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Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA
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As I sit here back in Denmark I can't help but smile when I think back on the 2014 year. I thought 2013 was good but this year has been something else. It is the first time in my 6 years as a professional triathlete that I have really strung together a season that I am incredibly proud of. It was not perfect but it was definitely great.

Winning Challenge Bahrain was the icing on an incredibly satisfying year. After the disappointment of Mont-Tremblant I always felt like I had unfinished business. I am very happy that the commitment and investments we made towards Bahrain paid off. What happened in Bahrain was no fluke and I have a lot of people to thank for my successes and especially the Bahrain victory. The person who has contributed significantly and who I owe a large part of the thanks to is coach Joel Filliol. I moved to Joel at the back end of 2011, under what were then controversial circumstances as I left a national coach towards the end of an Olympic cycle. Post Olympics I then opted out of the national federation and funding program to go my own way. At the time I felt I needed this return of independence, do what I felt was right and find new 'unridden' ground. This brought me to non-draft racing and now in 2014 it is safe to say it was worthwhile.

But what has Joel done? What has changed for me? Why did I perform the way I did in Bahrain? Having been given the go ahead from Joel to do this. We will both actively commit our time over the coming days/week or so to this "Ask Us Anything" thread. Joel is currently on camp in Portugal whilst I drown myself in wine over here in Denmark ;-) Please excuse any delays in the responses but fire away and we will both do our best to make this worthwhile.

Thanks


London 2012 Olympian : 6 x IRONMAN 70.3 Winner : 2014 Challenge Bahrain Champion : 2014 Hy-Vee 5150 Champion : Master of Human Nutrition - Twitter: @helle_f Facebook: /helletri Web: hellefrederiksen.com

Sponsors: Uplace-BMC Pro Triathlon - Nike - Sands Beach Active - NormaTec - Bragi - Hotbox Roasters
Last edited by: helle_f: Dec 10, 14 5:21
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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Huge congratulations on the win, fantastic work.

I know a lot of people will have some great questions for you so I'm just going to sit back and soak up as much information about the making of a champion as I can.

Thanks for doing this.


Blog: http://www.coopstriblog.wordpress.com
Latest blog: Setting Goals. With or Without Gin.
Date: 10/31/2017
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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Helle,

Thanks for joining us. What are your race plans for next year? What is your analysis of the recent Challenge announcements and what effect will it have on pro triathletes next year? Explain for us the dynamics of being on one of the currently few organized professional triathlon teams and what is your view of what the future holds for these type teams.

Best holiday wishes!

David
* Ironman for Life! (Blog) * IM Everyday Hero Video * Daggett Shuler Law *
Disclaimer: I have personal and professional relationships with many athletes, vendors, and organizations in the triathlon world.
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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Congrats. Is there something about your physiology that allows you to benefit from the non draft format more than the ITU format where the bike has more variability and less consistent power effort? Or did you change something in your training for this. HyVee + Bahrain is a solid year. What are your thoughts about how the Challenge Triple Crown can be used to grow the sport in terms of pulling in outside sponsors who are not involved in the sport (you have spoken eloquently about values that pros can bring). What is the focus for next year?

Finally one of our forum posters, a single age group woman mentioned she was reluctant to travel to Bahrain alone, perhaps you can share your views, albeit as a pro, you were likely more taken care of than an age grouper traveling by herself. But perhaps hearing the views of the women's division champion might alleviate the concerns that she and others may have to make the trip to Bahrain/Dubai/Oman.

Well done and congrats on your year.

Dev
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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Congrats on the great season, it is awesome to see someone who had a career before triathlon successful.
Nutrition - any tips on daily nutrition and race nutrition? I know this is different for everyone but just your general thoughts. Also what nutrition tips for women do you have that would differ from men?
Training - what changed this year? For the HIM distance do you focus more on intensity or distance when training?
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [david] [ In reply to ]
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David,

You are welcome. 2015 plans are currently being revised. Had you asked me the same question prior to Challenge Bahrain and the announcement of the triple crown I would have said my 2015 season would not start until April. I would also have said my 2015 season would focus on hitting race best form at IRONMAN 70.3 World's at Zell-Am See. Now I can not say the same, I may once I reflected and digested it all but for now we have chosen to not make any plans until I learn more on the triple crown, support platform, sponsor recognition of such events etc.

My thoughts on the Challenge announcements? Amazing and much needed. There will no doubt be an effect, to what level I do not know but I feel it will delay the short course athletes jump up to IRONMAN if they were considering it. There is now more incentive, prize money and exposure opportunities (or at least promised to be) in these Middle East Challenge races that athletes like myself almost have little to no incentive to go long. Especially when our heart doesn't want to go long. I do feel the lack of coverage IRONMAN 70.3 World's got this year really effected how athlete's and people view the value of 70.3 World's.

Uplace-BMC. This is an incredibly organized and professional setup. For me in 2014 it has actually not changed my, or others, racing and training dynamics which I applaud. I put a large part of the success the team has had down to this. We are not governed to do this or that in terms of races or training, we are not dictated by a sports director telling us what training and food to eat. We are still independent. Of course we have team goals but we share a common trait, all athletes on the team want to win or podium at races, this is in line with the team goal. We are provided with support as and when we want it and this matters. I think teams, if actually having goals and intentions to want to take on other teams, is the way this sport can grow and become more commercial and exciting. What is very important about teams though is that there has to be consistency and an identifiable image, there needs to be a purpose. I feel triathlon is and should always be an individual sport but if we want to commercialize the sport I feel teams can, if done correctly, provide a better platform to attract endorsements, develop athlete performance, help companies develop products and in general develop the sport. The biggest thing that is lacking for teams to really 'turn the wheels' is a commercial series, the developments of the middle east may just bring that.


London 2012 Olympian : 6 x IRONMAN 70.3 Winner : 2014 Challenge Bahrain Champion : 2014 Hy-Vee 5150 Champion : Master of Human Nutrition - Twitter: @helle_f Facebook: /helletri Web: hellefrederiksen.com

Sponsors: Uplace-BMC Pro Triathlon - Nike - Sands Beach Active - NormaTec - Bragi - Hotbox Roasters
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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Helle,
congratulations to a great season and an impressive win at Bahrain!
I read on your website that you list Holstebro as your home town. I really love Vestjylland and its coast (and I have spent some very nice and relaxing days in Holstebro). So how much time do you actually get to spend at home over the year?


Cheers,
malte
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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A Huge congratulations on a great 2014 Helle! I was on the edge of my seat throughout the Bahrain coverage as you ran your way to victory. I've got a few questions if you don't mind.

What was the Bahrain experience like? Many have been saying how well organized and professional it was. How the royal family rolled out the red carpet for you professionals. How would the athlete experience compare to the 70.3 world in Mt Tremblant for example? I'm not asking you to speak ill towards WTC but just curious what your honest opinion is on this topic when comparing the two.

Did you change anything in your preparation for Bahrain vs Tremblant? Did you just have a good day or were you confident going in that you had a victory within your grasp? What hurdles did you have to overcome that the coverage wouldn't have given us insight into?

Last but not least is the 20M non-drafting rule. I know it's likely a touchy subject for you with the recent Twitter activity but I'll ask regardless. How close do you feel the pro field was to adhering to the 20m rule? Did you find it difficult to judge if you were far enough/ too close while out there? Do you feel it was a fair race like it was intended to be with the lengthening of the non-draft zone? Do you feel it played to your strengths or hindered your performance?

Thanks for taking the time to reply to the ST community. It's really amazing that the triathlon world is so small and I could have the Challenge Bahrain champion replying to my questions. Enjoy your wine and a little R&R ... If you're into whites with a hint of citrus try Stone Leigh Sav Blanc (great with warm goats cheese and honey) ... You can thank me later!

------
"Train so you have no regrets @ the finish line"
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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$100,000!!!

So what are you going to splurge on?
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [fierceSun] [ In reply to ]
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dont forget denmark is high tax country then the coaches shrare ( v deserved me thinks ) so make it more like 50 000

fierceSun wrote:
$100,000!!!

So what are you going to splurge on?

http://www.pb3coaching.com
Last edited by: pk: Dec 10, 14 8:37
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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Congrats on the win! You looked very fast yet comfortable on the run. Can you describe your typical run training leading up to a HIM race?

- how much weekly run mileage?
- how much time spent slower than race pace, at race pace, faster than race pace
- do you include resistance training and explosive exercises like plyometrics?

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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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What wine is your tipple of choice?

Congrats on a stellar year.
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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So happy for you Helle.

I remember just a year or so ago you had some birch allergies or the like rear their head, and can't even imagine something like that.. to train, be ready and then have your chest lock up etc..
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Maui5150] [ In reply to ]
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interesting you should mention birch allergy. I was just reading an article about cross reactivity of certain food allergens with birch pollen and how these could cause seasonal GI intolerance to certain foods. definitely applicable to nutrition choices in an endurance athlete.
http://www.foodintolerances.org/default.aspx
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [robgray] [ In reply to ]
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robgray wrote:
Congrats on the win! You looked very fast yet comfortable on the run. Can you describe your typical run training leading up to a HIM race?

- how much weekly run mileage?
- how much time spent slower than race pace, at race pace, faster than race pace
- do you include resistance training and explosive exercises like plyometrics?

I really like these questions. I would love to hear Joel and Helle's views on Polarized training, ie not training in that middle zone 3+sub threshold range. Run and bike would be cool.

The ins and outs of being on a team would be interesting.

I know you should never ask a woman's weight, but you seem so petite on the podium. So what is your FTP and what is that in W/kg :-)
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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Congratulations on a great season and thank you for being so open on here and with your new facebook series. Great stuff!

My question is for you and Joel on your approach to bike training for the non drafting events. What has been key in your transition to one of the stronger riders out there? Also, power based riding? Days per week, etc.


https://twitter.com/mungub
http://benmunguia.blogspot.com
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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Thanks Dev,

I'm now starting to identify that my physiology is definitely more suited to the non draft format more than the ITU format. It is clear that I have a much better ability to sustain high consistent power outputs over large periods of time, of which is not 'relevant' in ITU, or not so relevant at least. Despite my 40km average power being higher in non-draft races than ITU races the requirements of ITU do not favour a rider of my type. What I really like about the developments of non-draft and half-distance events, as shown this weekend, is that you really need to carry no weakness over all 3 disciplines to come out on top. This trend I only see getting stronger over the years.

In terms of training approaches, not a lot has actually changed to be honest, of course we focus more now on the longer sustained efforts rather than short peak power accelerations, especially on the bike. Swim and run is very similar in terms of pace focus. Prior to the London 2012 Olympics we focused on efforts reflecting the ability to run 34 minute 10km, we still try and stay in contact with that type of effort.

Triple Crown, this is a huge opportunity, not just from a professional athletes perspective in terms of big prize money but in terms of growing the sport. I have long been frustrated with the lack of exposure in the sport. We as athletes and more so event organisations have an obligation to sponsors to provide them exposure. Irrelevant of what the minority might think we absolutely need this sport exposed and commercialised. Outside sponsors are looking for a way into this sport but they don't want to come near it when they lack any significant opportunity to get recognised. Only last year I spoke with a strong title sponsor of a world tour cycling team. His words to me at the time were pretty simple but pretty obvious, he got more eyeballs seeing his brand and hearing his story per $ spent than he could get in any other sport. Yet he acknowledged that triathlon was an incredible sport to be a part of. This showed me how much it meant that companies desire that exposure. Having heard a lot in Bahrain this weekend I really feel that Challenge understand what this sport needs, not from a business perspective but from a sporting perspective. I'm excited to follow the developments.

Regarding Bahrain and my experience as a woman, this is a great point and thank you for raising it. It should be noted that despite being supported to go to this race I actually opted to not stay in the race hotel for my own preparation reasons. I was in the capital, Manama, due to race start location, which was far more a populated area than the Sofitel location where all pros, and a large portion of age group athletes stayed. This likely exposed me more to the culture and people of Bahrain. We chose to rent a car, not relying on the chauffeur service plus we ate out most evenings. For me to feel more safe and suited to an foreign environment or new country I do a lot of research to find out if there are any cultural/religious rules or etiquette that you ought to follow. I do that to respect the new country and its people but more so for myself to feel prepared. I can say honestly that I felt Bahrain on the whole was far more westernised than you could expect. I did travel with my fiancé, Ben but not for the reason that I felt unsafe travelling there alone. Had Ben not been in a position to go I would still have gone alone and probably still put myself out of the pro support locations/services. Upon reflection of the 6 days we spent in Manama I would never discourage a female travelling to Bahrain to do that race and I would certainly go again. At the end of the day we are travelling into a new country and my feeling is that providing we know and respect they culture there is no reason to feel afraid. I'm expecting the same in reference to Dubai and Oman.


London 2012 Olympian : 6 x IRONMAN 70.3 Winner : 2014 Challenge Bahrain Champion : 2014 Hy-Vee 5150 Champion : Master of Human Nutrition - Twitter: @helle_f Facebook: /helletri Web: hellefrederiksen.com

Sponsors: Uplace-BMC Pro Triathlon - Nike - Sands Beach Active - NormaTec - Bragi - Hotbox Roasters
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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Congratulations on the win. I have been disturbed by the fact that the main person bankrolling this race is accused by multiple sources of being directly involved in the torture of pro-democracy activists in Bahrain. Do you think that it is right for you to participate in this race, thereby indirectly legitimising not only the oppressive Bahraini government but also the extremely unpleasant behaviour of which Shaikh Nasser is accused?

Lok forward to your reply

Cheers

Rob
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [mungub50] [ In reply to ]
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Our approach to the bike could be described generally as 'the right load at the right time'.
Most often we do two specific power based sessions on the bike during the build up to events.
We use different types of sessions including strong finish rides, race specific power sessions, and sessions with targets over race pace.
It's a pretty simple approach, and has worked well for Helle.

>>>>
JoelFilliol.com - check out the Real Coaching Podcast
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [robgray] [ In reply to ]
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Hey robgray:

Helle usually runs between 4-6hrs per week.
Most runs are easy, with two main sessions per week, which will be faster than race pace for the main sets of these sessions.
Resistance training 2x per week, no plyometrics.


J

>>>>
JoelFilliol.com - check out the Real Coaching Podcast
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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Given the caliber of the competition, the prize purse and the live coverage, do you think Challenge Bahrain has earned the title "70.3 World Championship"? And will you call yourself the Half Ironman World Champion?






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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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Given your long course talent, any kona plans?

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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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helle_f wrote:
I did travel with my fiancé, Ben

Damn.

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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [James Haycraft] [ In reply to ]
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James Haycraft wrote:
helle_f wrote:
I did travel with my fiancé, Ben


Damn.

Yes, we all have a crush on Ben.






The Age Group Home on Facebook
Twitter jokes
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Joel Filliol] [ In reply to ]
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Nice to see Coach Joel on here.

One of the best!

Was over in Victoria BC for a few days, and was thinking of you!


Steve Fleck @stevefleck | Blog
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [PUTU] [ In reply to ]
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Daily nutrition: I am a very strong advocator for balance when it comes to approaches to nutrition. A lot of people have inconsistencies with their eating patterns that often reflect their racing and training exploits. Of course it is easier said than done. I'm not a fan or big supporter of what people call diets. Daily food intake is a lifestyle choice, sport aside, energy levels, mood, concentration, recovery are all things effected by nutrition. It is very important, for me at least, that we as individuals find balance with our intake of proteins, carbs and fats. Vary the intake and eat organic, rather than processed. When balance is found it is not uncommon for people to feel they can eat lots and eat often.

Race nutrition: it is such an individual approach and I read so many articles of this works and that works but truth be told there is not one formula that is guaranteed to work for another. Identify what you are good at intaking, for example I can not stomach the intake of solids so my race nutrition is based on the intake of gels and fluids. The recommended carbohydrate intake varies person to person. We made a change in Bahrain and for the first time I felt I got my nutrition right, on the bike I am working +/- on intaking 70g CH per hour. The run slightly less.

In relation to food approaches specifically for women to be honest again there is no major, stand alone point that I would advise. For example my diet is not based on the fact that I am a woman. That being said women can be different and can require more of some nutrients than others in order to find balance. This would be a case of assessing blood values and doing some general testing then applying nutritional approaches based on the individual.

Training: actually not a whole lot has changed this year in the way of training. We have really focused a lot on finding consistency. This has been the key. A lot has contributed to finding consistency though, we have limited my change of environment, committed more to having my osteopath around during heavy blocks of training. I guess you could say injury prevention through the availability of treatment has been a bigger focus in 2014 than previous years.


London 2012 Olympian : 6 x IRONMAN 70.3 Winner : 2014 Challenge Bahrain Champion : 2014 Hy-Vee 5150 Champion : Master of Human Nutrition - Twitter: @helle_f Facebook: /helletri Web: hellefrederiksen.com

Sponsors: Uplace-BMC Pro Triathlon - Nike - Sands Beach Active - NormaTec - Bragi - Hotbox Roasters
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [RobK] [ In reply to ]
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RobK wrote:
Congratulations on the win. I have been disturbed by the fact that the main person bankrolling this race is accused by multiple sources of being directly involved in the torture of pro-democracy activists in Bahrain. Do you think that it is right for you to participate in this race, thereby indirectly legitimising not only the oppressive Bahraini government but also the extremely unpleasant behaviour of which Shaikh Nasser is accused?

Lok forward to your reply

Cheers

Rob

Hypocritical given you live in the UK.
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [malte] [ In reply to ]
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Malte,

Thanks. Vestjylland is a beautiful place, a very raw piece of nature. I'll be heading up to Holstebro on Wednesday next week to spend Christmas with family. Unfortunately I don't get to spend as much time as I would like in Denmark. This is one of the sacrifices I have had to make in order to get the best out of myself. Prior to the Christmas holidays I have spent in total 3 weeks at home and around family and friends.


London 2012 Olympian : 6 x IRONMAN 70.3 Winner : 2014 Challenge Bahrain Champion : 2014 Hy-Vee 5150 Champion : Master of Human Nutrition - Twitter: @helle_f Facebook: /helletri Web: hellefrederiksen.com

Sponsors: Uplace-BMC Pro Triathlon - Nike - Sands Beach Active - NormaTec - Bragi - Hotbox Roasters
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [NordicSkier] [ In reply to ]
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NordicSkier wrote:
RobK wrote:
Congratulations on the win. I have been disturbed by the fact that the main person bankrolling this race is accused by multiple sources of being directly involved in the torture of pro-democracy activists in Bahrain. Do you think that it is right for you to participate in this race, thereby indirectly legitimising not only the oppressive Bahraini government but also the extremely unpleasant behaviour of which Shaikh Nasser is accused?

Lok forward to your reply

Cheers

Rob

Hypocritical given you live in the UK.

No it's not you silly.

Rob
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [RobK] [ In reply to ]
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RobK wrote:
NordicSkier wrote:
RobK wrote:
Congratulations on the win. I have been disturbed by the fact that the main person bankrolling this race is accused by multiple sources of being directly involved in the torture of pro-democracy activists in Bahrain. Do you think that it is right for you to participate in this race, thereby indirectly legitimising not only the oppressive Bahraini government but also the extremely unpleasant behaviour of which Shaikh Nasser is accused?


Lok forward to your reply

Cheers

Rob


Hypocritical given you live in the UK.


How is it hypocritical of me? You know nothing about me, yet you make this accusation? Is this a reference to the UK's involvement in the CIA's torture activities? Not something which I was directly or indirectly involved in, nor which I would condone in any way... unlike sheikh Nasser Bin Hamad Al Khalifa I have not accused of being personally involved in any torture or repression of people in my country on the basis of their religion, nor have I participated in a race organised by such people, so I am at a loss to understand in what way I am a hypocrite. I think this is an entirely reasonable question to ask.

I guess everyone's a big man online.


Rob

Not being a "big man". Pointing out the bullshit of calling out middle eastern human rights abuses when our own governments are guilty of the same, or far worse. Maybe noone should race in the UK?

BTW, torture is wrong. The basis for the torture is irrelevant.
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [NordicSkier] [ In reply to ]
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I don't think you understand what "hypocrite" means.

Rob
Last edited by: RobK: Dec 10, 14 13:36
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [cshowe80] [ In reply to ]
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Chris,

Thanks a lot for the kind words. I am very happy so many got to actually see the race and the coverage was good.

Bahrain was a fantastic experience, it really was. I know post race there was a lot mentioning this and some may think that pros got special treatment but honestly trying to put myself in the shoes of an amateur I would say the experience was great. I actually had a coached athlete who made the trip over from Denmark and he was blown away by the experience, pre, during and post race. The Royal Family and Challenge as an organisation definitely covered all bases. I'll point out the things that mattered to me and gave me a sense of "this is how it should be done." I was supported and felt as though I was a valuable part of this race, from the beginning, this went a long way and is something, to date, I have not felt to this level, other than being at the Olympics. Anything that was potentially going to be stressful for me pre-race was taken care of and available to me. When I got off the jetway at Bahrain airport there was a chaperone waiting for me, escorted me through immigration, walked me to my bags and placed me inside an Audi and off to my hotel. I did not touch my luggage. At the hotel they were expecting me, greetings as though I was a person of importance, small but appreciated. Swim lanes were booked and we were advised where to and where not to ride. We had a rental car but if I wanted it I could call an Audi to take me to swimming, shopping, nightclubbing, whatever, I was told to use it as that was what it was there for. Challenge's pro liaison Lisa Pringle was just there to look after us and she did, if you needed something she did her very best to get it for you. What I noticed was it positioned the professionals on a pedestal that the amateurs actually looked up to. Whenever a Audi VIP car would turn up outside the pro hotel you would notice amateurs delay their entrance in to see who would get out. Again small things but something that matters. As I said in pre and post race interviews the only thing I can compare it to is the Olympics.

Preparation for Bahrain was really no different to Tremblant other than a bigger focus on the course requirements of Bahrain. I was confident I had the work in me to contend for the win. My training block prior to Bahrain, of which Joel was on hand, was the best block I had probably ever conducted but the consistency of a year was shown on Saturday. What hurdles did I have to overcome? In the race there was a very significant point where the elastic to Rachel Joyce, who was charging towards Jodie Swallow, nearly broke. Rachel rode incredibly well on Saturday. There was a lot of tactics, at least for me and many times Rachel made surges to get rid of me. These surges hurt me a lot, the gap occasionally stretching to 60 - 100m and I was really on the rivot replicating that of an ITU race on times.

20M non-drafting rule. It is difficult for me to pass judgement on how others raced because I was so involved and committed to what was going on immediately around me. I saw nobody. It was only on the F1 circuit did I actually realise and see that Annabel Luxford was part of the front group. I personally felt the 20m rule brought a significant amount fairness to the racing. I found the rule fairly easy to judge. We, Ben and I, had paced and measured the distance between cat-eyes on the road, pre-race, I had so much fear that a situation like Mont-Tremblant could happen again that I didn't want to chance anything. I also took the time to consultant with ITU officials pre-race to gain an understanding of what their point of reference was going to be to judge to 20M and with this they confirmed the 'metal cat-eye' reference. So all I focused on for the majority of the ride was this image: https://twitter.com/...s/540905834142646272 I'm a strong biker so felt the 20M ruling played to my strengths.

Thanks for the wine hint. The way we are going I may call it a day after day three ;)


London 2012 Olympian : 6 x IRONMAN 70.3 Winner : 2014 Challenge Bahrain Champion : 2014 Hy-Vee 5150 Champion : Master of Human Nutrition - Twitter: @helle_f Facebook: /helletri Web: hellefrederiksen.com

Sponsors: Uplace-BMC Pro Triathlon - Nike - Sands Beach Active - NormaTec - Bragi - Hotbox Roasters
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [fierceSun] [ In reply to ]
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I have a wedding in the not too distant future, it will come in handy there.


London 2012 Olympian : 6 x IRONMAN 70.3 Winner : 2014 Challenge Bahrain Champion : 2014 Hy-Vee 5150 Champion : Master of Human Nutrition - Twitter: @helle_f Facebook: /helletri Web: hellefrederiksen.com

Sponsors: Uplace-BMC Pro Triathlon - Nike - Sands Beach Active - NormaTec - Bragi - Hotbox Roasters
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [pk] [ In reply to ]
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Agreed on the 'coaches share', much deserved.


London 2012 Olympian : 6 x IRONMAN 70.3 Winner : 2014 Challenge Bahrain Champion : 2014 Hy-Vee 5150 Champion : Master of Human Nutrition - Twitter: @helle_f Facebook: /helletri Web: hellefrederiksen.com

Sponsors: Uplace-BMC Pro Triathlon - Nike - Sands Beach Active - NormaTec - Bragi - Hotbox Roasters
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Maui5150] [ In reply to ]
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Thanks.

Yes the two times I have encountered birch pollen reactions have been horrendous. One was in the lead up to the Olympics and the other was upon arrival into Knoxville, both times put me on the sidelines for a long period of time. We now know to avoid birch pollen bloom periods. My reactions have more so triggered my asthma which has really been tough. Thankfully we managed it OK in 2014.


London 2012 Olympian : 6 x IRONMAN 70.3 Winner : 2014 Challenge Bahrain Champion : 2014 Hy-Vee 5150 Champion : Master of Human Nutrition - Twitter: @helle_f Facebook: /helletri Web: hellefrederiksen.com

Sponsors: Uplace-BMC Pro Triathlon - Nike - Sands Beach Active - NormaTec - Bragi - Hotbox Roasters
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [AlwaysCurious] [ In reply to ]
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You owe me a dollar - https://twitter.com/...s/542583487208124416


London 2012 Olympian : 6 x IRONMAN 70.3 Winner : 2014 Challenge Bahrain Champion : 2014 Hy-Vee 5150 Champion : Master of Human Nutrition - Twitter: @helle_f Facebook: /helletri Web: hellefrederiksen.com

Sponsors: Uplace-BMC Pro Triathlon - Nike - Sands Beach Active - NormaTec - Bragi - Hotbox Roasters
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [robgray] [ In reply to ]
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Right now given that my heart wants to achieve more and get faster over the half-distance I have no personal desires to race in Kona, not in 2015 at least. Also thankfully my sponsor income is not determined on whether or not I race Kona. As it stands now it would be a poor business decision for me to shoot for Kona because it is the trend to do so. If my curiosity and belief that I can compete in Kona rises, I may give it a shot, until then I have enough to improve on over the half-distance.


London 2012 Olympian : 6 x IRONMAN 70.3 Winner : 2014 Challenge Bahrain Champion : 2014 Hy-Vee 5150 Champion : Master of Human Nutrition - Twitter: @helle_f Facebook: /helletri Web: hellefrederiksen.com

Sponsors: Uplace-BMC Pro Triathlon - Nike - Sands Beach Active - NormaTec - Bragi - Hotbox Roasters
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [RobK] [ In reply to ]
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Rob,

Should I base my participation in triathlon events on the political status and happenings of a country I would probably not find myself racing too often. I chose to focus solely on what I feel is good for the sport of triathlon. On that basis I feel it is right for me to have raced in Bahrain. I'll not go any further into this issue.


London 2012 Olympian : 6 x IRONMAN 70.3 Winner : 2014 Challenge Bahrain Champion : 2014 Hy-Vee 5150 Champion : Master of Human Nutrition - Twitter: @helle_f Facebook: /helletri Web: hellefrederiksen.com

Sponsors: Uplace-BMC Pro Triathlon - Nike - Sands Beach Active - NormaTec - Bragi - Hotbox Roasters
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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helle_f wrote:
Thanks Dev,

I'm now starting to identify that my physiology is definitely more suited to the non draft format more than the ITU format. It is clear that I have a much better ability to sustain high consistent power outputs over large periods of time, of which is not 'relevant' in ITU, or not so relevant at least. Despite my 40km average power being higher in non-draft races than ITU races the requirements of ITU do not favour a rider of my type. What I really like about the developments of non-draft and half-distance events, as shown this weekend, is that you really need to carry no weakness over all 3 disciplines to come out on top. This trend I only see getting stronger over the years.

In terms of training approaches, not a lot has actually changed to be honest, of course we focus more now on the longer sustained efforts rather than short peak power accelerations, especially on the bike. Swim and run is very similar in terms of pace focus. Prior to the London 2012 Olympics we focused on efforts reflecting the ability to run 34 minute 10km, we still try and stay in contact with that type of effort.

Triple Crown, this is a huge opportunity, not just from a professional athletes perspective in terms of big prize money but in terms of growing the sport. I have long been frustrated with the lack of exposure in the sport. We as athletes and more so event organisations have an obligation to sponsors to provide them exposure. Irrelevant of what the minority might think we absolutely need this sport exposed and commercialised. Outside sponsors are looking for a way into this sport but they don't want to come near it when they lack any significant opportunity to get recognised. Only last year I spoke with a strong title sponsor of a world tour cycling team. His words to me at the time were pretty simple but pretty obvious, he got more eyeballs seeing his brand and hearing his story per $ spent than he could get in any other sport. Yet he acknowledged that triathlon was an incredible sport to be a part of. This showed me how much it meant that companies desire that exposure. Having heard a lot in Bahrain this weekend I really feel that Challenge understand what this sport needs, not from a business perspective but from a sporting perspective. I'm excited to follow the developments.

Regarding Bahrain and my experience as a woman, this is a great point and thank you for raising it. It should be noted that despite being supported to go to this race I actually opted to not stay in the race hotel for my own preparation reasons. I was in the capital, Manama, due to race start location, which was far more a populated area than the Sofitel location where all pros, and a large portion of age group athletes stayed. This likely exposed me more to the culture and people of Bahrain. We chose to rent a car, not relying on the chauffeur service plus we ate out most evenings. For me to feel more safe and suited to an foreign environment or new country I do a lot of research to find out if there are any cultural/religious rules or etiquette that you ought to follow. I do that to respect the new country and its people but more so for myself to feel prepared. I can say honestly that I felt Bahrain on the whole was far more westernised than you could expect. I did travel with my fiancé, Ben but not for the reason that I felt unsafe travelling there alone. Had Ben not been in a position to go I would still have gone alone and probably still put myself out of the pro support locations/services. Upon reflection of the 6 days we spent in Manama I would never discourage a female travelling to Bahrain to do that race and I would certainly go again. At the end of the day we are travelling into a new country and my feeling is that providing we know and respect they culture there is no reason to feel afraid. I'm expecting the same in reference to Dubai and Oman.


The two most important points that I wanted you to answer is expanding the sponsorship scope of triathlon outside of the endemic sponsors and traveling to Bahrain as a woman. I hope the latter appeases some of the concerns of my female age group friends.

On the "former", I was recently passing through Newark Airport and saw a massive wall size add for Tag Heuer and the NYC Marathon. I actually took a picture of that advertisement and sent it immediately to IM CEO Messick, because that is the type of thing that I feel our sport can aspire to. If NYC marathon can do it, so can triathlon. Watching a triathlon is as "boring" as watching a marathon. Both are participation sports, albeit running has a theoretical "wider reach". But let's not fool ourselves and sell triathlon short. It is perceived by the general participant as a higher "bar" for participation and in some way proving the participant has higher skill/versatility/determination/focus (even though we know that being say a 27 min 10K runner or an Olympic swimmer is outrageously crazy hard). If I asked the average person at the gym or the office they would say triathlon is a "higher achievement". So in that vein, I believe there is a positioning of our sport by race organizers and professional athletes to up sell what we offer to sponsors from outside the sport. I'd love to see the likes of Credit Suisse, Audi (OK they are at Bahrain), Apple, Ebay, Nissan, Rolex and their peers dive in with both feet and out compete each other to be part of triathlon. I think it is possible with the right packaging of the offering. The fact that watching long course triathlon is like watching paint dry is not that important. TV is the old media and even though it gets eyeballs, over time the internet will win over. In my son's generation, no one talks about what is going on in network TV. In my generation we did. They talk about what is in the media via the internet.

Non Endemic sponsors can see value in associating with a sport that is seen to be health oriented, a challenge, high performance, a lifestyle, and very competitive in nature. If I look at companies in my sector (technology), triathlon shows all of the values that we want either our products or our employees to have. The connections have to be made between triathlon and the VPs of Market and also VPs of HR who can likely leverage professionals like you as spokes people for companies.

Keep up the good work and I am glad that you see the opportunity in converting the race podiums into business opportunities for you and the sport. I think this is something that is largely lacking....and I think being a European athlete you actually have a better chance at that 'conversion' of potential non endemic sponsors to "real ones". Just today I was in a technology meeting in Europe with the CTO of a company. He spotted a tiny Ironman logo that I had with me and struck up a conversation related to that. That never happens in North America. There is generally more respect for endurance oriented athletics in Europe....and I might add in Europe the sporting superstars "look" like real people....footballers, tennis players, track athletes, skiers. US big sport, be it basketball-NFL-MLB-Ice Hockey, the type of athlete that dominates is a bohemoth that looks like the incredible hulk. This is actually important, because the main stream sponsors expect pro athletes in North America to look like jacked up comic book heros, whereas in Europe a triathlete who "looks" like a normal human falls into the category of what an athlete is expected to look like. Messi, looks no different than a short pro traithlete if we both put a suit on. Likewise many of the top WTA Pros look no different than a you and your peers. I think it is easier for you all to "fit in" to the pro athlete mould in Europe and bring non endemic sponsors in and wish you all the best to make this conversion that is long overdo, even though some age groupers claim you and your peers bring no value.
Last edited by: devashish_paul: Dec 10, 14 14:39
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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Darn it. That's what I get for trusting media sources. But don't feel bad; in the first version I misspelled "World". And mistook Michael for his half-brother Skeletor.

But here's a fixed version. Now will you call yourself Half Ironman World Champion?






The Age Group Home on Facebook
Twitter jokes
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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helle_f wrote:
Rob,

Should I base my participation in triathlon events on the political status and happenings of a country I would probably not find myself racing too often. I chose to focus solely on what I feel is good for the sport of triathlon. On that basis I feel it is right for me to have raced in Bahrain. I'll not go any further into this issue.

Congratulations on your recent successes and your future celebrations.

Re - Politics of the host nation - your response is perfect, and should once and for all, silence any critic of those that do chose to participate.

helle_f, I will stand and applaud you and your achievements on so many levels.
and you will be welcomed Down Under with open arms any time you care to visit. Challenge Half in March'15 :-)
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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Helle,

What about your swim training??? How many days per week, km/wk, etc??? Did you swim as a kid growing up??? What is your best time in a pool for 400, 800, and/or 1500 scm/lcm???

Many congrats on your 2014 season and we hope to see you do really well again in 2015!!!

Thanks,

Eric


"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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I am super happy for you
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Avago] [ In reply to ]
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Avago wrote:
helle_f wrote:
Rob,

Should I base my participation in triathlon events on the political status and happenings of a country I would probably not find myself racing too often. I chose to focus solely on what I feel is good for the sport of triathlon. On that basis I feel it is right for me to have raced in Bahrain. I'll not go any further into this issue.


Congratulations on your recent successes and your future celebrations.

Re - Politics of the host nation - your response is perfect, and should once and for all, silence any critic of those that do chose to participate.


I really don't understand how anyone might think that. She doesn't the address the main issue at all: this isn't just a general politics issue, this is more specifically about the person bankrolling the event who is accused by multiple sources of being personally involved in torture of pro-democracy activists. This isn't simply like doing a race in Apartheid South Africa, it's like doing one organised by the security police and with the cheques presented by Hendrik Verwoerd and Eugene De Kock. You might like to contrast this response with, for example, the vitriol that's directed towards Brett Sutton every time his name is mentioned here: the crimes that Sheikh Nasser is accused of are at least of the same magnitude as Sutton's, far more recent and have gone unpunished. Secondly, simply avoiding these issues is a complete cop-out: from the response above I assume that she would be happy to race in Apartheid South Africa or North Korea. Not too nice really.

Of course, she's had a lovely time, been treated like a rock star, won the race and made a load of cash so it's going to be difficult for her to deal with that, so the easiest thing is just to produce a bland and fairly meaningless response and ignore the issue.

Rob
Last edited by: RobK: Dec 11, 14 1:44
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [ericmulk] [ In reply to ]
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Hey Eric,


Helle's swim training is fairly standard - usually scm or scy in the US, 5x per week, 4-5km per session - mix of endurance, strength and pace. What works is how that interfaces with the bike and run training. We have a fairly repeatable pattern we use most of the year and progress the quality as she gets fitter.


J

>>>>
JoelFilliol.com - check out the Real Coaching Podcast
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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Helle how much riding do you do on your own and how much with the Itu guys?

http://www.pb3coaching.com
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Joel Filliol] [ In reply to ]
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For the run and bike training how many sessions are done per week? Are the majority of these sessions typically at an "easier" pace? Do you mix in high intensity intervals as well?
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [FastTwitch12] [ In reply to ]
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Hey FastTwitch12,


Helle runs 4-6x per week, with 2 work sessions usually, others are easy. Bike is 4-5x with 2 work sessions, otherwise easy.


J

>>>>
JoelFilliol.com - check out the Real Coaching Podcast
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [pk] [ In reply to ]
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Helle hasn't been on the ITU squad camps in the last year - most of her riding is on her own, with some sessions with Alicia Kaye when in Florida or Boulder, or joining some athletes for basic rides at Sands Beach in Lanzarote.

>>>>
JoelFilliol.com - check out the Real Coaching Podcast
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Fleck] [ In reply to ]
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Fleck - Victoria is a great place - enjoyed my time there. For many years it was a world hub of triathlon excellence.

>>>>
JoelFilliol.com - check out the Real Coaching Podcast
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Joel Filliol] [ In reply to ]
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Joel Filliol wrote:
Hey FastTwitch12,


Helle runs 4-6x per week, with 2 work sessions usually, others are easy. Bike is 4-5x with 2 work sessions, otherwise easy.


J

Thanks Joel

Are "work sessions" typically above threshold or it depends on time of year, session etc. The "polarized model" seems to say very little threshold type work regardless of time of year and would love to hear your opinion of it.
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [marcag] [ In reply to ]
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We use threshold training in the 2 months prior to racing, or within the racing season as maintenance. Higher intensity than threshold is often difficult to achieve when under a high overall work load, whereas threshold, tempo, or steady can be done effectively even when very fatigued. I agree that too much threshold could be 'toxic' but really it's just a work load issue. 'Polarized training' has become a bit of a buzzword - I don't worry too much about the label - of course the majority of the volume high level athletes do is an easy intensities - the rest is 'hard'. Nothing new or novel, and it doesn't need to be more complicated than that.

J

>>>>
JoelFilliol.com - check out the Real Coaching Podcast
Last edited by: Joel Filliol: Dec 11, 14 8:07
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Joel Filliol] [ In reply to ]
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Nothing new or novel, and it doesn't [get] more complicated than that.


Read this line over carefully folks, from one of the best coaches in the world! Make sure you understand it. Key!


Steve Fleck @stevefleck | Blog
Last edited by: Fleck: Dec 11, 14 7:17
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [AlwaysCurious] [ In reply to ]
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AlwaysCurious wrote:
James Haycraft wrote:
helle_f wrote:
I did travel with my fiancé, Ben


Damn.


Yes, we all have a crush on Ben.


O M G!
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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helle_f wrote:
Thanks.

Yes the two times I have encountered birch pollen reactions have been horrendous. One was in the lead up to the Olympics and the other was upon arrival into Knoxville, both times put me on the sidelines for a long period of time. We now know to avoid birch pollen bloom periods. My reactions have more so triggered my asthma which has really been tough. Thankfully we managed it OK in 2014.

On the bright side you're not me. Went for an allergy test and the doctor said I'm allergic to "trees".

Anyway as for questions I'm just wondering if you prefer a flatter course like in Bahrain or a hiller one like in Mont Tremblant? I mean this both in terms of which you enjoy more and which you think you're more suited to. Other than that to ask a more ST approved question how do you go about pacing yourself during a race and how much does this have to do with pre-race planning?

Thank you to both Joel and yourself for doing this and of course congratulations!
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Joel Filliol] [ In reply to ]
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So what would a typical hard workout look like for the bike and run?
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [FastTwitch12] [ In reply to ]
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The bread and butter sessions are the build finish, lots in the sport do these: bike 2-3 or 4hrs with the last 30-90 mins building pace or at race pace. Similar with the running: building / progressive runs / negative splits.

J

>>>>
JoelFilliol.com - check out the Real Coaching Podcast
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Joel Filliol] [ In reply to ]
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The bread and butter sessions are the build finish, lots in the sport do these: bike 2-3 or 4hrs with the last 30-90 mins building pace or at race pace. Similar with the running: building / progressive runs / negative splits.

Interesting. Good to know that, despite not having a clue what we were doing back in the mid 80's to early 90's, we did a lot of this! :)


Steve Fleck @stevefleck | Blog
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Joel Filliol] [ In reply to ]
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Very interesting thanks for sharing


So then are the easy sessions just at a constant steady pace for a specific amount of time or mileage i.e. at a certain heart rate or power?
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Joel Filliol] [ In reply to ]
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Joel Filliol wrote:

Most runs are easy, with two main sessions per week, which will be faster than race pace for the main sets of these sessions.

Joel, Helle, thanks for taking the time. Very interesting.

A question... what does 'easy' mean? Or how do you decide what pace / power to do an easy workout at?
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [FastTwitch12] [ In reply to ]
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FastTwitch12 - easy is driven by perceived effort primarily, not power, heart rate or pace.


J

>>>>
JoelFilliol.com - check out the Real Coaching Podcast
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Joel Filliol] [ In reply to ]
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Coach Joe,

Congrats on a great result! To be completely honest, I'd never heard of you before reading this thread, looks like you have some pretty impressive results lately.

My question is, how do you think you stack up as a coach against the best pro coaches in our sport, Matt Dixon, Mark Allen, Jesse Kropenick, etc?

Thanks in advance, love it that you guys are out here answering questions from us common folk!
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Jordan45] [ In reply to ]
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Jordan45 wrote:
Coach Joe,

Congrats on a great result! To be completely honest, I'd never heard of you before reading this thread, looks like you have some pretty impressive results lately.

My question is, how do you think you stack up as a coach against the best pro coaches in our sport, Matt Dixon, Mark Allen, Jesse Kropenick, etc?

Thanks in advance, love it that you guys are out here answering questions from us common folk!



PAULO IS BACK ON SLOWTWITCH

Jonathan Caron

Jonnyo Coaching
Last edited by: jonnyo: Dec 11, 14 11:06
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [jonnyo] [ In reply to ]
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haha, nice.

Accelerate3 Coaching https://accelerate3.com/
Moxie Multisport https://www.themoxiemultisport.com/
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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Aspire maybe, but let's be real hear huge difference between NYC marathon and any single ironman. They had over 50,000 finishers, and who knows how many lining the streets and watching live. But I see what you mean.
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [ericmulk] [ In reply to ]
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I've swam since the age of 5. At the age of 11 I started swimming competitively. Since the age of 12 I was on the national team until the age of 18. I swam in the European Junior Champs twice, became Danish Junior Champion 4 times. I was a short specialist specialist by the end of my swimming career. Most notable times 58" on 100 SCM freestyle, 2'04" on 200 SCM freestyle, 4'54" on 400 SCM medley.


London 2012 Olympian : 6 x IRONMAN 70.3 Winner : 2014 Challenge Bahrain Champion : 2014 Hy-Vee 5150 Champion : Master of Human Nutrition - Twitter: @helle_f Facebook: /helletri Web: hellefrederiksen.com

Sponsors: Uplace-BMC Pro Triathlon - Nike - Sands Beach Active - NormaTec - Bragi - Hotbox Roasters
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Staz] [ In reply to ]
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I really enjoy the tough honest courses that offer varied terrain, yet there is no doubt fast courses suit me well.

Pacing and awareness of required racing effort comes from both training and racing experience. We are not governed by watt outputs or run paces, instead we train on feel and use these tools to learn over time the type of effort we are putting out. I had no pre-race pace planning for Bahrain other than taking the run out fast. All other disciplines I just had it in my mind to race hard and respond to however the race would unfold.


London 2012 Olympian : 6 x IRONMAN 70.3 Winner : 2014 Challenge Bahrain Champion : 2014 Hy-Vee 5150 Champion : Master of Human Nutrition - Twitter: @helle_f Facebook: /helletri Web: hellefrederiksen.com

Sponsors: Uplace-BMC Pro Triathlon - Nike - Sands Beach Active - NormaTec - Bragi - Hotbox Roasters
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [AlwaysCurious] [ In reply to ]
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No. I would say it looks like I have bigger guns than Michi Raelart in this picture though ;)


London 2012 Olympian : 6 x IRONMAN 70.3 Winner : 2014 Challenge Bahrain Champion : 2014 Hy-Vee 5150 Champion : Master of Human Nutrition - Twitter: @helle_f Facebook: /helletri Web: hellefrederiksen.com

Sponsors: Uplace-BMC Pro Triathlon - Nike - Sands Beach Active - NormaTec - Bragi - Hotbox Roasters
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Salmon Steve] [ In reply to ]
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Currently I've gone through a few bottles of Tres Torres the past days. I'm not a wine snob but like a nice red, the occasional rosé.


London 2012 Olympian : 6 x IRONMAN 70.3 Winner : 2014 Challenge Bahrain Champion : 2014 Hy-Vee 5150 Champion : Master of Human Nutrition - Twitter: @helle_f Facebook: /helletri Web: hellefrederiksen.com

Sponsors: Uplace-BMC Pro Triathlon - Nike - Sands Beach Active - NormaTec - Bragi - Hotbox Roasters
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Jordan45] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Jordan45 wrote:
Coach Joe,

Congrats on a great result! To be completely honest, I'd never heard of you before reading this thread, looks like you have some pretty impressive results lately.

My question is, how do you think you stack up as a coach against the best pro coaches in our sport, Matt Dixon, Mark Allen, Jesse Kropenick, etc?

Thanks in advance, love it that you guys are out here answering questions from us common folk!

Head in hands.

Twitter
Instagram
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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helle_f wrote:
No. I would say it looks like I have bigger guns than Michi Raelart in this picture though ;)

And now you owe Michi Raelert a dollar. Probably one for his brother, as well. :-)




The Age Group Home on Facebook
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Joel Filliol] [ In reply to ]
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Joel, let me start by saying thank you for jumping in here to answer questions with actual answers and not a bunch a fluff. Very helpful for me and I am sure a lot of others to see what a top mind in the tri coach world does with his athletes.

I have followed you a good bit the last few years and you seem to be one of the best in turning around or producing top level swimmers in triathlon. Do you follow the same model with swimming as you do with biking and running (not much high intensity but instead more easy and tempo work)? In addition, do you feel it truly comes down to needing more swim miles to improve or are there certain items/approaches you use with your athlete's that almost works universally to capture low hanging fruit that are not necessarily talked about or focused on in traditional swim lessons/training?
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [songmak] [ In reply to ]
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [travis_lt] [ In reply to ]
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Well damn, thanks! The worst part is I remember reading this and saving it as favorite.
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [RobK] [ In reply to ]
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RobK wrote:
Avago wrote:
helle_f wrote:
Rob,

Should I base my participation in triathlon events on the political status and happenings of a country I would probably not find myself racing too often. I chose to focus solely on what I feel is good for the sport of triathlon. On that basis I feel it is right for me to have raced in Bahrain. I'll not go any further into this issue.


Congratulations on your recent successes and your future celebrations.

Re - Politics of the host nation - your response is perfect, and should once and for all, silence any critic of those that do chose to participate.


I really don't understand how anyone might think that. She doesn't the address the main issue at all: this isn't just a general politics issue, this is more specifically about the person bankrolling the event who is accused by multiple sources of being personally involved in torture of pro-democracy activists. This isn't simply like doing a race in Apartheid South Africa, it's like doing one organised by the security police and with the cheques presented by Hendrik Verwoerd and Eugene De Kock. You might like to contrast this response with, for example, the vitriol that's directed towards Brett Sutton every time his name is mentioned here: the crimes that Sheikh Nasser is accused of are at least of the same magnitude as Sutton's, far more recent and have gone unpunished. Secondly, simply avoiding these issues is a complete cop-out: from the response above I assume that she would be happy to race in Apartheid South Africa or North Korea. Not too nice really.

Of course, she's had a lovely time, been treated like a rock star, won the race and made a load of cash so it's going to be difficult for her to deal with that, so the easiest thing is just to produce a bland and fairly meaningless response and ignore the issue.

Rob

RobK,

why don't you just let it be.
helle_f has stated
I chose to focus solely on what I feel is good for the sport of triathlon. On that basis I feel it is right for me to have raced in Bahrain. I'll not go any further into this issue.

You can chose to go to Bahrain or not go to Bahrain... entirely your call.
Just as I can chose to go to China or Qatar or Azerbaijan for my work or sport or whatever - we all make our own choices...
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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helle_f wrote:
I've swam since the age of 5. At the age of 11 I started swimming competitively. Since the age of 12 I was on the national team until the age of 18. I swam in the European Junior Champs twice, became Danish Junior Champion 4 times. I was a short specialist specialist by the end of my swimming career. Most notable times 58" on 100 SCM freestyle, 2'04" on 200 SCM freestyle, 4'54" on 400 SCM medley.

Very nice, I too swam my first 25 at age 5, one of my earliest concrete memories. Nice times for sure. Thanks much for this info:)

One other Q: have you had any bad bike wrecks??? IMO, they are truly the unspoken issue of triathlon training and competition, espec if you keep riding 7000-8000 mi/yr outside every yr for many yrs in a row.

Cheers,

Eric


"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [jonnyo] [ In reply to ]
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jonnyo wrote:
Jordan45 wrote:
Coach Joe,

Congrats on a great result! To be completely honest, I'd never heard of you before reading this thread, looks like you have some pretty impressive results lately.

My question is, how do you think you stack up as a coach against the best pro coaches in our sport, Matt Dixon, Mark Allen, Jesse Kropenick, etc?

Thanks in advance, love it that you guys are out here answering questions from us common folk!



PAULO IS BACK ON SLOWTWITCH

haha!
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [travis_lt] [ In reply to ]
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travis_lt wrote:
All your answers here :-)
http://joelfilliol.blogspot.com/...this-blog-is-is.html

I think Joel saved the best for last in his "bonus" 21st rule:

Bonus: Love swimming if you want to get faster. Embrace the process of getting faster in the water. Chlorine sweat is a good thing.

Very few tri-guys/girls ever learn to love swimming, and hence very few learn swim really well:)


"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Avago] [ In reply to ]
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Errrr I was letting it be. You seem to be the one who keeps bringing it up, I just replied to your message.
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [songmak] [ In reply to ]
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songmak - different model with swimming - especially for those without a swim background - we create many opportunities for quality swimming - every day has steady, strength, building, descending opportunities - very little fluff - long main sets, lots of steady and strength swimming. We use the swim tools to pattern good technical swimming, and repeat to get strong. Many are athletes are on here looking for some easier way with swimming, but there isn't one. More frequency, more volume, less traditional stuff, more repetition. This article captures my approach: http://joelfilliol.blogspot.com/2012/01/most-popular-post-on-this-blog-is-is.html






>>>>
JoelFilliol.com - check out the Real Coaching Podcast
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [ericmulk] [ In reply to ]
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Bad bike wrecks, where do we start. Actually as you write it is an unspoken part of triathlon training and competition. Who I am today as an athlete and racer has in some part been shaped by my horrendous experience and encounters of bike crashes. Thankfully for a number of years I have managed to avoid any significant happenings on the bike. That said during my ITU years I was involved in a number of crashes, primarily in races that actually left a psychological stamp. From 2008 to 2012 I had been involved in (< Blue suit, getting feet out). I have scars in my neck from chainring teeth, received minor plastic surgery to my forehead and lip, encountered a discus prolapse as a result of crashes and poor post crash management. In January of 2012, with Olympic qualification yet to be secured, Ben and I were hit from behind taking us both down. Ben took the brunt of that crash breaking his elbow but we were both incredibly lucky to walk away from that.

Here's some articles covering more on bike related crashes:

Realizing A Dream Pt. 1
A Month Of Defeats


London 2012 Olympian : 6 x IRONMAN 70.3 Winner : 2014 Challenge Bahrain Champion : 2014 Hy-Vee 5150 Champion : Master of Human Nutrition - Twitter: @helle_f Facebook: /helletri Web: hellefrederiksen.com

Sponsors: Uplace-BMC Pro Triathlon - Nike - Sands Beach Active - NormaTec - Bragi - Hotbox Roasters
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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Ouchy! That was you in the swimsuit, right? I take it there was some serious road rash from that, looks like you took a good slide.

Q - out of the current crop of best male/female ITU racers on the circuit right now, who do you see as having the greatest potential in non-drafting and middle/full distance? Obviously we have seen success from Frodeno and Gomez in the mens', and recently Nicola Spirig representing the ladies successfully at Cozumel. Who else have you got your eye on?!

ETA: and yourself, obviously! Really bad manners there, naughty knighty76...
Last edited by: knighty76: Dec 12, 14 1:24
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Joel Filliol] [ In reply to ]
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Joel, thanks for your contribution on this thread. I like the simplicity of your approach, it matches the simplicity of my brain.

A slightly off topic yet important Question. What the heck is on this TV screen, is there some kind of strange conditioning going on here?!...

http://joelfilliol.com/consulting/
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [knighty76] [ In reply to ]
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knighty76 - ha, I didn't notice that - it's at the gym at the Noosa Australia pool - I like your conditioning theory so let's go with that ;-)


J

>>>>
JoelFilliol.com - check out the Real Coaching Podcast
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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Jodie twitted this. Your post race interview with Jodie and Rachel was really good. I am sure some of the readers of this thread will enjoy it.


http://www.witsup.com/...tter-with-the-top-3/


What did Tim Don do to cut the interview ?
Last edited by: marcag: Dec 12, 14 5:59
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [marcag] [ In reply to ]
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Just the mental toughness alone to pound out 30x100, 40x100 or 50x100 is impressive. It makes a IM swim seem like a walk in the park. My High School swim team, looking back, is still some of the hardest training I've ever done in my life. Not sure I could do that now... not without 30 other guys in the pool with me, pushing me.


TrainingBible Coaching
http://www.trainingbible.com
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [marcag] [ In reply to ]
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I enjoyed doing this interview, to have the three podium girls there like this was great. Also I think Jodie and Rachel put a full stop on any doubt by fellow competitors on whether or not I deserved to win that race ;)

Tim Don being Tim Don totally pranked us into thinking the camera was not recording. He slowly approached and mimed "it's not recording", he clearly knew it was.


London 2012 Olympian : 6 x IRONMAN 70.3 Winner : 2014 Challenge Bahrain Champion : 2014 Hy-Vee 5150 Champion : Master of Human Nutrition - Twitter: @helle_f Facebook: /helletri Web: hellefrederiksen.com

Sponsors: Uplace-BMC Pro Triathlon - Nike - Sands Beach Active - NormaTec - Bragi - Hotbox Roasters
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [ericmulk] [ In reply to ]
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Erik, I know you enjoy swimming and so do most of us. I do find your statement about very few tri guys learning to love swimming being somewhat patronizing. First of all you don't have any data to back this up. Second point, it is true that many age groupers swim less than one might want to or need to for optimal performance, but this is driven by many factors none of which have any correlation with how much we may love swimming (or not).

1. Basic access to a pool. For around 30 weeks per year, I can't get to a pool during week days (just an example).

2. Time overhead. For many a 40 min swim may involve a 60 min commute. Tradeoff is a 110 min bike or run block in that window and which might have a larger impact on results.

3. Pool hours. Bike and run you can do whenever. Swimming people are restricted by hours their pool is open and work and family often get in the way....easier to bike or run when life gets out of the way.

4. No access to clean water....this is not a first world issue, but the sport is larger than rich countries only.

By the way, I really enjoy swimming a lot and finally after 14 years of waiting I have an easily accessible rec center with 3 lanes open from 6 am to 9 pm minus 4-7 pm, so I essentially have infinite access whenever I am at home and it is awesome. But when pool access is not that easy, it is much easier to access running or biking. Age group racing has always been about sub optimal tradeoffs and doing cost benefit...not always about doing what we may love more or less. Most of us love all three believe it or not...seriously if you don't love all three why would anyone do this as a hobby that we don't get paid for.

Helle and the pros, sometimes they must do workouts-travel-family sacrifice, personal social sacrifice and other items that they don't love doing to be successful, but that is what we all do in our professional lives to optimize professional outcomes...but age groupers, I doubt that most hate any of the three sports and largely love/enjoy all three. If you are in the sport for any length of time that's basically a requirement to keep doing it.
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [knighty76] [ In reply to ]
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Yes that was me in the swimsuit. It hurt a little.

Great question with current crop of ITU athletes. If we think of those athletes that have been on the fringe of switching to non-draft/longer distance for some time I think Moffy (Emma Moffat) would excel at the distance. I think Moffy is the one stand out for me at least that would be able to move the bar of middle distance racing, as a few others already are, if she found the right training and lifestyle formula to match it. As for the men, there is no one person that stands out to me really. It really isn't an easy jump to make. I think Jodie Stimpson, when her Olympic ambitions are fulfilled could be quite dangerous.


London 2012 Olympian : 6 x IRONMAN 70.3 Winner : 2014 Challenge Bahrain Champion : 2014 Hy-Vee 5150 Champion : Master of Human Nutrition - Twitter: @helle_f Facebook: /helletri Web: hellefrederiksen.com

Sponsors: Uplace-BMC Pro Triathlon - Nike - Sands Beach Active - NormaTec - Bragi - Hotbox Roasters
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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devashish_paul wrote:
I do find your statement about very few tri guys learning to love swimming being somewhat patronizing. First of all you don't have any data to back this up.

But it's true.

Accelerate3 Coaching https://accelerate3.com/
Moxie Multisport https://www.themoxiemultisport.com/
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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helle_f wrote:
Yes that was me in the swimsuit. It hurt a little.

Great question with current crop of ITU athletes. If we think of those athletes that have been on the fringe of switching to non-draft/longer distance for some time I think Moffy (Emma Moffat) would excel at the distance. I think Moffy is the one stand out for me at least that would be able to move the bar of middle distance racing, as a few others already are, if she found the right training and lifestyle formula to match it. As for the men, there is no one person that stands out to me really. It really isn't an easy jump to make. I think Jodie Stimpson, when her Olympic ambitions are fulfilled could be quite dangerous.

By the way related to this and my earlier question about physiology. My feeling is that to be a good ITU athlete you need a slightly different fasrt twitch composition in muscle fiber to deal with the swim start, the surges on the bike and the sprint finish. This is kind of why I asked you that question because I'm guessing as a fan more than anything that you might have more slow twitch (muscle fiber not website) than the other girls.

Look at Mo Farah who closed the 5000m in London with a 53 second 400m. That same fast twitch that allows him to close hurts him at the marathon where he ran a "slow" 2:08 (all relative). Observing from far away, Gomez has never been the guys surging and sprinting for the win...a perfect example is his 4th place in Beijing being de coupled by Frodo-Whitfield-Docherty. His Silver in London was done as a diesel as was his win in Mont Tremblant this year. I don't follow ITU women enough to observe who is that girl today who lacks a bit of fast twitch for ITU type racing but that lack might be an asset over steady half and full IM racing...do you think that person is you for now. I think Chrissy Wellington was an extreme in that camp with a giant engine and work ethic who could lock it into a super high aerobic pace and drill that all day. Chrissie did not do much in her brief appearances in draft legal races.

I see IM vs ITU as very similar to marathon vs 5000m and certainly when the 5000m starts slow and ends literally close to world class 800m speed. Another example we can give is Craig Alexander...did not make the Aussie Olympic team, but look what he did at half-full IM racing. It's not that IM has less talented athletes/deep fields, it just rewards a slightly different physiology
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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Plus I'd be willing to bet most of those on here who love swimming might not be as into biking or running. While I agree that you have to really immerse yourself for improvement I don't think there's any guarantee of ever learning to love it. Also those such as Eric who love it likely grew up doing it and always had it as part of their life rather than having made some conscious choice to love it.
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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Daniela Ryf?

As for the swim debate, for us age groupers it is clearly a time invested vs benefit question rather than anything else. As example I swim maybe 1.5h a week and I lose to top pros maybe 5 min on half distance, but 20 min in biking and run, clearly my time is better spend running and biking than swimming.

I always thought the crazy swim amounts of pro's is just the time left over once you've done all the running and biking the body can handle? Ans maybe some race dynamics reasons
Last edited by: markko: Dec 12, 14 10:21
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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Due to this thread, I kinda have a crush on both Helle and Joel...






Take a short break from ST and read my blog:
http://tri-banter.blogspot.com/
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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PATRONIZING??? You have got to be joking. At least 1/4 of the swim-related posts on this forum have some reference to how much the poster despises the swim and how he/she only swims to "get to my bike". I think it is abundantly clear to anyone with an open mind that most ST-ers actually hate the swim and only do it so that they can call themselves triathletes. Perhaps 10% of ST like swimming, and maybe 1% truly love swimming, as in they'd rather swim than do any other sort of sporting activity.

As to access to a pool, that's just another excuse. Choose where you live more carefully.


"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [markko] [ In reply to ]
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Yes for sure Daniela, but I consider Daniela already fully switched. Daniela is, based on her performances at Wiesbaden and Mont-Tremblant, the standard.

The crazy swim amounts of pros is a necessity. The Bahrain race, the Mont-Tremblant race were all setup in the swim. If you want to compete at the highest end of non-draft/middle distance the swim commitment can't be a 'left over' after biking and running.


London 2012 Olympian : 6 x IRONMAN 70.3 Winner : 2014 Challenge Bahrain Champion : 2014 Hy-Vee 5150 Champion : Master of Human Nutrition - Twitter: @helle_f Facebook: /helletri Web: hellefrederiksen.com

Sponsors: Uplace-BMC Pro Triathlon - Nike - Sands Beach Active - NormaTec - Bragi - Hotbox Roasters
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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Gratulerer saa meget Helle og God Jul :-)

It was fun to watch you release some Danish Viking power in the desert. Impressive performance.
It looks like Denmark is really stepping up in the non draft triathlon world these days lead by strong women.

Is it frustrating for you athletes to watch other endurance sports getting attention in Europa and on Eurosport and local TV, almost always live. While the coverage from non draft triathlon is not present at all.
Long distance triathlon is a lot more fun than to watch the European championship in 10,000 speed skating so it is not the sport that is boring by itself.
Do you think Challenge now with Bahrain and Dubai/Oman will help with giving you elite athletes a media platform?

Go Danish Dynamite
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Joel Filliol] [ In reply to ]
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So how far out from a race do you begin preparation? Do you train with certain periods focused on different aspects like more speed work closer to competition
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [ericmulk] [ In reply to ]
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ericmulk wrote:
As to access to a pool, that's just another excuse. Choose where you live more carefully.

Now that is a patronizing statement.
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [ericmulk] [ In reply to ]
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ericmulk wrote:
PATRONIZING??? You have got to be joking. At least 1/4 of the swim-related posts on this forum have some reference to how much the poster despises the swim and how he/she only swims to "get to my bike". I think it is abundantly clear to anyone with an open mind that most ST-ers actually hate the swim and only do it so that they can call themselves triathletes. Perhaps 10% of ST like swimming, and maybe 1% truly love swimming, as in they'd rather swim than do any other sort of sporting activity.

As to access to a pool, that's just another excuse. Choose where you live more carefully.

I"m not going to even bother discussing what triathletes in general do based on some posts on Slowtwitch and the source of your stats....there is an entire world of triathlon outside of this place anyway...but your point in bold, for starters, there are many other family and professional reasons why people choose where they choose to live BEFORE access to swimming pools becomes a factor. By definition as age groupers, we choose where we live based on family objectives and professional objectives....the reality for most is that sport has to take a back seat in this decision making process. Having said, that I have chosen where I live because it allows for an active lifestyle and have turned down much more lucrative professional opportunities because I want a balance, but not everyone is going to make that choice and we can't be patronizing and tell them to choose a better location where pool access is good....it's not another excuse, it's just that other people have other priorities in life that have nothing to do with sport. For you it might be an excuse because you value sport/swimming. Others value other aspects of life. You spend 30,000m per week swimming. Other people might spend those same 10 hours coaching their kid's baseball or soccer team, so those facilities might be important to that family over swimming facilities.

I'm lucky, I now have access to a pool all day when I am in town. This week I was on business travel and had zero pool access. I ran 108K. But I'm not going to bang on others who won't get out and run that much and judge them just because I ran a bit more than the average triathlete. But all I was doing was working, eating, running, traveling. Running is just so much more portable a lifestyle sport than swimming. Swimming has a lot more restrictions...but I love it because I can work my cardio really hard in every swim. I can't work my cardio that hard running without breaking down. I can work my cardio equally hard as often as swimming while biking, but it means having access to the bike...can't do that on the road either, so stuck with running. All the sports have their value. Where we live and what we have access to are not excuses and they are no reflection of what we might love about a sport or not. Please don't judge people by your values...live your life and let them live their lives....don't ask them to live in conformance with your values. I know it is hard to do. I'm always suggesting people to get out of their car and bike everywhere, but it's not viable in many communities and I'm also inclined to tell them that if they want they can move to where they can ride...quite often, it's not even an option, so I am equally guilty as you in this regard....we all do it....just pointing it out and will try to catch myself too.
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [JSully] [ In reply to ]
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JSully wrote:
ericmulk wrote:

As to access to a pool, that's just another excuse. Choose where you live more carefully.


Now that is a patronizing statement.

NOT MY INTENT but simply that IME, most cities of 25,000 or more have at least one indoor pool so, unless you choose to live in a town with less population, you should have an indoor pool available 12 mon/yr. By factoring your swim into your everyday life, it is not hard, i.e. with very little "out of the way driving", to either swim in the am before work, swim at lunch, or swim after work. Plus, while most tri people seem to think not all of swimming on the weekends, Sat and Sun are 2 more days to get you up to say 5 days/wk of swim. Perhaps i am over-simplifying but, in 40 yrs of swimming in about 10 diff cities/towns, the most "extra time" i've ever had to take was a 30-min round-trip drive to the pool.

Also, one other thought is to buy a set of stretch cords for $35-$50 and "swim" in your living quarters whenever you want. If you can afford it, you can buy a Halo Swim Bench for around $400 or a Vasa Trainer for $1000, both relatively cheap compared to your average tri-bike:)


"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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helle_f wrote:
Bad bike wrecks, where do we start. Actually as you write it is an unspoken part of triathlon training and competition. Who I am today as an athlete and racer has in some part been shaped by my horrendous experience and encounters of bike crashes. Thankfully for a number of years I have managed to avoid any significant happenings on the bike. That said during my ITU years I was involved in a number of crashes, primarily in races that actually left a psychological stamp. From 2008 to 2012 I had been involved in (< Blue suit, getting feet out). I have scars in my neck from chainring teeth, received minor plastic surgery to my forehead and lip, encountered a discus prolapse as a result of crashes and poor post crash management. In January of 2012, with Olympic qualification yet to be secured, Ben and I were hit from behind taking us both down. Ben took the brunt of that crash breaking his elbow but we were both incredibly lucky to walk away from that.

Here's some articles covering more on bike related crashes:

Realizing A Dream Pt. 1
A Month Of Defeats

Damn, you've had your share for sure!!! I have some chainring teeth scars on the skin over my rib-cage but my most visible scar is on back of my left calf, where some sharp part of my bike cut into my calf muscle and so the muscle is visibly short. Also, the knee was twisted a bit and so for several yrs now i "pop" my knee every 1-2 min across the day. The knee never hurts but rather just feels tight, and then lifting and tightening the knee causes the knee to audibly pop, which has been known to cause some people to flinch just hearing the pop:) BUT, on the very, very positive side, the knee never hurts and i can swim, bike, and run until complete exhaustion w/o issue:)

Hears to hoping we both continue to avoid significant bike accidents in 2015:)

Cheers,

Eric


"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [FastTwitch12] [ In reply to ]
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FastTwitch12 - with the season as long as it is now, you are never far away from race preparation, so I prefer to think of the building into races simply layer on top of layer of conditioning - the layers then aren't substantially different, with the quality of output increasing over time.

>>>>
JoelFilliol.com - check out the Real Coaching Podcast
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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So what does a typical training week look like for you?
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [FastTwitch12] [ In reply to ]
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Lads please discuss your personal swim and whatever arguments somewhere else. Most people would really appreciate that
This thread is about Helle and Joel.

Helle and Joel how do you decide what and were is the best training environment for helle? ie squad training vs her own training.
Helle what do you see as the main differences, training in a squad, more on your own and with Alicia ?
cheers

http://www.pb3coaching.com
Last edited by: pk: Dec 13, 14 15:57
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [RobK] [ In reply to ]
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Rob you clearly have no idea what the hell you are talking about.
You might want to stop now before you make a bigger fool of yourself.
Just a correction, as a South African we are no longer an apartheid country in case you missed it we had a black president the amazing Nelson Mandela from 1994, and we have had democracy before that so count the years !!! Triathlon is a big sport here and all people from all races participate. We had our share of sport and other sanctions for many years under apartheid this days are long gone thankfully.
SA is a great place so please get your facts straight interrupting an interesting thread.

I follow myself on twitter!
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Paolo55] [ In reply to ]
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Howzit Paolo you seem to be a bit of a domkop. I have spent plenty of time in South Africa and am entirely aware of the political situation. That's why I wrote "Apartheid South Africa" and not "South Africa", an obvious reference to the pre-94 situation. Doos.
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [James Haycraft] [ In reply to ]
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James Haycraft wrote:
devashish_paul wrote:
I do find your statement about very few tri guys learning to love swimming being somewhat patronizing. First of all you don't have any data to back this up.


But it's true.

Thank God, at least one other person agrees with me:)


"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [RobK] [ In reply to ]
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Rob nobody's interested in your political view on this, Nordic answered spot on. Perhaps take your "disturbance" to another forum on another site. It's funny how people resort to personal insults when they lose an argument.

I follow myself on twitter!
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Paolo55] [ In reply to ]
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Paolo55 wrote:
Rob nobody's interested in your political view on this, Nordic answered spot on. Perhaps take your "disturbance" to another forum on another site. It's funny how people resort to personal insults when they lose an argument.


Mate, what planet are you on? Firstly, I haven't lost an argument because there hasn't been one, secondly the person who resorted to personal insults was you: maybe you've forgotten what you wrote?

Rob you clearly have no idea what the hell you are talking about.
You might want to stop now before you make a bigger fool of yourself.

Finally, the great irony here is that you're sitting in South Africa enjoying freedoms that arose partly (only a small part but an undeniable one nonetheless: what about the 'Keep Hansie Flying" posters in the referendum?) because of professional sportspeople boycotting a regime on the grounds of its human rights record. How quickly we forget.


Rob
Last edited by: RobK: Dec 14, 14 3:21
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Joel Filliol] [ In reply to ]
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Hi Joel,

Tomorrow we will be starting a 100day/100 run challenge here on ST.

One of your peers, just posted a blog entry that running everyday can be detrimental to older AGers and women, (including pros) and not necessary due to cross over of other disciplines.

What are your thoughts on running frequency ?
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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Just a note from me to say that I was not aware previously that the human rights question had already been vigorously debated on his forum here:

http://forum.slowtwitch.com/...t_reply;so=ASC;mh=25

Lots of very good points made on both sides there and well worth a read. It's certainly changed my opinion to a certain degree.

Had I known about that I wouldn't have asked my question in such a direct manner, and I apologise for my rather judgemental attitude.

Rob
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [marcag] [ In reply to ]
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marcag - Really the only answer to a question like that is 'it depends on the individual', but the idea that running every day is detrimental is BS. The majority of people who have some sort of running history and wanted to achieve this as a goal could run the 100/100 if they manage themselves by running easily enough and varied the duration of the days.


Frequency is the most effective tool for improving any discipline for most athletes.


J

>>>>
JoelFilliol.com - check out the Real Coaching Podcast
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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Helle and Joel, congratulations on your successes in 2014!!!

I was wondering what kind of tapering you do when coming into a 70.3 distance? With a busy schedule all year, how do you manage your recovery after a race and tapering going into a race?

Thank you and I look forward to seeing what 2015 brings your team!

http://www.sfuelsgolonger.com
http://www.blueseventy.com
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Joel Filliol] [ In reply to ]
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Frequency is the most effective tool for improving any discipline for most athletes.


Gold!

Thanks, Joel


Steve Fleck @stevefleck | Blog
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [marcag] [ In reply to ]
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...who said anything about running every day....just sayin....no one forcing anyone to do anything stupid, only people force themselves to be stupid. If you look at Sutton's suggestion it is fairly wide sweeping...then he goes on to talk about doing fartlek, long runs, tempo etc etc....is that not a lot worse than a bunch of easy jogs say 3-5 days per week which might be more appropriate for an older athlete recovering from injury or in a less advanced stage of aerobic development or over weight? Love some things Sutton says, but often he makes wide sweeping statements as if they are facts and then lots of guys will just go follow it and get injured....as usual the answer is "it depends".

So in this thread aside from Helle doing Q&A, now we have a debate about South Africa's former regime, we have an emerging Sutton debate and fortunately a peer coach of his (Joel) coming in and answering with "it depends", we have the politics of Bahrain, which we already knew would happen and we had some questions about the 20m draft zone (which we also knew would happen) and we have a bunch of swimmers telling triathletes they don't love to swim enough. In short, a regular week around here.

Thanks Helle for putting up with the unruly mob and actually filtering through all this to actually provide some value.
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [hickorynotch] [ In reply to ]
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hickorynotch - tapering is fairly standard - some tune ups tuesday and wednesday of race week, with the remainder easy, normal frequency and about 50% volume.
Pre and post race are the same for all races - big or small ones. It's predictable and consistent.


J

>>>>
JoelFilliol.com - check out the Real Coaching Podcast
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Tri-Banter] [ In reply to ]
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Tri-Banter wrote:
Due to this thread, I kinda have a crush on both Helle and Joel...

I know what you mean and I saw them live at prize giving, my lower jaw is fractured from hitting the table!!!!!

Grb
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Joel Filliol] [ In reply to ]
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So what does a typical pros training week look like when coached by you?
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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Hi Helle,

How much time do you spend on the bike trainer when you are at home, in the winter ? What do your easy rides look like on the trainer ? I struggle with the idea of benefit of 1hr easy trainer rides. Maybe I'm wrong.

Does Joel adjust your mix of s/b/r to take account of tri unfriendly winter season or do you simply avoid it by going to Mallorca :-)
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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Pretty hectic period at the moment, little time to sit down and read through posts. Keep the questions coming and answers will follow during the week. Thanks again.


London 2012 Olympian : 6 x IRONMAN 70.3 Winner : 2014 Challenge Bahrain Champion : 2014 Hy-Vee 5150 Champion : Master of Human Nutrition - Twitter: @helle_f Facebook: /helletri Web: hellefrederiksen.com

Sponsors: Uplace-BMC Pro Triathlon - Nike - Sands Beach Active - NormaTec - Bragi - Hotbox Roasters
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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helle_f wrote:
Pretty hectic period at the moment, little time to sit down and read through posts. Keep the questions coming and answers will follow during the week. Thanks again.

Helle...wait wait....that's not acceptable. First thing you need to do when you get out of bed is log into ST while having your espresso (perhaps 3 is even better), respond to a few posts, get into a random argument and pissed off because of some random person on the internet. Then your morning swim workout will have higher quality because you will be well revv'd up about what some anonymous person on the internet said. This is the best warmup to morning training. Dan Empfield needs to post that in forum rules :-)
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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thanks Helle and Joel, interesting thread.

So here's what I get from this thread for training secrets:

most effort is easy, the rest is hard effort.
easy is driven by perceived effort primarily, not power, heart rate or pace.
5 swims weekly, 4-5km each.
6 runs, 2 work sessions, rest easy
4-5 bike, 2 work
bread and butter sessions are the build finish: bike 2-3 or 4hrs with the last 30-90 mins building pace or at race pace. Similar with the running: building / progressive runs / negative splits.
Higher intensity than threshold is often difficult to achieve when under a high overall work load, whereas threshold, tempo, or steady can be done effectively even when very fatigued.
Frequency is the most effective tool for improving any discipline for most athletes.

Funny, looks like lots of simple hard work, not many secrets as such, how disappointing ;-)
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [doug in co] [ In reply to ]
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There are no secrets!

Just good, honest, consistent work, day after day, month after month, year after year. No such thing as that one special workout that will take you to the next level. Just like you can't throw a single brick down and build a wall - it's all the bricks, fitting well and joined together, that make the wall.

Group Eleven – Websites for Athletes / mikael.racing / @mstaer
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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helle_f wrote:
As I sit here back in Denmark I can't help but smile when I think back on the 2014 year. I thought 2013 was good but this year has been something else. It is the first time in my 6 years as a professional triathlete that I have really strung together a season that I am incredibly proud of. It was not perfect but it was definitely great.

Winning Challenge Bahrain was the icing on an incredibly satisfying year. After the disappointment of Mont-Tremblant I always felt like I had unfinished business. I am very happy that the commitment and investments we made towards Bahrain paid off. What happened in Bahrain was no fluke and I have a lot of people to thank for my successes and especially the Bahrain victory. The person who has contributed significantly and who I owe a large part of the thanks to is coach Joel Filliol. I moved to Joel at the back end of 2011, under what were then controversial circumstances as I left a national coach towards the end of an Olympic cycle. Post Olympics I then opted out of the national federation and funding program to go my own way. At the time I felt I needed this return of independence, do what I felt was right and find new 'unridden' ground. This brought me to non-draft racing and now in 2014 it is safe to say it was worthwhile.

But what has Joel done? What has changed for me? Why did I perform the way I did in Bahrain? Having been given the go ahead from Joel to do this. We will both actively commit our time over the coming days/week or so to this "Ask Us Anything" thread. Joel is currently on camp in Portugal whilst I drown myself in wine over here in Denmark ;-) Please excuse any delays in the responses but fire away and we will both do our best to make this worthwhile.

Thanks

Did you know that women were granted the right to vote in Bahrain way back in.....wait for it....2002?
That said, take the money and run!
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [doug in co] [ In reply to ]
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doug in co - that's it, simple, focused on the fundamentals - the 'trick' if anything is knowing when / why / how to deviate from the 'formula', which could be for a variety of reasons, fatigue, illness, travel, recovery, etc.

>>>>
JoelFilliol.com - check out the Real Coaching Podcast
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Joel Filliol] [ In reply to ]
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Joel, are there any physiological markers you track in your athletes, such as HRV ? Or is it all "how they feel" ?
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [marcag] [ In reply to ]
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marcag - no recovery markers like HRV or morning hrt, etc. This quote sums it up:

"What is your ideal monitoring system? Coaches that pay attention" - @PfaffSC

Paying attention to mood, body language, words, tone, and simply watching movement, RPE, vs actual paces/power, vs expected. Reading feedback.

None of the 'modern' tracking has proven useful, reliable, easy to consistently implement, or causes other problems such as creating doubt within the athletes mind, which then tends to become reality.

J

>>>>
JoelFilliol.com - check out the Real Coaching Podcast
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Joel Filliol] [ In reply to ]
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thanks

On a less technical note...I heard you on Fitness Radio. Great interview.
As a Canadian with a name like Filliol, I was expecting a little more of a jonnyo accent. Au contraire. :-)
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Joel Filliol] [ In reply to ]
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Joel and Helle thanks for the thread. Congrats on a great season for you both.
Joel, I had a question for you. How do you train an AGer differently than a pro like Helle. Obviously the pros do more volume than just about all AG athletes.
Or maybe it's easier to ask something more specific. Your bread and butter sessions where the pace builds up to race pace by the end for the pros, do you prescribe the same for AG athletes? I would just think that the race pace for AG is just not that high enough of an intensity to build into for an AG athlete. That is if we use the somewhat accepted power suggestions for say IM racing. AG = .65-.75. Pro = .75-.80
I get its only a few percentage points, but we are usually looking at a different of 15-20 hours per week of training. I hope this makes sense.
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [tucktri] [ In reply to ]
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tucktri - the builds are not necessarily to triathlon race pace, but either simply by effort, or to physiological markers such as 1-2hr power/effort, or 1/2 marathon pace/effort. The beauty of these build/neg split sessions is even doing them by effort works very well, and it's hard to do them 'incorrectly', and the feedback if you do it immediate (unable to maintain the 'building' pace). E.g. next long ride, do the last hour 'hard' and see what you get for output.


J

>>>>
JoelFilliol.com - check out the Real Coaching Podcast
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Joel Filliol] [ In reply to ]
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Joel Filliol wrote:
tucktri - the builds are not necessarily to triathlon race pace, but either simply by effort, or to physiological markers such as 1-2hr power/effort, or 1/2 marathon pace/effort. The beauty of these build/neg split sessions is even doing them by effort works very well, and it's hard to do them 'incorrectly', and the feedback if you do it immediate (unable to maintain the 'building' pace). E.g. next long ride, do the last hour 'hard' and see what you get for output.


J

Joel....it sounds like at the peak of the "build" you end up at a slightly lower intensity/perceived exertion than in Daniel's cruise intervals (which he took from swimmers doing 400 m intervals). In other words an intensity from which you can recover quickly and do fairly frequently?
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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Hey Dev,

I don't worry about how to label that session, but any training we do ought to allow recovery and frequency to come back at the next session or next day as planned- that's the consistency principle.

>>>>
JoelFilliol.com - check out the Real Coaching Podcast
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Halvard] [ In reply to ]
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Tusind tak Halvard.

Sorry for such a delay in the response.

Us Danes can produce some solid triathletes that's for sure. If you base it on country population I'm going to put it out there that Denmark has the best rate of pro success per capita ;)

Yes it can be frustrating. Previously it may take up more energy or thoughts than it does now but on the whole I think the issue is deeper than we may think to overcome. In Denmark for example the focus on triathlon is insignificant which can hurt, especially when so much effort goes into winning such a race like Bahrain. IRONMAN Denmark does a great job at exposing the event and activating medias, especially television in Denmark. But that is it for Denmark. Anything outside of Denmark or the IRONMAN Denmark event is not valued unless there's a lifestyle story to relate to. Medias just don't understand the sport enough to cover it for performance purposes alone or recognize a big performance/exciting event.

In relation to Challenge Bahrain and the influence. I can with confidently say that it has already brought changes and some of the most needed ones. A reference was made to me today, by a business profile in the sport on a large level, who previously only valued, recognized and supported performances at IM 70.3 and full IM events. It was clear that performances in the Challenge Triple Crown in 2015 would carry equal value/recognition for them as that of Zell Am See/Kona.

How developments of Dubai/Oman/Bahrain take place I can only speculate. There is no doubt that having connected with 90% of my sponsor team post Bahrain they are now all ears towards the future of this series and other whispered developments. Dependent on the success of Dubai from a exposure, experience, coverage perspective then we could be looking at a very real 'change of trends'. Time will only tell.


London 2012 Olympian : 6 x IRONMAN 70.3 Winner : 2014 Challenge Bahrain Champion : 2014 Hy-Vee 5150 Champion : Master of Human Nutrition - Twitter: @helle_f Facebook: /helletri Web: hellefrederiksen.com

Sponsors: Uplace-BMC Pro Triathlon - Nike - Sands Beach Active - NormaTec - Bragi - Hotbox Roasters
Last edited by: helle_f: Dec 17, 14 12:21
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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helle..have to disagree on your per capita comment ;)

How about New Zealand. 4.5 million. Erin Baker, Rick Wells, Hamish Carter, Bevan Docherty, Andrea Hewitt, Cameron Brown, Terenzo Bozzone.


Although over the years, Australia may be able to lay claim to that title just through sheer numbers...
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [fulla] [ In reply to ]
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I think Seychelles could be in with a shot - only one pro (Nick Baldwin), but a population of about 43*...



* Actually 92,000 according to wiki

On twitter talking about Triathlon, Cycling & Sport Science - @taffytriathlete
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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devashish_paul wrote:
helle_f wrote:
Pretty hectic period at the moment, little time to sit down and read through posts. Keep the questions coming and answers will follow during the week. Thanks again.


Helle...wait wait....that's not acceptable. First thing you need to do when you get out of bed is log into ST while having your espresso (perhaps 3 is even better), respond to a few posts, get into a random argument and pissed off because of some random person on the internet. Then your morning swim workout will have higher quality because you will be well revv'd up about what some anonymous person on the internet said. This is the best warmup to morning training. Dan Empfield needs to post that in forum rules :-)

That and the perceived need to match the training of all the (aspiring) triathlon pros on here.
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [pk] [ In reply to ]
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Great questions.

My decision comes down to what location can provide me with the most stable environment. The question then comes down to what contributes to a stable environment for me? Ben, facilities, treatment, ease of recovery, food availability, climate, terrain, treadmill. These are a few of which are all factored.

Training in a squad, absolute necessity for ITU racing where racing is as a group.
Training on your own, absolute necessity for non-draft racers to be able to punish themselves when alone.
Training with Alicia, awesome. It's very rare a girl can train with a girl, on an almost identical program and it brings smiles, added motivation, closer friendship and better racing. When a training partner brings proven positive for one another then don't change or break that intentionally.

pk: I'll elaborate on this last Q shortly as it deserves a more detailed response.


London 2012 Olympian : 6 x IRONMAN 70.3 Winner : 2014 Challenge Bahrain Champion : 2014 Hy-Vee 5150 Champion : Master of Human Nutrition - Twitter: @helle_f Facebook: /helletri Web: hellefrederiksen.com

Sponsors: Uplace-BMC Pro Triathlon - Nike - Sands Beach Active - NormaTec - Bragi - Hotbox Roasters
Last edited by: helle_f: Dec 17, 14 12:43
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Joel Filliol] [ In reply to ]
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Joel Filliol wrote:
doug in co - that's it, simple, focused on the fundamentals - the 'trick' if anything is knowing when / why / how to deviate from the 'formula', which could be for a variety of reasons, fatigue, illness, travel, recovery, etc.

Joel - would some of that deviation come as part of periodisation across the season? If so, how do you go about periodising the higher intensity workouts? Do you use the 'build sessions' across the whole season & off-season, or do you include other types of high intensity work at different times?

Do you agree with Brett Sutton's 'reverse periodisation' approach that he wrote about here - http://trisutto.com/...ation-for-triathlon/

On twitter talking about Triathlon, Cycling & Sport Science - @taffytriathlete
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [TaffyTriathlete] [ In reply to ]
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TaffyTriathlete - I don't like labels like 'reverse periodisation' - it's not new or novel - planning/periodization for sport always goes general to specific. In long distance racing of course the more specific work is going to come closer to the race, vs the early season when you are not as fit.


Our periodization model could be thought of with a concept of layers - each layer builds on the last, with the quality of what is achieve continuing to progress as conditioning deepens. In this model the type of work evolves but is not massively different from one phase to another.


We use building session in both the early season and specific phases, and of course are simply one type of session among others. The off-season is typically very short, and doesn't include any intensity.


J

>>>>
JoelFilliol.com - check out the Real Coaching Podcast
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Joel Filliol] [ In reply to ]
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Joel Filliol wrote:
Hey Dev,

I don't worry about how to label that session, but any training we do ought to allow recovery and frequency to come back at the next session or next day as planned- that's the consistency principle.

Joel, I love your approach...I think I am the prototype age grouper consistency athlete....if there was a 365 day long age grouper stage race, I'd win that event or at least hit the podium most years, so I agree with most of what you say....do you plan to have any long weekend type of training camps where you invite age group athletes to train with you and maybe select pro athletes that you work with?
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [RobK] [ In reply to ]
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RobK wrote:
Avago wrote:
helle_f wrote:
Rob,

Should I base my participation in triathlon events on the political status and happenings of a country I would probably not find myself racing too often. I chose to focus solely on what I feel is good for the sport of triathlon. On that basis I feel it is right for me to have raced in Bahrain. I'll not go any further into this issue.


Congratulations on your recent successes and your future celebrations.

Re - Politics of the host nation - your response is perfect, and should once and for all, silence any critic of those that do chose to participate.


I really don't understand how anyone might think that. She doesn't the address the main issue at all: this isn't just a general politics issue, this is more specifically about the person bankrolling the event who is accused by multiple sources of being personally involved in torture of pro-democracy activists. This isn't simply like doing a race in Apartheid South Africa, it's like doing one organised by the security police and with the cheques presented by Hendrik Verwoerd and Eugene De Kock. You might like to contrast this response with, for example, the vitriol that's directed towards Brett Sutton every time his name is mentioned here: the crimes that Sheikh Nasser is accused of are at least of the same magnitude as Sutton's, far more recent and have gone unpunished. Secondly, simply avoiding these issues is a complete cop-out: from the response above I assume that she would be happy to race in Apartheid South Africa or North Korea. Not too nice really.

Of course, she's had a lovely time, been treated like a rock star, won the race and made a load of cash so it's going to be difficult for her to deal with that, so the easiest thing is just to produce a bland and fairly meaningless response and ignore the issue.

Rob

I think the distinction you make between the morality of individuals versus governments is fairly arbitrary. A person who works for a government has agency, which means they have a choice whether or not to do that work. The pros and cons they face in different countries may differ but they have agency nonetheless. With choice comes moral culpability. So while your distinction between the culpability of the government of Bahrain and the government of South Africa may stand up to your subjective scrutiny, I think it is far from being a universal truth. Further, you present a neat binary categorisation of individual power versus institutional power. I don't think this is the place to bang on about the naiveté of that categorisation, but suffice to say that that's not how institutions work.

So, Bahrain is not a special case, distinct from other countries with policies with which a person might agree or disagree. And every time a person travels to another country, they pay taxes to the government of that country, which is a tacit (or perhaps not so tacit) endorsement of those policies. Am I responsible for propagating what some people see as an abhorrent war in Iraq, because I paid sales tax in NYC? Maybe. Am I responsible for the illegal detention of prisoners in Afghanistan, because I didn't withhold my taxes in the UK? Maybe. But maybe not.

In addition, while the argument for avoiding a country based on its politics or policies is valid one, so is that of engagement. Avoidance is a form of sanction and the question of whether or not sanctions work is entirely up for grabs. Iran, Myanmar and Cuba - they can be used to support either argument.

Perhaps we all could do more. Perhaps Helle could and I could and you could too. But for you to tell anybody what impact they caused by racing in Bahrain, or tell them they're not a nice person, or tell them that their response is a cop out - well, that seems a little off.
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Neil] [ In reply to ]
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I'm not going to reply to this at length because I've taken up enough of this thread, so I'll just refer you to my more recent post on the matter which you don't seem to have noticed.

Rob
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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Wasn't able to watch it live, but watched the full race online. Stunning performance. Congrats
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [pk] [ In reply to ]
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pk: just following on from my previous response. The main differences between training in a squad, on my own or with Alicia actually do not differ massively for me thankfully. Personally I don't need a squad of athletes, not in terms of company in training or in terms of how my races are. That said irrelevant on whether the ITU group likes squad training or not I believe it is the best training environment for ITU specific racing. Group training develops certain skill sets that are specific towards ITU racing. The same is said for solo training it does develop skills and attributes specific towards non-draft/solo racing.


London 2012 Olympian : 6 x IRONMAN 70.3 Winner : 2014 Challenge Bahrain Champion : 2014 Hy-Vee 5150 Champion : Master of Human Nutrition - Twitter: @helle_f Facebook: /helletri Web: hellefrederiksen.com

Sponsors: Uplace-BMC Pro Triathlon - Nike - Sands Beach Active - NormaTec - Bragi - Hotbox Roasters
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [marcag] [ In reply to ]
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Luckily for me I am fortunate enough that I can choose my training location pretty much year round. My body responds better in warmer climates so I have to follow that. I spend about 4 - 5 weeks of a year in total at home (3 of those now being for off-season/Christmas). I'll spend the majority of time on the home training or outdoors MTB'ing. That said I am responsible for a number of athletes who are based in cold climates, I have them doing a lot of home trainer stuff. It works. It is a good substitute if managed well. 1 hour easy rides, and easy rides in general need to be there. If you need to work hard your body needs to be in a position to do so, that means it needs to be rested. Instead of looking at the 1 hour easy ride as 'an easy ride' look at it as a piece of the weekly jigsaw.

I'll choose Lanzarote over Mallorca ;) That said we can get unfriendly weather wherever we are in the world and S/B/R is adjusted on a day-by-day basis. The weekly pattern is set with a purpose so change for the weather needs to be discussed.


London 2012 Olympian : 6 x IRONMAN 70.3 Winner : 2014 Challenge Bahrain Champion : 2014 Hy-Vee 5150 Champion : Master of Human Nutrition - Twitter: @helle_f Facebook: /helletri Web: hellefrederiksen.com

Sponsors: Uplace-BMC Pro Triathlon - Nike - Sands Beach Active - NormaTec - Bragi - Hotbox Roasters
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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I can definitely see how that can and does happen, hence why I choose to read rather than contribute, most of the time :)


London 2012 Olympian : 6 x IRONMAN 70.3 Winner : 2014 Challenge Bahrain Champion : 2014 Hy-Vee 5150 Champion : Master of Human Nutrition - Twitter: @helle_f Facebook: /helletri Web: hellefrederiksen.com

Sponsors: Uplace-BMC Pro Triathlon - Nike - Sands Beach Active - NormaTec - Bragi - Hotbox Roasters
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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helle_f wrote:
I can definitely see how that can and does happen, hence why I choose to read rather than contribute, most of the time :)

Please come with the teflon wetsuit on before logging into ST and keep contributing. Nothing really sticks around here anyway. Then after your three espressos, you can hit the swim workout at full throttle! All kidding aside, unlike many sports, we're lucky to have a medium to interact with champions. Sure in many cases we will like what you are saying and in other cases we might ask some hard questions that are uncomfortable to answer. Personally I don't think you need to answer why you chose to do a race in Bahrain, or China (where was everyone asking ITU to pull triathlon out of the Beijing Olympics???) just like I don't need to answer why I might go on company business to China. The fact remains that our governments have not sanctioned most countries and international authorities that govern our industries (such as ITU in your case) say it is OK for commerce to happen in Bahrain related to triathlon. As a pro, if you don't use that opportunity, someone else will and in a competitive world, a professional in any industry has to seize the opportunities. If we were talking about human rights organizations or NGO's that's another story, but working in a commercial revenue generating side of industry, you either compete or get out. That's just how the world works.

So please keep contributing as we all learn what it is like to be in the shoes of the top athletes in the sport...

One more question....your Masters in Nutrition degree. Did this change how you approach your preparation for races and also the nutrition in racing. One of our posters, Rob Gray has done a fair amount of investigation on carbohyrdate utilization in long course racing and has modified his CHO intake in lead up to long IM events with decent success. I think perhaps I might look into this for IM racing although living half the time on the road, controlling any intake of food seems to be difficult as I have to eat whatever ends up on my plate or I can get my hands on passing through airports.
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Joel Filliol] [ In reply to ]
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That makes a lot of sense, and much like Dev I really like this simple yet structured approach to training - having had a turbulent season, I've come to the conclusion myself that consistency is key, and it seems like this is the foundation of your approach. Thanks for the reply!


Also, just to pick up on something you said earlier:

Joel Filliol wrote:
FastTwitch12 - easy is driven by perceived effort primarily, not power, heart rate or pace.

Do you use this approach with all athletes, or are some guided by heart rate, power, pace etc?
From the athletes I know, it seems that a lot of age groupers struggle to reign in their intensity and train at an easy effort; instead they end up "racing" every workout. Some even get caught up in the idea that hard sessions are the only ones that count and eschew easy sessions completely. They obviously tend to get injured a lot!
Do any pros suffer from this problem as well, and do you approach them differently?

On twitter talking about Triathlon, Cycling & Sport Science - @taffytriathlete
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [TaffyTriathlete] [ In reply to ]
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TaffyTriathlete - it's best to learn how to pace via RPE - tools can help this, but calibrating the brain is the most effective long term strategy.


Pros are subject to the same problems of making the easy sessions to quick, but generally this self corrects pretty quickly under heavy training loads, which results in the easy sessions getting slower. It's being 'too fresh' that causes problems sometimes - but it's a matter of discipline in any case.


J

>>>>
JoelFilliol.com - check out the Real Coaching Podcast
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Joel Filliol] [ In reply to ]
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Joel Filliol wrote:
TaffyTriathlete - it's best to learn how to pace via RPE - tools can help this, but calibrating the brain is the most effective long term strategy.


Pros are subject to the same problems of making the easy sessions to quick, but generally this self corrects pretty quickly under heavy training loads, which results in the easy sessions getting slower. It's being 'too fresh' that causes problems sometimes - but it's a matter of discipline in any case.


J

Related to this, I am sure you have seen your share of athletes rip it up in B events when they are not fully rested and tapered and still in the middle of a training block. Then for the A event, rested, tapered and first half heros, but difficulty later in the day. Is there anything you do with them to re calibrate the brain for "rested and tapered" events, because in reality if an athlete is consistent in her training, it is tough to ever be truly rested for hard workouts. As such, A events may be the only time the experience the "new calibration". That may only be a few times per year.
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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Dev - I don't find this kind of calibration a problem - if you can pace and manage yourself tired you can probably do the same fresh. Athletes who have the problems you described have not got the loading right into the race. The problems being too fresh have to do with being able to dig too deep in some sessions, therefore affecting following sessions, and consistency over the week (single workout heros). A general workload fatigue tends to 'protect' the athlete from being able to hurt themselves in this way.

J

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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Joel Filliol] [ In reply to ]
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Do you ever have athletes bike 2x per day
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [FastTwitch12] [ In reply to ]
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FastTwitch12 - never have done the 2x bike per day.

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JoelFilliol.com - check out the Real Coaching Podcast
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Joel Filliol] [ In reply to ]
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Hi Joel,

to what extent do you consider yourself a 'data guy' ?

I suspect you use TP or Raceday or something like that.
Is it simply to communicate workouts, feedback, schedule or do you dive into the data ?

Are you a PMC/CTL/tsb believer ? Do you even look at it ?

What does an athlete dashboard look like ?

If you are not a data guy, do you find some of your athletes are more than you ? Is Helle ?
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Joel Filliol] [ In reply to ]
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Joel Filliol wrote:
FastTwitch12 - never have done the 2x bike per day.

Hey Joel, many of us often do the 2x bike per day because we bike commute to work and extend one ride to add in our "main workout" and use the other ride for transportation/recovery/consistency. I think this would work in the context you are suggesting, its just that one bike is the main workout, the other one is filler and better than "time in a car/train/bus".
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [marcag] [ In reply to ]
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marcag - I use data, power, GPS, do race analysis on the files, schedule some sessions with power and pace ranges, review it, and feedback on it. I look at the PMC, but don't use it for planning. We have some athletes more interested than others in reviewing power and pace. With Helle we review files and races together. That said I don't consider myself a 'data guy', more of a 'human guy' because that is what effective coaching is about. The vast majority of the 'problems' I have to solve as a coach are psychology related, not physiology related.

Athlete 'dashboards' include all the power stuff, plus volume ranges in each sport.


J

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JoelFilliol.com - check out the Real Coaching Podcast
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Joel Filliol] [ In reply to ]
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Joel, really enjoying your posts.

You quote Lydiard on your site and your answers seem in the spirit of what he would say. For example, Arthur would say that you couldn't just tell someone to do 20 X something because the athlete was likely to do overdo it and that it was better if the coach/athlete stopped the workout when they had had enough.

Likewise, I was too tired to hurt myself while I running over 100 miles a week when I was doing it week after week. The most dangerous time for me was when I was around 40-60 miles a week and fresh enough to hurt myself.

I'm a 60 yr old triathlete who likes to train. 6' and 145lbs. My first goal is health and racing goals are sprints and Olympic distance. My routine is like this and I'll do it indoor or outdoor rather than miss a day.

Monday brick: 60 min bike as I feel, 30 min of jogging and running drills on grass field to open and refresh legs, 40 minutes of swim varying distance and intervals.

Tuesday recovery: 60 min or more swim, 10 min row (seems to help lower back), 30 to 50 min of weight lifting for feedback, muscle balance between opposing muscle groups and keep shoulders healthy.

Weds brick: like Monday; yet, I run hills to maintain some ability to run uphill and downhill.

Thursday recovery: like Tuesday.

Friday brick: like Monday; yet, I run a 5K time trial on a treadmill for feedback.

Saturday brick:
Summer: 800yd or 1.5K lake swim, 10 mile or 18mile bike, 5K or 10K steady run.
Off season: 30-90min bike, 30-60 steady min run, 20-40 min swim.

Sunday recovery: like Tuesday. I'll also vary the weights on a given workout to be light, medium or heavy and adjust the reps accordingly.

If I need more recovery, I back off the effort and remind myself that it's only training, that I'm just out to get information and this is not a life or death workout.

To taper I would just skip a brick or two and just do some sharpening work to make sure that I have the coordination to match fitness and freshness.

How far off am I from what you would have me do? Advice?

My apologies for making this "all about me"; yet maybe others can learn from what I'm doing wrong too. Thank you in advance for your reply.

Indoor Triathlete - I thought I was right, until I realized I was wrong.
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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Dev, thanks and your words in that first part. They are spot on.

Nutrition: my Masters in Human Nutrition was completed whilst not being fully committed to making triathlon a profession. My study was the most important thing to me at that time. This meant when fully committing to making triathlon my full-time profession I carried my knowledge of nutrition with me. Therefore I haven't knowingly opted for a specific nutritional approach. I have more used myself as a guinea pig so that I have found out what works and doesn't work for me fx. Fasting workouts, energy intake during long rides, recovery foods, electrolyte or salt intake are all things, among others, that I have played with and gained an understanding of what the pros and cons of it are. The fact that I have my degree in Human Nutrition allows me to really know the positives and negatives of correct/incorrect nutrition, both as a lifestyle but now also in terms of its effects in high performance sport. My bachelor degree was in sports science so naturally I was able to combine and apply my knowledge in both areas to compliment each other. It is one thing to be a nutritionist but it is another thing to understand the impact sport has on your physiology and nutrition can support this.

Up until February 2013 I was a sole ITU racer so my need to put significant emphasis on race day nutrition was minimal. That said nutritional from a lifestyle/day-to-day basis is the bread and butter for performance consistency but more so for a stable and healthy weight. As I now put focus on longer events race day nutrition has required a little more focus, but still not overthought. I'm still looking at my intake requirements for races between 4 - 4.5 hours, so still not massively long. There definitely does need to be different approaches for IRONMAN/full distance events. It's interesting that Rob has done such study and it's great that the area is given focus. My biggest advice is always to try and keep the body in a stable and consistent eating pattern, especially if it is responding well to the nutritional approaches on a day-to-day basis. There is absolutely no denying that nutrition can break a race, but nutrition will not be what wins you the race.

Balance and consistency is showing time and time again to be the biggest % in terms of winningest approach to nutrition. We should approach nutrition on a person by person case but balance and consistency should always be the end goal.


London 2012 Olympian : 6 x IRONMAN 70.3 Winner : 2014 Challenge Bahrain Champion : 2014 Hy-Vee 5150 Champion : Master of Human Nutrition - Twitter: @helle_f Facebook: /helletri Web: hellefrederiksen.com

Sponsors: Uplace-BMC Pro Triathlon - Nike - Sands Beach Active - NormaTec - Bragi - Hotbox Roasters
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [IT] [ In reply to ]
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IT - I wouldn't be able to answer in any detail without asking questions and understanding the full picture of where you are coming from.


However I can make a couple general comments:


For health - sure, you have variety, frequency and strength, with a low stress approach.


For performance - longer steady run, longer bike w/ hills, replace 5km TT with fartlek with range of paces 2-3 weeks out of 4.


For taper - Friday easier, same volume.


J.

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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Joel Filliol] [ In reply to ]
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Joel,

Thank you for improving that schedule! Having read your changes, they make even more sense compared to what I was doing. Special thanks on the taper advice. Wish you and your athletes the best.

Indoor Triathlete - I thought I was right, until I realized I was wrong.
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Joel Filliol] [ In reply to ]
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Question from IT and your response got my attention. This is a great thread. I am 67 and in great health with solid base. No problem with 16 to 20 hours a week. Have done last two races a hair over 14 hours and trying to get to 13. Very little literature for old guys. How do you alter your approach for old farts?

KQ strategy - Outlive the competition
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [marcag] [ In reply to ]
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marcag and TaffyTriathlete: I wrote an article back in May of this year about 'data' and my use of it, you may be able to get something out of it and I'm pretty sure JF thinks in a similar way - http://www.hellefrederiksen.com/become-racer-hard-work-trumps-data/


London 2012 Olympian : 6 x IRONMAN 70.3 Winner : 2014 Challenge Bahrain Champion : 2014 Hy-Vee 5150 Champion : Master of Human Nutrition - Twitter: @helle_f Facebook: /helletri Web: hellefrederiksen.com

Sponsors: Uplace-BMC Pro Triathlon - Nike - Sands Beach Active - NormaTec - Bragi - Hotbox Roasters
Last edited by: helle_f: Dec 21, 14 7:55
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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helle_f wrote:
marcag and TaffyTriathlete: I wrote an article back in May of this year about 'data' and my use of it, you may be able to get something out of it and I'm pretty sure JF thinks in a similar way - http://www.hellefrederiksen.com/become-racer-hard-work-trumps-data/

Thanks, great article and very nice site. Lots of good stuff !
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Ron from IN] [ In reply to ]
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Ron from IN - my view for older athletes is to allow for more recovery time between intensive sessions, and make those types of sessions more strength based - builds/hills/progressions/tempos. So younger athletes might do 2-3 intensive sessions per sport per week, older athletes would do 1-2, with the remainder at easy/basic paces.


J.

>>>>
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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Hi Helle,
Do you eat the same foods most days? what would your typical daily diet be?
Thank you, I'm enjoying reading your posts :)
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Joel Filliol] [ In reply to ]
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Thanks again for your insights Joel - very interesting.

You mentioned that it's hard to include a lot of over-threshold work due to the overall workload that Helle & other athletes are maintaining week-in-week-out...how does this work for your ITU athletes? I'd imagine that the over-threshold and sprint work is much more important for them to be able to stay with the pack when surges occur...how do you fit this work into their plans? Do they work on a lower overall volume so that more intense sessions can be included without impacting overall workload? And do they do a larger number of intense sessions in total?

On twitter talking about Triathlon, Cycling & Sport Science - @taffytriathlete
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [TaffyTriathlete] [ In reply to ]
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TaffyTriathlete - for any ITU athletes, the basic fundamental conditioning underpins the ability to perform the specific demands of the race. Many prioritise the specific demands over building and maintaining the fundamentals. We need much less race specific work than most athletes think. So the answer is not to reduce the overall volume to perform the intensive work, it's more the opposite - intensive work in the context of 'high' overall volume is what underpins success.


J.

>>>>
JoelFilliol.com - check out the Real Coaching Podcast
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Joel Filliol] [ In reply to ]
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Joel Filliol wrote:
Many prioritise the specific demands over building and maintaining the fundamentals.

I think this probably describes every age group athlete I know! (Including myself, I'm sad to say!)

I'm gonna write this wisdom down somewhere and remind myself of it every time I think I'm not doing enough speedwork...

On twitter talking about Triathlon, Cycling & Sport Science - @taffytriathlete
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [shannonc] [ In reply to ]
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Hi Shannon,

I try and eat the same foods on a weekly basis rather than a daily basis. Day to day can look similar but not identical, or at least I try not to make each day identical. It is important that we maintain variety in our approach to eating on a daily basis.

A weekly food shop would contain white fish, salmon and chicken as meats. A mass range of vegetables and salad. Whole grain bread. Shed loads of yoghurt (Greek and organic), granola, muesli.

I wrote these two articles in 2013 regarding my approach to food and what I eat:

How I train and what I eat... - http://www.hellefrederiksen.com/...rain-and-what-i-eat/

What I eat and my approach to food - http://www.hellefrederiksen.com/...my-approach-to-food/

I hope this helps a little.


London 2012 Olympian : 6 x IRONMAN 70.3 Winner : 2014 Challenge Bahrain Champion : 2014 Hy-Vee 5150 Champion : Master of Human Nutrition - Twitter: @helle_f Facebook: /helletri Web: hellefrederiksen.com

Sponsors: Uplace-BMC Pro Triathlon - Nike - Sands Beach Active - NormaTec - Bragi - Hotbox Roasters
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Joel Filliol] [ In reply to ]
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thanks again Joel,

on the JFTracing site there is a picture of David doing some form of testing

Is formal testing something you do with your elites ?
If so, can you give an example of how it changed their training more than just measuring improvement.
Last edited by: marcag: Dec 22, 14 4:29
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [marcag] [ In reply to ]
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marcag - the pic of David is just a profile picture - we don't actually do any lab testing or indeed performance testing of any type with our athletes.


J.

>>>>
JoelFilliol.com - check out the Real Coaching Podcast
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Joel Filliol] [ In reply to ]
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How many hours per week do your athletes work out? is there a range?

Also, how many times per day do your athletes train?

Thanks again
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Jason80134] [ In reply to ]
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Jason80134 wrote:
Did you know that women were granted the right to vote in Bahrain way back in.....wait for it....2002?
That said, take the money and run!

Men also were granted the right to vote in 2002, that's because parliament was set up in Bahrain in 2002 by the then new King Hamad, as he wanted Bahrain to become a Kingdom with a democratic government - just like the British system. Prior to that, no one voted as the Kingdom was ruled by the late Sheikh Isa - a much loved King by all.
Last edited by: The Customer: Dec 22, 14 22:16
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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Thank you so much for replying, made my day :)
What are your gels of choice? I'm still trying to experiment with them, finding one that doesn't give me an upset stomach.

Also, how many treadmill sessions do you do per week?
Last edited by: shannonc: Dec 22, 14 16:27
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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Great thread Helle and Joel. Have enjoyed following along.

Mat Steinmetz

51-SPEEDSHOP.com - instagram - @matsteinmetz - facebook
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [shannonc] [ In reply to ]
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You are very welcome.

Gels is an interesting one. I've tried many, I only use gels when in racing. Currently I am using Etixx. It isn't such a thick gu like gel which I find helps the intake. I use both Isotonic Gel and a caffeine gel.

A point to note about the upset stomach, it may not solely be the gel that causes the issue. It could for sure trigger an upset stomach but there can be other contributing factors such as artificial intakes in an every day diet.

Treadmill running: my time spent on a TM varies. It depends what type of training block I am in, what environment is around me, how fatigued I am or how 'fresh' I need to be in the days ahead. Usually 1 x per week when in a heavy training block. This link explains why we use the treadmill - https://www.facebook.com/...hp?v=831112480262179


London 2012 Olympian : 6 x IRONMAN 70.3 Winner : 2014 Challenge Bahrain Champion : 2014 Hy-Vee 5150 Champion : Master of Human Nutrition - Twitter: @helle_f Facebook: /helletri Web: hellefrederiksen.com

Sponsors: Uplace-BMC Pro Triathlon - Nike - Sands Beach Active - NormaTec - Bragi - Hotbox Roasters
Last edited by: helle_f: Dec 23, 14 0:49
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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Just out of interest, I clicked on the link and have several questions:

  1. How fast do you run 1K repeats for ITU racing versus Half IM and how many
  2. What percent grade
  3. Do you ever do hill work on the treadmill in a big training block for the cardio load while taking out the downhill pounding?
  4. In your ITU days did you ever to back and forth intensity bike to fast treadmill to get used to sub 3:30 per kilometer immediately out of T2 (or faster)
  5. In that video what shoes are you running in and what drop
  6. Do you ever use a fan for cooling on the treadmill to keep the intensity up (as one might on a trainer)

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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Joel Filliol] [ In reply to ]
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Joel Filliol wrote:
marcag - the pic of David is just a profile picture - we don't actually do any lab testing or indeed performance testing of any type with our athletes.

By "performance testing of any type", does that include Coggan-style FTP tests? If so, do you instead extrapolate figures from races and hard workouts, or another method to determine zones and goals?

ZONE3 - We Last Longer
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [tessartype] [ In reply to ]
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tessartype - no performance tests of any type, no time trials, no lab tests, no field tests. The only performance testing that is relevant is racing performance. I don't worry too much about labelling zones - really they don't change that much over time, and when they do it's obvious from general sessions we are doing. Goals are simply the next step forward from where we are now. Can only move one step at a time.


J.

>>>>
JoelFilliol.com - check out the Real Coaching Podcast
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Joel Filliol] [ In reply to ]
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Hey Joel, I've really enjoyed yours and Helle's feedback and appreciate your time. I have a couple quick questions.
1. A lot of athletes on this site talk about the importance of doing 4 to 6 reps of strides (about :20 each) at the end of every easy run. Is that something you recommend for athletes or is that a waste of energy?
2. I have noticed that there are a lot of athletes who have a big engine and a lot of power and can ride the wheels off most people, but when they get on the run they are well below the level of the competition (Tom Davison comes to mind). If they aren't over-biking would you think this is most likely due to training habits or something about their specific physiology that limits them?

Powertap / Cycleops / Saris
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Tulkas] [ In reply to ]
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Tulkas - 1- yes I recommend strides regularly, for neuromuscular coordination. 2- The 'big bikers' are sometimes legitimately stronger than others, sometimes not. Those who believe they are stronger on the bike often ride harder relatively than others, so there is a psychology element in play. What limits big riders at the sharp end is a combination of how they train (putting more emphasis on riding in training, less on running), and physiology / economy (due to heavier weight, body type / shape, and biomechanics), and psychology.

J.

>>>>
JoelFilliol.com - check out the Real Coaching Podcast
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Joel Filliol] [ In reply to ]
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Thanks for the quick reply!

Powertap / Cycleops / Saris
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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1. It's not often I run 1km repeats actually, not now or then. I had maybe one or two specific "1km rep sessions" all year. I am fortunate enough that I can still access the same type of top end speed. But as a reference I am running to date 1 - 5 minute intervals where the 1 min pace could hover around 3'00" per km and the 5 min around 3'25" per km. These are often conducted numerous times within a longer session. However my treadmill is primarily longer steady workouts up to an hour. I try as much as I can to run the really top end stuff outdoors.
2. 1%
3. Yes. For the exact reasons you state.
4. No specifically on a treadmill. We did and still do some hard bike session with a brick that contains some fast get out pace (between 5 - 15 minutes). I did do swim to bike bricks quite often to tolerate and teach the mind to handle what was needed immediately exiting an ITU T1.
5. Nike Lunarfly, I believe it has a 9mm heel-to-toe drop but honestly it is not something I pay much attention to.
6. Yes I always try to have a fan close by.


London 2012 Olympian : 6 x IRONMAN 70.3 Winner : 2014 Challenge Bahrain Champion : 2014 Hy-Vee 5150 Champion : Master of Human Nutrition - Twitter: @helle_f Facebook: /helletri Web: hellefrederiksen.com

Sponsors: Uplace-BMC Pro Triathlon - Nike - Sands Beach Active - NormaTec - Bragi - Hotbox Roasters
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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Thanks to everyone for their contribution to this thread. I have really enjoyed being a part of it. For now I will log off and enjoy the rest of the Christmas festivities at home with my family. I leave my family again on the 26th for many months away from Denmark as I chase the wants of my 2015 year.

Have a fantastic Christmas. Enjoy the celebrations. I'll check back when settled back on Sands Beach Resort, Lanzarote should there be further interaction

Always feel that you can interact and ask your questions via my social platforms.

Make 2015 an awesome one.

H


London 2012 Olympian : 6 x IRONMAN 70.3 Winner : 2014 Challenge Bahrain Champion : 2014 Hy-Vee 5150 Champion : Master of Human Nutrition - Twitter: @helle_f Facebook: /helletri Web: hellefrederiksen.com

Sponsors: Uplace-BMC Pro Triathlon - Nike - Sands Beach Active - NormaTec - Bragi - Hotbox Roasters
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Joel Filliol] [ In reply to ]
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Joel Filliol wrote:
tessartype - no performance tests of any type, no time trials, no lab tests, no field tests. The only performance testing that is relevant is racing performance. I don't worry too much about labelling zones - really they don't change that much over time, and when they do it's obvious from general sessions we are doing. Goals are simply the next step forward from where we are now. Can only move one step at a time.


J.

^^^this. 100% perfect. I do have a Powertap admittedly, but it really is used for shits and giggles mapping out local climbs and doing W/kg math in my head to give me the "psychological" I am fit mentality. Never do I do a workout to power. I just ride. I do not run with a HR monitor anymore. 3 paces: base, tempo, hard. I've done ok as an aging AG hack who loves wine and cookies with this program. #DOTHEWORK

Joel your mentality above is so true. Do the work. Do it again. Repeat.

THIS HAS BEEN A GREAT THREAD. thanks for the contributions.

@rhyspencer
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [helle_f] [ In reply to ]
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Just put up a nearly hour-long interview with Helle, Joel, and Ben Powell that covers lots of this thread at ZenTriathlon.com Tone of voice adds even more depth to what's been said. Enjoy!

----------------------------------------------------------
Zen and the Art of Triathlon. Strava Workout Log
Interviews with Chris McCormack, Helle Frederikson, Angela Naeth, and many more.
http://www.zentriathlon.com
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Re: Winning Challenge Bahrain and non-draft success - AUA [Joel Filliol] [ In reply to ]
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I don't think this has been posted yet so here's a great summary from Joel: http://joelfilliol.com/...ning-and-performance
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