I also posted a pic of Steffen riding in a Wingspan from 2012....but I think it is pretty clear that these tend to be exceptions to the rule. For whatever reason, as a general rule, it seems Sutton athletes avoid aero helmets in Kona

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Significant difference in head temp, but NO difference in GI (basically core) temp. No helmet effect on HR or power output.

. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23539083


Another which appears to be not yet published, but is university research: no effects of helmet on temps


. http://www.academia.edu/...E_IN_WARM_AND_HUMID_

Sorry, I should have been clear that I was talking about Kona. In Kona these are Sutton's thoughts, which as you point out are even more illogical since she wears them in other races.

But you cannot build a spreadsheet that takes into account the point I am making can you?

I am not talking about putting the number zero into a spreadsheet for the temperature difference between wearing an aero helmet and not wearing an aero helmet. My point is one of perception, which is an experienced based construct, not a quantative number you can throw into a computer.

I can perceive it to be hot, or I can perceive it to be cold, or I can perceive it to be somewhere in-between. I can perceive there to be an effect on my temperature due to my choice of equipment. If my perception is that I am overheating, my performance declines. If my perception is that I am not overheating my performance does not decline. Whether I am overheating or not is actually pretty irrelevant at this point - if I perceive I am too hot the spread sheet has not taken this into account. Its my perception which is not a measurable scientific number and is very N=1.

Ryf obviously had a reason for using a road helmet - probably due to humidity and temperature and but we are guessing here. She has used both aero and road helmets before, so its not like she has not made an informed choice. She knows what they both feel like, and she knows 1 is aerodynamically faster than the other.

The research can say there is not temperature difference (and there is no research for a 112 mile ride out to Hawi here) and the aerodynamics can say the aero helmet is 3 minutes faster all day long. If Ryf's perception is that she is going to overheat she made the right choice. The spread sheet cannot take account of that, and it cannot tell us if she would have overheated or not. All the spread sheet can do is add, subtract, divide etc etc etc

I did note in her interview with Bob Babbit she said she only got to the Island on Tuesday and had not ridden all the course. I am guessing she used a road helmet because she had not tested and aero one on the course. She is not N=1 at that either, once you see Chrissie winning with a road helmet if kind of gives it an acceptability.

I am not saying your spread sheet is wrong, I am saying that it cannot tell us she would have been 3 minutes faster at the finish line. I am right in what I am saying.

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She can also choose to conquer false perceptions, like say, Craig did.

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Kat Hunter reports on the San Dimas Stage Race from inside the GC winning team
Aeroweenie.com -Compendium of Aero Data and Knowledge
Freelance sports & outdoors writer Kathryn Hunter

If its your perception its not false. Its your perception. Yes I certainly do not disagree with your sentiment - I am sure I would have advised her to go with an aero lid as well. The spread sheet still cannot predict a 3 minute saving at the finish line. Of course with this years experience she may be in a position to alter her perception, obviously as Craig Alexander managed to do after he had some experience of the island - like many others.

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Whatever semantics you want to wrap it in, get over it. Know that your perception doesn't change your performance, and it won't.

The 8 men in the aero helmet study said they perceived a difference but performed the same anyway. Why do you think Ryf would be different?

Maybe she should fire her coach, at least in his equipment choice capacity.

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Kat Hunter reports on the San Dimas Stage Race from inside the GC winning team
Aeroweenie.com -Compendium of Aero Data and Knowledge
Freelance sports & outdoors writer Kathryn Hunter

Interesting to me that everyone seems to agree that Kona is unlike any other IM race. In fact, one of the pros I think made the statement that there was no other IM race in the world with the conditions of Kona. The heat, humidity, and the winds apparently make Kona unique. The swim is affected by the surf/tides. The bike can be into a headwind in both directions. The run, unique to Kona. At least that is what has been said over and over in the 30 years I have been following the race. But apparently the uniqueness of Kona shouldn't impact decisions on what gear to use or not to use. Everyone should line up with the same swim, bike & run gear and forget the conditions unique to Kona.

See Rule 4


With that reasoning, she should have used training wheels too.

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I have nothing to get over! Its my opinion and I can justify it!


Well if I was being pedantic I would point out that Ryf is a woman - and study refers to 8 men. But I will go back to my earlier point - generalisations are fine generally - but not individually. Are you convinced that Ryf would not perceive a difference that would not affect her performance. Reality is neither of us really knows - but there must be a reason why she chose a road helmet? Whatever that reason the spread sheet cannot take that reason into consideration - and cannot predict she would be 3 minutes quicker at the finishing line.


Maybe. I don't know. The interest for me here is Steffens choice - she is not coached by Brett Sutton anymore - she takes advice from Macca - but she still wore a road helmet.

Honestly I am not having a go at you personally - I just think the spread sheet works well in the wind tunnel and can be used to guide equipment choices - it does not work well enough to say if Ryf chose a aero helmet instead of a road helmet she would have been 3 minutes faster at the finish line.

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Sure it does, in at least 3 ways I can think of:

1. you might want to use a shallower front wheel than normal

2. you might want to pick equiment that is good at high yaw, even if you are fast

3. you might want to use a straw based drink solution, even if you hate those.

There just isn't any reason not to wear an aero helmet =)

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Kat Hunter reports on the San Dimas Stage Race from inside the GC winning team
Aeroweenie.com -Compendium of Aero Data and Knowledge
Freelance sports & outdoors writer Kathryn Hunter

Oh I agree
I think it is more like 2 minutes +/- 1 minute

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Kat Hunter reports on the San Dimas Stage Race from inside the GC winning team
Aeroweenie.com -Compendium of Aero Data and Knowledge
Freelance sports & outdoors writer Kathryn Hunter

See Rule 7.

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is a shaved head really cooler than with long hair?

I don't know!

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Kat Hunter reports on the San Dimas Stage Race from inside the GC winning team
Aeroweenie.com -Compendium of Aero Data and Knowledge
Freelance sports & outdoors writer Kathryn Hunter

I've been shaving my head to race for years and decided not to for kona, maybe that's why I melted on the run!

did you really overheat on the run or was it just your false perception? pink

Is that thought based on the spread sheet, your experience, a combination of the 2 or your perception of what the potential time saving could be?

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By how much? I need a new helmet (old one got "used") and wanted to get the Course as a semi-aero training helmet that could be used for racing, in a pinch, if I had a disaster like my aero helmet clasp breaking (as happened to a teammate race morning once). I also like the symmetry of using the Course for training and P-09 for racing.

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The point is, ladies and gentleman, that speed, for lack of a better word, is good. Speed is right, Speed works. Speed clarifies, cuts through, and captures the essence of the evolutionary spirit.

I wonder if the outcome of the race would have been different if the AG men started 5min later too.

Like for example how 130psi in your tires might "feel" faster, but is in fact slower on normal road conditions.

OR how going lower could also feel faster, but isn't necessarily faster.

.... or how those huge frame mounted hydration things with 30' of plastic tubing look fas.... oh wait, those definitely look slower AND are in fact really slow.

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Thanks for the link. I know there is evolving information on heat loss from the head, and that's why I didn't mention a number. I've never heard 'half' before. I'd heard numbers between 15-25% however.

My real point was that in hot conditions (Kona) having a lovely insulating bubble of styrofoam around your head (aero helmet) vs a much more open syrofoam ball (standard vented road helmet), the aero helmet will retain more heat, just at the time you want to dissipate heat.

In my own work (HVAC engineer) I know that if you insulate the hell out of a building, it will retain heat well, but all the insulation in the world won't help you if you leave all the windows and doors open all the time. I used that same approach with the helmet on the head in Aero or vented cases.

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We are in dire need of romulusmagnus and his propensity models here

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Kat Hunter reports on the San Dimas Stage Race from inside the GC winning team
Aeroweenie.com -Compendium of Aero Data and Knowledge
Freelance sports & outdoors writer Kathryn Hunter

Or maybe a trucker hat.

she doesn't like the sound of the wind on the covered ears of aerohelmets...I am sure Macca wouldn't have prevented her from using one if she wanted to.