I'm late to the party but here's some more data. If anyone wants any other specifics let me know.

4:54
AP 206W
NP 216W
IF-.72
6'2" and 160#[/img]

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Ben McMurray
Northern Michigan Small Farm Venture ---> http://facebook.com/hillvalleymi [/size]

watts/height would be interesting

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Kat Hunter reports on the San Dimas Stage Race from inside the GC winning team
Aeroweenie.com -Compendium of Aero Data and Knowledge
Freelance sports & outdoors writer Kathryn Hunter

Poor man's proxy for watts/cda?

was waiting till I got my pics before posting again. It's nice to see similar numbers shake out to about the same time.

Recap
height-6'1"
weight-165lbs

swim-58:32
bike-5:11:57
AP-202
NP-216
VI-1.07
TSS-295
IF-0.76
run: 3:50:16

Any advice on my aero position is much appreciated. I have about 2 more spacers to go for the stem to be slammed.

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Proudly Team BSR

Well, I believe that is what Computrainer does in their model...you plug in your height and weight, you pedal at a certain amount of watts and the CT just calculates your ground speed based on some assumption of drag given your height...and when it is non zero grade it factors in your weight. Not sure if they also use the weight to calculate what your aero profile might be :-). i have generally found that the CT model to be way off, but I guess it really does not matter as long as you just compare CT rides with CT rides....sorry for the thread hijack.

Dev

Kiley-

Want to know something interesting, one of the three amigos that rode 2:16 at Vegas in our AG, rode 4:39 at Kona. Interesting data point, he out split me and the other "top" bikers, minus the other 2 2:16'ers, by 6 minutes in Vegas. Kona he had the 3rd fastest split in our AG, and its not like I got blown out of the water.

Brandon-

Completely understand that your race is totally different. The slingshot method is a lot easier for us to do and especially when I came out of the water like 300th, it left plenty of people on the course to pass. I doubt I would have rode 4:41 if I had to race with you guys, obviously I would have no pack to ride with, other than maybe the pro girls that all would pass me on the swim ;) Are you going to be at Austin? Hopefully see you down there and we can talk down there, want to pick your brain about some stuff.

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-Brad Williams
Website | Twitter: @BW_Tri |Instagram: @BW_Tri | Strava | Co-Founder & Coach at: KIS Coaching
Partnered with: Zoot Sports | Precision Fuel &Hydration | ISM

Looks like someone was paying attention to what clothing has tested as fast. Was the black color of the PI suit an issue in terms of being hot? Did you wear it for the run? If you took it off for the run was it a quick change?

Thanks in advance...

I wasn't hot in the PI suit, any more than I'd be at a Kona race. I liked it actually... kept it wet at each aid station.

Getting it off was fine, getting the running kit on was not. My usual T2 at Kona is 2:30 and I split almost 5min this time, however a full minute of that was pissing in the trough and some other time wasted on non tri-suit stuff. So some seconds wasted that could have been better if I rehearsed more I suppose.

I'll probably never race in a tank tri top again... no sunburn anywhere except my forearms this year.

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Eric Reid AeroFit | Instagram Portfolio
Aerodynamic Retul Bike Fitting

“You are experiencing the criminal coverup of a foreign backed fascist hostile takeover of a mafia shakedown of an authoritarian religious slow motion coup. Persuade people to vote for Democracy.”

Good info, I was a bit put off by the black color but sounds like it's no big deal.

I see P5, P5, P4, new P3, old P3, old P3, P2, Transition?, Argon, Swift (Gyde), devashish paul's? What other bikes are people riding?

Yup, I must have entirely misheard...haha ;)
In any case, I'm not looking to argue. I agree with your list of multiple confounding factors that make it hard to make any significant conclusions. Terrible pacing on the bike (and the run) is another one that I'm repeatedly shocked by at Kona.
Well, I hope you find what you're looking for in this analysis.

Mine is an old model Slice. I basically got it this year so that I can have my saddle slammed all the way back in a road position, but the reach is so short that I can get to my aerobars without stretching out my back. The reason I want to ride in that John Cobb Slam position is to put more weight on my butt/back wheel, as I have neck injuries that result in headaches if I put too much weight on my upper body with the saddle forward.

open for anyone, but for you guys listing wattage at Kona, what kind of average power are you pushing on your long training rides in comparison to your ironman bike average?

higher, lower, same?

just curious.

thanks,
jack

for very long rides (over race distance/time eg 6+ hours) it's 20-40 watts lower than race day
my race rehearsal rides were 10-15 watts higher (not intentionally, I just underperformed by 10-15 watts on race day)

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Are you ready to do an Ultraman? | How I calculate Ironman race fueling | Strength Training for Athletes |

This thread is so interesting...just because I wasn't prepared for the way Kona turned out. Totally my fault but if I had to do it all over again I would change a lot! I simply burnt up on the bike. What's interesting is that I averaged 7 watts less at LP and ran a 2:57 vs. my walk/run 3:48 at kona. The heat is the same for everyone but man was it brutal on this pasty white guy.
I am fortunate enough to be able to knock out 100 mile rides just about every Friday during the season and usually average 10-20 watts less on those rides. Of course it's sunny PA and not Hawaii :)
I ride a Valdora tri bike and rode 808's, a 55tooth chainring, 11-25 cassette, and no aero helmet on raceday. No pics from race but this was from a ride beforehand:




Kudos to you guys that are dialed in for that race.

I had the exact same experience.

Had a great swim for me 1:02 and legs felt great race day.
I actually felt like I held back quite a bit on the bike but I totally overheated.
It was game over for me as soon as I started running, nothing I could do at that point.
I shuffled a 3:53, which was quite frustrating.

I arrived 10 days early, and thought that some light training race week would be enough to acclimatize but I guess not.
I also chose to use the A/C in my condo this time around.
Lots of things I'd change if I did it again.

My long ride watts are also 20-40W lower than race day normally.

there's your trouble

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Eric Reid AeroFit | Instagram Portfolio
Aerodynamic Retul Bike Fitting

“You are experiencing the criminal coverup of a foreign backed fascist hostile takeover of a mafia shakedown of an authoritarian religious slow motion coup. Persuade people to vote for Democracy.”

No kidding. Was about to post the same.

Why does anyone think that they can ride less watts for long rides in training and then show up on race day, output not just more but 20-40 more and then run well off that? In the kona heat.

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"One Line Robert"

The reason why is because my long rides are 6-7hrs untapered.
I rode higher watts at tremblant with no problems running afterward.

I know people like to chalk bad runs to overbiking, but that's not what happened in my case. I held my watts fine in Kona without much trouble.

Believe what you want, but like the others I have enough race experience to know what my limits are.

Yeah, 3:48 off the bike at Kona

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Eric Reid AeroFit | Instagram Portfolio
Aerodynamic Retul Bike Fitting

“You are experiencing the criminal coverup of a foreign backed fascist hostile takeover of a mafia shakedown of an authoritarian religious slow motion coup. Persuade people to vote for Democracy.”

A few thoughts on the heat acclimatization that might be helpful for some of you guys:

1. Trainer rides back home with minimum fan. Get used to jacking up the core temp. Rapp said you need more than 10 hours of that. Some may need slightly more, some slightly less.
2. Kona week, I saw tons of people out riding and running in the morning. That's exactly the wrong time of day. Run in the afternoon and don't go and ride on the Queen K where there is airflow.
3. Go ride south of the pit past Keahou shopping center where there is a wide road and long steady climbs where you are going slow enough to overheat with minimal air flow. Do repeats of these climbs in aerobars and you'll get used to your core temp being jacked up. What I am surprised about is that literally no one is riding there. Everyone is out on the Queen K
4. Get sun exposure as much as possible without burning early on race week. Most of us don't get enough sun back home to deal with a 9 hour run day in Kona. Then hide from the sun the last 48 hours. Make sure you have days out in the sun mid day. Again, I see lots of people in Kona out training at 6 am, but that dies off in the afternoon. I'd recommend afternoon workouts as much as possible. The guys riding with sleeved clothing have the right idea on the sun exposure part
5. One more reason for afternoon workouts. If you are coming from east coast, 4 pm in Kona is 10 pm back home. If you are from Europe, 4 pm in Kona is 4 am back home. You need to be ready to perform on race day "prime time" which is from 2 pm to 5 pm for you sub 10 guys. You can't expect to be on during that time of day if race day is your first work out where you are performing in the "wind down sleep time" back home.

I'm not as fast as most of you guys, but I've helps a lot of guys racing in the heat in different time zones. It's a bit of a fine craft if you are not totally used to it. Although my time was slow compared to you guys, my performance in Kona at 10:49 was in line with 10:46 at LP and 10:51 in Tremblant. Like most I had a problem at each race (LP flat, Tremblant locked up neck in the swim, Kona, torn hamstring....so they all kind of added the same amount of penalty to each day, resulting in somewhat consistent finishes).

I consistently average about 5-7% higher on my race rehearsal long rides versus race day.

BOOM!
Tapering doesn't give magic fairy dust where you can push 20-40 more watts. It's ok, you went too hard. (Not Eric)

Come on guys, do all threads have to degrade to such pettiness?
I responded to give my insights into my race and mistakes.
I have no problem admitting to going too hard on the bike and suffering afterwards. I know what that feels like and what sort of power that takes for me.

If you read above I'm not the only one who does their long rides below race watts. I also do them below race effort.

A month earlier I had raced centurion at 290W for 4.5hrs, so again I know what my limits are. I raced kona at 167lbs and know I'm not a fastrunner by Kona standards, but in my experience there was more going on with me on race day.

If you think I'm in denial, that's cool I'm not trying to impress anyone with my average bike time and below average running.
Again if you want to turn your brains off and believe that all bad runs are due to overbiking that's up to you.
I happen to think otherwise.

Over heating is essentially over biking. Whhat are your other thoughts on slow running cases? Interested.

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Eric Reid AeroFit | Instagram Portfolio
Aerodynamic Retul Bike Fitting

“You are experiencing the criminal coverup of a foreign backed fascist hostile takeover of a mafia shakedown of an authoritarian religious slow motion coup. Persuade people to vote for Democracy.”