....Also, I couldn't agree more with what devashish laid out. I don't like to pimp my writing around on the forum, but I did write a somewhat recent piece for Xtri on this topic, so I figured I would share it on this thread. http://greaterthanendurance.blogspot.com/...b-interview-and.html

I am always transparent when commenting on threads like this because you guys are older and wiser than me, but this was interesting to say the least. When I was interviewing for jobs last winter most employers *loved* the multisport slant; more powerful on my resume than having worked at McKinsey (no joke). That said, when one hospital system asked me if I was planning on getting divorced, I was completely thrown off. Didn't end up taking that job...

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Brad Stulberg
Author, Peak Performance
http://www.BradStulberg.com

racing doesn't kill mariages..... leaving your wife home with 4kids that are being absolute hellions does!

doesn't matter WHAT you are doing if the end result is a pissed off wife left at home.

......and this is why i drink beer and sit around a campfire with my wife and kids instead of getting those long rides and runs in.


Tim

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Tim

The othe 50% end in death.

I got into triathlon to keep me busy enough so I did not do something stupid like getting married again.

My experience, after 30 years of marriage, is if folks do not find things they share, then when the kids leave for college, a much larger percentage of folks are getting divorced now. (At least that is what I am reading in articles now). I also strongly believe that any activity that is so self focused, whether it is IM training, lots of work hours, etc. may end up bad at the end. I got married for we, not me. I got married because it was better to compromise the me things to do the we things especially with family.

I am right now at Disneyland with my Granddaughter. My wife asked if I wanted to bring my bike or running shoes. I said no, I need to save my energy chasing around my granddaughter so she, my wife, and my daughter and husband can enjoy the park. This will be the first time in about a year I will not be exercising for me for 5 days. (Now I am carrying around my garmin since I am interested in how many miles per day we will walk).

I wife goes to basically all my races that I have done the last 15 years. She helps at all the races and it has become a major social activity for us.

I just cannot relate to the folks who say they need there long bike rides by themselves on the weekends. For the folks who are married around 20 years, you are heading into the next big test when the kids go off to college, and one finds out if you still enjoy doing things with your spouse. For the ones who get divorced, it sure messes up the future family stuff when the grandkids come, IMO.

So, off to see Mickey and Mini for 3 full days.

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Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

Boom Nutrition code 19F4Y3 $5 off 24 pack box | Bionic Runner | PowerCranks | Velotron | Spruzzamist

Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep

I didn't read what AndyPants said in that other thread, but my Ironman journey definitely changed me too, and I was the spouse that asked for the divorce.

I decided to do a sprint tri after watching the Sydney olympics - I was just over 30, with a new baby, and fat. The gold medal winner had just had a baby 10 months ago, so I identified with her to some degree, and thought if she could win a gold medal, I could at least get off my fat ass. Prior to that, there had been nearly no regular physical activity since college. Looking back, I think I was going through a depressed period in my 20's and early 30's. Whether I can thank the exercised induced endorphins, the structure of training, the time allowed to take for myself, I was able to slowly climb out. As the fog lifted and I became more involved and more fit and moving up to longer distances, my husband stayed stagnant. He was supportive at first but then got sick of it, whether because of the time spent or because he could tell I was changing inside as well as outside, I don't know. Or maybe I wasn't changing, maybe I was just growing up, becoming more clear on who I was, who he was, and what was good for me.

6 years later and my 1st Ironman finish complete, the turning point for me was an anniversary party for my best friend and her Ironman husband (who was one of my training partners). The host asked us to go around the room and say what we loved best about our spouse. Every wife in that room seemed to have something special to say about her husband - he is passionate, he is loyal, he is goal-oriented, he is warm and caring, he is a good provider, he is a good father, etc. I excused myself to go to the rest room before the question came around to me, and I hid in there for a while, because all I could think to say was that my husband was funny. He wasn't any of those things, but he sure was funny! It was like a cold glass of water dumped on my head. From that day on I couldn't look at him the same way without finding something inadequate. 2 years later, by then a 2 time IM, I told him "I can't do this anymore."

He blames Ironman for the divorce, but I can't imagine what my life would be like if I had stayed on that unhealthy, depressed path.

  
If I put into my marriage what I put into my training, we would be continuous honeymooners.


.

This! We've been together 19 years or so (not sure when we got married) and I got into IM last year. So far we're going strong and our issues (we all have them) have nothing to do with training. Key is to keep communication open and BE open, trust and care. Does he say incredibly STUPID and hurtful stuff? Hell yes. But I know his mouth to brain filter is totally absent and he does not mean to come off the way he does so I respond to his heart instead of his mouth. Though there are times I give him hell for his mouth (and he takes it because he knows I'm right).

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http://harvestmoon6.blogspot.com
https://www.caringbridge.org/visit/katasmit

Been married 36 years: empty-nesters and financially comfortable.

My wife and I each have our own unique hobbies and interests. She is supportive of my training and racing mostly because she sees the resultant health benefits.

But she has only has attended two races that I can think of in the past eight years. It really doesn't bother me that she isn't actively supportive of my triathlon activities; I really don't need her support to validate my interest in the sport.

And quite frankly, triathlon isn't really a great spectator sport and I think it would be inconsiderate to expect her to get up before dawn to attend my races just to be bored the whole time.

Her biggest complaint about my triathlon participation has been the piles of old race shirts and running shoes that I've accumulated over the years that take up space in the closet.


Out of consideration, I do try to train at times that don't interfere with other common activities. I'm a morning person and get up early to train both during the week and on weekends. She likes to sleep in on the weekends which allows me to get up early and get a run or ride in before she rolls out of bed at 9AM.

Somehow it has worked over the years. I think that mutual respect had a lot to do with it, plus we're best friends in addition to being married. If we were ever to split up it wouldn't have anything to do with my participation in triathlon.

Mark

My experience, after 30 years of marriage, is if folks do not find things they share, then when the kids leave for college, a much larger percentage of folks are getting divorced now.

True.

There is a large wave of tale-end of the baby-boom people who have been married, have "stayed together for the kids" then ounce they are empty-nesters they get divorced very soon after the last kid goes off to college or leaves the family home. In fact, on college campuses there is a cottage industry of counselors having to deal with, the kids of these parents, who are now terribly guilt ridden, now realizing there parents, lived perhaps many many years through a loveless marriage, just for them. Also, because role-modelling in the home is so potent and powerful, these kids also may have odd or different ideas of what is a great, close and intimate relationship, depending on how good or bad their parents acting abilities are.

Few married couples getting divorced consider the impacts on their children. Depending on what happens, they can be either heavily or subtly impacted, with some pretty serious long term ramifications.

Here's four scenarios:

1. Happily married couple, everything 100% good staying together forever. Typically and as one would suspect, this gives kids the best opportunity.

2. The amicable divorce, where lines of communication are always good, kids needs in the divorce are always put first - kids fair almost as good in this situation as in #1

3. The bad divorce - where the bitterness, and bad communication just go on and on and on, even years after the divorce - there has been noted and significant issues with many kids from this scenario.

4. The Stick-It-Out-For-The-Kids option: Sounds good on paper, but as noted above, role-modeling is a powerful influencer and learning situation for kids. They pick up on everything and see everything going on in the home. Unless you both are Academy Award winning actors, some not-so-good messaging and role-modelling will be picked up on. The kids will think that your contrived idea of a marriage is normal. If they have been fooled, then you get the trauma-delayed impact noted above in college or shortly after they leave home!

I have been working on #2 for many years. It has not been easy. It's had it's challenges. I've had to relearn a lot of things and lean a lot about myself. Set many things aside, delay and put-off many others. And first and foremost, keep the needs of my son, always in the forefront of what I do. Over the long term it's been worth it for him, and for me.

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Steve Fleck @stevefleck | Blog

[Couples that train together stay together.

Could not agree more!
]

Says who? Do you have stats available other than n=1 to backup your statement?

Fred.

It isn't just Ironman. Ironman can teach people they are tougher than they thought and maybe that is enough to get them out of a dead marriage. But a lot of things can do that.

I agree with Jen's statement ^^ Sometimes we stay in relationships because we are too afraid or insecure to leave. Once we discover how strong we truly are, it may give us the push we need to get out of a stale relationship. They say the journey is everything and I believe that it isn't just a journey about finding your physical strength but also about discovering more about ourselves than we knew. And then seeing the truth in our lives.

Nicely worded piece of literature there Mr.Paul.
I reckon you could ork as a marriage counsellor on the side :)

Terry

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"You are never too old to set another goal or to dream a new dream" - Les Brown
"Discipline is the bridge between goals and accomplishment" - Jim Rohn

Steve, I liked this post a lot. I'm in the #2 slot myself, though remarried for nearly 8 years as part of a 10 year old relationship.

I'm also the child of divorced parents, and one thing I would add is that both for myself and every single other child of divorced parents that I know, our parents' divorce was a source of personal strength and "character building" for us. It forced early emotional maturation, greater independence, and a recognition that you cannot just rely on your parents for everything (sometimes, for anything). I firmly believe that I would a lesser person than I am had my parents not divorced.

My own amicable divorce was made a lot easier by two things. One was the profound insight that forgiveness really benefits the foregiver more than the forgiven - it was such a relief to get over my anger and resentment at my daughter's mother, and made me so much happier. The other was to understand how a quote from Margaret Mead applied to my own life. She was on a TV show in the early 1970's and the rather younger interviewer commented on her "three failed marriages". She stopped the interviewer by saying "no, that's not right". "Well, it says here that you've ... ". "No, I had three very successful marriages". We live longer, and have so much more potential for personal change in this modern world - its a truly exceptional relationship that can last as long as we expect them to these days. I've joked with my wife that modern marriages vows should be structured more along the lines of "till death do us part, or some other momentous personal transformation makes this no longer a sensible arrangement for any of us" :)

In my case, athletic activity had nothing to do with the divorce, and in fact sharing it has been a fairly central part of both my marriages so far. My first wife and I rode bikes together (we met doing so, in fact), and my current wife did her first Ironman based on the conviction that I would teach her how to ride ("race") a bike.

I understand that the "Couples who train together stay together" works for some (though where do kids fit in there?) but for us it's nice for each of us to have our own space part of the time. I like to think of it as a healthy flexible partnership rather than 24/7 dependency.

I've only very rarely had my fam with me at races, cuz I know they're boring as hell to "watch"; mostly just standing around waiting, with only brief glimpses of action. Of course it'd be nice for me to see them at the finish, but making them put up with the rest of it would be even more selfish than the time I already take away for training.

Here's another view. I feel somewhat unbiased because I have not done a triathlon since the 1900's but I still love to keep up-to-date on what's happening.

I am going to over-generalize to make my point, but I think this is fairly accurate...

• The number of triathlete's that are type A personalities compared to the general population is quite high. Type A personalities are often focused on themselves more than they are on others. This does not go well will many marriages, friendships etc.
• Triathlete's seem to see themselves as better than others by training a crazy number of hours per week and thinking that they are healthier than others because of it. The simple fact is that this excess is more counter productive to ones health than moderate exercise combined with a healthy diet and sleep regime. The me, me, me attitude can be a turn off to be around.
• Further to the me, me, me behavior, I always get a kick out of eavesdropping on many AG'ers conversations. It is amazing how good they believe they are and how much better they believe they are compared to others. Somehow, doing an Olympic distance event or an IM and taking 50% longer than the pros gives them bragging rights in society. I can only imagine what kind of spouse they would have to have to accommodate that personality.

Just a different view.

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Adrian in Vancouver

This exactly for us. Spouse does not go to races and would never ask her too. She supports the training as she knows it makes me happy, and mutual respect of each others' interests is paramount (not participation) and do it at times that does not interfer with "out time" which includes dinners, date nights, walks, etc. Works great for us. Also helps we are now empty nesters and more free time for us.

Ding!
Ding!
Ding!

BINGO!
We have a winner!


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It really doesn't matter does it? When a door closes new ones open; opportunities!!

After reading this thread, I was surprised that nobody mentioned how a divorce affects your kids (for couples that do have kids), and how that should factor into your decision. It's not just about ironman and exercising. Your decision to get divorced has the greatest affect on the kids (although I've never been divorced so I can't say that with 100% certainty). I'm 25 and my parents got divorced several years ago while I was in college. I'm used to it at this point, but it still sucks and I wish it never happened. It totally screws up family relationships, not just between you and your spouse. Think about that before you get divorced.

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my strava

Did you read post #35?

It would seem to apply directly to you!

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Steve Fleck @stevefleck | Blog

My wife and I had been doing tris together for many years until I retired from racing this year but we still bike together regularly and she's still racing. All I can say is its nice to have a spouse into the same things you are (we also scuba dive together) but is not the deal maker in a relationship. I've seen relationships were both were triathletes but the couple still split up.

Good points, I didn't see your response before replying. I hit the reply button this morning when I got to work, but never got around to writing anything until later on. Good to see that some people are considering the impacts.

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my strava

Personally I don't think there is a link between divorce rate and Ironman training / racing. All that IM does is provide a trigger (perhaps fuse is a better metaphor) to something that has already started. If you didn't do IM, something else would be the trigger point.

Couples drift apart for many reasons, and my experience has been that it is not usually one thing that does it but a lot of things that build up over time.

Oh, I think our 40th anniversary is next year. Six kids, (2 adopted to delay empty nest syndrome) and now 8 Grandkids. You may have noticed the wording. The "Aniversary Number" is unimportant to both of us, it just is. My son started getting into Triathlons a couple of years ago, I did 3 Sprints this year and have committed to a half next year. My wife comes out to Tris if they are in town, that's it. And is not interested in training at all. For my birthday this past weekend she presented me with a scrapbook of pictures and memorabilia from my Tris this summer (I really need to remember to look like I'm having fun). So, I get support. Sure, you could say that with me doing a few sprints that I'm not into the training regime some of you are but over the years my "hobbies" have consumed a lot of resources (Financial and time wise). Let's see, Motorcycles including long trips (Mexico to Canada) and breaking a collar bone othe race track, RC controlled planes and Helicopters (fly on weekends, fix during the week), hiking the West Coast Trail & others (hours of self supported 2 and 3 day weekends in the mountains and training in the evenings), doing an MBA while working full time, hockey (playing, coaching and reffing all at the same time), skiing (weekends and some week nights) and others - you get the idea though, all time consuming with associated costs. My wife wasn't interested in any of these other than I did get her hiking for a bit. She prefers quilting, sewing, bird watching, and other similar activities.

Anyway, the point is that, in our relationship, we both do things that we like to do (I don't understand why anyone would like gardening, I'd rather slit my wrists lengthwise). We go out for coffee on the weekends, do stuff with the Grandkids together, sometimes walk, watch some TV, trips to Mexico sometimes but we are not that dependent upon each other for entertainment or self-esteem.

N+1 I suppose.

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BC Don
Pain is temporary, not giving it your all lasts all Winter.

This isn't an indictment against anyone in particular, but rather against every one, myself included, in a nation where only half of us will stay married:


I know there are a lot of accomplished triathletes here on slowtwitch. A whole lot of real hard asses who would not quit an ironman if you chopped one of their legs off half-way through the run. They will train for a year to target one 8 to15 hour event (depending on how good you really are). It means you are tough, and driven, generally speaking.


As I read this thread this is the part I can't understand. If you're such a fighter, why don't you fight for your marriage, like you fight for a Kona Spot? Why don't you expend that same energy to make your marriage awesome, not just okay, but awesome? Do you value your half-assed age group 3rd place more than you value the person that promised, swore an oath, before God and your best friends, to love and cherish until death do you part? Did you not take that commitment any more seriously than your 6 am group ride? After all aren't you the person that told yourself you can do anything, and then proved it. Here is the real truth about Ironman and Divorce. You're not divorced because you're enlightened, or fit, or a new person, or you spend too much time on a treadmill. You are divorced because when the going got tough you and your spouse didn't HTFU and stick to your commitment and decide to make it better. You were satisfied to say, "oh, we went our separate ways" and that to me is not very tough or driven at all, that is a quitter.


Love is not a happy feeling, or great sex, or mutual adoration (although it can encompass all those things), first and foremost it's a commitment. The commitment you made when you got married, for richer or poorer, in sickness and in health. If you think you're so f***ing tough how about proving it by working to make your marriage better every day, just like you do your power numbers and your swim stroke. That's a memory you can cherish in 20 years, and its a lot warmer at night than a $5 plaque and a worn out race number.