgusted that the general tone in two pages of the thread was one of passive neglect towards marriage and like you pointed out, an attitude that it can just be thrown out when it no longer suits them.


Sorry for any confusion, Velo E

Your story was great and all, but what I'm dying to know is whether you've ever qualified for Kona.

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Mediocre Athlete: Stumbling across the finish line since 2008.
http://www.mediocreathlete.com

Fleck


As far as what then? Well, I am happily married, not divorced so I do not have a plan for and have not been faced with "what then"? Planning for it seems to me to be counter productive. I'll keep trying to plan against it instead if I can.

But still, what then? I say that you keep plugging away, loving your spouse the best you can, every day that you can. Am I man enough to do that in the face of brutal adversity? Well, I hope so. I hope I am that tough. I plan to be that tough. We won't know for sure if I am that tough until either she or I die proving it.

I will say this though, I work out about 10 hours a week, which I know is a low number for all the "animals" here on slowtwitch. Now if my marriage started to come apart and I spent those 10 hours just thinking about how I can make my marriage better, and acting on those thoughts, with just those ten hours I am sure I could turn it around. If I used those ten hours per week to show my wife why she was so special to me that I decided to commit the rest of my life to her, I'm sure I could convince her. I am sure that if we would put that same "never say die attitude" towards our marriages that we do to going 112 miles in a circle (which sounds kind of ridiculous when you put it that way), the divorce rate would drop dramatically. Especially in a crowd as tough as this one thinks it is!

"Over the long term it's been worth it for him, and for me."

In 'that' way.

Epic and awesome! Thank you.! I think Ill go do something special for my Wife and Kids tonight!
FTW!

Preach it!!

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"Alice laughed. `There's no use trying,' she said 'one can't believe impossible things.' `I daresay you haven't had much practice,' said the Queen. `When I was your age, I always did it for half-an-hour a day. Why, sometimes I've believed as many as six impossible things before breakfast!'"

What folks need to do is put Ironman in perspective for their spouses. I think the only time my wife's been systemically pissed at me is when I STOPPED IMs and IM training (or, really, any kind of training) for six months and played World of Warcraft non-stop instead... When I quit WoW cold turkey on Valentine's Day and asked her if she wanted to join my fat ass for a run (to start training for an IM 5 months hence), she couldn't have been happier...

Good points about "when the kids go off to college". I think a lot about that as my son is 2 years away. We were just meeting with old friends who had their youngest go off and we both asked, "are you missing the action around the house", and they replied along the lines of "yes, but now it is about us again. There are a lot of things that we wanted to do for us that we put on hold for many years, that we can go do together. We built something good with the kids, and now we can celebrate some that, just the 2 of us". Well, I hope that it us, when the time comes. My friends seemed and felt very fulfilled with that stage in life and raising a family had brought them closer together as they worked on many life goals together. Like a team it was like they won the Stanley cup and now they are doing the victory parade. I thought that was cool. We both admire that couple and their approach to life. Nothing in life is certain, but I guess it requires work every day in some way or another.

^^^^^^^^^
This - nothing comes for free, "work" for a marriage isn't always hard to do. :)

30 years in October, some bumpy spots, but the IM training hasn't been a negative at all, we (both) like to travel, and IM certainly creates a focal point to start a trip - then you make sure the rest of the trip is about the two of you.

You said it better than I could.

20 years together, married 16. We were out of shape when we got married, had kids, got in shape and have trained for our respective events alongside one another. As our children get older and break into their own sports, we share a love of watching them go and chase their dreams.

Love, respect and mutual admiration for what we hold dearest (our marriage and our children) will ALWAYS win out over a workout. Always.

Quote:

Now if my marriage started to come apart and I spent those 10 hours just thinking about how I can make my marriage better, and acting on those thoughts, with just those ten hours I am sure I could turn it around. If I used those ten hours per week to show my wife why she was so special to me that I decided to commit the rest of my life to her, I'm sure I could convince her.

I admire your attitude and conviction. Just don't be so certain that things would work out the way you think. You'd be doing this as your marriage started to come apart, and that's the onset of crazy time. There are lots of ways marriages can come apart, and in some of them even the most well-intentioned spouse(s) will not be able to stop the collapse, even if they want to.

Anyway, keep on enjoying your marriage and family!

for us (starting next fall), it will be more a case of "the swim is over, now we can get on with the easy, fun parts" :)

HAHAHAHAHA! Right on.

A strong relationship is built on trust, respect, support, love and of course fun. If a triathlete's relationship breaks down, it's not because of triathlons, it's because there was a loss of respect, support, trust, love or fun. Blaming anything other than that is just a smoke screen denying reality.

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The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design.

Thank you, I need this reminder every once in awhile.

I think your post was well said. I will add, that many of the 50% of failed marriages fail because of nothing more complicated than run of the mill selfishness. Marriage is a partnership. The marriage partnership has interests of its own, separate from the individual interests of the partners. Thankfully, what is in the best interest of a partner is frequently in the best interest of the partnership, but not always. When one or both partners regularly put their own interests ahead of the interests of the partnership, the relationship breaks down. Both partners need to be willing to HTFU and sacrifice some of their own selfish ambition and pursuits at the alter.

4 kids and going on 18 years. My wife and I are total opposites. Marriage is hard to do. Suck it up buttercup.

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Panabax

We�ve heard that a million monkeys at a million keyboards could produce the complete works of Shakespeare; now, thanks to the Internet, we know that is not true.�Robert Wilensky

Totally disagree. I do not train together--wifey & I go two totally different paces. This is an unrealistic & unscientifically proven statement.

Thank you for this post.
And not to nitpick on OP, but everyone seems to cite this 50% divorce rate. It's really closer to 40%.

I think your very right ,I have seen 2 friends marriages end because of so called ironman but all us friends were well aware of the underlying issues.

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"Be your best cheerleader , not your worst critic.”

My post in the other thread (so you don't have to try and find it):
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I, as a womens who has been in this sport for 12+ yrs and who ended a marriage (his reason: Ironman; my reason: we grew apart and you didn't like who I became, fair nuff) pretty much here on ST, I am really torn by all the posts, especially the last one from the OP re: kids. I was going to ignore the whole thread but now I can't.

Triathlon is by its very nature a solo sport. We may train with others, but come race day, on the field of battle, it is every person for themselves. And while we are a welcoming bunch, we are also a very driven and competitive bunch, even if we only compete with ourselves. But when we are an A-type and our spouse is not, as soon as we discover this sport FULL of A-types like us, and we devote all our attention and efforts to this new thing, why are we surprised when they don't like it? or act supportive? It changes the entire dynamic of the relationship. Of course they aren't going to be supportive. Why on earth would you think they would be? Asking them to try and be supportive isn't going to work unless they are similarly minded, likewise constructed, and understand their partner for who they really are , well it just ain't gonna work.

Sometimes we enter relationships when we have a firm grasp of who we are, what makes us tick, what we love and what we hate. Many times we don't - we are naive, we think a chid or 3 will make it all work out, we hope that counselling or restricting activities we find truly satisfying will help carry the relationship.

It never does.

I honestly have come to believe that we end relationships often because we realize that we have been less than truthful about WHO WE REALLY ARE, instead being WHO WE THINK WE SHOULD BE. And triathlon, as such an individual sport, we find a space to find out WHO WE REALLY ARE. And if WHO WE REALLY ARE != WHO WE THINK WE SHOULD BE then whomever is our partner is bound to suffer. IN Japanese, we call it hansei, it is a time and space for reflection. This solo sport we all love affords us the time and space for such reflection. It also affords us the individual challenges against which we pit ourselves. Against which we test ourselves. Against which we find out just how strong, how powerful, how determined we are.

And this is how we find out WHO WE REALLY ARE.

Here endeth the lesson.

AP
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I stand by this.

AP

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"How bad could it be?" - SimpleS

So well put! Totally agree.

Amen!
Being that we can be single only once in our lives, this thread reminds me of why I never want to marry.

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DISH is how we do it.

+1

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"Though she be but little, she is fierce" ~Shakespeare | Powered by HD Coaching | 2014 Wattie Ink Triathlon Team | Facebook | Instagram | Twitter

I have a friend that said this before. He said its nauseating to hear about someone's race and the "me" attitude, as if nothing else in the world is happening. Funny you also pointed this out.

Huh? WTF did you just say? Sorry - I tried several times to read the, uh, lesson but it hurts so bad.

Isn't that like saying "because we can be non triathletes only once in our lives, all this talk of hard work, training and sacrifice reminds me of why I never want to be a triathlete"?


.

it's ok, your brain will stop hurting shortly ;-)

AP

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"How bad could it be?" - SimpleS

This has been an awesome thread, and I think everyone has made good points. I started tris after I was married and started a family. there was much resentment from my spouse and I knew that would happen. From what I've learned in my experiences, most of you have already stated. But what I can't stress enough to myself is that marriage/family is all about sacrifices. Would I love to work out 18+ hours a week sure, is it realistic for me in my situation? no. So I don't. I still get by with results that I'm happy with and basically those results are in this order: being healthy, setting an example of an active lifestyle for the kids by them seeing me train/race, and finishing a race with a realistic goal time. I train almost exclusively on my time, be it early or late or during naps. If I cant train, I can't. If theres a time where I'd like to train but it conflicts with family, I ask. I try to sacrifice what I want to do, within reason, so that I can juggle everything the best I can, and I've found that balance with my family. As others have said, it takes EFFORT, a lot, more so than training because its not FUN to sacrifice your time. I am also very conscientious of what my wife and kids what to do and accommodate them. You must give to receive as life is a give and take relationship. If my wife wants to go out, spend time with friends, do family stuff, take a nap, spend extra time after school, I always say yes to show that I support her as well no matter what I think about what she wants to do. Her sacrifice comes in being woken up, having a tired husband at times, saying ok to long weekend rides occasionally, me spending money on gear I probably don't need and expensive races, and listening to me describe my workouts.... Sacrifice must be done on both ends, and if one is more selfish than the other, it will never work, and it has nothing to do with triathlons.


Great stuff, I've learned a bunch reading this today.

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The Rat Snake:
A Tribute Race at Gilbert Lake State Park, Laurens, NY May 16 2015
Follow the Rat Snake on Twitter

I know one divorce that occured soley because of IM training. My friend became so obsessed with tris that his wife became an after-thought. Fortunately, the kids were in college. That was 3 years ago and he still doesn't have a girlfriend. Rarely dates. It's nothing but tri, tri, tri. I avoid him because tris are all he wants to talk about with me since I'm one of his few friends that does tris.

I did my first tri in "84. Loved it and did 3 more until my second child was born. It was obvious that 2 kids is 10x the work as one, so I just biked 3x a wk, while my wife ran 3x. Tris are fun; marriage and family should be your life. Keep it in perspective.

And now a word from the other side....the dark side

Wow, I am getting all teary eyed and $hit

As the veteran of two successful marriages and now happily unmarried, for the life of me I cannot see the benefit of all this hard work and sacrifice for ONE (1) person... nope, cannot see it - 50% of marriages end in divorce, the other 50% in death. I do not believe we were meant to be with the same person for life.

I go where I want, do what I want, see who I want, don't answer to nobody... and extremely happy

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"if you chose it, it's not really pain"

I knew you and your wife would never be split up by Ironman, I believe I realized that when I passed you at IMFL one year while you were getting a drafting penalty! Somehow I just thought, "He and his wife will never get divorced!" Happy Anniversary!

Did I mention the time you got a drafting penalty at IMFL?

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"Remember: a bicycle is an elegant and efficient tool designed for seeking out and defeating people who aren't as good as you."

--BikeSnobNYC

" As the veteran of two successful marriages and now happily unmarried"

huh? How do you define a "successful marriage"

+1

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Steph
Snapple Triathlon Team
Powerbar Team Elite

very interesting.....

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The Rat Snake:
A Tribute Race at Gilbert Lake State Park, Laurens, NY May 16 2015
Follow the Rat Snake on Twitter

Seven I's in one short post. Your probably better off with having no commitments. Are you still bitter about the divorce(s)?

Not even close but maybe to some. This thread is sad and reminds me of some of the reasons I have elected to remain single. I mean single in the true meaning- never married.

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DISH is how we do it.

Interesting thread to say the least. I'm divorced but it didn't have anything to do with training or tri's. From the perspective of a divorced person who is trying to date and get a relationship. Everyone is interested at first, girls like the fact that your fitter than anyone your age and younger, they love going away for weekends and seeing some races at cool places and venues and appreciate your dedication and hard work when compared other non interesting guys out there. After a couple months, something changes. And the reasons they were attracted to you in the first place are now an impediance to their wanting more time with you. And then they refer to your training as a part time job when you get 12 weeks out from your A race full IM.

Ive experienced that in 4 different relationships over the past 2 years. Just some thoughts from the other side

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Hold my Beer and watch this!

That's obviously your problem right there... it's not just about ONE (1) person.

I also take it there weren't any kids involved. Can't just divorce them.

It seems like the same problem can exist married or not.

I wonder if this thread stays alive long enough ... Everyone will go back to their families and a 12 hr IM will then be the new KQ time. Hmmmm


In all seriousness, I appreciate the posts. Please keep them coming. I'm working through my own relationship issues right now and the recent threads on relationships are helping me.

a successful marriage is one that worked well for the spouses until it stopped working, at which point, they ended it. contrast with an unsuccessful marriage which may never have really worked well for one or both spouses, and/or continued to exist long after it started to fail.

i have a friend who says of myself and my first wife "see, you guys had the perfect marriage and now you have the perfect divorce". its not entirely a joke.

Understood. IMO though, there is still a HUGE benefit to marriage...a depth of relationship, friendship, and intimacy that can only be experienced through it (meaning a lifetime vow). Definitely worth it for me, and this thread reminds me of that.

I'm just glad I didn't elect to remain a non-triathlete after hearing about the hard work, sacrifice, other peoples' DNF stories, etc.


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"a successful marriage is one that worked well for the spouses until it stopped working, at which point, they ended it."

Yeah, ummm, ok. Carry on.

you have an alternate definition? i don't mind you sitting in judgement as long as you have some kind of alternative in mind. requiring that "success" in marriage requires absolute committment until one spouse dies is an excessively narrow vision in my opinion - certainly in an era when the possibilities for personal change have widened so much and when the average life expectancy is (historically) so high. or perhaps you feel that there are no issues that occur within a marriage that cannot be addressed without ending it?

Well, it seems to me that if you have a relationship that lasts for 5 or 6 years, dating, and you have a good time but eventually have a falling out, fine you can say it was great. But marriage has a vow - death til we part & all that. That's what makes it different than dating. If you don't make it until "death til we part" then no, I would say it was less than successful.


Its akin to calling the maiden voyage of the Titanic "successful." It was, in fact, a great trip, the food was wonderful, the ship was opulent & comfortable, the passengers all enjoyed themselves tremendously. Right up until it struck the iceberg.

fair enough :)

Titanic may be an example that is unfair, because it ended in death for most.

What if I said this.... If you trained for ironman and the race didn't go well, and you had to DNF. Would you, take back all of the training and wish you never tried? Would you train harder and race IM again? If you tried again, and again, and again... and you DNF'd every time.... would you still do Ironman?

I truly believe that marriage is great. I also don't take back any experiences with my wife. But, I question that death do us part is realistic. Don't get me worng, I believe that should be true, but how much pain, or loss of other experiences that could bring joy should be endured? I think that is a more difficult question to answer.

Is it only the length of marriage that makes it a success? If you make it 25 years and sleep in separate beds? 50 years and do not talk to one another?

I'm simply saying that you can't call it a successful marriage if it ends in divorce. Death or not, the titanic is a fine example. The boat needs to get you to the other side, and despite the fact that all was well & good until disaster struck, it didn't make it. The whole point in going to the church (temple, etc) and getting married is to take the vow and make the commitment. If you fail to meet that commitment then I would not call it a success.

You can tell yourself anything you want to make yourself feel better, but if you were to DNF in an Ironman, I sincerely doubt you would call it a success. I sure wouldn't.

Edit: And I certainly understand that not every marriage can work. People change, situations change, etc. Nothing wrong with it, it doesnt mean that anyone is a bad person. I only questioned the gentleman above calling it a success even though he had two marriages end in divorce.

I think it is also very important that people recognize their limitations and know when they're not cut out for something. I'm not blissful in my marriage, but it is the best thing that ever happened to me, it is hard work but rewarding in ways I never imagined and while he drives me batfuckingcrazeee at times, I can't imagine life without him. HOWEVER, if I knew within myself that I was not cut out to share my life with someone else, it would be in Everyone's best interest if I stayed single.

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http://harvestmoon6.blogspot.com
https://www.caringbridge.org/visit/katasmit

Cheers to that Kathy!


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Well yeah, but I still had a successful swim & bike...

Reading this all makes me feel quite blessed that me and my wife share a passion for road biking, but even so we regularly need to make sure that it is a shared passion. Sometimes we both listen to our inner voice when we know that something else needs to take precedence over training, but we also find ways to ensure that we support each other's fitness time and goals. I'm not happy if my need to train has robbed her of her needs and visa versa. There is of course never enough time for everything so we try make enough time for what matters. We've been discordant at times but the interesting thing is that the best times are when we both feel quite affirmed and supported in our fitness goals.


I wish I could package it in a box for some others here, but it is a highly personal thing. I guess I'm writing to say that it is possible to very fitness minded and have an excellent marriage. Don't give up hope on this if you are feeling despondent.

I love this post so0 I can vent like everyone else. But I read another post today where which bike would be faster at kona P5 or a ridley. Wow so much thought went into the answers and I cant even imagine how much effort went into the set up and the training and money, it adds up to commitment full stop. So I don't think training and IM are the reasons for divorce, it's underlying issues that are highlighted by IM training. Just a thought

Right on to that.

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DISH is how we do it.

I love your point about 1/2 of all marriages ending in death! LOL

I nearly reached divorce, largely due to my tri addiction. If I'd realized the option was death, I probably would have opted for divorce! LOL

Now

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TriDork

"Happiness is a myth. All you can hope for is to get laid once in a while, drunk once in a while and to eat chocolate every day"

I wonder what a thread like this will look like in 15 years. There was a thing on the CBC radio a few weeks ago (can remember which show) about divorce rates. It said that the 50% number is largely influenced by couples who got married in the 70s during a period of shifting expectations about marriage (dual careers, household responsibilities etc). More recently, rates have gone down as couples a. wait longer to get married and b. are more open with each other about expectations.

With regard to triathlon I would suspect many more people are already into the sport when they get married now so there is less need for either changing expectations within the relationship or not changing and getting divorced.

It's really tough when the other half doesn't fully support the addiction.

Here is a Youtube video to cheer you up. Stay strong.

been doin tris for a few years and my chick and i are still in love thats a win...if she fucks me right its a win win nomsaiyan?! But i am on that male enhancement so Its always a win win nomsaiyan?! seeing blue haha

Same here, here's my rant.

Ironman and divorce have nothing to do with each other. If you want to be married you'll do what it takes to be married, if you don't want to be then don't be. Don't use ironman as an excuse. We all know what it takes to be an average or better triathlete. If some of the people that use ironman as an excuse were to put as much effort into their marriage as they do training, it would be a different story.

For some people, working out and racing are a stress relievers.
I think your relationship is already in trouble before you start working out and racing.

So I went back and reread #74. In reading that, it is not just "Ironman" that does this. Any activity that is long and affords the time to be reflective has the same effect. I used to hike, long distances, in the mountains, by myself. I've also done a number of multi-day, self supported cycling tours. And have gone on weekend jaunts with one of the local cycling clubs. With all activities I get to spend several hours a day with my thoughts. It gave me and continues to give me the chance to reflect on my life and all it's aspects.

So, as per many of the respondants, this is not about Triathlon's being bad for marriages rather it is about couples growing apart and NOT making the effort to continue to seek common ground and enjoyment of and with one another.

Something that is rarely discussed before marriage is the amount of effort it will take to keep a marriage going, especially once the honeymoon period is over.

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BC Don
Pain is temporary, not giving it your all lasts all Winter.

I've been happily married to a runner for 37+ yrs. She is currently doing HMs and I train for HIMs. We do our long runs together, which we love doing together. BUT, I can see how 12+ hrs wk of training, when your spouse is not an athlete or if you have kids, can put a huge additional strain on a relationship. I started doing tris around 1983. When our second daugher was born in '86, I stopped. We both continued to run, but no way would I have had time to train for tris. Looking back, I can see that I would have missed too much of our kids growing up. Priorities.....Just my 2 cents. YMMV

WTF did I just read?

The quote seems to be evidence of yet another UNCW grad that spent more time at the beach than in class... :)

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I tweet!

I was wondering the same thing....

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leslie myers
http://www.foodsensenow.com

Watch "Trailer Park Boys - The Best of J-Roc" on YouTube
https://www.youtube.com/...youtube_gdata_player

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http://en.wikipedia.org/...eoesophageal_fistula
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cerebral_palsy
2020 National Masters Champion - M40-44 - 400m IM
Canadian Record Holder 35-39M & 40-44M - 200 m Butterfly (LCM)

Haha! Thank you for that!

Why isn't there a Slowtwitch dating site already..sheesh :))

I don't know about divorce rates for triathletes but I do know that if I do end up divorced, I want to be in good enough shape to pick up a younger hottie and do stuff with her - triathlon is a way of hedging my bets.

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Remember - It's important to be comfortable in your own skin... because it turns out society frowns on wearing other people's

The posts are numbered. I never noticed before........... :-)

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He who understands the WHY, will understand the HOW.

Til death do us part.

Bingo!

Take a bow Velo E, that was very well said.

Just aged up to the 50+ AG this year. My wife is 32. We have a 2-month-old daughter. The problem isn't keeping up with the younger hottie and doing stuff with her, it's staying in god enough shape to keep up with the RESULTS of doing stuff with her...

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Some are born to move the world to live their fantasies...

https://triomultisport.com/
http://www.mjolnircycles.com/

I fought for my marriage in counseling for 3 years and worked on it for another year. I gave up. I have to live with that decision, but I felt like I would give up another decade and only teach my kids that relationships are about counseling. I told my wife when I proposed, I was proposing an idea of a life together. Through counseling, she determined my idea was a fairy tale and not reality. I am not giving up on the fairy tale.

Realize, as in my case, the difference from triathlon as marriage is that triathlon is not a team event. One person can try as hard as they want..... Limp along in pain. Puke and keep moving. Wake up everyday with high hopes of a great workout. What about the other person? Their actions change the dynamics of everything.

This is just a joke..... But, you could have voted and then drove to the hospital the day your wife was born. Weird huh. Totally not meaning anything by this comment.... Just weird when you put it in perspective.

Some of the best advice I ever got: You should associate the happiest activities in your life with your spouse. If you have a hobby that your wife simply cannot stand (after giving it a legitimate chance), then find a different hobby. Mine used to be golf; I was a single digit handicap. I gave it up because it drove my wife insane. Now, I spend nearly the same amount of time (and money) running, but because she grew up in a running family, she completely supports it. I don't miss golf one bit.

You should associate the happiest activities in your life with your spouse:
Maybe that means training together, if you are in somewhat equal physical condition.
Maybe that means one spouse supports the other by going to races, etc.

I love running, but I wouldn't go to races if my wife (and kids) didn't genuinely enjoy coming to them and often participating. Of course, physical fitness is one of the things that drew us together in the first place. These posts about folks not realizing that their spouse was a couch potato until after they were already married are making me cringe. I'm no Dr. Phil, but that seems like the kind of thing that might come up while they are dating...

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�What comes into our minds when we think about God is the most important thing about us.� -A.W. Tozer
"The best things in life make you sweaty." -Barbara W.
"I was never great at math, so I had to learn to run faster." -Robbie Sandlin
�Life is like a 10-speed bicycle. Most of us have gears we never use.� Charles Schultz

Very interesting thread. I have been divorced for 13yrs, and it was a nasty one with 2 young children. I was at the time a professional athlete but not with Tri, another sport. I think that all professional athletes and or very committed amatures have something in common. The desire, the passion to win or to do your personal best.

I went to a shrink to talk things over when going through my hard times and she said something interesting to me. She said this "on the track you would run a competitor over to win, crush him if you had to, to win.......its in your blood, your dna to compete. When you come home you have to sometimes cross the finnish line together with your spouse. Don't take the race home" What she meant was that I was taking the race home to my wife...now ex-wife. That was my problem.

She said to me most marrages fail with athletes in general, not just triathletes, all athletes. What ever sport we do, we are hardcore and being a hardcore competitor at home will have difficulties.

50 years old with a 32 year old...Man you got skills brother. pics pls. If your piece is big enough and you know how to use it properly your marriage will work. I said what all the women were thinking so boys...get your pieces together if you need a male enhancement do your research.

Are you out of high school yet?

So 75% of Ironman finishers are divorced?

Maybe I should stay on my current team. 75% of us are still with our first spouse. I will remain so as long as I don't offer unsolicited advice to my IMAZ training wife.

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Yours in golf,
PGA_MIKE
Couch Potato to IM SPUD in 4 years

Excellent point.

If your piece is big enough and you know how to use it properly your marriage will work. I said what all the women were thinking so boys�


Wow, thanks for the insight.

What about those of us who didn't marry a brainless rhino? Should we consider a more cerebral approach or just follow your lead and keep them tied round the back of the trailer?

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https://www.pbandjcoaching.com
https://www.thisbigroadtrip.com

Been happily married for 21+ years, and couldn't disagree more. My wife loves tennis, and I suck at it. She likes to walk, and recreational swim, but has no interest in endurance sports. We each need our own space, interest, and relationships (friend stuff, not the other). Interesting how different folks get the same desired results with opposite approach.

On a somewhat separate note, we've enjoyed 14+ years of the "tri life". But, I was on my "A" game for only a few years. It would not have worked if I was full speed all those years. Even when I KQ'd, I averaged only 12-13 hours/week. For me personally, and I know others that make it work, my marriage, work, family, and sanity would not survive year-after-year of 15-18 hours/week training.

I accept a challenge of "how loud I can whisper" - meaning I have a box of 6-10 hours/ week with some occasional mega blocks. But that's all I can do in my balanced life. I like to see how fast I can go within that box. Edit: I also like my sleep and relaxed downtime. I know I could squeeze out another 5 hours/week to train, but just not me anymore.

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Damn, that's a cold ass honkey.

"Tennis lessons", huh? Is that what she calls it?

(Sorry, on my iPad, not sure how to make my letters pink. Totally joking.)

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�What comes into our minds when we think about God is the most important thing about us.� -A.W. Tozer
"The best things in life make you sweaty." -Barbara W.
"I was never great at math, so I had to learn to run faster." -Robbie Sandlin
�Life is like a 10-speed bicycle. Most of us have gears we never use.� Charles Schultz

This! I was in a short lived marriage when I became a runner a few years ago. We grew apart and I saw that my husband didn't support me "paying" to run races when I could just run for myself. Our different mentality on challenging ourselves came out and we soon fell apart. I'm now in a relationship with a triathlete and its the reason I got into triathlon training in the first place! I really believe that being on a similar training schedule is the best scenario but if both people don't have the same interests, both people have to be support of the others. That is why I believe marriages do fail relating to athletic training.

A few years ago, we got someone to cut our grass. I asked if we could outsource the rest of my spousal duties so I could train more...

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Damn, that's a cold ass honkey.

I have been married 24 years and completed 2 iron distance race, 5 or so marathons and tons of shorter races. My wife does not run, bike or swim. Things are very good, especially now that we have an empty nest. If you love each other and respect each other it is certainly possible. I will say I was pretty tired today, ran 12.5 then went shopping.

Shopping after running for 12.5 miles??? You sir, are a machine!

It is possible my wife would agree. :)

Very nicely stated.
I think as some others has said it very much depends upon circumstances and there are obviously limitless ones.
if it is genuinely causing disruptions in the relationship due to missed events or lack of attention to the fundamental structure of the relationship then it should be discussed and compromise attempted.
The thought that a spouse does not support the other because they are excelling,have increased self-esteem,image,etc. or feel that the athletic spouse should spend all of their time with the other as "quality" time,shouts of an underlying issue with insecurity,low self-esteem.
We marry the person in front of us,NOT the person we want them to be or that they can be molded into.

Terry

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"You are never too old to set another goal or to dream a new dream" - Les Brown
"Discipline is the bridge between goals and accomplishment" - Jim Rohn

Great post.

Todd

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Seen on ST: NOTSOSWUYD: None of the secrets of success work unless you do.

Good for you. And you're certainly not alone in how you felt, that's for sure. :/ Many people take for granted that everyone around them is happy and being in that sort of situation really sucks. I've been there.

I've run into the problem where my wife used to be a big-time athlete all the way through college. Now, she has no hobbies or anything notable to speak of. I started training a few years ago and she's never been very supportive. Eventually, she admitted she was jealous because SHE used to be the athlete. There's a lot more to it, but that was a telling moment for me.

Jealously is a real challenge. I'm still trying to find a way to get my wife motivated to do something active or find some hobby. Some women really are content on being great moms/parents as the focus of their life... but most are not. I'm not saying that they don't love to be moms or love their children, but it they don't want that to define them. My wife's job took a turn where she no longer enjoys it, and it's really created a large gap in her life.

My compromise is that in 2 years, I hang it up.. or at least bakc it down ot rational traiing volumes where he schedule and commitments are priority... and it's "her turn" to be committed to a goal or hobby.

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TrainingBible Coaching
http://www.trainingbible.com

THIS.

I created an account just to post to this thread. My marriage is on its last legs. It started last year when I trained for an ironman. I did my absolute best to balance time for training and my husband (no kids). I skipped workouts to spend time with him, I made sure there was a home-cooked meal for him on the table 95% of the time. He was unhappy but he never told me in a productive way; all I would hear were things like "You bike too much", "You're working out AGAIN?" etc. (He told me he supported me doing an IM but I'm not sure he knew what he was in for.) I would try to spend more time with him but he wouldn't want to do anything but sit around and watch tv. All the time he could have spent developing his own interests and he just sat around and got depressed.

Thought it would be better after the race. It didn't. When I said I would cut down on the training, I think he thought I'd work out a few times a week, like normal people. I still ran marathons and a 50k and shorter tris. To me, that WAS a huge cutback compared to IM training. I tried to make him happy and tried to spend time with him but he was angry and pushed me away. Our communication was shot. I got very depressed and started focusing more on myself to feel better. We put a huge wedge between ourselves that we've been trying to repair but nothing is working. Weekly counseling is not working. I cut way back on training and try to train more while he's at work (we work slightly different schedules). It's not helping. It's still not good enough. He wants me home more just to be there sitting around. He still has no passions or interests of his own to speak of and his self-esteem is incredibly low. I've always known that but completing an IM, and spending time with more go-getters like me, has shone a HUGE light on the difference between us. He does not inspire me or make me a better person and obviously I can't do the same for him. I'm about to cut and run because we don't have kids and I can't see us being happy without one or the other sacrificing who we are.

Without wanting to sound harsh, if this man wants somebody to sit next to him while he watches TV you should get him a dog.

I'm in a similar situation, but perhaps with a few key differences. It's true that I have found my passion and my partner hasn't found hers yet. But we also have a little girl together, and whilst I love my hobby I love my daughter much much more, so trying to train without interrupting that is a difficulty. Lots of what I do is at night time, and if I want to ride 2+ hrs at the weekend I'm getting up very early. But my girlfriend IS proud of me, and she DOES want me to live my dreams. And we do love each other very much. She just doesn't want it screw up our family, and doesn't want to be left doing all the housework and staying at home so that I can ride my bike. Fair enough. But it is really, really difficult. To the point that I am not going to race full distance in the immediate future, which is my own choice.

But if she simply wanted me to sit around and do nothing whilst she sat around and did nothing, I'd wonder where on her scale of priorities my happiness was. What you describe doesn't sound like somebody wanting you to spend time with them, it sounds like somebody wanting you to be as unhappy as they are.

No kids? Get out of there and meet someone from your club!

It's just harder than all that. I still love him, and the fact that I'm on my way out the door (I moved out and everything) is breaking his heart. At the same time, he needs to help himself. He wants me to reach my goals but he doesn't have anything that he does where I can return the favor and be supportive. Truthfully, I'm not sure that he even knows what he wants, except that he's unhappy (you're right), but I can't fix that for him.

I told my therapist this story: a while back, we were running together - he does run a little although he doesn't have the love for it that I do - and we were running up a hill. He was struggling; meanwhile, a good song came on my ipod so I was smiling and dancing up the hill. He snapped at me, "Just go!!!" because I'm faster than him and he was angry that I was happy while he was struggling. The solution to him isn't for him to find a way to be happier, it's for me to find a way to be unhappier. He'll say it's not so but deep down, that's been our whole marriage. I was unhappy and unhealthy when we met 6 years ago; as I grew, I've always been the one to concede and when I started doing things for me, it drove us apart.

As for my club....all married, gay, or crazier than I am. I'm a 16:28 Ironman. I would be faster if I threw my life more out of balance but for an endurance athlete, I have to say that I train more on the hobby level and am content to be in the back of the pack. The fun people are all back there anyway. So I know myself well enough to know that I'm not going to click with a sub-3 marathoner who follows a strict diet plan. But I'm not doing well with Mr. Passionless, either. Someone in between like me, perhaps???

Your husband does not appear to respect you or your passions. That is a shame. You seem to be very motivated and have found something you love to do. You are doing the right thing by moving out (if I read your post correctly). He needs to reevaluate the priorities in his life. If he cannot come to terms with who you are and who you want to be, then you are better off finding someone new. Both of you will be happier in the end.

This has nothing to do with your time commitment for IM training/racing. I believe your husband is trying to hold you back so he doesn't feel the need to motivate himself. As others have posted, IM training, while very time consuming and intensive, will probably not lead to divorce unless there are other underlying factors brewing.

if you are training together, talk to each other and do not listen to your own music on you iPod. You might as well just go out and run by yourself. I would consider it offensive if my partner who is running with me whislt she would be fitter is listening to her music.

/counseling-mode on
By the sound of it, there are deeper issue's between you and him then just the training/time-spent and unless you speak directly to and with each other in private with no referee or guidance around, no amount of counceling will help you guys out. Get the frustration out of each other.

I'm happy that my current partner is very supportive and also very athletic. She understands and knows first-hand what it takes to achieve something in sports. IT does not mean we don't have arguments about it, but I am sure I discuss upfront and before making my race-calendar what it all means and it's implications. That way, it becomes unfair behaviour blaming afterwards when the training-days are getting reaaly long.

As athletes, we are perfectly able to take the training-load, but we are also people who need a stable emotional environment. It takes support and understanding to reach your emotional balance so you an get the best out of your body. That is exactly why top-athletes are supported by strong spouses/friends and even an mental coach.

I can't tell you what to do, I think you know what to do, but you are holding on a bit. You need to make a clear-cut choice and be straight and open about it. To everyone. I have not been in the beginning at the end of my marriage. FWIW: She was very supportive, but very un-sporty. It caused additional emotional harm and made it dag on longer then it needed to be. Not because I wanted to hurt her, but only because I wanted to soften the "blow". It had exactly the opposite effect of what I wanted to achieve.

/counseling-mode off

I'm not trying to bash you, but your posts come across something like "I'm an Ironman now, I deserve better." Maybe this is completely not the case. You obviously were crazy about this guy when you married him, doing some bike riding shouldn't have changed that.

Let me give you my example...I went from sedentary to a cat 2 bike racer (FOP in tri terms) in about 3 years with the same girlfriend the whole time. She didn't suddenly take up bike racing (and I never asked her to) and our relationship was still great. I don't want to have a girlfriend to train with. I want a girlfriend who I like to spend time with when I'm not training.

I eventually broke up with that girlfriend for reasons that had nothing to do with my training. I am in a relationship now with an awesome girl- she runs and works out and it really doesn't matter to me what she does. I obsess over riding 4 hours vs 5 and if my FTP is 300 or 320, she is none of that and it works out perfectly.

-Physiojoe

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-Physiojoe
Instagram: @thephysiojoe
Cycling coach, Elite racer on Wooster Bikewerks p/b Wootown Bagels

Sounds like a mutually destructive marriage. The tough part is you say that you still love him but from what I've read, he doesn't really care all that much for himself. And, you may be enabling that to some extent.

Something I have more experience with is people and jobs. I've hired a number of folks and "helped" others to move on. When there isn't a fit between a person and their job, whether that be because the job has evolved and they haven't (similar I think to your case) or the person doesn't have the skills (not usually the case) or the person doesn't get along with others (more often the case) a number of things happen. First, everyone is somewhat miserable, employees ask why that person is still there and the person dislikes coming into the office. Although they will fight to keep their job, when they do move on and look back at the situation a year or so later, they are much happier, in fact everyone is. It's like "staying together for the kids", everyone sees the problem and are miserable and it doesn't work.

Added to that, you've been to councillors. If you've been to councilling and can't work it out, time to split and move on.

FYI, I've been married over 40 years. My wife has absolutely nothing to do with anything athletic. I, on the other hand, well, do Triathlons. But, she is fine with me training and not sitting in front of the boob tube for hours at a time (although there are a couple of shows we watch). We take vacations where I hit the gym or swim or run while she reads a book or listens to a podcast. We'll go for walks to see sites but that's the extent of her exercise.

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BC Don
Pain is temporary, not giving it your all lasts all Winter.

I was in her position 4-5mo ago. It's not because of the triathlon, not because of the Ironman. It's because she's found a passion, rediscovered something about herself, lit a new flame.....he's worried about being left behind. He apparently leans on you for a big piece of his identity - if he's not with you (& you're not with him) then who is he? You've found an answer to that & that's a scary thing for the person that feels left out. That starts the depression/insecurity....& it only grows as the distance between you gets wider. You've found something that does make you a better person, something that helps round out who you think you are. He feels like he's losing you in that process & that leaves him lost.

People were meant to grow, evolve, learn.....when we have someone else in our lives we make the decision to either do that together or apart. Both partners need their own interests, their own passions....sometimes those are the same, sometimes they aren't. But everyone needs their own identity. If you've found part of yours & he can't support, appreciate or enjoy that....much less if he makes you feel guilty for having found a passion & enjoying it...then it's sad.

It's not easy but you can't make someone appreciate a passion unless they want to - unless they try to understand it & are secure enough to understand that it doesn't have to weaken your bond & that it would be him that you come home to if it didn't make you feel bad for being who you are.

Good luck....I can say this part is the pits....but the other side of it is wide open. Find what makes you smile & run after that with your whole heart. Those that are worthy will be there.

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AW

Wait, dude can't keep up with a 16-1/2 hour IM chick? What, is he an AARP candidate, or carrying a heavy backpack? I kid, I kid ~ sort of.

Just drop the fat turd already. Sounds harsh, but you know that's what you're saying already anyway, only beating around the bush about it looking for validation here... Well you have it.

and just because they might want to be moms and focus on kids it doesn't mean forever. I totally focused on the kids until the youngest was 6 and then started exercising. When she was 9 I did my first triathlon and first IM. Now it is ME time. :) I have been doing an IM every year since 2010 but I work from home so I'm around the kids, but they know that dad really is the go-to person. people can change but I'll never consider myself a triathlete (and especially not an ironman). I'm a MOM and most proud of that.

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http://harvestmoon6.blogspot.com
https://www.caringbridge.org/visit/katasmit

+1000

I've been there, done that, and am so happy after moving on. After 14 years, I realized that he's never once met me at the finish line of a race and missed a dozen other milestones in my life that were important to me (grad school graduations, big promotions, etc). He promised to come to my IM this year (#3) and backed out again (also backed out on the others). That was the breaking point for me. We tried counseling, I took a year off from it, I've supported his hobbies for years (and they are time sucks, too), and been 100% behind him in raising his son from a previous relationship. When people asked me about races or anything positive in my life, he flat out walked away like he couldn't even listen to it. The resentment was pallable. IM didn't cause it but it sure made me more aware of his BS attitude about supporting your significant other. Some people aren't happy unless everyone else around then is as unhappy as them - and he seems pretty miserable with his life but won't do any work to make it better. I woke up about 2 months ago, completely done with it and broke it off (no kids btw us either). After 14 years, you'd think it would be hard to do but I can honestly say I've been happier in these last 2 months then I've been in 14 years. I'm only bummed that I put up with it as long as I did.

I read somewhere a quote that said, "some of the loneliest times in my life have been while I'll was in a relationship". So very true.

Your story is mine and I am having a very hard time coping with the distance. We have only been married a year and it's falling apart all around me.

I'm never getting married then. I prefer training over dealing with angry women

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Make Inside Out Sports your next online tri shop! http://www.insideoutsports.com/

Give you marriage a chance.

I've been married 34 years and my first year of marriage was the hardest. It was an adjustment period. I can't imagine training for an ironman and being a newlywed.

Never say never!! There are a lot of great ladies (and guys) out there....I'm super lucky and happy to have a partner that supports me, work, hobby's etc!

Life is so much better have some one at home......

I'd forgotten about this thread, but it was a good time to revisit it. An update on me: my divorce should be final on 5/5. It'll be the day after my 5th marathon this year. (7th since I left.) Obviously I've picked the running up about 10 notches since I left. :) It's been incredibly hard - I tell people I'd rather do five Ironmans in a row with no seat on my bike than go through that ever again. Still is hard. I'm not convinced that I need to find another runner/triathlete but I am convinced that I need to find someone with some kind of passion for life. In the meantime, I've met some wonderful people at races - male and female - and surrounding myself with some positivity reminds me that there's more in the world than the narrow world I was stuck in. I joined the Marathon Maniacs and that's like a big ol' family. I've also PR'd at the 13.1, 26.2 and 50k distance. I would like to get back into tris; running has just been easier and involved less thought and has been my best stress relief now. It's been a hard road, but I also feel a lot more like me than I have in years.

Looking at another Ironman down the road. Also looking at revisiting the world travel dreams I had put on hold. Signed up for the Paris Marathon lottery and got in for next year, so I'll see where life takes me. I'm 32; plenty of time to chase my dreams. All of them.

I probably look through entirely too oversimplified lenses but after reading this entire thread it seems to come down to independent people and dependent people. You can't combine the two and expect lasting results without major changes to someone's nature, which isn't likely either.

Kudos to that, man, I'm raising a glass of nuun for every word of it :) going through the same these days, so this thread helps ALOT ,thanks for sharing it. Passion for life and all those awesome crazy ppl around, right.

When I first became married, my husband was a closet smoker -especially while I was out on century rides.

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Proud Representative of Slowtwitch Anti-Atheists Society.

Actually, I often think that's harder when you have two serious athletes and kids. I divorced and remarried long ago when I was a runner. At the time I thought if I ever remarried it would have to be to some fit runner lady. Then I met someone who was my complete opposite but complemented me in practically everyway. My wife is overweight (and was when I met her) and her hobbies are nothing more exciting than reading and cooking. She is my best friend and I wouldn't trade her for anyone. She supported my running then and my switch to triathlons 7 years ago. Whatever race I want to do she is 100% behind me. She is as much a fixture at the LBS as I am. We'll be celebrating our 19th wedding anniversary this summer.

Marriage is the chief cause of divorce. - Frank Burns

'Couples that tri together stay together'

There.
Fixed for ya 2.5 years later :)




.

I agree the training (or not) part is a red herring to whether you're really of compatible temperament or not. Traning together makes for a nice sound bite, and it *could* be the source of a deeper bond, but not necessarily at all. I know athletic couples who train together (or did at one time) and it still works great over many years, but others who were once compatible athletically but came unraveled when trying to balance having a kid or two, and then suddenly got very petty and insecure with each other about who got to do what training and when while the other had to "take one for the team" and so forth, or when other training partners were added to the mix.

The fact that they were both runners or bikers may have looked like a good match at first, but really it was pretty superficial. People who are too 'married' to their training or athletic goals and have their sense of self tied up in that don't always do very well when they have to take a back seat to someone else sometimes ~ even if that other person has similar interests, because it's just not possible for everything to be perfectly even or fair 100% of the time (especially if/when kids or job conflicts are ever involved). The ones I know who are still successful have been able to get along when one or the other of them had to scale way back on training due to kids and/or work, and recognizing that after years of uneven training like that, they often weren't able to do things 'together' like they used to because their fitness levels were too incompatible ~ yet they still remained supportive of one another at whatever level/activity that happened to be at the time.

Completely agree! My first marriage lasted 2 years. I picked up running when we were newlyweds and wanted to enter races. Ex-husband thought running was great but paying to run (aka race fees) were ridiculous and didn't encourage me. That was an underlying problem that I should have seen coming but I we were both so inactive when we were dating, I didn't think anything would change.

When I started dating again, I looked for runner athletes because I knew we'd have something in common. A year and a half later, I'm training for my first half iron on my boyfriend's triathlon team. Yes, it helps that we have a similar training schedule but I think even if I didn't join him, I would have supported him. I loved being his sherpa last year (hence the screen name) and only picked up the sport myself because I wanted to do it for me. I'm completely positive that if I weren't training along side with him, I would be supportive of him. I can't predict the future but I do think that at some point, I'm going to be a triathlon spouse because he has more passion towards the sport and I have more passion to procreate. :-)

The insensitive clod! Exercise is drinking Diet Coke.

Amen to this post:

If I put into my marriage what I put into my training, we would be continuous honeymooners.

This is going on the bathroom mirror! Thank you.

Are you serious or are you writing a script for the Naked Gun?

"Ed: Doctors say that Nordberg has a 50/50 chance of living, though there's only a 10 percent chance of that."

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My Blog

Nicest post I have read in a very long time!

That is great! You are lucky, she definitely sounds like a keeper :-)