"Fuck off with your sofa units and strine green stripe patterns, I say never be complete, I say stop being perfect, I say let... lets evolve, let the chips fall where they may."

Dear Rick in the D:

All your base are belong to us.

Sincerely -

The UCI

So my stupid question for the night is why is it 76.1 deg and not 78?

Because everyone knows it doesn't matter for Oceanside, it's going to be colder than that.

I believe the average temperature at Oceanside is categorized by the NOAA as: "Shriviling".

-Jot

EMILIO:
You're not going to continue your
"rigorous investigation." You will
publicly state that there is no
Rule. Or -- imagine,
the rest of your life with your
scrotum flapping empty.

THEM
(mouth taped)
... no... please, no...

EMILIO
We'll send one to Competitor Magazine
and one to the Triathlete.
Press release style. Your nuts will
be bicoastal. Understood? The
people you're after are everyone you
depend on.
(more)

EMILIO (cont)
We do your laundry, cook your food
and serve you dinner. We guard you
while you sleep. We drive your
ambulances. Do not f**k with us.

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persequetur vestra metas furiose

I still do not get how you think DeSoto was damaged, either him personally or his company.. I think the damage if any, was done to WTC, but more specifically the Oceanside race..We are yet to know how it all went down, most likely at the local level given the quick turnaround of this one day rule. Rest assured heads will roll there, at the very least get a bitch slap. Really looks like someone made up a rule, did not run it by corporate, and certainly did not run it by USAT. I think there is definately a lesson here, hope it was learned. But as far as Emilio, he began his talk about this a long, long time ago here and with USAT. All was cleared, verbal oks were given, and he in good faith made his legal product. This was not quietly sprung onto us the tri community, or the governing bodies. What more could the guy have done, and the history of this incident just shows him as the good and honorable guy. There are many others out there that are having to take a hard look in their mirrors, but I gurantee you that Emilio is sleeping soundly tonight..

USAT and Ironman can both get out of this loop that seems to have no good end for them, it will be interesting to see if they take the high road...So far it looks as if they are at least heading upward..

Mark, yep would love to hear how WTC got the 5mm in there rules. But as I just started a new thread, they replaced the 5mm and added the 76.1 which is worse. Talking to Charlie and Skip on this, they both just told me this was news to them. And I know first hand USAT will never lower the cut off from 78, I have tried. Skip is talking with Steve tomorrow on all this mess. What is interesting though is Dan's post implies that Steve states all these changes were already talked with USAT for months and implies they would agree. Something is missing here big time!!

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Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

Boom Nutrition code 19F4Y3 $5 off 24 pack box | Bionic Runner | PowerCranks | Velotron | Spruzzamist

Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep

While I agree DeSoto's reputation isn't damaged, it does have the potential of damaging WR sales. A wetsuit purchase is an investment to me: I plan on swimming in it for 3-4 years at least. Hell, up till now, I've used that gray T1 you sold me a few years back. I'm guessing that thing is 6 years old.

Reading Dan's front page article, it seems unclear if thick wetsuits will be banned after September or January. If I purchase a WR this summer (which I had planned to do) and it gets banned before the summer of 2011...well I'll be swimming LP 2011 in an old gray T1.

Victor

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for what it's worth--as a worried and confused Water Rover buyer, I've had a couple of PMs with Emillo and I have to say he is one righteous dude! I'm not smart enough to know what the rule should be or not--there are obviously many in this forum who are!--but I do know I'd like the rules to be clear and the process of setting them even clearer.

Obviously they are not today but one thing for sure, Emillo stands behind his customers and his products. You could do a lot worse than buy any of his prducts. Good on you Emillo. I'll keep my WR--not because of the rule thing but because of you! (that said, I do like the rule clarification--OC--here I come!!!)

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Randy Christofferson(http://www.rcmioga.blogspot.com

Insert Doubt. Erase Hope. Crush Dreams.

I still have 4 days I could send mine back since they are still in the boxes. I also was concerned about the comments from Steve in Dans article. It implies they plan to go forward with these changes. I have a tough time
spending this much money for something I might only be able to use for 1 year, and then not even be able to sell it. WTC now seems to be the group I have lost trust in. And based on what has happened, you would trust them to implement a drug testing program?

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Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

Boom Nutrition code 19F4Y3 $5 off 24 pack box | Bionic Runner | PowerCranks | Velotron | Spruzzamist

Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep

"you are high if you don't think the specter of a real ban being raised at Oceanside will not adversely impact his sales"

the pole monty is talking about was made by sky pole. the olympic ban rocketed that company's sales, and they essentially rebranded the pole "the unfair advantage," which is what the IOC, or whoever banned it, called it.

that established, i think you're correct, in a certain sense. i think a lot of people are now wondering whether this will be a banned suit at some time in the future. no argument with you there.

but on another level, i think it was a positive thing for de soto, because, much or most of what makes the suit fast is not the thicker rubber. furthermore, i'm quite certain that if the water rover became illegal at the start of day tomorrow, the new rules would leave room for emilio to design the new, legal, practically-as-fast, de soto wetsuit by morning lunch break. then it's head-scratching, to see how to make his suit illegal without causing other suits to be caught up in the ban. i think that would probably make for a pretty good narrative, if you're de soto.

over here at slowtwitch editorial, rappstar comes down on the side of aquaman's one-piece, i come down on the side of de soto's first wave. that's each of our faves, personally. no secret there. i think this will probably raise de soto's visibility overall, but, yes, in the narrow category of the water rover's sales, i don't know what this will mean. it could go either way. i'm sure there are a lot of sales he won't get, maybe there are new sales he will get.

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Dan Empfield
aka Slowman

We are yet to know how it all went down, most likely at the local level given the quick turnaround of this one day rule.

The WTC knows that the wrath of the AmericanPeople is swift, overwhelming and furious......

This is a great day for innovation, capitalism, internet unrest, civil disobedience and social wetsuit justice!!

Glad it went down this way. DeSoto Sport is a First Class operation.

'Hat Tip' Karl for bringing it up and to Dan for getting it done.

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**All of these words finding themselves together were greatly astonished and delighted for assuredly, they had never met before**

Slowman, a question for you...

If you could buy just one suit that had to last you at least three years for a variety of US based USAT and WTC races, would you buy a Water Rover or a First Wave?

Victor

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are the 70.3 people honestly going to enforce this; check everybody's wetsuit? I doubt it. I mean, somebody was able to swim an IM leg with Fins on! Just pick off the lettering on the suit. It will look just like every other black wetsuit. I seriously doubt some 70.3 volunteer is going to get a ruler out and measure the thickness of the chest panel

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---------------------------
"This wheel definitely beat the 808 in this test, no question, and I do commend Hed on producing a really fast wheel...the wheel is fast, I am not disputing that." - joshatzipp on the Stinger 9
My Website
HEDmafia.com

So you recommend everyone cheats?!!

The problem comes when you get to Clearwater as most of the non-US races will have had a ban on wetsuits greater than 5mm. So are peole advocating that non-US triathletes must buy a WR so as to be competitive for one race a year? I can see what WTC where trying to do, create a level playing field across all of their races. I suspect it will happen sooner rather than later, they may have just gone about it the wrong way!!

Just because one can cheat doesn't mean one should cheat. Sorry, but if the rule say nothing > 5mm I'm not going to knowingly wear a 10mm wetsuit.

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We all know no one has ever, or is cheating in our sport, we are 100% drug free. Just ask a few Pro's that have been caught about cheating. :o)

And or course, no one has ever violated the rules, no one has ever drafted, or thrown a gel pack or bottle on the side of the road, or passed on the right, or taken family members across the finish line, or, or or,.

Dave

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Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

Boom Nutrition code 19F4Y3 $5 off 24 pack box | Bionic Runner | PowerCranks | Velotron | Spruzzamist

Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep

I was referring to my own policy, not everybody's. I've not knowingly done any of those things, but clearly some people do and don't have a problem with it.

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blog
twitter

"If you could buy just one suit that had to last you at least three years for a variety of US based USAT and WTC races, would you buy a Water Rover or a First Wave? "

first wave. that's not simply because a water rover may not be legal in three years, it's because most of what's fast, comfortable, etc., about a T1 is in the first wave. i have a water rover (i have one of just about everything), and i will most likely continue to swim in my first wave.

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Dan Empfield
aka Slowman

I couldn't agree more. You are one SMFIC. Now go get that tattooed on the inside of your bicep.

And here I thought you would be in a 2010 Superfull.

No problems with BlueSeventy Helix!!!

"You are one SMFIC."

i'm the Sebewaing Mutual Fire Insurance Company?

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Dan Empfield
aka Slowman

LOTFL I haven't thought of that since like 1999.

So if you do have a WR, have swam in it, but will still just use your T1 which Mark says is slower, I wonder why?

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Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

Boom Nutrition code 19F4Y3 $5 off 24 pack box | Bionic Runner | PowerCranks | Velotron | Spruzzamist

Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep

"So if you do have a WR, have swam in it, but will still just use your T1 which Mark says is slower, I wonder why?"

i can't speak for monty. i'm very comfortable in my first wave, that suit doesn't alter my swim mechanics the way the water rover does, i'm going to be at or near the front of the swim in either suit (in my AG) and, finally, i'm 53 and i don't feel like haggling over the final second per 100yd of speed.

this isn't to denigrate the water rover. but it's like a muscle car with a big hemi engine and 400 horsepower but without the luxury elements. i'm more comfortable having the power windows and heated seats.

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Dan Empfield
aka Slowman

Dan...could you possibly elaborate what you mean by altering your swim mechanics. I think i have an idea but I want to be sure.
THanks
Mark