Hi Ian Peace,

I would love to get your fit advice. I'm now looking at the QR X-PR.

I was out of tri for a couple decades, basically since they cancelled the Rifle IM... but I've gotten sucked back in. I sold my 650c Lightspeed Blade a while back; I don't have the dimensions, but I'd used a Look adjustable stem to get the bar height where I needed it.

• I'm 5'10" with about a 30" inseam after thorough stretching
• My road seat height is about 28.5" (BBc to seattop) using 172.5 cranks

Lots of arthritic notches in my hip joints, so I've been riding my road bike with a fairly open hip angle (bar tops about even with the seat height)

I might also seek an in-person bike fitter. I'm in the Santa Cruz/SF Bay Area.

Thanks for your help,

Eric Pederson

Video of my current setup and position via My Velo Fit:

nanban_ronin,
Good on you for really chasing your position. If you're not perfect now my guess is that you will be soon - just from your recognition of the value of fit and your ability to chase it.

Let me answer your questions directly first...
I think a size 54 can work for you, yes. But I get the feeling that you could be even happier if you rode a bit longer and lower. if you went to a 56 the lower part would be even more of a challenge but the longer part would assisted. I think you could get to where you might be best with this size 54 bike and a 130 stem slammed* and add some aerobar tilt^
*It looks to me like you have zero spacers under stem and a pretty thin headset cover - good. I can't tell if there are any pedestals in the aerobars, if there are, remove them.
^Make sure the longer stem you get is -17 degrees in pitch (I'll recommend a Profile Design) and then.. put the bike on the trainer and loosen the bolts that clamp on the aerobars on the round base bar - just loosen them a bit so you have to pull on 'em with a wee bit of force to get them to rotate. Ride for a moment with the bars fairly level as they are now and then pull 'em up a touch to add more tilt and see if that's more comfortable. Keep trying different degrees of aerobar bar extension tilt 'til you find a spot you love. The might make your shoulders even happier and as you tilt the aerobar up the pad will go down and I think you'll like riding lower.

Normally I'd be suspicious about the saddle being all the way back but you're riding so far out on the nose of that seat that you're still riding pretty steep. Once you get the front end a hair longer and lower... slide the saddle foward just a bit and see if you get more power.

Ian

---

Ian Murray
http://www.TriathlonTrainingSeries.com
I like the pursuit of mastery
Twitter - @TriCoachIan

Eric,
You've given me some really good intel here and based on all of it I suspect your Pad Y is roughly 650mm and your Pad X is ~455mm. So I'm going to prescribe off of that...and...I'll do it for all 4 variations of X-PR front. Before I do I'm going to ask you not to freak-out at the sizing. QR does something very smart and very different with how they size their tri bikes. The size is based on Stack of the frame - brilliant! But it also sounds super small, which it is not.

If you got the X-PR with a "mortal" stem (PD - Profile Deisgn 1/17) and the PD 35a aerobars you'd need a size 52 with the 90mm stem in the -17deg position, 20mm of spacer under the stem + 10mm of aerobar pedestal, and arm pads mounted dead center. I like this because I could be off in my Y/X estimation a little bit and it gives lots of room to move the pads up, down, fore, aft to find your perfect spot.

If you got the X-PR with the same "mortal" stem and the PD Supersonic Ergo+ 35 SLC aerobars then it would be a 52, 90mm stem in -17 positon, 25mm of spacer + 25mm of pedestal, and pad set 2 holes foward of dead center.

If you got the X-PR with QR's OEM aero (read: "super") stem with the PD 35a aerobars .. .then it would be 54 with the 75mm stem, 10mm of "stem spacer" + 25mm of aerobar pedestal, and pads offset -4.75cm (which is to say... 4 holes fwd of 100% back).

If you got the X-PR with QR's aero stem and PD's very sexy Aeria Ultimate bar & SLC aerbars then you'd need a 54 with a 90mm stem, 10mm stem spacer + 35mm of aerobar pedestal, pads -6.25 off set (AKA 5 holes fwd of 100% back).

How one might decide on these 4 front end options could be based on a few criteria: budget, aesthetic, "aero-ness" (although, that's hard pinpoint), etc. If you have questions get back me here and we'll drill down deeper into details.

Also, Rifle IM that was cancelled.... My mind goes straight to this planned-to-be, first ever, off-road ironman distance race triathlon that was set for Rifle, Colorado in 2004. I'm curious of that's the one you're referecing.

Ian

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Ian Murray
http://www.TriathlonTrainingSeries.com
I like the pursuit of mastery
Twitter - @TriCoachIan

Thanks Ian, I really appreciate the sizing help. That is incredibly valuable.

Yes, that Rifle IM. IIRC, I would have seen you there - if not for the fires which cancelled it. That one really captured my imagination.

My favorite race was always Tinley's Dirty Adventures - so much fun. Even in the deluge year.

But, road is good, too.

Best,

Eric

Thanks Ian, I appreciate your feedback!

I actually tried sitting further back in the saddle and did a 3 hour ride 2 weeks ago. It totally changed how I use my legs; my glutes and hamstrings were worked really hard in this position. I've read that proper position/technique means cyclists use their entire leg and improper technique can mean a cyclist only uses one part (i.e. just quads). Because my glutes/hamstrings worked hard and became fatigued when sitting further back in the saddle, does this mean I've been using poor technique?

Here's some analysis of my position when sitting further back in the saddle (no adjustment made to the bike). My Velo Fit detects some additional changes are needed to use this position.

Video:

https://www.myvelofit.com/shared/72417979-8336-4493-83d9-bb6b460d2965

nanban-ronin,
"does this mean I've been using poor technique" - I don't know. There's not enough info in this one-off situation. It could mean that your hamstrings and glutes worked hard because they are undeveloped. It could mean that legs worked hard but efficency was worse than riding forward on the saddle. It could mean too many things.

Let's simplify things a bit. There is a position that 99.9% of fast people use in triathlon. Chances are you belong in that position. If you look HERE and HERE you'll see where all the pros, men and women, positioned themselves in Kona last year. This is the same spot in which they train/race/comport themselves on the bike. This is the same spot fast people have been riding for nearly two decades (both in triathlon and, to some degree road time trial). This is were my athletes (athletes I fit, athletes I coach) hold themselves on their tri bikes. This is the place. I think you're very close to this place and I think at this point in your progression you should judge it more by feel than my video/body angle analysis.

Comfort is priority one. You have to remain comfortable in the aero position. Lots of folks place themselves in a spot they think has less drag but it's so uncomfortable that after 4-5min they have to come up onto the base bars to stretch and recover and - in the end - that's slower. "Bake-into" the chase of comfort is the creation of power - because it's easier (read: more comfortable) to make race watts in one postion than in another so a powerful position is also a comfortable position.

That position that 99.9% of fast folks ride is not exact, is not precise. We can't say THE best saddle height results in a knee angle of 146 degrees at the bottom of the pedal stroke (where you are now). What we say is an appropriate saddle height results in a knee angle that is between 135 and a 146 degrees and if you're outside of that knee angle there better be a really compelling reason for it. So... once you're in the range (and you're in the range) then we stop chasing numbers and start chasing feel. How does this cockpit distance (for example) feel after 20min in aero? How does this pad width feel after 3 hours in aero (for another example). How do the wrists feel with the extensions position at this angle after 50min in aero, etc. etc. etc.

Ian

---

Ian Murray
http://www.TriathlonTrainingSeries.com
I like the pursuit of mastery
Twitter - @TriCoachIan

Hi Ian!

I'm looking to buy my first TT bike, specifically interested in the X-PR based on the available features (Di2, paint options, etc) and budget. I'm coming from riding a road bike that I bought secondhand on FB marketplace - a 2019 Liv Avail SL 2 Disc, size Medium. I had a fitter fit me to this bike, but unfortunately he's out of the country for the next month, so I haven't been able to get TT bike fit measurements before looking to purchase a TT bike (a bit motivated based on the current QR spring sale to get an order in!).

I'm female, height is 5'6, inseam is around 31in. I chatted with someone at QR who said the size 50 frame would fit. I'm leaning towards the Aeria hydration system, not sure about the bar extensions (is one "better" than the other aside from alloy v carbon?).

Hopefully that's some info that can help in pointing me in the right direction in terms of fit. Thanks so much!

klondikebar,
You've given me some good info here and I suspect your Pad Y is around 600 and your Pad X is ~425. As you've already noted the X-PR comes in a couple of different front-end options and here are the prescriptions and opinions on all of 'em....

X-PR size 50 with a 90mm QR Aero stem, the Aeria Ultimate basebar and Ergo 35+c aerobars. You'd need 10mm of stem stack and 25mm of aerobar pedestal. The arm pads would be offset -5.50. I like all this because you have lots of room to move the pads up, down, fore, aft to find your exact spot. The QR aero stem and the Aeria Ultimate bar is sexy sure but it also allows for Profile Design's Aeria Ultimate BTA (Between The Aerobars) hydration system to plug in seamlessly.

X-PR size 50 with a 90mm QR Aero stem and the Sonic 35a aerobars. You'd need 10mm of stem stack and 15mm of aeobar pedestal. The arm pads would be offset -5.50. Same room to move up/dwn/back/forth. There are a couple of differences here and one of them is that the elevation from aerobar to bullhorns (AKA "pursuit positon") is 15mm, while the Aeria is 25. That's not a huge difference but one that might matter to you. Yes, the aerobars here are aluminum vs carbon above.

The "35" in the aerobar is the angle of the bend - it's a "ski bend", you can see it here https://profile-design.com/...5c-carbon-extensions. If you look in the "description" drop down it says the carbon ones are 262gms/pair for the 400mm length and then compare description on the aluminum ones HERE is says the extensions come in 340 & 400 and they are 200gms/pair. That's curious. Anyway... I like clamping aluminum better than carbon and the extension get calmped.

You can also do the X-PR with a "mortal" stem..

X-PR with a Profile 1/17 stem and Sonic 35a aerobars. This could happen no a size 48 and a 52....but I like the look of the size 50 with a 110mm stem in the -17 degree position with 15mm of spacer under the stem & 5mm of aerobar pedestal and then pad offset -6:25.

X-PR with a Profile 1/17 stem and a Supersonic Ergo+ 35c aerobar. Same as the one just above: 110, -17, 15mm spacer + 5mm pedestal, pads offset -6:25.

Let's say for a set that you didn't care about aestic of the QR Aero Stem - I would argue that the PD 1/17 stem might be easier to pack into a tradition bike box for flying/shipping.

You can't go wrong with any of these you just need to decide on budget, BTA preferences, and the look of the stem.

Ian

---

Ian Murray
http://www.TriathlonTrainingSeries.com
I like the pursuit of mastery
Twitter - @TriCoachIan

Hi!

My Pad Y is ~590, my Pad x is ~440. What's the right V-PR for me?"

Height is 5’6” and inseam is 31”


Thank you!

 

Sweet T,
There's a fork in the road on this bike - you can either get the Vision Pro Extension (3 lengths, not much adjustability, sexy, and you'd need to know your extension length if you go this route. Details HERE) ...or... you get the Vision TFA (a more tradition aero bar, lots more adjustment. Detials HERE).

If you get the Vision Pro..... size 50, 20mm of arm pad pedestal, then position the arm pad bridge foward, mount the arm pads in bolt hole row 1 of the bridge and use hole row 2 in the arm pad itself.

If you get the TFA.... size 50, 25mm of arm pad pedestal, then position the arm pad bridge foward, use row 8 of the screws holes on the bridge and arm rest hole 2 on the arm pad.

This all seems complicated but it aint. Midway down THIS page you can open the Fit Coordinates for either bars and see how it lays out.

I'm here if you have more questions.

Ian

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Ian Murray
http://www.TriathlonTrainingSeries.com
I like the pursuit of mastery
Twitter - @TriCoachIan

Hi Ian, thank you for the reply. I was just looking at this msg, and noticed somehow the Pad X measurement is wrong - it should be 460 (center), not 440 as indicated below.

Does this change anything? I like the Vision Pro extensions.

Thank you!

440ish to rear of pad, 460 to center. I should have noted why I changed that. I'm sorry. It's the right perscription.

Ian

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Ian Murray
http://www.TriathlonTrainingSeries.com
I like the pursuit of mastery
Twitter - @TriCoachIan

Hi, I may need your help.

I am trying to find a TT bike for Triathlon that will be large enough for me and a friend forwarded me on to your post about the Quintana Roo PR Tri Bike.

I am 6ft 6inches tall. Inside leg 38 inches. Outside leg 47 inches.

Please see image attached for the measurements of my existing TT Turbo set up that has been working well for me so far.

The fitting guide suggests I need size 58.5 however I know I cannot just rely on that.

Please can I ask for your expertise/guidance and advice to help me ascertain if I can fit on this bike and what size would suffice?

Thank you very much,
Ali Brown
A very tall triathlete with very long legs, haha!

Do you have any video or pictures of you on the bike?

Hi Ian

It's really cool to see you still going strong on this thread after nearly 4 years!

I'm based in the UK, and there doesn't seem to be a lot of supply of QR bikes or frames here, but I've spotted one retailer that has a PRFour frameset at a large discount right now - but only in the 58.5 size.

So my question is quite specific - will that (or can that) frameset work for me?

I'm 187cm tall with an 87cm inside leg and my current saddle height is 831mm

I've attached an export of my most recent fit, which is on my road bike with clip-on bars. I've struggled to match up the numbers on here to either the geometry chart for the frame, or to the pad X/Y numbers you mentioned below

I hope that's enough info for you!

Ali,
I suspect your Pad Y is ~713 and your Pad X is ~515. If I'm right about that....

QR PRfive or four (same geometry) size 58.5 with a 110 stem in the -17deg position, 20mm of spacer under the stem and 10mm of aerobar pedestal and then the pads off set -2.50. This bike comes with a "mortal" stem, a normal, regular stem and in lengths of 70, 90, and 110mm. It can be positioned at -17 degrees (level with the ground) or flopped at +17 degrees (pointing up in a big way). Then you can tweak the pad height via two manners: spacers under the stem and pedestals on the aerobars. Lastly, the pads can be moved fore/aft to detial the cockpit distance. "off set -2.50" means they are roughly 2 holes forward of the middle spot. If my guess of Pad Y and Pad X is not dead-on that's okay because there's still lots of room to move the front up/down/fore/aft to find your spot.

QR PRsix with a 110 stem, base bar clamped with mid-spacer + 40mm of pedestal. Then bracket foward and arm rest mounted the mid-front hole. This bike comes with a "super" stem and is only made in three lengths: 75, 90, 110. There are two ways to detial the pad height.. one of them is how the base bar gets clammped into the stem - there's a clam shell in the stem and you can put both bits below the base bar and raises the whole system. Put both bits above the base bar and that lowers the whole frontend, or split 'em (one above, one below) and and get a mid position. Then the aerobars and finalized with pedestals - the max is 75mm so at 40 you're in a nicely central spot with room to move up and down. Then... the arm pads are set on a bracket that can be positioned forward to get more distance out of the cockpit or backwords to shorter the cockpit and then there's holes on the arm cup to detial that fore/aft spot.

Get back to me if you have questions, Ian

---

Ian Murray
http://www.TriathlonTrainingSeries.com
I like the pursuit of mastery
Twitter - @TriCoachIan

glenjamin,
The road bike numbers only help a bit.. .you're going to be a far superior position on a real tri bike. I suspect your Pad Y is ~675 and your Pad X is near to 490. If you were to get this QR PRfour in size 58.5 here's what you'd need to do 70mm stem in the -17 degree position and slam it - zero spacers and zero pedestal. That would leave the Pad Y at 680...but, by adding tilt (aerobar grips up and pads down down) you'd get to 675. Now, I don't mean full on preying mantis, I just mean 10-15 degrees of tilt like most of us like to ride for comfort and aero. The Pad X of 490 is no problem; the off-set is -1.75 or 3 holes foward of mid placement.

Ian

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Ian Murray
http://www.TriathlonTrainingSeries.com
I like the pursuit of mastery
Twitter - @TriCoachIan

Does that mean I’ll be pretty constrained position-wise if I go with a 58.5?

 

glenjamin,
The constraint you'll find is in the Pad Y. I'm guessing 675 but maybe you're crazy flexible and want to ride at 650 - that would require you to build the bike with a -23deg stem slammed and even then I'm not sure you'd get that low because you have to stay with a short stem. So, the answer is "yes, this bike will fit you" but no, you won't have a lot of room to play as the 58.5 is on the bigger side for you.

---

Ian Murray
http://www.TriathlonTrainingSeries.com
I like the pursuit of mastery
Twitter - @TriCoachIan

Excellent, thanks! I’m not particularly flexible so I’m gonna go for it - thanks for the advice!

Hi Ian,
Thanks for providing this fit assistance, really helpful when looking at the various options.

I have a current setup that I hesitated to share, it's a bit cobbled together and really in the pursuit of all-day comfort (which I did achieve). Likely not fast or optimal, but it is data.

Height: 182.8cm
Inseam: 87.6cm
BB to saddle top center: 749mm

This is on a 2013 Orbra Ordu 56cm--
BB to pad center stack: 724
BB to pad center reach: 546
Saddle tip to pad center: 527
(Saddle length: 241.3)
Crank length: 172.5

I'm interested in an X-PR or a PR5.

Any and all thoughts welcomed and appreciated!

Agd,
If I just charge forwad with Pad Y of 724 and Pad X of 500 (to rear of pad) then....
For the QR PRfive size 56 with a 110 stem in the +17deg position slam the stem (zero spacers under it) and run just 5mm of aerobar pedestal and then place pads offset -1.75 (which is QR speak for 3 holes fwd of center).
For the XPR size 58.5 with a 110 stem* in the -17deg position, 20mm of spacers under the stem and 40mm of pedestal, the pads offset -4.00 (two holes fwd of center).
*if you choose the XPR then get the Profile Design Zero/Seventeen stem - lots of options for you to adjust.

If you had come with just your body measurements I would have guessed your Pad Y at ~670 and Pad X at ~470. But when you say "all day comfort" and you acheived that - SUCCESS. That is so much faster than someone riding what they think is sexy/aero and have to unfold themselves every 8 min due to neck/shoulder/back pain. Here's the cool thing about where you are now (724/500) and where I would have guessed (670/470) - you can get both positions and dozens of places inbetween with the bike size & and front end configs I prescribed. So I love that you're comfy (always priority one) and if there's some evolution of your postion these bikes will move to meet you at lots of new positions.

Ian

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Ian Murray
http://www.TriathlonTrainingSeries.com
I like the pursuit of mastery
Twitter - @TriCoachIan

This is exceptionally helpful, thanks so much!

I was actually hoping things would line up for that X-PR in the scratch and dent sale, but at 54cm that's quite a bit off from 58.5-- all that to say you've saved me from getting off on the wrong foot fit wise and I'm grateful for that.

I'll march forward with your recommendations and work with my local tri shop if I settle into something more tucked in.

Hi Ian,

I just stumbled upon this board/post and it seems like a great resource. Thanks so much for providing this service!

I'm an age group triathlete looking to buy my first dedicated tri bike. There is a great Quintana Roo sale going on right now that I'd like to take advantage of. I'm looking at either the PRfive or the X-PR, but of course I want to make sure I buy the right size. I have a fitter I use locally, so I'm mainly just concerned with the correct frame size and choosing the correct stem for my needs. Once I choose those I can have my fitter dial in everything else.

For the past couple of years I've been riding a Specialized Diverge gravel bike that I've made more triathlon-ready with clip-on aerobars and a Redshift seat post that allows me to quickly shift the saddle a few centimeters forward and up into a more tri bike-esque aero position. I know a gravel bike and a tri bike are different beasts, but I do like my current position, so I went ahead and took the measurements (with the saddle in the aero position):

Height: 1650 mm (5'5)
Inseam: 800 mm

Saddle height: 690 mm
Pad Y: 645 mm
Pad X: 385 mm

I think that's all you need, but let me know if you need anything else from me.

Thanks in advance,

Jon

Jon,
You're welcome and I happy to help.

I know that RedShift post and it's an option if you're gonna try and tweak a road or gravel geometry into a more appropriate aero position. I'm going to keep your Pad Y/X of 645/385 in mind and also think you could ride closer to 600/420.

If you got the PRfive you should get a size 48. Don't freak about about that, QR measures their bikes by Stack so this size has a Stack of 480 - it's super logical, could be called a 54cm or S/M. Get that size 48 with a 90mm stem. Here's the beauty of this option. If you position the 90mm stem in the +17 degree configuration, 10mm of spacer under the stem and another 10mm of aerobar pedestal you'll have a Pad Y of 646. Then you place the arm pads offset -5.50 (this is ~3 hole back of center) you'll have a Pad X of 384. Now... same bike, same hardware: flop the 90mm stem so it's in the -17deg position, go with 20mm of spacer and 10mm of pedestal, offset pads -3.25 (nearly centered) and you've got Pad Y 601 and Pad X 420. And.... you can get a whole bunch of positions in between and a bit beyond the numbers we're using right now. That mean's you're pretty much guarenteed to find an optimal position with this bike and bits.

In terms of the X-PR... it comes with 3 different front-end configurations.

1. Profile Design Zero/Seventeen (just like what's prescribed in the PRfive above) w/ Sonic 35a aerobars. see 'em HERE
2. PD Zero/SEventeen again, but now with Supersonic 35+ SLC aerobars. See 'em HERE
3. QR Aero Stem w/ PD Sonic 35a aerobars - this one will not work for you. To get your current Pad Y of 645 you'd have to get the size 52 and then the shortest Pad X will be ~415.

Get a size 48 with either Sonic or Supersonic aerobars and 90mm stem, and then...
+17 position with 25mm of spacer under stem and 20mm of pedestal.. and..pad offset of -6.25 yeilds 645/385
-17 (flopped) with 25mm of spacer under stem and 15mm of pedestal..and..pad offset of -4.00 yeilds 600/420
and again... lots of positions inbetween to find your spot.

Lots of good options here...

Ian

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Ian Murray
http://www.TriathlonTrainingSeries.com
I like the pursuit of mastery
Twitter - @TriCoachIan