The swim will be cold, very cold; think 50s. The bike looks like it will head up to Montezuma so there will be some climbing but nothing too terrible; the run will be pretty flat on the trail around the res. The elevation will be high. Until they release more info that's pretty much what you are looking at.

I saw this as well and tentatively have it penciled in for next year. I'm not from out there but spent a week between Vail, Frisco, and Boulder this past June. I accidentally drove part of that bike course (or roughly the same direction, I can't make out what roads/paths they're using) and I don't recall any killer climbs though it might be a steady climb one way and a steady descent the other. The swim is going to be COLD!!!

Honestly though Dillon/Frisco is a cute little town and it's an awesome area to train.

I am not from the area either but like to travel around to see new places and venues. A group that I train with is thinking about making a road trip out of it and coming up for a few days.

It is definitely tough to figure out details with the limited information at this point. The swim would be interesting with water that cold. I am guessing the air temps can be unpredictable that time of year as well.

I've got it penciled in for next season for sure. Looks like a blast. I believe they are planning on having a $25,000 prize purse as well.

It is definitely tough to figure out details with the limited information at this point. The swim would be interesting with water that cold. I am guessing the air temps can be unpredictable that time of year as well.

It's a brand new race. I am sure other news and information will come out soon.

The people behind it are Human Movement - one of the best race/event organizers in the U.S.

The race that has recently been run that may be most similar to this is the Leadman in Bend. Swim was in a cold mountain lake at altitude ( although not this high).

I suspect that this will be a very well run event, that will attract a good crowd of what I call the core-group - guys/gals, that get it. That are into pioneerism and adventurism - two things that really drove triathlon in the early days of the sport that seem to be very much lacking now, unfortunately. I say, get out of the box, and check something like this out! :)

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Steve Fleck @stevefleck | Blog

Very well put. I certainly wasn't knocking them for the lack of information as it was only recently announced. My group of friends love to travel and try new things much like you mentioned. Thus we will definitely be on the starting line to represent Oklahoma.

Air temp will likely be ok. Early September in the mountains can be absolutely beautiful. Think high 60s to mid 70s with bright sunshine. The morning temps are cold, but once the sun is out it warms quickly. Since it is only a half I would think they will start the day a bit later giving the temp a chance to rise before the swim start.

I think it looks like a awesome event except that water temp. On a good year the surface temp will hit 60 as a high in August (heat of the summer). The bike and the run will be spectacular. The key for people doing the race will be getting through that swim.

If you go to the following links, there is some SBR course information:

http://106westtri.com/course-maps/swimcourse/

http://106westtri.com/course-maps/bikecourse/

http://106westtri.com/course-maps/runcourse/

Looks interesting...

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Team Kiwami
Instagram

Seems like no discussion since Dan featured it on the main page: http://www.slowtwitch.com/..._Triathlon_5365.html

I haven't raced long course now in a year or two but starting to get the itch for next season and this is definitely on the radar.

Human Movement also runs the Rocky Mountain Tri, which is an "olympic-ish" (800 yd swim, 20 mile bike, 10k run) in early August, in the neighboring town of Silverthorne. I did it this year and it was definitely the prettiest race I've done. Water temp was not too bad (I think about 70), but the swim was in basically a little pond so Lake Dillon will probably be colder. They do a good job of keeping things organized and running smoothly, and they know how to pick a course that keeps you gawping at the scenery instead of thinking about how tired your legs are :) I'm absolutely planning to sign up for 106 West as soon as it opens.

we have more we're going to write about this. if you haven't see this yet...

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Dan Empfield
aka Slowman

The gruff cowboy VO is a little heavy handed but I get that they're trying to put their own flavor on a Norseman-esque 'epic' promo video.

I don't know where I fall in terms of the 'typical' triathlete these days, but an independent half in a cool or challenging setting is about the only half distance race I can get excited about anymore. Despite my misgivings and general displeasure with most decisions made by the WTC these days I still would be drawn to a branded event for a full distance race. The crowd energy, fanfare and general spectacle that goes along with the event still sucker me in.

Reflecting on 70.3's on the other hand, I realize that out of the 10 odd ones that I've done that I look back on the more unique independent races with far more fondness than somewhat generic feeling branded events. I'll never forget my experiences at races like June Lake and Wildflower whereas the apparent draw of a branded event, a somewhat consistent atmosphere and experience, has also made them seem dull and repetitive to me. This is combined with the perception that the WTC events that survive and thrive tend to be watered down to get the most people across the finish in the least amount of time.

In the end, I don't need every race to ape the Norseman vibe and pretend it's the most epic race in the world, it's a bunch of middle aged white people in spandex not the summit of Mt. Doom, but I am truly glad to see new independent races in more interesting if not more challenging settings.

to answer a question so far unasked on this thread (because i did ask) the voice is "seems like" sam elliot, not sam elliot. and that's a damned good seems like, if you ask me.

this is really the best of branded v unbranded, if you ask me. the guy putting on this race, jeff suffolk, really was at the heart of ironman's production team back when it was roch, huddle, suffolk and the crew working under graham fraser and building the ironman production brand. but since he split off he's rounded out his abilities as an event producer by putting on cultural events (like a big oktoberfest in denver this past week) that probably are beyond ironman's competencies, because this is not what ironman does.

jeff is also not encumbered by the extreme profit motives of PEP and i might write about how PEP has been treating ironman near the end of its ownership tenure. honestly, i think we got out of dodge just in time. think what you want, but i suspect the new chinese owners are going to be a little less penny pinching on the race experience than PEP seems to have become recently.

i don't think jeff will be sharpening his pencil, trying to eke every nickel out of this event.

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Dan Empfield
aka Slowman

No love for Pigman? :-)

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"Good genes are not a requirement, just the obsession to beat ones brains out daily"...the Griz

Let's just say I'll never forget Pigman.

Love is a strong word.

I'm actually really pumped for this race. Awesome venue.

Pre-reg is now open, public reg opens this Friday.

With pre-reg discount and processing fees the half distance is $140. How's that for value in grass root tri.

Of course Jeff gets this race off the ground after I've moved out of town. I did do his Silverthorne race a couple of times. Was nice to do a race that we didn't have to travel to. It'll be interesting to see how they manage traffic on the bike course as its a pretty busy highway. We might have to plan a trip back to coincide with the race.

I'm planning on racing - sounds like an awesome challenge!

Anyone seen an elevation chart for the half?

Yep, I already signed up, really pretty area, I have spent time out there the last4 years getting ready for Leadville, looks like fun

Don't worry, it will hurt!

Well put, I registered today because I like the idea of something different and unpredictable. I hope works out for Jeff, the area is beautiful and I could always use a belt buckle and cowboy hat from a day of Triathletic adventures in Summit County.

Hee hee ... you won't be the only Okie there ...

I'm in. Looking forward to it. Should be quite an adventure.

woohoo!!! officially signed up for my first 70.3 :)

Me Too!!!

should be fun. definitely putting Tri the Boat olympic on the calendar to get a taste of racing at altitude

I'm in...looking forward to a new and fun race experience!

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Steve Johnson
DARK HORSE TRIATHLON |

I'm in - looks like an awesome event

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Are you ready to do an Ultraman? | How I calculate Ironman race fueling | Strength Training for Athletes |

I'm in along with a bunch of the CU team.

We recently posted a virtual ride of the bike course... https://www.youtube.com/...QVM53BM#action=share or http://106westtri.com/course-maps/

Thanks for sharing the excitement for this event. It took us just shy of nine years to get this permit approved, but it will be worth the wait.

Re: water temps...I grew up on Lake Michigan so to me Lake Dillon feels like a pool swim. The water is super fresh, clean and the views are tough to beat. I'm (a lot) biased because I think the race really adds a lot of character to triathlon and racing. I get that it's not for everyone, but it wasn't designed that way.


Jeff Suffolk
humanmovement.com

jeff, looks cool but no usat sanction or mention. why not, some of us do want to qualify for nats, get ranked and support you. thanks. alex

Thanks Alex, it is definitely going to be sanctioned with USAT. I'm not sure why their logo's aren't posted yet, but I'm sure they will be soon. Thanks for the heads up.


Jeff Suffolk
humanmovement.com

Thanks for sharing the excitement for this event. It took us just shy of nine years to get this permit approved, but it will be worth the wait.

Jeff,

This hints a bit at what goes on behind the scenes with organizing endurance sports events. It's NEVER as easy or quick as people(participants) think it is from their side of things.

Kudos to you and your team for your hard work and persistence in making this happen.

Best wishes with this bold new event.

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Steve Fleck @stevefleck | Blog

Very excited for this event. Enjoyed the virtual bike.
Thanks for putting all the effort into making this happening.
Hope it's a successful first year event for y'all.

I rode most of the bike course this morning and this race certainly won't lack scenery nor challenge. The road up to Montezuma is no joke. I was grinning from ear to ear the whole time. Should be a really fun - and hard - event!





This one isn't from the race course, but still!

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Steve Johnson
DARK HORSE TRIATHLON |

This is one of my favorite parts of CO. I really want to do the half but IM Chatt is only a couple weeks later. The quarter distance could be an option though. Convince the wife to head out a week early for vacation aka acclimatization.

Thanks for the report. What were the grades like? What front range ride would you compare it to?

Thanks!

I'd say it most closely resembles the climb from 36 to Jamestown...but a couple thousand feet higher! The stretch from Keystone to Montezuma was the hardest part of the climb IMO.

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Steve Johnson
DARK HORSE TRIATHLON |

Thanks. Lefthand Canyon to the P2P is one of my favorite rides.

One more question: is the 2,219' elevation gain per 28 mile loop or is it 2,219' total for the 56 miles? Their website is confusing...

Total for the 56. It's about 1000 feet from Dillon up to Montezuma.

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Steve Johnson
DARK HORSE TRIATHLON |

That is what I thought and what their profile seemed to indicate, but I asked the same question of them and received this response:

"it is a 2 loop course, 28 miles each loop, so the elevation gain of 2219 is for one loop. 4438 in total.

Hope this helps! Enjoy the training - See you in September "

FWIW, I created a route on Strava as best I could with the description of the course from their website and got ~3,800' for the 70.3. So I'm thinking their 4438' is probably right after all.

I signed up over the weekend with the Father's Day discount code. Why do I keep picking races with cold swims? Should be a fun race.

I have no idea how anyone can get anything over say, 2600 feet of elevation gain for the 70.3. Dillon sits at about 9100 feet and Montezuma is at about 10200 feet, depending on where you're measuring from. The ~12-mile climb from Dillon to Montezuma is almost all straight up, without any descending...and the part along the dam in Dillon is completely flat. I don't know how these elevation gain profiles are computed, but it seems to me that you'd be hard pressed to get anything over 1300 feet of gain per lap of the 70.3. Maybe someone can fill me in b/c the elevation gains that some of these software programs are generating seem awfully generous, IMO.

Regardless of the net elevation gain, it'll be a slog to the top of the course, especially the last mile - which kicks up pretty good.

It's gonna be awesome!

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Steve Johnson
DARK HORSE TRIATHLON |

When I look at a map I come to the same conclusion as you which is why I can't figure out the discrepancy. Do you have a GPS file from your ride?

From the far end of the dam up to Montezuma, my file from the other day has ~1200 feet of elevation gain.

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Steve Johnson
DARK HORSE TRIATHLON |

Awesome pics and info, Steve. This race looks absolutely epic. I almost wish I didn't even know about it because the timing this year is just not right for me. But this is the kind of course that I can only hope is a game changer in the CO triathlon scene. There are only so many times we can lap the Res in Boulder....

Amen to that. The 106 West course could use a little more imagination with the double out-and-back as the current setup, but I imagine the permits would be hard to come by to do something else like loop around Lake Dillon via Swan Mountain Rd.

But this will certainly do...I'm not complaining!

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Steve Johnson
DARK HORSE TRIATHLON |

I was cruising the interwebs last night and found a 20% off code for this race. Code: 106TRI

When you rode the course did you ride out of Dillon on Hwy 6 or the bike path? I'm planning to ride it tomorrow and trying the ascertain the safety of 6...

I rode the path. Wanted a little more peace and quiet than dealing with the traffic, etc.

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Steve Johnson
DARK HORSE TRIATHLON |

Great, thanks! Does the path take you right to Motezuma Road?

It takes you up through the Keystone parking lot and I stopped at a stop sign just passed that and took out my phone to see exactly where I was...had to take a right and go maybe a 1/4 mile to Montezuma Rd.

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Steve Johnson
DARK HORSE TRIATHLON |

There's a handful of nice nice paths that take you around the rez. Some of them go near montezuma.

I rode a bit of the course and indecently during Triple Bypass last weekend, some really pretty scenery in general although the course itself isn't exactly the best riding in that area.

The water in Dillion reservoir looked cold and judging by the cold breeze coming off I'm pretty sure it more than looks it.

I ran the approximate course today. The portion on the bike path was meh but the dirt reservoir road was fantastic. I didn't start where T2 will be but I think the 700' per 6.5 mile loop is pretty accurate.There was quite a chop in the lake today and a wind that would make the entire day rather challenging. I took some photos but can't seem to post them.

I rode parts of the course today. A few additions to DarkHorse's course report: in his second photo, there now is a giant illuminated sign just past the "Share the Road" sign flashing "DANGER: Aggressive bears next 6 miles".

The road condition going up Montezuma is pretty good but you'll want to be careful on the descent. The first mile or so has some substantial holes, some of which were in shadows, as well as some swells that could launch you if you're not paying attention. Then the road turns smooth for a while before there are horizontal cracks in the road which mostly just provide for an annoying clunk-clunk clunk-clunk for a mile or so.

I can't comment on the Hwy. 6 portion as I road the bike path from Dillon.

Again today there was a strong wind and white caps in the lake. I'm not sure if that is typical or not.

It's the 2× long ascent and first portion of the descent that have me contemplating road bike with clip ons.

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Steve Johnson
DARK HORSE TRIATHLON |

Just a bit over 3 weeks out now, took another look at the bike video to mull over bike selection again. I'm somewhat torn. I'm sure TT will be faster despite the fact that I've ridden my TT bike once this entire year so far, but the road surface on the first part of that descent does look pretty craptastic. Guess will have to take it easy no matter what bike you're on but my P4 is a deathtrap on most everything but flats so that is giving me some pause.

I just made the decision to go with my road bike. Two big factors ... I don't have a compact crank on my Slice (living at 1000' translates to need lots of gears) and 40/56 miles are either straight up the hill or straight down the hill ... the TT bike gives me no advantage on either.

So for the few miles that are flat I will give up 2 mph to hopefully make some of that up on either the climb or being fresher (whatever that means in this race) for the run.

I just called the Dillon Marina. The water temperature is currently 44 degrees. That is not a typo.

I really hope that is deep water and not surface temp ... if so me thinks this race is going to have a shortened or non-swim (St. George 3 years ago ....)

Yikes

She told me it was surface, accurate within 4 degrees.

Gonna be FUN ... or something .... methinks my booties and hat are not going to be sufficient!

From the 106W website: "The average water temperatures will range from 61 to 64 degrees Fahrenheit". 61F is cold but do-able. 44F is not, especially for thin athletes.

The lady at the marina's response to the claim of 61-64F was "no way".

Alcatraz is what, mid 50s? With how many cases of hypothermia (or worse)?

Edited to answer my own question:
In all, rescuers pulled about 150 swimmers from the swim portion of the race, more than three times the normal number, Burke said. Water temperatures were about 51 degrees, air temperatures hovered in the mid-50s and 11-mph winds made the air feel closer to the mid-40s.
Normally, when the race is held in June, the bay is anywhere from 54 to 60 degrees, and air temperatures can be in the 70s or higher.

Agreed. I have done Silverman at 63F and it was COLD... and I am not thin. Straight up .... I won't be going in the water if it is that cold ... I suspect this will be a du before all is said and done.
On the other hand, it is going to be a fun day regardless. Seriously looking forward to it.

someone please tell me the swim will be cancelled if it's 44 degrees. that sounds like an absolute nightmare

Sorry for being combatitive. But come on guys. Any excuse to cancel the swim eh.....

Firstly, the water is not 44. 50 or warmer is more likely. (Ok- maybe in shallow water, in a sheltered spot, on the coldest recent morning. But the whole race is not going to be in that one spot).

Secondly, 50 degree water is not cold IF: 1) you are swimming hard
And
2) you are wearing a wetsuit.

I am the least cold tolerant person I know. But I could do the race in 50 degree water without a wetsuit. I would be cold. But I wouldn't be in the water that long. And my exertion would keep me warm enough.
And with a wetsuit I could probably float around for an hour or more with getting hypothermia.

Thirdly, it's a mountain RACE. You shouldn't enter such a thing if you want a warm water float.

Fourthly, being cold on the bike is a much more legitimate concern. Being wet and traveling 50 mph downhill, in 38 degree weather, does concern me.
But they won't cancel the bike....
They probably expect me to be prepared.
Why treat the swim differently?

Frankly...I'm just nervous for my diet half distance. I'm coming in in slightly less shape than I had intended. Anything to make it more difficult isn't welcomed at this point. I guess I'd actually be more concerned with it being choppy than cold

dirtymangos,

Firstly, I personally do not wish for excuses to cancel the swim. It is my best -- and favorite -- discipline.

I do not know your link to the actual water temperature. The person I spoke to was on site at the Dillon Marina where the race will start. If you have a more accurate, legit source of information that contradicts the marina, please share.

I am glad you are confident in your ability to swim in 50 degree water. Do you have actual experience swimming in those water temperatures or is your scenario based on hypotheticals?

Not everyone who signed up for the event based on the information provided by the race director (61-64 degree water temps which hardly qualifies as a "warm water float") has such experience or desire to test the limits of their body in 44 degree waters. There is no way for everyone to "prepare" for such a swim as you suggest. And yes, getting out of the cold water into cold air and getting on the bike with wet clothes and hair is problematic.

Are any of you guys in Colorado or actually ask someone who is about the weather? We've had 2 cold fronts that have come through in the last week or so, a pretty substantial one just in the past few days. The weather has been abnormally cold for this time of year the last 2 weeks and water temperatures have plunged. The race still being a few weeks away no guarantees can be made about the weather but it looks to be returning to a more seasonal (warmer) pattern during which time I would expect water temps to increase at least some.

Since one of you guys was talking about the year Alcatraz was in the beginning of March and not the middle of the summer, I did that race. The water was damn cold and I didn't fully regain feeling in my feet until a half mile or so into the run. But it was doable. That was 50-51 though, I can't see anyone holding a non-shortened swim in temps lower than 50.

So this past week we have had a lot of moisture here. The days have been around 60 degrees and the nights in the low to mid 30's. It looks the temperatures are going to stay in the 60's for the daytime and low 40's for at least the next week. These are typical temps for this time of the year.

Just read through the thread here and interesting the quick convo about the E elation gain confusion. I had it as well. After strava'ing I think I did ends up getting like 1900' but I was definitely confused. I'm in Breck for the night and going to ride probably just a lap of the course tomorrow as long as its not 40 degrees and raining.

Then off to stock pile pearl izumis at the outlet before they're gone forever :(

dirtymangos post is absurd. I did a tri this year with only a half mile swim at around 56 degrees and it was pretty awful. Your legs go numb no matter what, breathing gets difficult, and it's just no good.

Like I said I am a super wimp when it comes to cold water.
But I do own a wetsuit. And I would NOT plan on "taking it easy" in a cold water swim.

Escape from Alcatraz was toasty warm.
St George was toasty warm.
(After you had been swimming for a while. Yet both were supposedly in the low 50s).

I did a 5000 yd training swim in a glacial lake water where the water was around 45. (I did wear a wetsuit and a wool hat under my swim cap).

I have seen Inuits swim and play in 45 f water, for most of an hour, on a 45 degree day, with strong wind.

I think the warmest water the English Channel ever gets is 62. And that swim takes 10+ hours. And it doesn't count unless you do it without a wetsuit.

So no I am not being ridiculous.

It is ridiculous to sign up for a triathlon in September at 1100ft.
And then start pleading that they cancel the swim because it might be a little "cold".

It's not ridiculous if you're given information that says it will be 20 degrees warmer that it (theoretically) is

The 64 degree thing seems optimistic.
It might be that warm.
It might not.
The 40 degree thing seems like exaggerated hype.

My thought is this.
Plan on swimming fast. (It is a race after all. It is very hard to get cold when you are exercising vigorously). Use a wetsuit. If it is extra cold and/or you are especially sensitive to the cold - wear booties and a wetsuit cap. This is exactly the type of conditions the wetsuit is made for.

I have never been close to getting hypothermia from cold water.
Riding my bike down hill in 38 degree rain........
That accounts for at least 90% my engagements with hypothermia.

I am convinced that the unique danger with this race is cold rain and hail on the bike decents.

That's where I would get hypothermia.

I can see it now...
"Oh I don't need a jacket. It won't rain. And I will be racing hard. Anyway."
(Of course you don't race hard on the decents).

But weak swimmers are always worried about the swim.

comparing inuits, English Channel swimmers, and, apparently, yourself, to the majority of triathletes just underscores the absurdity.

I'm not really trying to attack you, it just seems clear that you're not as "wimpy" as you think. (As for myself, I use the top helix, it was not adequate to mitigate what I described. Next time I would add a thermal cap and booties, but not sure how much a difference it would make since I've never tried.)

Btw, they cancelled (or dramatically shortened) the itu long course worlds swim last year (i believe sweden) because the organizers considered it too cold, I'll be interested to look up the temp, but am sure it was in the 50s.

to answer my own question, long course worlds last year was 57.2 in the water and they shortened from 3800m to 1500m.

FWIW, USAT recommends a cancelled swim for courses over 1500m and a water temp below 53. Other variables like air temp, altitude, etc. are taken into consideration by the RD before making a final call.

I'm not also so sure about your suggestion to swim fast to warm up at an elevation of over 9000 feet. For "normal" elevations, I can agree with you, but going out hard at that altitude for most AGers with a water temp in the low 50s probably isn't the best idea. I

Alternatively, I'd try warming up on land while wearing my wettie in order to get warm before entering the water.

If I were placing bets placed on the information provided, and with the race still 3 weeks away, with days getting shorter and nights getting cooler, I would say there won't be a swim. I'd like to be wrong, however.

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Steve Johnson
DARK HORSE TRIATHLON |

Inclement and rapidly changing weather is always a possibility in the mountains, but certainly less likely in the morning than the afternoon. Unless there's a system/front moving through, I think everyone should be off the bike before the typical afternoon patterns kick in.

All the same, I think I'm leaning road bike now. I've been forcing myself to ride my TT lately after shelving it ~2 years ago after my last quasi-tri retirement and I rather despise riding it. It's damn fast, but eh, I have no strong competitive drive for this race and would rather enjoy the scenery and the experience rather than stare at the ground 5 feet in front of me for a few hours. Plus if the weather does turn south, I certainly am a lot more competent descender on my road bike.

Highest swim I've ever done in a race was June lake at 7,654'. I was living at sea level then, but I was also actually training for the swim then as well and it was a real kick in the nuts. Definitely could not push the pace. I did Tahoe as well, that wasn't so bad. I now live in the Denver metro and do sporadic OWS and my pace still is affected by the altitude, but double that elevation going up to Dillon is an entirely different animal.

As for cancelling the swim, the water is still in the 60s down here in Denver but that doesn't mean a whole lot. Provided the info from the Marina was accurate, I can't see it warming up a ton but I'm still hoping for the swim as well despite the fact that it's always been my worst event and I've swam once a week for the past few months if I'm lucky.

If they do hold it and the water is in the 50's, I recommend people considering grabbing a pear of neoprene swim socks / booties, you can get a pair from amazon for less than $20. That and a neoprene cap. You can do the swim-cap-sandwich for added affect which is latex cap, neoprene, then race latex cap on the outside. Annoying because it puts a lot of pressure on your head, but keeps you from getting brain freeze.

I, personally, am impressed with your penis. Thank you for showing it to us ... now I know to not bring my wife to the race because she might then know that not only am I not a world class swimmer capable of swimming the channel but that I am not as endowed ... whew, marriage saved.

You started your attack on those you perceived as being wimpy by saying you didn't want to be a dick ... thanks, Mr Trump, that makes the subsequent idiocy of your comments okay. Glad you did that ... don't want anyone to be too offended by you waiving that impressive penis around.

I am going to hang with the Inuit ... maybe it will toughen me up so I can be like you!

Little Inuit kids enjoying a swim in the summer are super macho.
So too, are the overweight old ladies that do the channel swim.

But you don't need that level of macho. ......
Just a wetsuit. And the ability to comfortably swim 1.2 miles.

Ha, well...For the record, we wouldn't have worked this hard to get these permits over the last nine years if we thought the water would get down into the 40's. That would be an awful experience for everyone involved. I grew up in Lake Michigan and that's cold even for me.

We picked September because the lake would be at it's warmest or close to it.

We were up at the lake this weekend, with air temps in the mid 60's and the water temps at two feet deep were pretty close to the same. Whoever answered that call at the marina was most likely messing with you unfortunately.

Our best guess is that Lake Dillon will be at 62*F on race morning.

Jeff

I'll be taking the TT up for its gear selection. Just praying the roads are dry. Went up there today to check the course out. There's a couple pot holes up at the top of the decent that I think could get someone really hurt. I'm glad I'm aware of them now. The climb is going to be a bitch on the second lap.

As for the water I'm glad to hear that 44 isn't accurate. Hopefully it's calm with some sun. That's all I'll ask for. Guna be a gorgeous and painful first 70.3 for me! Bright side:: it'll make all other ones seem easy....right?

Thanks for the update!

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Steve Johnson
DARK HORSE TRIATHLON |

Really? This website confirms the current 44F water temp:

http://www.fishingnotes.com/.../co/Dillon-Reservoir

FWIW - I've used that site for scouting water temps for early season races and it has been woefully inaccurate. Maybe it has something to do with the depth of the water that they're reporting.

As a current example, it has Union Reservoir in Longmont at 42 degrees and Boulder Res at 44 degrees. It was 76 degrees out at Union less than a week ago.

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Steve Johnson
DARK HORSE TRIATHLON |

Good to know!

I was in Boulder res yesterday. It definitely wasn't 44

Everyone knows you can't trust a fish with a thermometer. Duh!

Ha yes, it also says that Chatfield res is 43, which would be a surprise to me given I was swimming there last week without a wetsuit.

I live part-time up in that area. The temps are definitely NOT in the 60's in the morning, more like low 40's at this time of year. I was just there to ride the course and waiting until 9am to even get on my bike and it was still in the 40's, so I instead decided to ride up Montezuma in my car, and there was some ice on the road at the top, since it snowed on the peaks the prior evening.
I have no problem riding or running in the cold, however my concerns are getting out of cold water in wet clothing and then trying to navigate a bike ride with a numb body and no real way of being able to warm up since the air will not warm up until you're on the run. The road at the top of Montezuma is also something to be desired....there are plenty of basketball-sized pot-holes to navigate around, so let's add numb bodies, slick roads, lots of people try and pass, and oh yeah....we are all racing....yikes!
Warming tent for athletes to change into dry clothes coming out of the swim? Possibility of cutting the ride a tad short (like right by the bridge on Montezuma) to avoid the last mile and a half in the shade with crappy conditions?

Then take your time in transition and change into warm dry clothes. No one is forcing anyone to sprint out of the water, do a flying mount onto your skinny tire death trap and ride sockless in a wet, sleeveless trisuit.

I don't see this race as being one of the mass market downstream swim, flat bike 'everyone's a winner!' bullshit races that people do to one-and-done or set some new PR. I gather from the marketing that they are catering this race more to the 'extreme' triathlon crowd, it's supposed to be hard and the environmental conditions (altitude, temperature) are a deliberate part of that.

Not to say that this race really compares to Norseman, but you don't see a people there complaining about the cold swim, weather or possibly sketchy roads. That's kind of the whole point and the reason they all signed up for it in the first place, to overcome adversity. I don't know how hard this race will prove to be, but I hope people had sense enough before signing up to realize that a race at >10,000ft in the rocky mountains in September might not be all sunshine and lollipops.

edit: to clarify I'm not directing this at you personally, more the general vibe I get from this thread. Some sort of warming / changing tent in transition would be great if they could swing it, but I'll be bringing some extra towels just in case.

  I am super stoked for your passion for the extreme triathlon, and wanting to only do races that are not "fast and flat bullshit" as you so eloquently put it. However, when reading through this forum, it is obvious that there ARE people who have signed up for this race as either their first 70.3 race ever, or are from the flat lands and were looking for something that seemed challenging and different and I do not blame them, as this race was marketed in a way that made it seem like it would be a "beautiful setting" with the challenge of altitude. Not so bad, right?
My concerns do not lie with the "super human" prototypes such as yourself whom thrive on extreme conditions, more so, it lies with the people who are not prepared for these conditions and if precautions are not taken, it will end up effecting you, whether you like it to not because the course will become unsafe with people who do not know how to handle their bike. I am going to assume, that you have done races such as this, where you are completely numb on the bike, since you have the opinion that sucking it up will make everything just fine. After doing races such as Alcatraz in cold water, I can assure you that no matter how "tough" you think you are, when the elements take over your body...there is really nothing you can do, no matter how tough you think you are.
Making a reference to Norseman, frankly, makes me giggle. Nowhere in 106 West does it state that it's an EXTREME triathlon, it makes mention to the altitude, period. This race is in not marketed the way Norseman is, nor does it have the same precautions that are mandatory to their race, in which case athletes are 100% aware of what they just signed up to participate in. All pictures for 106 West are of athletes in their sleeveless triathlon suits, with beautiful weather. The mantra, "it won't be pretty, but it will be beautiful" is not exactly a descriptor to the elements that athletes are looking to encounter, nor does the description of the race course on the website. Extreme Triathlons such as Norseman require each athlete to have a support crew, for the specific reasons of monitoring the athlete and helping them when needed for reasons that have already been discussed in this forum. Nowhere in this race are athletes allowed to have support crew in our transition area, helping athletes dry off, warm them up as they are putting on ample amounts of clothing, and yet the water temperatures of these two races might end up being similar....
This race has the potential to be absolutely amazing, challenging and something I would be proud to promote to many people in future years. However, it seems to me that being the first year, there may be some things that need to be assessed a bit in order to make it successful and keep a positive vibe about it so that it is not a "one and done" deal. If you chose not to use some of the precautions that could be part of the race to enhance safety, then that is completely your perogative...and if it makes you faster and tougher, then I hope to see you on the podium and will cheer for your amazing race!

This thread has been a great reminder of why I gave up on tri years ago, people take this crap way too seriously. While amusing, your wild conjectures about my positions are misinformed to say the least.

My actual position is quite simple. Personal responsibility. If you signed up for the the "highest triathlon in the world" without thinking about what that might mean, then, well, good luck. The RD certainly has both a legal and a moral responsibility to conduct a race in a safe manner and perhaps there is more they could be doing in that regard, but that is out of my control. What is in my control, regardless of the race or venue, is to make informed and rational decisions about how I prepare for an event, how I participate in an event, and the decision to skip or cease participating in an event if I feel that my personal safety is in jeopardy... or hell, if I simply no longer feel like doing it.

How you conduct your race is up to you. Personally, if I am freezing coming out of the water, I'll probably take my time in transition and try to warm up. If I'm too cold to safely ride my bike or the conditions are well outside my comfort zone then I'll pull the plug myself. Luckily, I have swam alcatraz before, in March. I have raced a half at high altitude before (June Lake), I have swam/raced at altitude and near-freezing temperatures (Tahoe). I have a reasonable idea of my limits and a reasonable idea of how to race in these kinds of conditions. If I hadn't done any of these things, then perhaps "the worlds highest triathlon" wouldn't be the best place to start.

And with that, I'm out. Best of luck for a fun an safe race to all.

The way I see it.......

It looks like an awesome race, in a spectacular setting.
It presents a unique opportunity to challenge oneself.

Cold water, variable weather and high elevation. All part of the challenge. All things that make the race unique.

I wish the organizers success.

X2

Let's turn this to something positive and talk about how people are planning on dealing with the potential conditions. I'm interested to hear from anyone racing or not. I rode yesterday and i think it was in the 50s with no sun at all and some very light rain. Gave me an idea of what I'll need to stay warm.

What I know I'm doing/bringing (dependent on weather):
- bought some toe warmers for the bike
- thinking I'll wear my compression socks rather than sleeves to have my foot covered and a little more warmth on the legs
- will have arm warmers, warm headband, and full gloves ready if needed
- will have my cycling vest available

What more can I do?:
- have a few towels in T1 and spend time really drying off
- should I not wear my tri suit under the wetsuit so it's dry? Would it be worse to wear just compression shorts under the wetsuit?
- are neoprene booties, hat too much?
- .....all tips welcome

I did IM Lake Tahoe 2013, the year of the snow. I wore a neoprene cap but didn't have booties so I wore socks. They had heated changing tents and most people stripped out of their wet bathing suits in T1 (bring towels to dry off). I brought a travel mug full of hot tea which helped warm my core in T1. Many people were woefully prepared for the cold on the bike. Riding dry in 40s-50s is different than riding wet or with wet hair after a cold swim! I have long hair which doesn't dry easily so I wore a wool beanie. I wore many layers on the bike which I never took off. I had hand and toe warmers but they didn't work; I think I should have activated them prior to the swim so that they could be exposed to oxygen to heat up. The good thing about this bike course is it is generally uphill out of T1.

Thanks Tristen. This has been a fun conversation and it is certainly all context, as you mention.

We just hosted a 20 mile 'hiking' event last weekend in Colorado that started at 10,000' and went up to 12,500'. That's a normal weekend hike for most, but for those coming from sea level, it almost crushed people. I bought a mountain bike the same week I finished the Leadville 100, and though I only got a couple hours of any bike riding in that year, I knew I could finish it because it's not that hard. Some people would argue that it is hard. The 106 West course will be insanely gnarly for some and just a beautiful tri for others. We have had the tag line that "It won't be pretty but it will be beautiful" because the expectation is that this course will be really challenging, but if you take your time and enjoy it, the experience will be beautiful.

It looks like a high pressure system is on it's way to the high country, and we will have a sunny/moderately warm day. If you're from Florida, you'll be freezing no matter what. If you live in Evergreen, you'll be happy. If you're Ziebart and live in both locations, you'll just be confused.

We took 'official' water temps again today and the lake will be 62*F on race morning.

Jeff

Hey Jeff - did the run course ever change? I swore I remembered it going same direction as the bike course, towards keystone but realized last week it's going along the dam. Am I crazy?

I emailed the race about the possibility of switching from the half to the quarter distance. They said that could be done at packet pickup. I wouldn't be excited about doing that as I need a half on my schedule around this time, but cutting the swim in half is tempting.

The race support people also said that the water temps are expected to be at 60 degrees. That is a huge difference. 60 is no problem.50's are cold but doable. 44 is hypothermic and just plain painful. I don't see how the temps can rise that much in a week but I guess I will find out. I am not excited about driving all the way to Colorado from Kansas City just to DNS, so I hope it at least gets into the 50's.

MiddlePocket, The water temps are above 60*F right now. That was a bad rumor about the water being in the 40's.

Jeff - Wish I could be there in Dillon for the first 106 West Tri! I ride your bike course almost everyday when I'm at my condo during the summer. Love the bike path around Lake Dillon and the ride up past Keystone will be epic! Good luck with the race and if you move it away from the IM Wisconsin date in 2017, I will be there to participate! Z

Hey Tom, I spend time in the area every year but have never ridden up toward Keystone or Montezuma road. Is this going to be like climbing Swan road or climbing up Vail Pass or is this more like ride between Frisco and Copper Mountain on the Bike path? Just trying to decide between the road bike or the TT bike.

Thanks, Jeff

It is a bit steeper then the bike path from Frisco to Cooper, but not much. The road is a bit rougher than the bike path, but going up it's not a problem. Coming down, you will need hang on and watch for the cracks in the road! Have fun! Z

Has anybody received the athlete guide promised to us by August 22??

Any idea if there will be changing tents in T1?

Haven't received anything and really wondering why. Want to know what sort of parking and road closures we're dealing with and where exactly transition will be set up.

@jeffsuffolk - any idea when that's coming out?

In this interview with Laura Bennett ( https://soundcloud.com/...n-with-laura-bennett ) she talks about changing out of wet clothes, so I am hoping that means there will be change tents.

I'd like to know how the nuun will be delivered on the bike course: will it be in bottles already or will we have to stop to fill up our own using paper cups?

I'd also like to know if we can drop clothes after the first loop on the bike for the 70.3.

The current weather forecast Friday night is 39 degrees with a high on Saturday of 61. Keep in mind that high temps are typically reached around 3PM and that Montezuma will be colder. If that forecast holds, the air temp will probably be around 45 at race start.

Welp, there's your athlete guide

I predict several athletes in the last swim wave who are very capable of completing the bike course in the allotted time of 5:30 (which has apparently been reduced to 5:20) will not make the first bike cutoff at 28 miles due to the highly skewed average speed required to meet it (putting myself in that category).

how does it normally work? this is my first HIM. think i need to write some of these times on my hand!

.

Nix that. The race director informed me there are errors in the athlete guide. The 28-mile cutoff is not 12:34 p.m., rather 1:35 p.m. That I can do. He added that the second bike cut at 39 miles should read 2:36 p.m, not 1:35 p.m.

The family and I were on a boat on Dillon this weekend. I brought a thermometer and I got 60-62 surface temp in a couple spots.

I'll be up there next weekend, camping up on Swan Mtn Rd. I'll try and check on water temps.

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Formerly DrD

So just want to clarify this timeline- times seems to be a little off. I am coming from Denver, and with work- I wont be able to get up there today.

Race Morning Pick Up: 5:00-6:00 AM
Bike must be in transition by: 6:15 AM
Transition doesn't open until: 7:00 AM
Race Starts: 9:29 AM

So I drop my bike off at 6:00 AM and wait until 7:00 AM to actually set everything up?

thats the way i understand it. im just glad im going up today, it sounds confusing otherwise. hope you don't have any issues!


good luck to everyone racing!

Looks like you all had perfect weather today! Nice that they had the road blocked off for you.

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Formerly DrD

A little windy on the second loop but overall you couldn't ask for much better weather given the variability of the mountains. Swim was cold at first but not too bad in my opinion.

Overall I thought the race was very well done, though there were some pretty big gaps in the aid stations which they can hopefully tighten up next year.

The half distance definitely kicked my ass, given my lack of commitment to actual tri training anymore I think I'd do the quarter next time but I'd definitely recommend the race.

I agree the weather was about as good as we could have hoped for.

I think the athlete guide and at the safety meeting they said aid stations on the bike at 10, 20, 30 and 40 miles. There were only 2 aid stations I don't remember the distances. I drank my 2 bottles on the first lap and didnt grab anything from the aid stations and had a pretty big gap to ride until I got to the first one on the second lap. An extra aid station near turn around point would have been great for those doing the half.

On the run we had a head wind going out and a tailwind coming back in. Again I would have liked to see another aid station near the turn around between the first and second laps for the half. They said aid stations every 1.5 miles which wasn't true for the half. They had 3 aid stations on course around 1.5, 3, and 4.5 miles. That meant for the half runners you had around a 3 mile stretch with no aid stations. I did bring a gel flask with me so I had some nutrition with me, but some water or nuun to wash it down would have been fantastic.

Overall I enjoyed the race. The half definitely was challenging. It was cool seeing Dave Scott spectating and cheering us on during the run. I hope they can keep this event going. It was worth the trip out from California. I'd love to do it again when I am in better running shape.

Hopefully the race will stick around. It's definitely on my radar for the future.

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Formerly DrD

I agree that the gap on the aid stations in the middle was the most noticeable issue, especially on the run. I hit that one aid station on the bike that was about halfway four times and that worked out OK.

Overall though, I have to hand it to the organizers who have been working on these permits for nine years. A first time event usually has some kinks, but this was about as flawless as I think anyone could have hoped for given the unique setting.

It's funny, I was so concerned about the swim being so cold (it was cold, but definitely manageable as the organizers promised) and the bike (it is a pretty stout climb to Montezuma but the road surface was awesome overall, and the lanes closed to traffic were fantastic!) and I somewhat forgot to take into account the half marathon at the end. Turns out, that's where I think the altitude effects snuck up on a lot of folks, including me.

Great (but challenging!) event in a beautiful setting (hopefully everyone saw the aspen's changing already). Thanks to Mother Nature for the near perfect weather as well.

Agree with the sentiments on the water. Really was not that bad once you got moving. Couldn't feel my feet when I got out and that made an interesting attempt at getting my compression socks on.

Weather was indeed awesome, minus the winds that picked up on the 2nd bike lap for us BOP'ers. Couldn't have picked a much harder half for my first attempt. The bike course kicked my butt but I was overall relatively happy with my effort there. The run was a nightmare though. My stomach was an absolute mess and wouldn't let me run more than a few hundred yards at a time for the first 6-7 miles. Which sucked cause I actually felt pretty strong when I could run. No heavy, plodding feet, no heavy breathing. Just couldn't power through the stomach issues.

I thought aid stations were ok, but I have no frame of reference. The decent down montezuma was a bit rough on the road, but nothing you wouldn't be expecting riding in these mountains. Fully closed off bike lane was so amazing. Except to the downhill mountain biker on his way to keystone. we exchanged some choice words. Had the balls to call me a pussy...the guy who was going to spend his day sitting on a chairlift while we all climbed 4400'. Ok guy.

Huge congrats and thanks to Jeff and HMM for making this happen after 9 years. You could hear the genuine happiness and excitement in his voice announcing the wave starts in the morning and the finishers even at the tail end when I finished. Hope they get the chance to keep this going and making it better and better every year.

Loved it....great race, great venue...everything was superb. Can't wait until next year!

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Steve Johnson
DARK HORSE TRIATHLON |

I had a great day overall. There were several inaugural blunders but overall it was a successful event.

I felt the swim course was poorly designed with swimmers almost colliding with on-coming traffic at the first turn and poor visibility throughout. The water was bitterly cold but I was okay until my wetsuit came off. I sat in the warming tent for a good half an hour but was able to continue; sadly some others in the tent were not so fortunate. I had ridden the course earlier in the summer so there were no surprises there although coming back in to town on the second loop I was pushing downhill into the wind at 9.2 mph. Ow. I had a great run and actually beat my Boulder 70.3 run time. I carried my own water but still felt had to meter consumption with so few chances to refill. Another big fail was the one single port-a-potty in transition, one on the bike and one on the run resulting in lots of bushes getting watered.

There were no timing mats at the outstretches of the bike or run course and I saw some people cutting the course. Whatever.

I know a few people downgraded to the Quarter after realizing the Half was too much; it's nice the race directors allowed them to do that rather than DNFing.

The sheriffs were terrific and it was great to ride on a closed bike course. The spectator support was fantastic and the scenery unmatched. Congratulations to all who participated!

The complete closure on Montezuma was needed and appreciated, but I actually felt bad for the motorists jammed up on Hwy 6. I think we could have gotten by with less space, especially on the second loop of the half when everyone was so spread out.

Boulder this year was a tragic reminder of the risks of not having enough space and I also know they plan to grow this event in the years to come, but I heard enough grumbles from locals about the road closures that I'm sure it's a very touchy subject.

Really hoping this event happens again.

Jeff and team at HMM put together an incredibly well run event for a first time go. I thought the swim, bike and run course were all excellent. As above there could have been another aid station or two on the run, but I felt the bike was fine. I jumped in and swam around for a bit before the swim and was glad I did even as one who tends to get cold quickly. If anything it was great to just get rid over the initial face/brain freeze while not in the starting frenzy.

Weather was perfect so no need for gloves or warm clothes on the bike (although I definitely had them ready in transition). Wind only kicked up right as I was headed back into town, but that could certainly have made it much slower if sustained throughout. Climb/descent to Montezuma was great with only one turn requiring braking and otherwise clear sailing. Really appreciated the fully closed lanes.

Run kicked my ass. Training has been poor lately and there is no faking through a half at 9,000+ft. Nice variety to the run with the area around transition, Dam Road bike path and then the "hilly" forested section. Aid station volunteers were top notch, just wish there were more!

Overall big thumbs up. I'll be back if it happens again.

Interesting how much this varies from person to person. I was prepared to be freezing coming into T1, had arm warmers, gloves, long sleeve jersey and other warm gear in a bag ready to run into the warming tent with. Instead, I came out of the water, put on my singlet and was on my way with no issues or other stops, actually was pretty hot on Montezuma and on the 2nd lap. Only real difference between a normal tri was I didn't wear my top under my wetsuit and I put on socks and bike shoes instead of normal sockless tri shoes. Big contrast to Tahoe in '13 where I was freezing on the first half of the bike.

I guess this is the one area where it helps that I'm fat now compared to when I used to actually race

I didn't see anyone cut myself but it looked like it'd be really easy to. They could have gotten by just fine with 2 timing mats but they should have been at the top of Montezuma and the run turnaround instead. Granted I'm not at the pointy end, but in a race like this you'd really only be cheating yourself so as you said, whatever.

Also re: the bathroom thing, I saw a few athletes who clearly had to 'improvise' given the infrequency. The aid station and bathroom thing certainly left something to be desired relative to an WTC-branded event, but I'm pretty sure my entry fee was a whole lot less than a WTC event as well so I take the good with the bad. Obviously room for improvement there though.

Wow, just saw on the front page article (here) that Laura Bennett swam an 18:33 which was ten minutes faster than the 2nd fastest time male or female. That's pretty incredible!

I'm not sure how that's possible... that's under 1:00/100m isn't it? Which in any conditions is pretty amazing. In that cold water and at 9000ft.... and the course wasn't short

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Are you ready to do an Ultraman? | How I calculate Ironman race fueling | Strength Training for Athletes |

I'm sure I didn't swim the tightest lap but I got slightly over 1.3 mi on the swim on my garmin, it definitely wasn't short.

Beating the men's overall winner by 10 minutes in the swim seems pretty unbelievable but I'm just some scrub on the internet so want to be careful of what I say or infer.

She is an amazing swimmer, but for context she swam almost 26 minutes in New Orleans 70.3. Tim Hola is also a very good swimmer - he swam 25 min in Boulder 70.3 and at 106west he swam 30 min.

18:27 is too slow for one lap (for her) but in my opinion VERY fast for two laps in those conditions. I think the most likely outcome is that the timing company got it wrong. The pro women started quite a bit before the F40-44, so perhaps they took her swim end time as if she had started in the 40-44 wave, when in actual fact she started in the pro female wave (there were about 4 of them?) which was at least 10 minutes before the 40-44 would have started (I'm not sure the exact gap, but I'm sure it was about that)

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Are you ready to do an Ultraman? | How I calculate Ironman race fueling | Strength Training for Athletes |

Agreed. Her 18:27 minute swim time, per the posted results, for a 1,900 Meter swim is simply not possible. I participated in the race and it was a two lap swim. My time was 3 minutes slower than my usual half IM swim time. It appears she only did one lap of the swim. Oops!

I think you are right. I finished 60 seconds ahead of Laura, but started one wave (~7 min) behind her, yet she is listed in the results as beating me by about 4 minutes. Looks like her chip has her as starting in 2nd AG Wave (40+).

I think she did both laps, but the timing company made her start time as if she started in the 40-44 wave, when she actually started in the pro wave. It looked like were 4 or 5 pro women in the pro wave, but the results page only lists one pro woman. And I'm pretty sure she would've started in the pro wave. Which means her actual time should be closer to 30 minutes... overall she'd still be the first female so not a material difference in the outcome

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Are you ready to do an Ultraman? | How I calculate Ironman race fueling | Strength Training for Athletes |

yeah, you and 2 other guys were actually not chicked after all!

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Are you ready to do an Ultraman? | How I calculate Ironman race fueling | Strength Training for Athletes |

I spoke to Laura after the event - there was some confusion about which wave she should start in. In Results this afternoon they re-adjusted her swim time to 28:xx so she's still the OA winner. No biggie, and certainly no malice was intended.

Just a quick plug - this race was SO cool. It's the closest thing we have to an "Extreme" race for the 70.3 people out there. I'll be back and so will most people I know who raced it - although next time with a slightly thicker wetsuit. That water was cold.

My hat is off to the race organizers - they really poured their hearts and souls into this event. And it showed.

Does anyone have any insight on this event? Their website still says "2017 pre-registration" is going on while their Facebook page was updated over a month ago to say they are trying to secure a new bike course.

So much for that race. They announced the event was cancelled and refunded pre-registration fees.

Did they email that out? That blows. Was really looking forward to it.

No. I e-mailed the director last week asking what the status was. He responded to my e-mail saying that the race was cancelled and directed me to their Facebook page where the announcement was made last Friday:

"Hi Everyone! For those who have pre-registered, you should have been refunded today. The reason being, we do not have enough answers to launch registration May 1st and we don't want to string anyone along. There's a chance that we figure out courses and are able to host this event again, but we do not want anyone making plans around us right now. We're super bummed, as you know it took a decade to get this permit in the first place, so a lot of hard work went in to creating this great athletic challenge. We know we will be back and thanks for all the love!"

ah. thanks. soooooooo.... what's everyone doing instead?

Looks like it's officially canceled now, too bad I really enjoyed that race.

https://www.facebook.com/...s/10154925073821077/