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Re: Challenge Daytona Race Day Banter [MTL] [ In reply to ]
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MTL wrote:
jondavid wrote:
Anybody got a link to the full results? Sportstats' tracker does not seem to be working with me. Thanks


http://www.sportstats.ca or

https://track.rtrt.me/...o-route_1/FINISH-PTO

Looking at the results, am I wrong in saying that Lionel had an unusually bad swim even for him? 1:19/100m average....I thought he does faster than that in training? Maybe not....
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Re: Challenge Daytona Race Day Banter [TheStroBro] [ In reply to ]
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Yup

Commentators - people have their own opinions and there is not much they can do.

Belinda Granger, and Kevin MacKinnon have done a great deal of triathlon coverage to the best of my knowledge. I'm not sure how much Rick Allan (Voice of Nascar), the Main Host and Rowdy Gains (NBC Expert Swim Commentator) had seen or done in Triathlon (perhaps none!), and Alicia Kaye - I've never seen her do anything like this. But she was a VERY good triathlete herself!

All in all - I would say it was very good. Good Rhythm and give and take. My understanding is a lot of this all came together in the last few days with no one other than perhaps Rick Allan, knowing exactly what roll they were going to play.

There was a few technical glitches on Throws back and forth from MacKinnon and Kaye on the motor bikes on the course - but I thought that having them on the motor bikes, with head-cams for pete's sake, was brilliant!

I agree with you on the graphics and the data - we knew at almost all times, EXACTLY what was going on with the top-20 - and really, with all due respect, that\s all you really need to care about.

This did rival what I've seen for Super League Coverage - but also did things that Super League has not even done. Overall - it's obly at the Olympic Games that you are going to get this level of coverage!

I agree with you about the on-bike cameras. They have become somewhat standard now in the World Tour. And those Velon segments after a Stage Finishes at the Tour de France are often some of the coolest video available. You feel like you are right in the peloton. I think they could have done more with those.

Onward!


Steve Fleck @stevefleck | Blog
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Re: Challenge Daytona Race Day Banter [TheStroBro] [ In reply to ]
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TheStroBro wrote:

Now that both races are over. Looking at this from a broadcast product perspective, I know some things, but not everything as I work in a ball sport.

Commentators will always either turn people on or turn people off. The thing with commentary is you need to be able to present a cohesive dialogue to the novice who just discovers through flipping on the Peacock app, keep them engaged, but then also not dumb it down so much for the hard core. Early on the Professional Broadcasters kept it dumbed down and same with the Color/Expert commentators. It was kind of annoying. For the three pros, this was probably the first triathlon race they've ever covered. The main guy who does NASCAR. For me I didn't think the "Experts" knew enough about the field to provide adequate color commentary, especially for the women's race. The Professional Play by Play guys actually did a lot of research as they were able to tell stories but that's not where they fit in the broadcast, that was for the Color/Athlete commentators to do.

I will say, the women's race really didn't lend to the pros being able to present their best, but the cool thing for them is they had a second race almost immediately. They showed their stuff after being waterboarded with a morning triathlon session. I thought the commentary for the men's race was really really good. I think what helped the professional sports broadcasters was that there was actually a RACE going on. Man that was really exciting.

From a camera perspective, I don't think much extra was brought to the table here. So I only remember one cut to the onboard camera and that was 30 seconds from Rachel McBride, was that the only bike wired up in the women's race? Distinctly don't remember any cuts during the men's race, that needed to be employed a lot more.

The best thing about this race was the graphical presentation, it reminded me of watching a NASCAR race. The live splits really changed how the product feels. And I know graphics are expensive, but relying on the NASCAR team to produce this turned out a visual experience that was pretty excellent overall. In the end for a director, there isn't much difference between a stock car race around an oval vs a triathlon around an oval. The graphical presentation for me is the standard bearer, this is what needs to happen going forward whomever the event promoter is.

The difference for the next race is you don't get such an experienced production team on an open course 70.3 or 140.6 distance.

I'm really happy for Paula Findlay, great to see her healthy and put it all together. The Men's race was just an amazing show, and I honestly think it's extremely important for this race to have been won by a young guy, then add all of the other young guns that showed out. Halvard is probably pleased, and to the vegan who told Gustav's last ride didn't look like a taper on Strava? Time to eat some crow!

Also, only one ITU guy beat Lionel. And that run by Matt Hanson to take second!


good stuff.and much more productive stuff than silly negative one liner.

i agree the worst decision was to have a pool swimmer in the commentating team. belinda was good .
i thought the filming and commentating from the motorbike was good and could be even better if the commentators are guided a bit better in terms of camera work. when they had the athlete in the middle of the frame it was good. i guess that was definitely something new cameraman and commentator in one.

sine they had a load of nascar camera people involved i guess they will make a good improvement the next time as they will have a better idea about tri the next time.
i have to say for the male run the camera work was really good they moved well between leader and other important groups that was fab.
bit of a pitty the stream blacke out just after luis crossed the line but otherwise transmition was really good .
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Re: Challenge Daytona Race Day Banter [pk] [ In reply to ]
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Way to go Matt Hanson!!!!!

http://www.slfmotion.com
Instagram - @SLFMotion
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Re: Challenge Daytona Race Day Banter [stevej] [ In reply to ]
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stevej wrote:
There's a video on insta of Luis in the penalty tent. I can't make out what he says but he wasn't happy. Also seemed to be pretty upset when he crossed the finish line

Well, he shouldn’t be too mad. He was clearly drafting, he still earned a nice paycheck, and he gets to go commiserate with Taylor Spivey.

Aaron Bales
Lansing Triathlon Team
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Re: Challenge Daytona Race Day Banter [Canuck1] [ In reply to ]
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I was wondering the same thing, he looked almost ill, kind of pale coming out of T2 and it looked as it seemed to me as if he was touching his chest/lungs just before he began to dismantle. Same with Gomez, although Gomez went on to have a decent run and almost got in the top 10.

AB's tactics are not the greatest. He didn't really have to be at the front pushing the pace all the time. He could have let the LC's bikers hammer the front and stay within his limits like Iden did. Iden didn't really have a good swim for an ITU guy.

Schoeman was very impressive for a 130 lb guy on that course. Also considering he led the whole swim himself at a ridiculous pace.

Bummer about Luis, but yeah, he was really pushing the rules, specially at the beginning of the ride. Not sure about JB.
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Re: Challenge Daytona Race Day Banter [Fleck] [ In reply to ]
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That was an amazing race.

-Great video coverage.
-Need more engaging commentators. I nominate Tyler Butterfield - there’d be no silent pauses!
-Should Luis been DQ’d for being within 20m for over 2min? That was just ridiculous. no excuse. that said, he’s got the goods to do it all and his drafting didn’t help him.
-this was a balanced event and it’s right up the Norwegians’ alley.
-Hanson was spectacular.
-Appleton, Rudy and Sam really raced tough. (go 51 Speedshop athletes!)
-Sanders is a beast
-Findlay put on a clinic.
-PTO is on the map. most exciting and dramatic race I can think of.

wovebike.com | Wove on instagram
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Re: Challenge Daytona Race Day Banter [milesthedog] [ In reply to ]
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milesthedog wrote:
That was an amazing race.

-Great video coverage.
-Need more engaging commentators. I nominate Tyler Butterfield - there’d be no silent pauses!
-Should Luis been DQ’d for being within 20m for over 2min? That was just ridiculous. no excuse. that said, he’s got the goods to do it all and his drafting didn’t help him.
-this was a balanced event and it’s right up the Norwegians’ alley.
-Hanson was spectacular.
-Appleton, Rudy and Sam really raced tough. (go 51 Speedshop athletes!)
-Sanders is a beast
-Findlay put on a clinic.
-PTO is on the map. most exciting and dramatic race I can think of.

I agree, was sensational! Very very impressive. I kind of feel bad for selecting the $0 donation option now, would have been worth paying for...but not the minimum they had offered, that was silly.
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Re: Challenge Daytona Race Day Banter [dunno] [ In reply to ]
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dunno wrote:
milesthedog wrote:
That was an amazing race.

-Great video coverage.
-Need more engaging commentators. I nominate Tyler Butterfield - there’d be no silent pauses!
-Should Luis been DQ’d for being within 20m for over 2min? That was just ridiculous. no excuse. that said, he’s got the goods to do it all and his drafting didn’t help him.
-this was a balanced event and it’s right up the Norwegians’ alley.
-Hanson was spectacular.
-Appleton, Rudy and Sam really raced tough. (go 51 Speedshop athletes!)
-Sanders is a beast
-Findlay put on a clinic.
-PTO is on the map. most exciting and dramatic race I can think of.

I agree, was sensational! Very very impressive. I kind of feel bad for selecting the $0 donation option now, would have been worth paying for...but not the minimum they had offered, that was silly.

Want to see them get major advertisers, and make accessing the coverage easier and not feel like there are barriers to spectating.

wovebike.com | Wove on instagram
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Re: Challenge Daytona Race Day Banter [Fleck] [ In reply to ]
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Fleck wrote:
Also seemed to be pretty upset when he crossed the finish line


Hypothetical - no 2 min. penalty and he finishes in 2nd place only 10sec down Iden!


that is nonsense
he should really have gotten 2 penalites . i mean that was so so obvious ,same as johnny. both can not argue with those calls. but they would have lost more time on the bike had the ridden fair , a 600 m penalty lop would be better rather than being allowed to stand.

obviously he showed his potential for the longer stuff and i guess we will see him again and he certainly did add a lot to the race by being on the startline.
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Re: Challenge Daytona Race Day Banter [SBRcanuck] [ In reply to ]
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SBRcanuck wrote:

Ugghh...why can't LS get faster in the swim! :(

He flat out said post race that he ignored the swim in his training leading up to the race.

blog
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Re: Challenge Daytona Race Day Banter [pk] [ In reply to ]
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absolutely. from the second he left T1, it seemed as though VL was pushing the limits of the draft zone.

nonetheless, I was impressed at how well he rode in the bars for 50 miles.

Toro Performance
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Re: Challenge Daytona Race Day Banter [Fleck] [ In reply to ]
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I disagree, in my view, the coverage and commentators were quite mediocre. Just because someone has done it for a few years, it does not mean they are any good. Compare one of the guy's doing the TDF for flobikes(not Gerrans, but the clueless one) this year vs Ligget and Sherwen, for example. It just did not flow for me. For coverage they could have done some sort of camera splitting to see a bit more other than one camera. There was zero coverage other than the front of the race. It would have been good to see Long and Sanders chasing other than a five second clip of Long slingshotting off Sanders.

You also said this was only planned a few days ago? "by failing to prepare you are preparing to fail" and it was evident to many customers.

The men running splits started to drop, not go as deep at about halfway to the run. There wasn't much coverage of Iden, although I would agree that the fight for second was more interesting, they could have split the screen to show both.

And, I saved the best for last, the signal got dropped for some us. I know you could come up with a million excuses about this but reality is someone should get fired. This is just bad business. As someone had said somewhere, just when we thought it could not get worse than IM, we got this.
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Re: Challenge Daytona Race Day Banter [pk] [ In reply to ]
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pk wrote:
a 600 m penalty lop would be better rather than being allowed to stand.
.

Johnny Brownlee played that penalty well and Luis should have done the same. Go put a bit harder than you’d like for 11 miles, rest two minutes at the half way point and hammer it home. Better than right after the bike unless you were just hammered coming off the bike
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Re: Challenge Daytona Race Day Banter [Engner66] [ In reply to ]
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Engner66 wrote:
I disagree, in my view, the coverage and commentators were quite mediocre. Just because someone has done it for a few years, it does not mean they are any good. Compare one of the guy's doing the TDF for flobikes(not Gerrans, but the clueless one) this year vs Ligget and Sherwen, for example. It just did not flow for me. For coverage they could have done some sort of camera splitting to see a bit more other than one camera. There was zero coverage other than the front of the race. It would have been good to see Long and Sanders chasing other than a five second clip of Long slingshotting off Sanders.

You also said this was only planned a few days ago? "by failing to prepare you are preparing to fail" and it was evident to many customers.

The men running splits started to drop, not go as deep at about halfway to the run. There wasn't much coverage of Iden, although I would agree that the fight for second was more interesting, they could have split the screen to show both.

And, I saved the best for last, the signal got dropped for some us. I know you could come up with a million excuses about this but reality is someone should get fired. This is just bad business. As someone had said somewhere, just when we thought it could not get worse than IM, we got this.

Look out, we have a Karen...maybe you should demand to speak to the manager?
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Re: Challenge Daytona Race Day Banter [Engner66] [ In reply to ]
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Engner66 wrote:
I disagree, in my view, the coverage and commentators were quite mediocre. Just because someone has done it for a few years, it does not mean they are any good. Compare one of the guy's doing the TDF for flobikes(not Gerrans, but the clueless one) this year vs Ligget and Sherwen, for example. It just did not flow for me. For coverage they could have done some sort of camera splitting to see a bit more other than one camera. There was zero coverage other than the front of the race. It would have been good to see Long and Sanders chasing other than a five second clip of Long slingshotting off Sanders.

You also said this was only planned a few days ago? "by failing to prepare you are preparing to fail" and it was evident to many customers.

The men running splits started to drop, not go as deep at about halfway to the run. There wasn't much coverage of Iden, although I would agree that the fight for second was more interesting, they could have split the screen to show both.

And, I saved the best for last, the signal got dropped for some us. I know you could come up with a million excuses about this but reality is someone should get fired. This is just bad business. As someone had said somewhere, just when we thought it could not get worse than IM, we got this.

How much did you pay for the coverage??

blog
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Re: Challenge Daytona Race Day Banter [stevej] [ In reply to ]
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I didn’t lose coverage and I didn’t pay. Used PTO app on my iPad. Great races, great coverage. Would have loved to have had Greg Bennett do the commentary. His podcasts are money.

Let food be thy medicine...
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Re: Challenge Daytona Race Day Banter [dunno] [ In reply to ]
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dunno wrote:
Engner66 wrote:
I disagree, in my view, the coverage and commentators were quite mediocre. Just because someone has done it for a few years, it does not mean they are any good. Compare one of the guy's doing the TDF for flobikes(not Gerrans, but the clueless one) this year vs Ligget and Sherwen, for example. It just did not flow for me. For coverage they could have done some sort of camera splitting to see a bit more other than one camera. There was zero coverage other than the front of the race. It would have been good to see Long and Sanders chasing other than a five second clip of Long slingshotting off Sanders.

You also said this was only planned a few days ago? "by failing to prepare you are preparing to fail" and it was evident to many customers.

The men running splits started to drop, not go as deep at about halfway to the run. There wasn't much coverage of Iden, although I would agree that the fight for second was more interesting, they could have split the screen to show both.

And, I saved the best for last, the signal got dropped for some us. I know you could come up with a million excuses about this but reality is someone should get fired. This is just bad business. As someone had said somewhere, just when we thought it could not get worse than IM, we got this.

Look out, we have a Karen...maybe you should demand to speak to the manager?

:insert:lolz:/insert:

80/20 Endurance Ambassador
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Re: Challenge Daytona Race Day Banter [damon.lebeouf] [ In reply to ]
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Is everyone forgetting about the huge choice of camera F up at the most crucial part of the race?

Camera focuses on Sam Long for reasons only known to the producer as Ali Brownlee drops back injured (we only know this as we catch a glimpse of him stretching on the side line as Sam Long in about 6th place cruises by) unforgivable!
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Re: Challenge Daytona Race Day Banter [JackStraw13] [ In reply to ]
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JackStraw13 wrote:
I didn’t lose coverage and I didn’t pay. Used PTO app on my iPad. Great races, great coverage. Would have loved to have had Greg Bennett do the commentary. His podcasts are money.

Same...

Overall I was quite happy but I didn’t find the commentators spectacularly knowledgeable, but they werent that bad. I would’ve rather seen Barry Shepley in one of the spots.

Dan Mayberry
Amateur a lot of things, professional a few things.
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Re: Challenge Daytona Race Day Banter [drm437] [ In reply to ]
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Folks, that's about as good as it gets.

When we're complaining about the quality of the commentators like we're complaining about the B squad of NFL coverage, the PTO's done something right.

Solid B+ in my book today, only detractions being that you could have had *slightly* better commentators and the f*ck up on the website. Put Kona coverage to shame, which is what I think they were going for.

----------------------------------
Editor-in-Chief, Slowtwitch.com | Twitter
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Re: Challenge Daytona Race Day Banter [rrheisler] [ In reply to ]
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Agreed, this was great compared to most tri coverage. I would rank it slightly above Super League coverage as well. I thought the commentators were fine. I doubt they’re trying to cater to the ST crowd.

What is this feed drop out everyone’s complaining about? Someone trip over a power cord that knocked out coverage to a portion of the audience?
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Re: Challenge Daytona Race Day Banter [JackStraw13] [ In reply to ]
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JackStraw13 wrote:
I didn’t lose coverage and I didn’t pay. Used PTO app on my iPad. Great races, great coverage. Would have loved to have had Greg Bennett do the commentary. His podcasts are money.

I watched on my smart TV for free. Didn't loose coverage, and just streamed off the internet, with no app.

I love most of it, but hated the single file bike racing, on a track that wide. It did get old quick. I would love to see them use all that room, and paint several bike lanes, that operate independently of each other. Enforce drafting/passing rules within each lane, but let several lanes race side by side. That would also make the race track races more interesting, exciting, and unique.

Athlinks / Strava
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Re: Challenge Daytona Race Day Banter [rrheisler] [ In reply to ]
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rrheisler wrote:
Folks, that's about as good as it gets.

When we're complaining about the quality of the commentators like we're complaining about the B squad of NFL coverage, the PTO's done something right.

Solid B+ in my book today, only detractions being that you could have had *slightly* better commentators and the f*ck up on the website. Put Kona coverage to shame, which is what I think they were going for.

amen.

80/20 Endurance Ambassador
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Re: Challenge Daytona Race Day Banter [IanH] [ In reply to ]
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Right before the finish of the men's race the feed dropped out for many of us, and we couldn't log back in. It was probably down for 10-15min.; long enough to miss all the top men's finishers/interviews, but was fixed in time for the awards. Luckily the whole thing is up on YT: https://www.youtube.com/...b_channel=AndrasBeck.

ECMGN Therapy Silicon Valley:
Depression, Neurocognitive problems, Dementias (Testing and Evaluation), Trauma and PTSD, Traumatic Brain Injury (TBI)
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