I seem to have struck a nerve. Wonder why that is? The idea that someone would go slower than they could because of the actions of others seems really odd.

In 30 years of triathlon, I've never been penalized, nor have I ever drafted.

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"Go yell at an M&M"

You podium guys are awesome. And principled. And polite, to boot.

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"Go yell at an M&M"

Fascinating.

This thing you do where you read part of a post, and then somehow miss where said post's author clearly states something... is it a conscious choice you're making, or are you actually incapable because cognitive dissonance won't allow you to see a bigger picture?

I know, I know, if it is some form of cognitive dissonance, there's not really any point in asking.

I'm a decent 45-49F but I am extremely blown away by the older female times not mentioned above. I feel a little better learning about the massive drafting. Otherwise I'd just give up on my Kona quest right now!

Winner of the 45-49F did a 4:46 bike and 3:09 marathon for a 9:10 overall. Second place was a 9:28 overall.

Winner of the 50-54F was a little over ONE HOUR faster than last year's winner in that age group and she (2017 winner) is a very fast and experienced athlete.

I will most likely not ever sign up for IMTX because of the massive cheating/draft packs/no marshals for age groupers unless things change in the future. My own coach described it as "one big cheat fest".

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Death is easy....peaceful. Life is harder.

I wonder how many people are now thinking: "I could set my all time PR there next year!" And then go, I guess a clue might be how quickly IMTX fills up next year.

As everyone has mentioned and shown with blatant evidence, the peletons were horrible. The most irritating issue with me is that I was getting yelled at by an official for moving out of the way of the pack into the shoulder.

I said "You'd rather me draft this pack than ride of the shoulder?!", the response was a shrug and a head nod saying yes. No penalties, no nothing. Riding the shoulder is frowned upon though.

I'm thinking the opposite......I think more people will be turned off by this years event. Why travel to an event that not only has an unsafe bike ride due to packs etc, but also has lost a ton of respect/credibility.

Eh, it'll be a mixed bag.

I'm finding it interesting that I haven't seen a lot of race reports or PR brandishing. I wonder if it's the shame or knowing they will invite the wrong type of attention and get called out.

the Crushing Iron podcast guys had a take on it here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DdHyh66k-fA

basically they're saying, and I agree to an extent, that crap like this will push people out of the sport, but unfortunately it pushes out the types of people whom we want to stay in it.

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Swimming Workout of the Day:

Favourite Swim Sets:

2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly

Peggy Yetman who won 50-54 has done a 9:44 at Ironman AZ if memory serves me correct in recent years. She was 4th at Kona 2017 and is so fast. This time was not out of the ballpark for her and I will defend her time based on previous results. This wasn't a one off. The 45-49 age group I'm not as familiar with but I agree 100% with you. It was a draft fest. I'm not writing it off for next year though as I am optimistic it will change. There has to be a lot of pressure on Ironman to make sure this doesn't happen again. (I would like to think the athletes feel pressure by their ridiculous bike/ run splits, but I won't give that much thought.) The run course was absolutely amazing. That's a reason on it's own to do this race. I really think it will be better next year. Wishful thinking??

I've seen a fair number of PR brags, including some pros....

that's pretty sad but I'm sure people will think that. It's one thing to choose a course that aligns best with your strengths but it's pretty bad choosing a course so they can cheat. I definitely know people who pick courses because they are flat but that's definitely not the same as cheating obviously

just saying....gravel racing is growing quick and we welcome triathletes of all shapes, sizes, and skill levels. It's a great crossover sport from ironman, since it is still requires the ultra-endurance mentality of Ironman and you can still use aerobars :)

I see that Rappstar signed up for DK200. Hopefully more top triathletes will make the switch soon.


Side note: When it comes to IMTX drafting and strava, i was initially looking at how much coasting (0 watts or 0 cadence) riders were doing, and deciding in my head that the coasters were all cheaters. While that has a high probability of being true, I also do think it's possible that a rider could sit a legal distance off the back of one of those packs and still have to repeatedly coast and brake to not get into the draft zone, as dictated by the rules. Even at legal distance, a rider behind a pack of 30 riders would get a significant benefit, but not technically break the rules. Is it still ethical? That's debatable. But, if you were riding at 24mph and got caught by a pack doing 25mph, it's reasonable that you could sit off the back at 25mph pushing the same wattage you were doing to hold 24, without breaking any rules. Am i wrong?

Agreed. I did IM TX last year but not this year because of too much travel for work.

Despite the described pelotons this year, I plan to sign up for IM TX 2019 because I'm optimistic IM will take action for next year's race as it sounds like there was more than the usual amount of wrecks due to pack riding. Also IM TX is a hometown race for me, which makes it a lot more doable because I don't have to pay for travel or take off from work.

maybe. Do you think it has much of an effect on MOPers and BOPers? I'm a MOPer and I guess it has some impact on me from a safety aspect and an annoyance factor during the race having to navigate my way around the peloton draft packs. My only experience with bad draft packs was a HIM Wilmington in 2016 when it was windy. I had to work really hard getting around draft packs or slow way down once that passed me. Definitely irritating.

in my mind, if you are riding legally then you are riding ethically, basically the rules in sports define the ethics within the normal course of the competition, and you use the rules to your advantage. (that said, there are a handful of situations that may be legal but are unethical, but that's a topic for another day).

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Swimming Workout of the Day:

Favourite Swim Sets:

2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly

No. Many off the back of lots of groups were doing this, as opposed to overlapping wheels. If there had not been peletons & people were holding 6 bike length gaps in a single file line, all of you that weren’t there wouldn’t be bitching about the drafting.

I was at the Hardy service road exit for well over an hour. Starky came through, then Ackermann, then the pack...which was one after another very obviously riding together legally. Then came the first AG pack that was blantantly drafting, then the second, then the women pros started coming through obviously having been swallowed up by the packs. I took a few iPhone videos so if anyone really wants to go on a twitch hunt I’m happy to share.

Zero motos. Zero stationary officials. No one in the penalty tent. There are several overpasses where one could camp out with binoculars and radio in race numbers. A camera on the side of the road would work just fine too. Saturday was really disgusting to watch.


Yes, there were 3 tandems and 1 bike w/ trailer.

I was one of those who did not draft. I knew it was happening but had no idea how extensive it was. What kills me is I trained hard to earn my PR on the bike (it was a great time for me) and I'm proud of it, but it gets diminished in more than one way: by those who drafted and got pro-like bike splits in my AG, and by others who just assume we all cheated. Thanks, cheaters...deep down you know you didn't earn it.

I'm a bit late, but it is not as simple as that.

The fact you ask means you've never been in the situation, which means never a pack, which is cool :)

Here's what happens, and happened to me in IM Switzerland in 2009, and it ruined the experience somewhat. The problem is the 'pack' does not ride at a constant speed.

Say you are cycling at your power and 30km/h.

• You catch a pack doing 28km/h.
• You pass them, having to put out more power than you need to make the pass, say at 32km/h
• They latch on to you as you pass
• Now they start to pass you one by one due to the draft effect.
• Now you are mid pack, and a cheating drafter.
• The pack starts to slow, as the people who passed you don't want to keep up the effort.
• So - do you now put on a spurt, burn matches, and get to the front? If so, the same happens again as above. Or, you lift off and find yourself following a pack at 28kmh, slower than you could ride.

It's very annoying - in Switzerland there is 30km flat along the lake. After that the hills start and things break up.

On lap two I caught a pack just as described above and ended up in the middle for a few km, unable to put the effort in to drop it and watching it get slower and slower as I tried to slow.

It's really tough, and not as easy as you'd think. It's like a crit race pack - it ebbs and flows.

The footage from Texas is probably the worst I've ever seen, though.

No, I don't think that it will affect the sign up of MOP and BOP athletes. That's IM's core group if you ask me. Not necessarily the bucket listers who are 1 and done and not necessarily the Kona qualifiers. Most of the athletes want a challenge that is close to home or relatively easy and inexpensive to get to. The Woodlands fits that bill.

That's why further up, I mentioned the need for 2 distinct categories...I guess 3. Pros. Kona hopefuls. Everyone else. Drug test and officiate the crap out of the first 2 groups. And, the third group is not an anything goes group, but is a less stringent subset...you know like the entire field at IMTX 2018. Would it be more work on race day or different logistics, yes. Would it provide a potentially fairer and safer race? Yes. How to address it on a 40-45 mile double out and back? Hard to say.

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Brandon Marsh - Website | @BrandonMarshTX | RokaSports | 1stEndurance | ATC Bikeshop |

Thanks for the polite description, rather than calling me names. Some questions:

If you are going 30kph, and the pack is going 28kph, why do you need to speed up to pass them? You have 15 seconds to pass each rider, not the whole group. How much faster do you need to go to dissuade this pack from speeding up to draft you, do you think?

If they then speed up to pass you, you are not a drafter until and unless they slow down in front of you (which can happen). This would seem to be a situation in which the rule to drop out the back of the draft zone should be ignored, and you should be allowed to pass immediately at your normal speed (which by definition is higher than the cyclist in front of you, and which should be a bit easier due to draft effects).

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"Go yell at an M&M"

The 9:44 was a nice improvement from 10:18:55 last year in TX. I'm not throwing stones. Just looking at data. A 29 min improvement on the bike from last year too. That all being said I still think the top older women are super impressive. Even if all the top AG women were drafting in TX, the older women were faster than the younger ones.

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Death is easy....peaceful. Life is harder.

I compared 17' to 18' for several AGs and many of the bike splits were 20-30 min faster. When you ride a 5:15 in 17' and all of a sudden you are down to 4:45, it makes you wonder. 30 min is a big improvement.

I think the ebbs and flows is important to note. 1 pack does not ALWAYS stay one pack. Sometimes it splits even mid pass. I've had groups start to pass me, then a few split off and pop right in front of me and slow down. It's just a PITA surging to pass the packs or slowing way down to drop behind them out of the draft zone. I can be a constant struggle trying to get away from packs all day long. It's much different if you just pass one person, they fall back, then you move on to the next person to pass if there is somebody close.