Absolutely agree with your point Monty. Stupid and outdated or not, the rule is in place and it should have been a factor of consideration for whoever was popped.

I found out recently that THC can be metabolized differently from person to person. Depending how well you metabolize it, it's presence in your body will be lower or much higher. So, two people could ingest an equal amount of THC but have drastically different test values.

I don't think most people know this. And the only way to find out, is to get a test done. If you are a poor metabolizer, you need to adjust your habits approaching races. I'm not sure that the rules account for this either, which makes this whole case really interesting.

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Group Eleven – Websites for Athletes / mikael.racing / @mstaer

THC should definitely be on the list. It is a perfect addition in fact. The purpose of drug testing is not to stop doping. The purpose is to scam the public into believing something is being done and to keep media contracts and government handouts flowing into sports. Testing for recreational drugs and ghetto PEDs that have no effect on performance is ideal. Their inclusion guarantees people will be caught because use will be unintentional, accidental, or ignorant. The anti-doping agencies use the petty nature of the offense to demonstrate their hard line on drugs, the athletes get sympathy for being sanctioned for something that obviously had no performance effect, the sports use the lack of busts for serious drugs and occasional sanctions for useless products to claim the sport is largely clean, and the gullible public is satisfied. Everyone wins. Well, except for the poor bastard caught for THC, but no has much sympathy for potheads who cannot even lay off the weed for a few days before competition.

This makes absolutely no sense except for the fact that you have some sort of an issue with drugs.
Marijuana is legal in over a quarter of the country. It will be 100% within 10 years I’m sure. If it’s not a PED, it shouldn’t be on the list.
If you have a personal beef with drugs and specifically marijuana, that’s on you. It’s legal for recreational use and is not a PED.

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New Training/Racing Log - http://www.earthdaykid.com/blog --- Old Training/Racing Log - http://colinlaughery.blogspot.com

i can't say for sure, but i think arch agrees with you. his position - he can correct me if i'm wrong - is he thinks anti-doping in general, at all levels, is a fool's errand, and AG drug testing approaches the absurd. his point, if i understand him, is that testing for pot is exactly the sort of absurd thing you'd do, because of all the drugs this is the least appropriate drug to be on the banned list, but getting popped for it appeals to the get-off-my-lawn moralizers, and so validates the AG testing program and gives USADA a bust it can point to and say, aha, see, where catching dopers.

i don't agree with him, btw, about anti-doping. but i do agree that a THC is silly. i also agree with monty that, silly or no, you're an idiot if you get popped for it as a pro athlete, assuming it really is hard to test positive for it.

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Dan Empfield
aka Slowman

WADA tests to the single pecogram level...so...

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Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.

I love this. Do you listen to Last Podcast on the Left?

thank God the nietzschean supermen like you aren't fooled, and can help enlighten the rest of us!

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https://lshtm.academia.edu/MikeCallaghan

http://howtobeswiss.blogspot.ch/

Not sure why you or anyone thinks this is just a morality issue [general respone]. I think if WADA could get away with it they'd put alcohol on the list of banned substances. Those who continuously say Marijuana and specifically THC is not addictive are so full of shit because all of them, in my experience, are stoners. Guys who can't go a day without smoking weed.

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Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.

they ban pot because they can get away with it? that's the threshold? the mandate of WADA and by extension USADA is to curb performance enhancing drugs. pot got stuck on there, a long time ago, because it leads to sinning. not winning. it doesn't matter whether it's good or bad for your health, whether it's addictive, or any of that stuff. i don't smoke pot. never have. not once. don't care one way or the other. i just don't want some guy on a power trip in a blue blazer pushing his morals on me. if we're going to ban things that are addictive and bad for you, then fine. let's ban them all. alcohol. nicotine. if we're not going to ban it all, then let's not just ban the stuff that good christian men think should be banned. they shouldn't ban pot just because they can get away with it.

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Dan Empfield
aka Slowman

Umm alcohol is on the list. Remember back in the 70’s/ 80’s biathletes would have a nip of cognac to calm the nerves before shooting? At some point someone said “hey maybe guns and alcohol don’t mix very well”

Remember the drunk Russian high jumper (in competition) from a few years ago? IIRC he didn’t get 4 years, but he certainly got in a lot of shit, warnings, brief suspension, federation help etc.

The issue here just like with employment or stone & drive etc is that currently we are unable to prove timelines.

Maurice

But THC does provide a performance enhancing benefit. That's why it's on the list.

What's the threshold for THC, people in this thread state that it's high. However, as seen from the Jon Jones case with the UFC. WADA certified labs can test down to the single Picogram level. Now think about what a picogram is...one trillionth of a gram.

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Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.

I like this a lot. I share these thoughts. You happened to write them out pretty perfectly.

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New Training/Racing Log - http://www.earthdaykid.com/blog --- Old Training/Racing Log - http://colinlaughery.blogspot.com

first i've heard of it. how does THC make me a faster triathlete?

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Dan Empfield
aka Slowman

No idea about endurance sports or THC specifically

I do know my friend was the best 135 pound US Olympic weight lifter (the event) and he said smoking pot helped him a ton and it should be banned

Yes. Apples to oranges but it’s all I got

Can you reference where you have seen any evidence of this? Genuine question because I have never heard anything like that.

Also do bear in mind we're talking about a real performance enhancement here. Let's not forget caffeine was banned for a long time. Legal now, yet we know that it has performance enhancing properties.

Bonus points if you can find anything at all to indicate THC would be more performance enhancing than caffeine...

Anxiety on the swim?

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Eric Reid AeroFit | Instagram Portfolio
Aerodynamic Retul Bike Fitting

“You are experiencing the criminal coverup of a foreign backed fascist hostile takeover of a mafia shakedown of an authoritarian religious slow motion coup. Persuade people to vote for Democracy.”

Just pointing out that WADA has a dual mandate. Regulating performance-enhancing drugs *and* athlete safety. Not saying that justifies having THC on the list. Just pointing out it's not just performance enhancement.

Edit: After reading The Code, there are 3 ways for a substance to make it on the list: 1) performance enhancement 2) Endangers health/safety, and 3) violates the "spirit of sport."

The 3rd one is a little vague for my taste.

I could see Tramadol and hydrocodone making it on the list for 2). Probably not much of a performance enhancer, but apparently cyclists will pop anything pill-shaped and need to be protected from themselves.

This is only through casual surfing but it looks to me that beta blockers are the only substance banned for specific sports. More than happy to be told otherwise. But it looks like, other than beta blockers, if a substance enhances performance in some sports then it's banned for all. So we don't have to come up with a reason why it helps a triathlete if it helps an archer or a rhythmic gymnast.

WADA also say they may ban a substance because it harms health or is against the spirit of sport.

I don't really get why there is such criticism of WADA. Regarding cannabis and THC things are happening very quickly and it is all very location specific. I don't see it as a huge infringement of liberties and if they are dragging their heels a bit and the policy changes in 5 or 10 years why does it really matter?

I don't know the specifics of any case and if someone is genuinely hard done by then I hope common sense is applied. I'm certainly not saying anyone caught out is the equivalent of someone using steroids for performance gains. Not even agreeing with WADAs position.

yeah. that's what tygart said to me. at which point i asked about other substances that were as *dangerous* as THC. based on the response to that from anti-doping agencies, i'm highly skeptical of whether they apply the same rigor to that *second* mandate.

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Dan Empfield
aka Slowman

thanks for your n=1, let me give you mine.

after using, I went to start some overhead dumbbell presses 70lb each hand. I ended dropping on on my leg and bruising it. So definitely not a performance enhancer

Well it’s great you are bragging about knowing the athlete. It is pretty low on your part to brag about it. This is life changing for the athlete and will have a definite impact on them both financially and personally. Next time let it be their business and please respect their privacy. Yes, some people know who it is but I don’t see them going out and bragging about it. Grow up!

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Owner of a few Speed Concepts since 2011.

How did I brag? This athlete is a friend and someone I look up to. Did I give a name?

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New Training/Racing Log - http://www.earthdaykid.com/blog --- Old Training/Racing Log - http://colinlaughery.blogspot.com

If it is for safety can the tests test for impairment rather than just use? Just because you used marijuana and the test picks this up does not mean you are impaired at the time of testing.

I never said you named a name. The fact you gave a back handed brag that you know who it is (it came across that way) is my issue. Let them deal with it off forum and talk to them in private to offer support, not bring attention to yourself that you know who it is.

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Owner of a few Speed Concepts since 2011.