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Re: Brownlee for Ironman Western Australia [lacticturkey] [ In reply to ]
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lacticturkey wrote:
Wait what?? Brownlee doing IM at start of olympic build, Wurf doing olympic distance at start of kona build..... Its a mad house!

1 - AB : When Wiggins was preparing for Rio 2016 Team Pursuit (a 4mn event, x3), he was doing multi-stages tour, before going more specific in the last months. It is sometimes called "build aerobic capacity". Prepare/do IM 9 months before, why not ?
He can get Kona qualify, while working aerobic capacity... not a specialist, but until april, sound not stupid to me to do an IM to prepare the Olympics. After April... not sure.

2- Wurf : he need to improve his swim and run speed. Participate to some World Cup is a good incentive / motivation to make some more speed focus work. As long as he do not get injured...
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Re: Brownlee for Ironman Western Australia [Pyrenean Wolf] [ In reply to ]
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And for wiggens there was only one or 2 weeks between tour yellow and olympic tt gold

Recovery and specificity? That's for amateurs!
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Re: Brownlee for Ironman Western Australia [lacticturkey] [ In reply to ]
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After Cancellara crash and Martin injury, he was quite lucky, but still a nice achievement (hope you are not British :-)
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Re: Brownlee for Ironman Western Australia [lacticturkey] [ In reply to ]
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lacticturkey wrote:
And for wiggens there was only one or 2 weeks between tour yellow and olympic tt gold

Recovery and specificity? That's for amateurs!

Recovery and specificity of Brit cycling/sky riders, aren't we seeing the how, what, why playing out in court right now?
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Re: Brownlee for Ironman Western Australia [Jorgan] [ In reply to ]
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Jorgan wrote:
He found the heat a little too much on a UK forum too; that's why he's here.

There’s a UK tri forum? Really?

Rhymenocerus wrote:
I think everyone should consult ST before they do anything.
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Re: Brownlee for Ironman Western Australia [PJC] [ In reply to ]
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How would you advise, coach AB to win kona. With your experience taking someone from similar ITU to Kona winner in a short time.

Is it execution for him, change in training or both
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Re: Brownlee for Ironman Western Australia [stevie g] [ In reply to ]
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stevie g wrote:
How would you advise, coach AB to win kona. With your experience taking someone from similar ITU to Kona winner in a short time.

Is it execution for him, change in training or both

He can’t do two things at once.

Javier is trying the same thing.

Look at the latest blog post by wurf. Olympic distance triathlon is a completely different sport to Ironman.

They need to pick one or the other. Not both.

Rhymenocerus wrote:
I think everyone should consult ST before they do anything.
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Re: Brownlee for Ironman Western Australia [lacticturkey] [ In reply to ]
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lacticturkey wrote:
Wait what?? Brownlee doing IM at start of olympic build, Wurf doing olympic distance at start of kona build..... Its a mad house!



IM as base for Olympic = build base to then build threshold upon that base
Olympic as pre for IM = build FTP and then do IM as a high percentage of high FTP in all sports.

Note AB will do exactly that sequence. Its what Mark Allen did in the lead up to Kona 1989. AB may just have enough time after Tokyo for it to work. I'll be cheering for him at both events. I think he could have been going neck and neck with Frodo if he had not panicked out of T1 at the presence of Lange and lit up the first 20km of the Kona bike like a maniac. Frodo just stayed calm and eventually ended up where AB was. That's all AB needed to do....stay calm, not burn matches and save it for the run. He can't race an 8 hrs race like a 1:45 hrs race. A 1:45 hrs race you can burn through all the glycogen from last nite's pasta and still have fuel left in the tank taking no nutrition all day. For an 8 hrs race, he only has 2 hrs that comes from last nite's pasta and he needs to use that mainly in the last half of the run. The rest has to come from fat burning and taking in a good amount of fuel (ex: Ben Hoffman's 400 cals per hour).
Last edited by: devashish_paul: Nov 15, 19 18:18
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Re: Brownlee for Ironman Western Australia [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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It has been a long time since anyone managed to be great at IM and ITU in the same season. Theory sounds fine but looking at the Wurf experiment:

went to lower tier ITU race could not influence the result.

Top tier ITU Iden was able to win the 70.3 worlds

Brownlee and Gomez did ok but did not dominate IM the way many people though they would, but are still very very good at IM and at the very top of 70.3

ITU has the better athletes, but either as a function of federation funding, interest, or other factors they are not focussing on IM while they are doing ITU.

Could Iden or other win IM (kona as there is no doubt he could find and IM to win) in the same year as doing ITU well.
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Re: Brownlee for Ironman Western Australia [stevie g] [ In reply to ]
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No there's too much specificity to do well in both in the same short period, especially at the IM level. It's a whole different level to compete well at Kona vs evening doing well at the majority of other IM's. There's so many around the world and so few of athletes that it creates very different dynamics that only occur when the top 30 all race together.

Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II
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Re: Brownlee for Ironman Western Australia [B_Doughtie] [ In reply to ]
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Specificity is why he'll use his Kona training to punch his 2020 ticket (a-la Skipper and Hoff) then pivot to focus exclusively on Tokyo.
After the Olympics he'll then try to get Kona-ready. It probably won't work, but hey cyclists keep trying the Giro-Tour double too against all reason.

It also gives him some option to switch his focus to Kona if something goes pear shaped during his Oly prep (he is kinda injury prone).

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Last edited by: Titanflexr: Nov 16, 19 17:29
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Re: Brownlee for Ironman Western Australia [B_Doughtie] [ In reply to ]
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B_Doughtie wrote:
No there's too much specificity to do well in both in the same short period, especially at the IM level. It's a whole different level to compete well at Kona vs evening doing well at the majority of other IM's. There's so many around the world and so few of athletes that it creates very different dynamics that only occur when the top 30 all race together.
..

The sport changed dramatically when draft legal ITU racing was introduced,until that time it wasn't such a stretch for Ironman types to do well in Olympic Distance races.
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Re: Brownlee for Ironman Western Australia [Titanflexr] [ In reply to ]
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I actually don't think he's going to "focus" on Tokyo (I mean I dont think he's going to race IM races in that period, I just think he's done actually "caring"). I think he's not focused enough for ITU anymore, as I think he easily will be chosen because no one else to fill the spots from GB. But I think he's done going "all in" on ITU and is just going to basically use it as a fair well tour and "last shot". I just dont think he's focused or actual fast enough runner these days to actually win anymore. Thus I think he's going to race it by default because no one else has beaten him out, but I think he's going to not have his usual "focus" specifics anymore.

I just think he's moved on once he got destroyed in Leeds, but can still compete well enough.

Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II
Last edited by: B_Doughtie: Nov 16, 19 17:54
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Re: Brownlee for Ironman Western Australia [B_Doughtie] [ In reply to ]
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B_Doughtie wrote:
I actually don't think he's going to "focus" on Tokyo (I mean I dont think he's going to race IM races in that period, I just think he's done actually "caring"). I think he's not focused enough for ITU anymore, as I think he easily will be chosen because no one else to fill the spots from GB. But I think he's done going "all in" on ITU and is just going to basically use it as a fair well tour and "last shot". I just dont think he's focused or actual fast enough runner these days to actually win anymore. Thus I think he's going to race it by default because no one else has beaten him out, but I think he's going to not have his usual "focus" specifics anymore.

I just think he's moved on once he got destroyed in Leeds, but can still compete well enough.


Agree 100%, BUT, I think of the guys doing world cups, european cups that will be out (JB and Yee have their spots): sorts of Bishop, Izzard, Dijkstra...at least Gomez, who is the same sort of double game will earn his own spot (unless something unusual happens)....AB is a legend, but the GB team has already sacrified the 3rd spot both in Beijing and Rio for domestiques... is not that enough.... ???
Interesting comment above...in the old days of non drafting, guys could have a chance combining ITU and IM....also given that the field was not so competitive as it is now.

Somebody mentioned Wurf saying that ITU and IM are two different sports...well, he´s not discovered the fire. Cameron is a nice character, but coming from rowing and cycling and explaining people about what is and what is not triathlon, well...no comment

Spaniard. Sorry for my english for the sensitive ones :P
Last edited by: juanillo: Nov 17, 19 8:48
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Re: Brownlee for Ironman Western Australia [Pyrenean Wolf] [ In reply to ]
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Pyrenean Wolf wrote:
longtrousers wrote:
It seems that AB does not give up Hawaii (I presume he would take his slot if he can in WA)
(Could have happened of course that he would have said after Hawaii: "no this is too hot and humid for me: not again")

70.3 WC : spanked in 2018 by Frodeno and in 2019 by a youngster, he is seeking revenge...
Kona : massively spanked by... many peoples, he is massively seeking revenge :-)

I guess his learning curve will be fast, maybe faster than Wurf progression and doing less (relatively) repetitive mistakes than LS.

A half fit AB being spanked by Frodo!
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Re: Brownlee for Ironman Western Australia [Jackets] [ In reply to ]
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Jackets wrote:
Pyrenean Wolf wrote:
longtrousers wrote:
It seems that AB does not give up Hawaii (I presume he would take his slot if he can in WA)
(Could have happened of course that he would have said after Hawaii: "no this is too hot and humid for me: not again")

70.3 WC : spanked in 2018 by Frodeno and in 2019 by a youngster, he is seeking revenge...
Kona : massively spanked by... many peoples, he is massively seeking revenge :-)

I guess his learning curve will be fast, maybe faster than Wurf progression and doing less (relatively) repetitive mistakes than LS.

A half fit AB being spanked by Frodo!

That made me laugh too, given ABs injuries last year and lack of running that 2nd place was nothing short of miraculous
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Re: Brownlee for Ironman Western Australia [r0bh] [ In reply to ]
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r0bh wrote:
Jackets wrote:
Pyrenean Wolf wrote:
longtrousers wrote:
It seems that AB does not give up Hawaii (I presume he would take his slot if he can in WA)
(Could have happened of course that he would have said after Hawaii: "no this is too hot and humid for me: not again")


70.3 WC : spanked in 2018 by Frodeno and in 2019 by a youngster, he is seeking revenge...
Kona : massively spanked by... many peoples, he is massively seeking revenge :-)

I guess his learning curve will be fast, maybe faster than Wurf progression and doing less (relatively) repetitive mistakes than LS.


A half fit AB being spanked by Frodo!


That made me laugh too, given ABs injuries last year and lack of running that 2nd place was nothing short of miraculous

hmmm.... AB hasn't had a race in about 3 years when ppl haven't said he wasn't fit, even when he has stated he was ready. Makes me wonder if we will ever see one again.
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Re: Brownlee for Ironman Western Australia [chrisb12] [ In reply to ]
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Re: Brownlee for Ironman Western Australia [lacticturkey] [ In reply to ]
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If it wasn't for Frodeno, LIONel may have won.

29 years and counting
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Re: Brownlee for Ironman Western Australia [chrisb12] [ In reply to ]
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chrisb12 wrote:
hmmm.... AB hasn't had a race in about 3 years when ppl haven't said he wasn't fit, even when he has stated he was ready. Makes me wonder if we will ever see one again.

He was fully fit for both 70.3 worlds and Kona this year
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Re: Brownlee for Ironman Western Australia [r0bh] [ In reply to ]
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Interesting video on Wurf's Instagram of him and AB running at Kona, looks like much more of a midfoot strike than his trademark tippy toes ITU running style

https://www.instagram.com/...igshid=1tix7hbdqa7en
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Re: Brownlee for Ironman Western Australia [r0bh] [ In reply to ]
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I still see elements of the signature AB stride.

Maybe he only runs full AB when he's going full gas.

r0bh wrote:
Interesting video on Wurf's Instagram of him and AB running at Kona, looks like much more of a midfoot strike than his trademark tippy toes ITU running style

https://www.instagram.com/...igshid=1tix7hbdqa7en

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Re: Brownlee for Ironman Western Australia [lacticturkey] [ In reply to ]
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lacticturkey wrote:

Who is Frodo spanking??? Lange???


"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."
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Re: Brownlee for Ironman Western Australia [RobertK] [ In reply to ]
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Starts in 30 minutes.
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Re: Brownlee for Ironman Western Australia [Sean H] [ In reply to ]
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Anyone have a link to FB where you dont have to sign up for an account??
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