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Re: Giro Stage by Stage - Discussion & Debate (Spoiler Alert) [McNulty] [ In reply to ]
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I've never seen someone have the strategy that TD has on these climbs. Not respond to accelerations, just do his own power with confidence he'll pull them back in. Highly entertaining for sure.
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Re: Giro Stage by Stage - Discussion & Debate (Spoiler Alert) [Sean H] [ In reply to ]
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i think he should be okay. he's on slope of 12% right now; no need to go into red here

though TD doesn't look as good
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Re: Giro Stage by Stage - Discussion & Debate (Spoiler Alert) [Sean H] [ In reply to ]
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Sean H wrote:
I've never seen someone have the strategy that TD has on these climbs. Not respond to accelerations, just do his own power with confidence he'll pull them back in. Highly entertaining for sure.

Froome is pretty similar.
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Re: Giro Stage by Stage - Discussion & Debate (Spoiler Alert) [echappist] [ In reply to ]
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echappist wrote:

though TD doesn't look as good


Don't know why Quintana is dropping the hammer here if he was *anything* in the tank.
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Re: Giro Stage by Stage - Discussion & Debate (Spoiler Alert) [trail] [ In reply to ]
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they need to maintain gap at top of climb to really make time. if TD is back when the gradient top out, it's gruppos compacto; however, drafting btwn the leaders would help them create a bigger gap if TD isn't back
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Re: Giro Stage by Stage - Discussion & Debate (Spoiler Alert) [echappist] [ In reply to ]
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echappist wrote:
they need to maintain gap at top of climb to really make time. if TD is back when the gradient top out, it's gruppos compacto; however, drafting btwn the leaders would help them create a bigger gap if TD isn't back


I don't know, with that many guys in the group I have to think the fastest 3-4 guys could sustain a much higher pace over the final 4km.

Edit: I think Nibali and Quintana are just at their limit. That's all they've got. Pinot is having a great couple of days.
Last edited by: trail: May 26, 17 7:54
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Re: Giro Stage by Stage - Discussion & Debate (Spoiler Alert) [trail] [ In reply to ]
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Landa earned that one.
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Re: Giro Stage by Stage - Discussion & Debate (Spoiler Alert) [trail] [ In reply to ]
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that's what i meant;

sigmoidal, if you will. any slight gap will get amplied on the flatter section

looks like TD will lose the jersey. Issue will be how good he'll be for the time trial; doubtful he'll be as good.

also, where is Pinot?
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Re: Giro Stage by Stage - Discussion & Debate (Spoiler Alert) [echappist] [ In reply to ]
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And Zakarin and Pozzovivo go with no response. Quintana and Nibali are definitely just in survival mode.
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Re: Giro Stage by Stage - Discussion & Debate (Spoiler Alert) [echappist] [ In reply to ]
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Exciting. Can't remember the last time all 3 podium spots in the GC cracked. The pretenders are on the assault.
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Re: Giro Stage by Stage - Discussion & Debate (Spoiler Alert) [echappist] [ In reply to ]
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echappist wrote:

looks like TD will lose the jersey. Issue will be how good he'll be for the time trial; doubtful he'll be as good.


The time trial is lining up to be super exciting. Everything's all tightened up now across the top 5. Top 3 within 43 seconds. And I don't think Pinot and Zakarin are far off that.

This is how it should be. None of that business with Froome 5 minutes clear and doing a just-don't-crash TT.
Last edited by: trail: May 26, 17 8:14
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Re: Giro Stage by Stage - Discussion & Debate (Spoiler Alert) [trail] [ In reply to ]
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perhaps clean racing after all

This is the most exciting finale I could recall. There was Hesjedal trailing Rodriguez and taking Maglia Rosa on the final day in 2012; and there was Evans overhauling Schleck in 2011. top 6 are separated by fewer than 90 second. TD will rue the lack to attention when descending that hill as he surely burned a few matches
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Re: Giro Stage by Stage - Discussion & Debate (Spoiler Alert) [trail] [ In reply to ]
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Going to be an all-out assault from Quintana and Nibali tomorrow.
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Re: Giro Stage by Stage - Discussion & Debate (Spoiler Alert) [trail] [ In reply to ]
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trail wrote:
Exciting. Can't remember the last time all 3 podium spots in the GC cracked. The pretenders are on the assault.


NQ is the least exciting GC contender to watch race, give me conti any day. Anyways, if TD keeps the gap under minute he will win in the TT, by NQ's own admission he needs 90 seconds coming into the TT. A dead flat TT will significantly favor TD regardless of the fatigue level; likely NQ has gone very deep as well to gain these time gaps and could pay a serious price in the TT.

Edit: Tomorrows stage will be quite interesting, Monte Grappa is filled with so much history it makes the racing that much more enjoyable. Nibbles looks fatigued, NQ is either on the limit or waiting until tomorrow, likely on the limit. Pinot and the doped Russian are on a serious mission, i think one of them gets into the top 3 tomorrow.
Last edited by: Ron_Burgundy: May 26, 17 8:24
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Re: Giro Stage by Stage - Discussion & Debate (Spoiler Alert) [Carl Spackler] [ In reply to ]
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Carl Spackler wrote:
Going to be an all-out assault from Quintana and Nibali tomorrow.

Yup. They're going to want another minute. And now that blood is in the water, they'll be watching for the first hint of weakness. It's going to be a fun couple of stages.
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Re: Giro Stage by Stage - Discussion & Debate (Spoiler Alert) [Ron_Burgundy] [ In reply to ]
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Ron_Burgundy wrote:
]

NQ is the least exciting GC contender to watch race


I think he gets a bad rap. Take-GC-by-the-throat assault on the Blockhaus. Field-sprinting for 2nd. Throwing down as many attacks as anyone else. Yesterday he sent Anacona up the road, bridge to him, and tried a game-ending attack. He just didn't have it. Today he was just in survival mode like Dumoulin and Nibali. He's human. And his never-see-me-suffer poker face is kind of cool.
Last edited by: trail: May 26, 17 8:29
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Re: Giro Stage by Stage - Discussion & Debate (Spoiler Alert) [trail] [ In reply to ]
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trail wrote:
Carl Spackler wrote:
Going to be an all-out assault from Quintana and Nibali tomorrow.


Yup. They're going to want another minute. And now that blood is in the water, they'll be watching for the first hint of weakness. It's going to be a fun couple of stages.

Damn, I was stuck in meetings, but it sounds like they gapped TD on the steepest 12-14 degree grade section and then they all just sat on their watts in survival mode of sorts, the small guys in a group building a gap and TD more or less solo riding within himself, and then we they got on the "flatter section" the group effect allowed Quintana, Nibali and Pinot to gain more time and Pinot gained the most? Pinot may be the biggest winner in the last 2 days. Pinot is almost in spitting distance of winning this Giro. From what I understand he was "off" in the first ITT but when he has been on in the past, he's even beaten Dumoulin in an ITT? Can someone confirm that?

Now we need to get Quintana on a 650 bike loaded down with cement or depleted uranium filled aero bottles for the downhill TT....or a 75W booster motor :-)
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Re: Giro Stage by Stage - Discussion & Debate (Spoiler Alert) [trail] [ In reply to ]
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This race is still wide open.
TD was isolated today.

There will be 15k of flat tomorrow after the final climb.
But if TD is 1 minute off of Nibbles and Quintana after the climb (like today).
And TD is without support.
That 1 minute is not coming back.

That would give Quintana his 90 seconds on TD, and 43 seconds on Nibbles - going into the time trial.

That is even odds 3 ways.

TD is still probably favorite. (Because disaster can befall Quintana and Nibbles also)
I say:
30% chance TD wins
28% Nibbles
26% Quintana
10% Pinot
2% Zakarin
2% Pozzovivo

Tactically - I think Quintana needs Nibbles and/or Pinot on the last 15k tomorrow to keep TD away.
But Nibbles can perhaps take 43 seconds out of Quintana on the time trial.

The race can be won by Nibbles or Pinot.
It can be lost by TD.
Quintana's best hope is to sneak in a middle ground win- between a TD loss and a Nibbles Victory.
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Re: Giro Stage by Stage - Discussion & Debate (Spoiler Alert) [Velocibuddha] [ In reply to ]
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This race is still wide open.
TD was isolated today.


I love this race. Agreed - still wide open all the way back to Possivivo in 6th place 1:30 down.

Tomorrow will be critical to setting up the final TT on Sunday.


Steve Fleck @stevefleck | Blog
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Re: Giro Stage by Stage - Discussion & Debate (Spoiler Alert) [Fleck] [ In reply to ]
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I think TD losing the jersey was a good thing. He can settle in, and most importantly he doesn't have to wear the crappy magila rose skin suit for the final tt. That's like 1 min right there?;)
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Re: Giro Stage by Stage - Discussion & Debate (Spoiler Alert) [Velocibuddha] [ In reply to ]
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Velocibuddha wrote:
This race is still wide open.
TD was isolated today.

There will be 15k of flat tomorrow after the final climb.
But if TD is 1 minute off of Nibbles and Quintana after the climb (like today).
And TD is without support.
That 1 minute is not coming back.

That would give Quintana his 90 seconds on TD, and 43 seconds on Nibbles - going into the time trial.

That is even odds 3 ways.

TD is still probably favorite. (Because disaster can befall Quintana and Nibbles also)
I say:
30% chance TD wins
28% Nibbles
26% Quintana
10% Pinot
2% Zakarin
2% Pozzovivo

Tactically - I think Quintana needs Nibbles and/or Pinot on the last 15k tomorrow to keep TD away.
But Nibbles can perhaps take 43 seconds out of Quintana on the time trial.

The race can be won by Nibbles or Pinot.
It can be lost by TD.
Quintana's best hope is to sneak in a middle ground win- between a TD loss and a Nibbles Victory.

I am giving Pinot the highest hopes of victory outside TD. it's still TD's race to lose. Now that i checked the google, Pinot beat TD in the Romandie ITT in 2016. But Pinot needs to gain some time tomorrow. TD could just as easily attack tomorrow and take the stage and overall win, although he is looking "less strong" than earlier.
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Re: Giro Stage by Stage - Discussion & Debate (Spoiler Alert) [Fleck] [ In reply to ]
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Not only is this racing hotting up on the course, it's getting heated allround
http://www.cyclingnews.com/...riticism-of-tactics/
Nibbles was quite irritated at TD for some "cocky" remarks after stage18.

Quintana now leads TD by 38sec., but the consensus seems to be he'll need 90 seconds plus for a realistic shot at the overall win.
That means Movistar and Emirates are going to try and gap the pink on tomorrows climbs, and then TTT to the finish.
What a great finish this is shaping up to be!

res, non verba
Last edited by: RoYe: May 26, 17 12:22
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Re: Giro Stage by Stage - Discussion & Debate (Spoiler Alert) [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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devashish_paul wrote:
Velocibuddha wrote:
This race is still wide open.
TD was isolated today.

There will be 15k of flat tomorrow after the final climb.
But if TD is 1 minute off of Nibbles and Quintana after the climb (like today).
And TD is without support.
That 1 minute is not coming back.

That would give Quintana his 90 seconds on TD, and 43 seconds on Nibbles - going into the time trial.

That is even odds 3 ways.

TD is still probably favorite. (Because disaster can befall Quintana and Nibbles also)
I say:
30% chance TD wins
28% Nibbles
26% Quintana
10% Pinot
2% Zakarin
2% Pozzovivo

Tactically - I think Quintana needs Nibbles and/or Pinot on the last 15k tomorrow to keep TD away.
But Nibbles can perhaps take 43 seconds out of Quintana on the time trial.

The race can be won by Nibbles or Pinot.
It can be lost by TD.
Quintana's best hope is to sneak in a middle ground win- between a TD loss and a Nibbles Victory.


I am giving Pinot the highest hopes of victory outside TD.

I was thinking Pinot too. He's put time into the other 3 the last couple of days and is a good time trialist.
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Re: Giro Stage by Stage - Discussion & Debate (Spoiler Alert) [RoYe] [ In reply to ]
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RoYe wrote:

That means Movistar and Emirates are going to try and gap the pink on tomorrows climbs, and then TTT to the finish.


I don't know about that. I don't think Quintana feels safe with that TT time gap over Nibali either. And no team seems to be a fan of UAE.
Last edited by: trail: May 26, 17 16:00
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Re: Giro Stage by Stage - Discussion & Debate (Spoiler Alert) [RoYe] [ In reply to ]
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That means Movistar and Emirates are going to try and gap the pink on tomorrows climbs, and then TTT to the finish.

UAE don't have a dog in the hunt or the team to do this. You mean Bahrain-Merida? Or UAE to set up Costa for a stage win?

________
It doesn't really matter what Phil is saying, the music of his voice is the appropriate soundtrack for a bicycle race. HTupolev
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