I'd be pretty pissed too if some tri douche showed up on a TT bike and broke off the front...

Just because a ride's not "no drop" doesn't mean that it's acceptable etiquette to blow the ride up right out of the gate.

Everyone keeps telling you to find a different ride, yet you insist on showing up to a ride with people who you've already have confrontations with, that you happen to leave out of the OP, what is wrong with you?

Take a look in the mirror

This is the best advice so far. The more I read, the more I'm persuaded that the OP shares much if not most of the blame for whatever this problem is.

It's called social awareness. If conforming to the ride norms doesn't work for you, ride alone or find a group that better fits your style.

It’s these type of threads that make me happy i ride solo. Avoid the drama. I do realize not all group rides have drama but I hear a lot of bitching about issues in group rides.

Most group rides don't have drama, but even when there is some, the upside often far outweighs it. What each group ride has is its own character which can be dependent on the route, the number of riders, their experience, whether it's organized or sponsored by a club or shop, formal or informal rules/etiquette, whether its primarily for recreation or race training, etc.. Add the fact that every rider brings his or her personality, and you have dynamics that change over time and often from week to week. Not every rider works for every person, but the variability is one of the things that makes them fun. But I also get that many still prefer to ride solo -- absolutely nothing wrong with that (unless your goal is to get fast).

this is what i don't understand ... who cares if someone rides off the front? i ride with a pretty strong group, and if some jerk decides to ride off the front, we let him. sure we could chase him down if we wanted to, but we don't. it doesn't effect anyone else in the slightest

for me, it's mostly that I have specific bike workout I'm executing which obviously doesn't fit well with a group ride. But also I tend to be solo with many things anyway

First off, you don’t really know what you’re talking about. We do a 3 mile warm up. After that everyone knows we’re racing Wednesday Night Worlds. Some of these folks aren’t putting in the time or effort in terms of fitness. Generally one of myself or two other riders sets the tempo. One of the guys rides cross and likes surging. He generally breaks the group apart. Last week, another strong rider hauled ass pretty early. I grabbed his wheel and that’s when the ride began. It’s not like I’m consistently taking the top off to be an asshole like you’re saying. It’s supposed to be a competitive group ride, but several seem to have lost any kind of competitive edge and are lashing out at other riders that still push the group.

My friend that took the lead this week was getting railed on in a back channel discussion by a female rider. There’s just too much behind the back bitching for my liking. I can’t change it unless I disassociate from the group.

Who cares if someone rides off the front and why are they a jerk? This is Wednesday Night Worlds. In other words, roadie rules don’t apply.

Any other group ride I ride differently with the group. I’m not sure some folks on here know what a Worlds ride is about, yet they’re shooting their mouths off.

The group (which includes you) don't agree on what this ride should be. The mature thing is to hang out after, have a frank discussion with everyone and sort it out. It sounds like you are on the verge of quitting it anyway. What's the harm?

...or just walk away now if its not worth it. I've never been on a group ride with the slightest hint of what you are describing. If it is as bad as it reads, I'm surprised the ride didn't break up long ago.

How big is the group usually? To have an “WNW” and yet only 2-3 are strong and the rest of group avg *only* 18?

It still sounds like to me you and your fast buddies are breaking away from an group that is otherwise using it much more of a group ride and not an “anything goes” that a WNW truly represents. Maybe the fast guys that once dusted everyone now are fat and slow and cranky. Whatever the reason it just doesn’t sound like a ride that is that fast and thus breaking away is kinda “eye rolling” to everyone else.

So not faulting you just saying from what your describing it’s really not much of an WNW group that you can have fun with. As I said I’m shocked they don’t just let you and others go as it’s what a 3mph difference in pace from what you’ve described in this thread. It’s no where close to an WNW pace group.

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

It sounds like your are assuming the ride is a training race of some sort and are using tactics to break the group up, which is fine in the context of a race. But others seem to feel it is a group ride, which is generally about keeping the group together, no matter if it is a drop or no drop ride. Mostly a "drop" ride means not waiting around for those straggling off the back, it doesn't mean going to the front and jacking up the pace like a cave man.

You need to determine if this is a training race or a group ride. From people's reactions, it sounds like you may be riding like a bit of a wanker. This ride, for you, won't be a hard training day, so plan accordingly or just go ride alone and keep working on your fitness.

As someone who has organized a lot of group rides, there is nothing more exasperating that some goofball riding 10 feet off the front of the group looking back they they are in some sort of race.

TT bikes are dangerous in a group and give a competitive advantage in a breakaway. Either reason makes someone a jerk for showing up on one to a competitive road ride.

If this is your reason for hammering the ride... maybe you are taking things too literally.
Strava segment names don't necessarily imply (for instance) that anytime your group ride hits that road it's automatically a full-throttle, take no prisoners race.

Next time your group ride is going to go there, ask the group (or just its leader) what the general plan is. If the group plan does not fit your wants or needs, then go off with a subgroup that does have the same intent as you do.

There's a little climbing segment in our town called "Heart Explosion". Every time I've been there, there is NOT a pile of red goo at the top.

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Less is more.

We live next to a military base so people come and go frequently. The group had some stud riders a few years back, but now not so much. Btw, I’m not the guy that does all the surging. I show up to ride hard for Worlds and kind of expect others to do the same. This was the dynamic when I joined. I flatted a few weeks back 0.10 mile into the ride. They did not stop and I had no issue as I know what the ride is about. They simply asked if I was good and I told them to go on while I changed my flat alone.

When I had my first child 17 years ago I wanted to continue exercising and competing but also needed to cut out all of the extraneous stuff. Group rides were one of the first things to go because they generally don't contribute as much to your fitness given the time that they consume. Sometimes I do one as a treat and now that my daughter is old enough she is able to come along with me, which is special.

But if you want to improve at the sport the best way is to do intervals alone or ride with a small group of two or three people or of course just go out and race bikes. I find a lot of group rides are just hard enough to leave you tired but not hard enough to help you improve so you have to kind of take it easy the next day and in so doing you are moving backwards rather than forwards if that makes sense.

18mph worlds better be about three Cat 3 or better climbs strung together. Or that ain’t worlds.

Ours locally are all 23+ including the roll out and roll in.

Even at 100ft per mile I’ve done training rides at darn near 20.

Sounds to me like a confusion about the name. Lots of people joke about the weeknight ride being “worlds”. Not all are.

Again, 18 for “worlds” is really slow unless you’re looping a mountain pass.

agree 100%. also find new group if you don't like how the rest of the group is riding. it sounds like your the issue. the mass group dictates pace...not one rider who has his own agenda.

I like how our club does WNR. It's "no drop" for approximately the first half. Depending on forecast winds, a projected outbound pace will be mentioned in the email, typically 20-22 mph. If that's just a bit much for somebody, the ride leader will back the pace off a touch to keep the group together. (If you're really slow, the ride leader will drop back with you, say "thanks for trying, but maybe you're not quite ready for this group. Do you know how to find your way back?") One optional intermediate sprint will be set on the outbound route, so the greyhounds can stretch their legs if they want. At a pre-announced location roughly half way, it's "game on." It's not a instant hammerfest, though. The fast guys get to the front and start creeping the pace up. Nobody rides off the front, but people start falling off the back. And so it goes until the last two standing sprint it out for the town line. At least that's what I've been told/seen on Strava, as I'm off the back well before that! Most times I solo TT it home, but sometimes two or more of us stragglers will form a "groupetto of shame" and softishly pedal our broken asses to the finish together. Fast guys are handing out beer from a cooler to the stragglers as they come in.

OP, Sounds like you need to sit down with the group and try to hammer out some mutually agreeable parameters for the ride. And maybe that's the group staying together at ~18mph to some agreed upon landmark before it becomes "every man for himself." Whatever this ride used to be, it sounds like the majority of folks don't want to (and probably can't) hit it as hard as you want to.

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"They're made of latex, not nitroglycerin"

I think OP must be trolling. Strong rider? Breakway? Race? 18mph? Do you live in the mountains or something?

You are talking a mid-B group. By definition, the goal of such group is to keep everyone together (drop or no-drop) and racing is usually not the goal. If you want a hard ride where attacks are expected and encouraged, find an A-group. This whole conversation feels like complaining about complaining about the aerodynamic property of a share-ride bike... oh... am I at slowtwitch? I'll show myself out...

That’s my point. There’s a group of guys that are riding every WNW race group at 18-19 average, which should be B group. One is a total dick of a former racer that drinks a lot and has lost all fitness and motivation and thinks it’s his job to push people around. He’s got a group of buddies (followers) that are also similar to him. The rest of the group is a mixed bag. There are some very strong riders and some improving riders. There’s a few other riders that will go 22-24mph. The group is really split in terms of ability and it’s not growing. I know some of the politics I’m speaking of has driven some away. A fellow triathlete won’t come back due to conflict with the same guy I’m having an issue with.

These guys riding 18-19mph need to drop to A or B group and check their egos.

I wholeheartedly agree with everything you say. I’m glad someone actually gets it.

I recommend you stick to Zwift.