There's also the reason try to eliminate the technical advantage of wealth (and limit medical disasters). That's why everybody gets the same javelin in the javelin throw and UCI limits the bikes to have to be at least a certain weight - the real point of sport is to see athletes compete against each other fairly. Cyclist from poor countries already have it tough enough, so it's not cool to have them show up on 20 lb. bikes while rich cyclists show up on 10 pounders. We already see how unfair it is in Ironman how you can simply buy speed on the bike. And one of the reasons they eliminated those skin suits in swimming was rich countries could keep throwing full body kits at their folks after every heat even though they ripped, but the poor countries couldn't afford maybe even one.

The resources to hydrate yourself with needles and fluid bags frequently and safely takes $$$. So then the poorer athletes start trying to keep up and start making risky decisions by reusing needles and bags and sketchy medical folks (Dr. Nick from the Simpsons) or none at all, and then people start catching and spreading diseases, some of them irreversible, like HIV and hepatitis. So WADA says let's put an end to this and nobody gets them to keep the playing field even and people from spreading some nasty stuff.

Imagine athletes from a poorer country or just college kids at Nationals given free reign to have as many IV bags as they want. In a pinch, they'd start reusing needles and bags and even injecting each other, risking getting an air bubble in their blood stream and boom, dead. No needles, people... too dangerous. Limit it to nearly none at all and only under supervision by trained medical staff.

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Zen and the Art of Triathlon. Strava Workout Log
Interviews with Chris McCormack, Helle Frederikson, Angela Naeth, and many more.
http://www.zentriathlon.com

If you were sick enough to need an IV the small bags are a complete waste of time spitting into the wind as it were. If your health is legit at risk you and the doctor want the big bags.

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They constantly try to escape from the darkness outside and within
Dreaming of systems so perfect that no one will need to be good T.S. Eliot

doper!

;-)

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Dan Empfield
aka Slowman

I can reiterate what others have said in this thread. I've never had a post race IV, but after I took a course about anti-doping from the Canadian Centre for Ethics in Sport I asked about them, and I was told a retroactive TUE would be required if more than 100mL was administered.

Very Funny! Isn't there a rule here about calling out someone without any sort of proof? :)

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"Only those who risk going too far can possibly find out how far one can go." T.S. Elliot | Cycle2Tri.com
Sponsors: SciCon | | Every Man Jack

did you instagram your doping? like lochte did?

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Dan Empfield
aka Slowman

So, dumb but serious question: no diabetics at the games?

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The point is, ladies and gentleman, that speed, for lack of a better word, is good. Speed is right, Speed works. Speed clarifies, cuts through, and captures the essence of the evolutionary spirit.

Yes,

The issue, and basically stems from a technical one:

For example take cpt chaos example re Boulder.

If he receives the exact same emergency care in the med tent at an Ironman vs the exact same care via “hospital admission”

In other words, same care in an emergency fashion, one requires a retro TUE the other not because you are receiving an IV via hospital admission.

Really a simple technical question, is a med tent with specific qualified people, and specifically available emergency interventions...and an admission protocol or process a “hospital”

Don’t know honestly, I think there could be arguments both ways.

Maurice

My understanding was that this would apply to anyone non-TUE.

Ie if you were diabetic and taking insulin etc, you better have a TUE. Just to make your life easier.

Having said that...I remember reading it multiple times during Rio and Sk winter games, and I can’t find the source now.

Perhaps I am incorrect.

Maurice

Ah, ok. "No needles without a TUE" is very different from "no needles, period".

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The point is, ladies and gentleman, that speed, for lack of a better word, is good. Speed is right, Speed works. Speed clarifies, cuts through, and captures the essence of the evolutionary spirit.

Agreed my initial description or recollection was incorrect.

Maurice

Funny how when USADA was being paid by Floyd Mayweather they gave him a TUE for an infusion and kept it secret. It didn't come out until after the fight. I really doubt Money was in such a bad way he needed an infusion.

Man, what a dope. I feel sorry for him in a pathetic kind of way. He narked... on himself

A standard IV bag is 1000ml. Ten times the limit. 100ml is 3 1/3 ounces. A pittance, really. And not enough to hide any doping. Therefore it is probably a fair limit. I think we don't have nearly enough information on this to be commenting in any way on whether Lochte is a hapless dope, a victim of a technicality or a genius at cheating. Shall we move on to more salient issues?

I could see your point if it were even remotely possible to be severely dehydrated after the 200 Fly or if swim meets were a single day/event. It is sort of an apples-to-oranges comparison because nobody in Kona will be racing the next day and you would prefer to treat people out of an abundance of caution. You have no idea what their electrolyte levels are either. Lochte was going beyond what's allowed and he doesn't have any good excuse.

“Salient issues”. Like what you did there.

1) I just wanted to point out, that there is a national shortage of IV bags. People who are hospitalized, who are quite ill, can not get them. Our ER has instituted strict rules around who gets them in order to ration them out to only the sickest people. The fact that anyone is able to get one for some BS recreational reason is irritating.

2) among the rules around rationing that we have instituted- in order to get an IV for hydration, you must be unable to consume fluids by mouth. I would hope that Ironman medical tents would follow these guidelines as well.

3) no way Lochte did not know this was illegal- I think it is legitimate to ask the question- what was he hiding by using IV saline?

If he really knew it was illegal he wouldn't have posted it on his social media. Rio proved that he is not exactly a brainiac. He probably just didn't think anything of it. Do you have any idea how popular vitamin drips and the like are nowadays? They are popping up all over...they promote them for curing hangovers, recovering from travel, etc.

Ya, i can def see how it would not look good for elite swimmers to all be getting an IV after every practice. OTOH, had RL just done this in private instead of Instagraming it, he could've gotten away with it and no bad "optics". Further, i would think a person's arms would get sore if they got an IV every day for several months, just from having all those needles stuck in you.

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"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."

I’m not arguing if there is a shortage or not. But there are wellness centers popping up left and right where you can get IV therapy. While there may really be a shortage, to the unknown, they seem widely available with all the advertisements in the last few years for IV therapy centers. Remember when there was an ad for IV therapy at AG nationals a few years ago??

I think you are over-estimating the brains/smarts of Lochte.

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blog

I’m not arguing if there is a shortage or not. But there are wellness centers popping up left and right where you can get IV therapy. While there may really be a shortage, to the unknown, they seem widely available with all the advertisements in the last few years for IV therapy centers. Remember when there was an ad for IV therapy at AG nationals a few years ago??

I think you are underestimating the brains/smarts of Lochte.[/quote]
Under estimating? Or over estimating?

Do tell. Is your comment based on firsthand knowledge, or hearsay/speculation?

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Eliot
blog thing - strava thing

 

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Terrible Tuesday’s Triathlon

Next time I have a 5year old chemo patient who can’t get an IV, I will have you come in and explain to them how capitalism works. When critical medical supplies are in short supply, they should go to people who actually have a medical need for them.

Is that his wife getting an IV as well? Why?