False. She is running in KY and she ended her ad with "Democrat" across the screen.

Good luck ...

https://www.govtrack.us/...s/KY#representatives

---

If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went. - Will Rogers

Emery's Third Coast Triathlon | Tri Wisconsin Triathlon Team | Push Endurance | GLWR

She makes me want to move to KY just to cast a vote for her.

Yeah well, there's that.

Great ad, though.

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The devil made me do it the first time, second time I done it on my own - W

Very much so. Impressive.

---

If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went. - Will Rogers

Emery's Third Coast Triathlon | Tri Wisconsin Triathlon Team | Push Endurance | GLWR

It's a great ad.

I don't know how elections work for the Senate and House but it seems to me that anyone from the military, particularly those in combat, don't have a very good chance of winning the Presidency.

Clinton, Bush 2 and Trump all did everything they could to avoid service and won handily (particularly Trump...). The Presidential nominees with service (Bush1 vs. Clinton, Dole, McCain, Kerry,) were beaten handily.

I find that a little odd.

Personally I'm sick of hearing how Repubs want to take your healthcare away, but I can see how people benefiting from Obama care get fired up regardless of how unsustainable it is.

She's a retired Marine. She's not benefiting from Obamacare. She has Tricare health insurance as a retirement benefit.

Amy was a classmate of mine at USNA. Never knew her that well, but she had a good reputation as far as I can remember.

---

Slowguy

(insert pithy phrase here...)

So now the act of no longer forcing people to buy health insurance they don't want has been rebranded as "taking healthcare away"?

That's not a good ad.

That's insulting.

Oh yeah, there's no way a gnarly lesbian democrat wins in Kentucky either.



PS: the republicans can kiss my ass (McCain especially) for that cowardly bullshit they pulled last week.

Fuck all of them.

---

Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

Must have been so hard for her to have been married to a Republican dude for 13 years and had three children.

This bit about her induction into the Ky. aviation Hall of Fame is pretty impressive (non-political). She was on the flight line at Miramar during 9/11 awaiting orders to scramble to take down airliners (as a WSO, not a pilot at the time).

I can't imagine the struggles "she" must have endured.

---

Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

Tell that to this guy; POTUS 1953-1961. Maybe after another 3 1/2 years, what America needs is a little discipline...SLOWGUY 2020![/img]

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DFL > DNF > DNS

X2. I will likely vote with my dollars ;-)

---

DFL > DNF > DNS

For the life of me I cannot imagine why you would ever need to delete any of your posts.

---

I'm beginning to think that we are much more fucked than I thought.

And there were people here who thought the LR couldn't survive without your stellar contributions. Go figure.

---

Slowguy

(insert pithy phrase here...)

Every president from Eisenhower through GHW Bush were active duty during WWII.

Clinton was the only one of those 3 that won handily. G Bush and Trump just squeeked by - remember Bush was awarded the presidency by the supreme court and barely beat Kerry for reelection 286 v 251. Clinton began Vietnam as a student at Oxford then registered for the draft in law school, but got #310 (no one over #195 was drafted). Bill did protest the war though. He planned on ROTC at Arkansas, but didn't. The guy who ran that thought that he gamed the system to get a very high draft number.

Despite the situation that the armed services in the US get enormous respect (deservedly so) and if you say anything negative about them you will be stomped on it is only a tiny proportion of the population. The gap between people in the military and the general population has widened in the last 50 years. https://www.theatlantic.com/...-and-society/306158/.
It is an all volunteer army very professional and much more conservative than the population at large. I don't think the average person knows that many people in the military or can relate to what their lives are like. Ergo military service is much less likely to be viewed as an asset in the political arena. I did read a better article about this a few months ago that was more recent and from the Atlantic but a quick internet search has not found it right now.

---

They constantly try to escape from the darkness outside and within
Dreaming of systems so perfect that no one will need to be good T.S. Eliot

Al Gore went to Vietnam and lost. Kerry lost. McCain lost. Romney got republican nomination no military service. Ms. Clinton no military service nor Mr. Trump. Military service doesn't help you win the presidency anymore. The 80s was a long time ago.

---

They constantly try to escape from the darkness outside and within
Dreaming of systems so perfect that no one will need to be good T.S. Eliot

Worked well for so many out of staters in the Georgia election.

Obviously winning as a Democrat in Kentucky is a huge uphill battle. But if she can keep the dialogue as simple as "I fought for you against terrorists and I'll fight for you at home. All those guys do is talk," then she could be everything the right should fear. Particularly after the repeal-and-replace debacle.

Well, she is badass full of awesome. She doesn't have a prayer. The empty platitudes of love of military and country from the right will fall away when they dig into her history and destroy her. The Republican party and it's love of party above all will point out how she wants to take your money and is a leftist who loves weirdo trans people and will find some point in her career where she made a mistake that caused a brief pucker factor during a flight and call her a danger.

Go get'em Marine! You are the best and I hope you have good ideas but you are going up against old white men who look back fondly on the Mad Men days.

For the life of me I can't get myself all in a lather over some stupid political ad.

Bunch of lemmings around here.

Really? Two minutes of jets landing and "I'm a woman!!!!" is all it takes?

What she says referring to any actual policy is just an out and out lie.

I flew planes! I'm a gurrrl! Republicans want you to die!!!

Are you all really this easily manipulated by cool imagery?

Sad.

---

Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

So if she loses no more KFC?

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How does Danny Hart sit down with balls that big?

Yeah. A story of hard work and accomplishment. YAWN! What a waste. Now your trolling on the other hand. Next level greatness.

I'm just really skeptical when an entire media structure is falling all over themselves trying to see who can scream the loudest about how this is best political ad EVER!!!!!!

Quick google search produces a level of media masturbation I haven't seen in a long time for a two minute spot who's only reference to policy is a sensationalist lie.

I mean why not just put her in the White House right now?

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Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

Yes, that is the case now, but i will re-post something I posted a while ago in another thread. KY is historically a Democratic state. We have been trending Republican in national elections longer, but only recently has the Republican party here really been on equal terms as the Dems. Hell, as recently as 1999 the best the 'Pubs could do for a gubernatorial candidate was Peppy Martin, who in a foreclosure action against her is claiming that the banks are conspiring to murder her, the govenrment is tapping her phones and bombarding her home with radiation. She's basically wearing a tinfoil hat at this point.

Did you know that this is the first time in 95 years that the Republicans control the House of Representatives here? 95 years. http://www.kentucky.com/...rticle113464563.html

Gov. Matt Bevin is only the 2nd Republican Governor in 4 decades. http://www.wkyt.com/...ecide-339742142.html

Go here and see how many red boxes you see as opposed to blue since 1867. https://en.wikipedia.org/...strength_in_Kentucky

Bunch of lemmings around here.


What she says referring to any actual policy is just an out and out lie.


Almost 50% of the country just elected a man completely devoid of policy knowledge and who repeatedly lied.


If people are lemmings by supporting her, what does that say about the country?

It's just shocking to have someone who has done something running for office. I mean she has accomplishments. She busted her ass and did something pretty awesome. In a declining nation of idiots it's is a bit of shock to hear from someone like this.

It's just shocking to have someone who has done something running for office. I mean she has accomplishments.


But she didn't have a t.v show and has some knowledge of policy, in other words a loser...

My only disagreement here is with your math.

Trump got just under 66 million votes. There are about 325 million people in the US.

---

Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

When giving the opportunity to express her knowledge of policy she tells a whopping lie.

---

Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

There's a substantial difference between acknowledging a good product (Political Ad) and whether or not the product being advertised is worth buying.


It's a great Political Ad, and the hype surrounding it proves it to be true.

---

The devil made me do it the first time, second time I done it on my own - W

This is an interesting question. If it is not okay for patriarcial (sic) old white guys to not allow women in combat if there would be a draft should women be exempt? I can't think of a good reason why. Probably a moot point because likelihood of a draft is almost zero.

---

They constantly try to escape from the darkness outside and within
Dreaming of systems so perfect that no one will need to be good T.S. Eliot

I don't think it's interesting at all. They should be eligible for a draft, and assigned to the most appropriate positions.

Edit to add: In theory. As you noted, it would never happen, but if it did, shit has really hit the fan, in which case, see above.

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The devil made me do it the first time, second time I done it on my own - W

You've got quite few customers wanting to (literally in one case) toss money at her righ here in this thread.



The hype surrounding it proves there's a bunch of hype surrounding it.

There's a lot of hype surrounding the Mayweather/Mcgregor boxing match.

I guess that means it's going to be a fantastic fight!!!!

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Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

What was her whopping lie?

Republicans want to take away the healthcare of 20 million people.

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Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

Ah!

Then you understand what makes for a good political ad.
I never said she'd be a good candidate. I'll let those who do defend their comments.

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The devil made me do it the first time, second time I done it on my own - W

When this claim is made one these two things are true (and possibly both)...

1. The person saying it thinks you're stupid.

2. The person saying it is stupid.

It is estimated that 20 million people will choose not to buy health insurance if they were not forced to purchase it.

From that we he the statement "republicans want to take away healthCARE from 20 million people.

It is one of the most insidious and Orwellian type of lies I can think of.

---

Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

I think the hype surrounding the msyweather fight is idiotic and illustrates the gullibility and stupidity of so many people, just like the reaction to this ad.

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Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

I hear he has ties to Russia.

---

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

Starting from scratch...

I wouldn't compare the two, beyond the superficial veneer of "popular."

You're underestimating, if not dismissing entirely, the value of character and personal biography. It matters, even if the policy positions (I don't know where she stands on much) don't pass muster.

---

The devil made me do it the first time, second time I done it on my own - W

I thought Bill Clinton taught us that policy, not character, is what matters.

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Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

I don't think that's quite telling of the whole truth.

As I understand it...

There are already a lot of people who aren't purchasing health insurance, despite the ACA stating that they have to. They're taking the penalty instead because they don't qualify for assistance with the premium due to too high of an income but still feel that the high premiums are not affordable.

Then there are those whose incomes are low enough to qualify for assistance with the premium and have coverage as a result. If ACA is repealed, those are the ones who would lose access to coverage in the way that it is now, because they'd be back in a situation where they couldn't afford any coverage available to them. These are the ones she and others are referring to in addition to those who have pre-existing conditions who may lose coverage if ACA is repealed, so there is a truth to her claim.

Of course, that second group isn't really much better off with ACA because the plans that they can get with assistance also have such high deductibles that those throw many into financial chaos anyway. ACA is a dumpster fire bit of legislation. That much is painfully obvious. If anyone were speaking truth, they'd be saying that repealing and replacing ACA or leaving ACA as-is are both awful solutions and we need to go deeper into the root of the high cost of health care and figure out why the U.S. has significantly higher per-capita costs than other first world nations.

That just doesn't fit into a sound bite. And it requires effort & collaboration, something the petulant children in D.C. seem incapable of doing. You've got to give it to her -- she at least seems to have had experiences that would seem to lend themselves to more reason, leadership, and working with those she doesn't 100% agree with, and that should be breath of fresh air in the swamp.

Trump and Clinton Policy and character don't matter much

---

They constantly try to escape from the darkness outside and within
Dreaming of systems so perfect that no one will need to be good T.S. Eliot

Even if that were true (it isn't), lack of health insurance does not mean you lose access to health care.

---

Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

Almost 50% of the country just elected a man completely devoid of policy knowledge and who repeatedly lied.

My only disagreement here is with your math.

Trump got just under 66 million votes. There are about 325 million people in the US.

Well, almost 50% of those who voted elected a man completely devoid of policy knowledge and who repeatedly lied.

Either way you say it, it's still pretty funny.

"lack of health insurance does not mean you lose access to health care. "


Depends on your income.

Wrong again. Obama got over 50% of the votes. Twice!

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Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

Oh boy...

I can't even respond.

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Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

Then don't.

Come on -- you know that's an untruthful use of semantics. Technically speaking, everyone has access to health care. Technically speaking, I have access to purchase Apple or Microsoft.

It's just a matter of having the money to do it, right?

I heard this BS argument when ACA was first passed -- "people had access to health care before, all they had to do was go to the ER." While technically true on one front, it's bullshit. If I'm dirt poor, have no insurance, and break my arm, I could go to the ER, have it set, etc. and they have to take care of it. They're still going to bill me and if I can't afford it my credit is shot, unless they're merciful and write it off (driving up the costs for everyone else in the process...). If I need follow up care, physical therapy, etc., they're not even going to book the appointment without ability to pay.

But that again gets back to my initial point -- anyone who argues for ACA as the answer or repealing and replacing ACA as the answer is being 100% disingenuous. At least her claim has truth to it and I'd bet with her background & perspective she'd be more amenable to an actual solution to the root problem than the vast majority of the lot in D.C.

At least her claim has truth to it and I'd bet with her background & perspective she'd be more amenable to an actual solution to the root problem

And that's the real reason she has no chance.

No, it doesn't.

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Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

I said fuckall about the ad or the candidate. My response was to you and your posts. And I'm not in a lather about those either.

I was just noting that you only have to go back and delete posts when you say shit like first calling her a lesbian and then heavily implying that she either was a man or is too manly for women.

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I'm beginning to think that we are much more fucked than I thought.

You can say "no it doesn't" all you want, but I showed you where it does. Your "no it doesn't" here reminds me of my 3 year old when she's caught red handed and can only say "no, I didn't!".

This.

---

If you are a Canuck that engages in gratuitous bashing of the US, you are probably on my Iggy List. So, save your self a bunch of typing a response unless you also feel the need to gratuitously bash me. If so, have fun.
"Don't underestimate Joe's ability to f___ things up" - Barack Obama, 2020

My faith in US politics, which reached a nadir in the past 6 months, has been resurrected by this ad.

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Remember - It's important to be comfortable in your own skin... because it turns out society frowns on wearing other people's

Pink?

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Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

I didn't say a thing about her manliness. Interesting that you brought up her manliness.

I rest my case.

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Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

Why would you think it was sarcasm?

---

Remember - It's important to be comfortable in your own skin... because it turns out society frowns on wearing other people's

So a competently produced 2 minute political tv spot can have that profound an effect on you?

Wow.

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Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

Sure, because when you say this...

"I can't imagine the struggles "she" must have endured"

...you certainly weren't suggesting anything about her manliness or femininity. While you were gone, did you attend the BarryP School of Bullshit?

---

Slowguy

(insert pithy phrase here...)

I put "she" in quotes because that's my assumption of "her" gender. Others might want to identify her differently (like jpo did). I wouldn't want to impose my gender assignment of "her" onto anyone else.

Try to keep up.

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Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

I put "she" in quotes because that's my assumption of "her" gender. Others might want to identify her differently (like jpo did). I wouldn't want to impose my gender assignment of "her" onto anyone else.

Try to keep up.[/quote]
Uh, huh. Just like Barry was very careful to never explicitly call anyone a racist.

---

Slowguy

(insert pithy phrase here...)

I guess the irony is lost on you that you accuse her of intellectual dishonesty and then you do the exact same thing. Of the 20 million or so who are predicted to "lose" healthcare coverage under "Trumpcare" yes, many would do so because they would opt out. However, many would lose coverage because of the terms of the bill. These include cuts to Medicaid, barring pre-existing conditions, premiums becoming prohibitively expensive for older people. But carry on with your simplistic trolling.

Show me a bill that has been passed, or even voted on, where the above is true.

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Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

Here. It was voted on and passed in the House. And that is the kind of bill she is campaigning against.

And on that bill (from Wiki):

Among the key concerns identified by health-care experts were that (1) the tax credits funded at the level proposed in the bill are insufficient to pay for individual insurance, and could lead to Americans dropping out of the health care market;[43] (2) the bill's elimination of the ACA's community rating provision (barring insurance companies from charging older people more than three times what they charge younger people) would increase cost disparities between age groups and would increase premiums for Americans more prone to illness;[43] (3) the dropping of healthy people from the health insurance market (adverse selection[42]) could lead to insurer "death spirals" that would decrease choice; and (4) the phaseout of the Medicaid expansion was likely to result in a loss of healthcare for poorer Americans.[43]
=====================

Now you show me a bill where what you say is true (that EVERYONE who "loses" healthcare coverage would only do so because they would be choosing to drop coverage).

I give you this.

Can you show me the text of the actual bill where there are cuts (less money than before) in anything?

I'm just not going to accept Wikipedia's reporting of "concerns" from healthcare "experts".

Sorry.

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Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

I'm not going to do a circle jerk for you. You know what you are claiming is not true, but are unwilling to admit it, so you're just obfuscating at this point.

Oh, a story in the politico that characterizes the bill to bolster D talking points!

Well that settles it. You got me there.

Let's just do this...

...it's claimed that there are Medicare cuts. How much did we spend on Medicare in 2016 and, according to the bill how much would be spent in, say, 2020? Is it more money or less money?

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Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

See Kay's response above mine. This is nothing new with you, but you're being willingly blind.

"she"

Really? That is your weak ass dodge? You could be the next Trump communication director. You might even last 7 days.

---

I'm beginning to think that we are much more fucked than I thought.

So in other words you can't find any actual cuts in Medicare.

thanks.

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Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

The Frank Luntz is strong with this one.

(And no, that sure the hell isn't a compliment.)

I wouldn't last 7 minutes.

But it would be a fun fucking 7 minutes.

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Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

That bill that MidWest and I both cited would have phased out the Obamacare Medicaid expansion.

Here is a fairly independent assessment of the bill:
http://www.nbcnews.com/...t-won-t-work-n730361

But again, show me a bill where 100% of those would no longer be covered, would be choosing not to have healthcare cover? Because THAT was your main point in calling her a liar. Trouble is, your point is not true.

I'll give you the challenge then.

How much was spent on Medicare in 2016 and how much was proposed to be spent under this bill? Is the proposed spending less than or more than the 2016 level?

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Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

In other words, you're being petulant. No matter what you're shown in these things, you stand by like a toddler with your hands on your hips saying, "Nope, I don't believe it." And the sad part about it is you're actually smarter than that. I know where this is going with you, so why bother to spend time pulling the numbers?

...to the conclusion that there are no proposed cuts in Medicare funding.

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Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

Right. There has been proposed increases in Medicare spending. Those propsed increases are being phased out and you guys are calling it a "cut" when in actuality the amount of money spent on Medicare will continue to increase for as far as the eye can see, just as much as Obama wanted it to.

That's not a fucking cut.

Again, I ask you, how much money was spent on Medicare in 2016 and how will be spent in 2020?

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Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

Why are you obsessing about Medicare numbers? First of all it is Medicaid increases that the bill would phase out. Second, this is only a part of the reason many would no longer be able to afford or have healthcare. There are many other reasons.

"...the bill radically reforms Medicaid and phases out the ACA’s expansion of the program by 2020, which covered 11 million people according to the Kaiser Foundation, while grandfathering in some existing recipients. The Republican plan would transform Medicaid so that the government would pay states a fixed amount for each person enrolled rather than an open-ended commitment. These changes could potentially force states to offer less far-reaching programs over time."

And I'm not arguing in favor or against any bills. I'm just calling you out on your BS statement that she is lying because you claim the only people who would lose healthcare cover under the Republican plan are those who would chose to drop coverage (happily).

It is ironic though that her ad is about overcoming being main-splained by old white men what she can and can't do in life. Which she pretty much gave them the middle finger and accomplished what she wanted anyway.

Then a bunch of old white guys in the LR come and man-splain what she can and can't do. And then make all sorts of comments about her physical appearance and possible sexual preferences like 12-year-old boys.

She didn't "fly a plane." She's a highly decorated Marine F-18 pilot. That's really damned cool, and was something unthinkable for a woman just 20 years ago. You can disagree with her politics, but this is a remarkable woman, and exemplifies the ideal of American merit-based self-determination.

You have no credibility in your arguments. You're just flinging around random emotional tantrums with little basis in rational thought.

The argument is not if more money will be spent on Medicaid in 2020 vs 2016. The answer is yes whether under ACA or the Republican House bill. But that does not win you your argument, so you might as well get off that soapbox. On this specific point, the ACA includes a much bigger increase in Medicaid benefits, allowing many elderly patients affordable healthcare that they will not be able to afford under the much more modest increases in Medicaid under the Republican bill. Ergo, they will lose health coverage and not by choice.

I'm "obsessing" about Medicare cuts because it seems to "common knowledge" that there are actual cuts when there are not any fucking cuts.

That serves as one of the basis for the huge lie that is being foisted upon us.

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Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

Mansplained?

You're pathetic.

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Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

ACA defenders seem to understand the concept of slowing the rate of growth versus rate reduction, when it came to the ACA's promised effects on health insurance premiums. GOP budgeting, not so much.

---

The devil made me do it the first time, second time I done it on my own - W

Says the troll from under the bridge.

Say something tibbs disagrees with = troll.

Got it.

---

Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

The latest incarnation of Tibbs is diminished.

---

"People think it must be fun to be a super genius, but they don't realize how hard it is to put up with all the idiots in the world."

When are you gonna come train with us?!

---

Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

No your weird back track on questioning her sexuality did. Now it could have been your weird way of arguing against gender reassignment which is another troll tactic.

Diminished? When have I ever been inished?

Dude, never.

I found a gym up here in Idaho, signed me and my 14 year old up, lasted a few weeks and injured my ribs. Then started a job with a schedule that basically never allows for training.

FML.

(Pity party by invite only.)

---

"People think it must be fun to be a super genius, but they don't realize how hard it is to put up with all the idiots in the world."

I said nothing about gender reassignment.

Also, she does look like a lesbian, and wouldn't surprise me if she was. For the record, I personally know several lesbians that have kids, two of them were married to men. Given the policy of gays in the military during her tenure she could not be "out".

Her look and demeanor (of a lesbian) will hurt her in a place like Kentucky. That's an insult of the Kentucky voters, not the lady pilot.

---

Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

Yep. Point proven.

Damn. I've fucked up my ribs a few times. Painful.

So you coming to train or what? :)

---

Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

I knew you'd come around.

---

Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

Damn. I've fucked up my ribs a few times. Painful.

This evens out my rib cage. On the positive side, it's about the best injury to have. Doesn't really interfere with anything except exercise. (Deadlifts are a no go, btw. You can pick it up, but you can't put it down.)

Sneezing and hiccups are kind of a bitch, but whatever.


So you coming to train or what? :)

Eventually.

---

"People think it must be fun to be a super genius, but they don't realize how hard it is to put up with all the idiots in the world."

Yep. You are a troll. I love feeding you though.

Sounds like a pretty mild case. I've strained/torn the intercostals a few times. The first time I did it I felt some discomfort and, like you said, sneezing was problematic. I ignored the pain, kept training and promptly tore the muscle. Standing up or laying down became a minutes long process. I sneezed once and it dropped me. I made sure I didn't sneeze again for a couple months.

The other two times I did it I paid attention to the mild pain and refrained from any hard rolls for 6 weeks.

Get better. Be patient.

---

Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

Sounds like a pretty mild case.

Totally. As long as I exhale while sitting up, I'm all good. First time was much worse.

If my work schedule allowed, I could be back on the mat in 4 weeks. But it doesn't, waaaaaaaaa.

---

"People think it must be fun to be a super genius, but they don't realize how hard it is to put up with all the idiots in the world."

Enlighten us, what is the "lesbian look"? I thought lesbians were a pretty diverse bunch, kind of like straight men & women, running the gamut with interests and styles. Guess I better tell the gay folks I know that they have a certain look to uphold.

I sneezed once and it dropped me. I made sure I didn't sneeze again for a couple months.

I used to wrestle and once tore an inter-costal muscle and there was no way I could continue wrestling. It was hard enough sitting up straight.

I also broke 12 ribs once and carried around a coughing cushion for about a month. Ribs are not to be messed with.

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Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

Nonsense. Lesbians, like everyone else, dress and modify their appearance to proclaim their identity.

---

"People think it must be fun to be a super genius, but they don't realize how hard it is to put up with all the idiots in the world."

Of course people modify their appearance to proclaim an identity, but it's preposterous to claim that there's a universal "lesbian look." But you know that already.

it's preposterous to claim that there's a universal "lesbian look." But you know that already.

True. There are as many as three, perhaps even four "lesbian looks."

---

"People think it must be fun to be a super genius, but they don't realize how hard it is to put up with all the idiots in the world."

TheForge .......

She looks exactly like theForge.

Only she has smaller boobs and skinnier thighs.

I assume when you say 3-4 you're referring to just the style preferences in your own family?

Uh huh.

Tell me, when was the last time you needed to be told a chick was a lesbian?

Get over your progressive dogma.

---

"People think it must be fun to be a super genius, but they don't realize how hard it is to put up with all the idiots in the world."

Dogma? I don't think you know what that word means.

I've been surprised several times, by both gay men I thought were straight and lesbians I thought were straight, and vice versa. But I suppose you'd actually have to know a few actual people and some gay people to have that experience.

Dogma? I don't think you know what that word means.

lol!



I've been surprised several times, by both gay men I thought were straight and lesbians I thought were straight, and vice versa.

Sorry to be blunt, but I don't believe you.

---

"People think it must be fun to be a super genius, but they don't realize how hard it is to put up with all the idiots in the world."

I never claimed there was a universal lesbian look. I just said that this particular person looks to me like she is a lesbian.

I mean come on, man. How far off the mark am I really?

---

Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

Please visit me in Dallas. I will introduce you to the many members of the LGBTQ community I am friends with. Your mind will be blown by all the things you appear not to know.

She looks to me like someone who's not feminine. That doesn't mean a person is lesbian. I've known plenty of women who work with their hands in dirt, grease, muck, farms, etc. who don't look dissimilar from that and are definitely not lesbian. And I've known dainty women who are gay. To say "she looks like a lesbian" is to suggest that someone with this look is more likely to be a lesbian. But, really, if she were, would it matter? That's really not germane to the topic of whether or not she'd make a good legislator and an improvement over who represents her district. It is, however, likely the kind of low, childish blow she'll face from her opposition.

You're wasting your time arguing with someone who has no intention of making any sense. Duffy had some time off, and so now he's jumping back in feet first to make up for lost douchebag time.

---

Slowguy

(insert pithy phrase here...)

I don't think I'll lose any sleep tonight knowing that some blowhard on the internet's best defense is "I don't believe you."

You are correct about that. I made the mistake of thinking he was a little neutered. This thread has proven otherwise. Not that I should be surprised, but F me for falling back into the same type of cesspool. Nobody to blame but me for that.

I'm gratified by the knowledge I haven't disrupted your sleep.

Sleep is more important than people know.

---

"People think it must be fun to be a super genius, but they don't realize how hard it is to put up with all the idiots in the world."

Yes, that's basically what I'm saying. More specifically, someone with this look is more likely to be percieved as a lesbian.


To me? No.

To a large contingent of Kentucky voters? Probably.

And that is, and always has been, my whole fucking point.

---

Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

Oh, so that's why you lobbed that grenade. A training exercise for everyone's benefit?

That's a weird fucking way to attempt to make your point. Or a weird way to cover your tracks afterward. I'll take your word that it was what you say it was, but it sure as hell wasn't clear to anyone but you.

Mrs. Duffy just saw the pic on my screen as said "who's the dyke?"

---

Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

Case closed! Mrs. Duffy is known world wide for her eye for people's sexuality.

Mrs Duffy probably drives one of these too.

Great stuff.

I wasn't being a douchebag, I was just teaching all of you ignorant people what a douchebag might act like.

You haven't lost a step. Same old crap.

---

Slowguy

(insert pithy phrase here...)

Oh no!!!!! Lance is a lesbian too!

The Duffys are a classy family.

We are decidedly unclassy.

---

Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

She drives one of these...



And sometimes she drives one of these...

---

Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

The biggest mystery is why you spent all that effort deleting all those posts. Where you thinking of running for public office and now have reconsidered?

---

They constantly try to escape from the darkness outside and within
Dreaming of systems so perfect that no one will need to be good T.S. Eliot

Missed me, huh?

---

Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

Can't get into that right now.

Except to say that, at this point, I no longer feel it's necessary to continue deleting posts.

---

Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

I thought it was worth a shot. Having you and vitus posting again has livened things up.

---

They constantly try to escape from the darkness outside and within
Dreaming of systems so perfect that no one will need to be good T.S. Eliot

now this is a worthy topic.

i suspect most people believe it's appropriate to force people to buy car insurance they don't want, because the lack of (theoretically) universal car insurance breaks down an entire insurance system that requires universality in order to prosper.

there are many problems with health care in america. but the requirement that everyone participate is not one of them.

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Dan Empfield
aka Slowman

My auto insurance primarily pays for damage I do to you. If I run you over o most certainly should have to pay to fix you.

My health insurance pays for me. If I want to let myself go untreated o should be allowed to.

And while we're comparing health insurance to auto insurance...

...auto insurance doesn't pay for oil changes or tune ups. Auto insurance pays accident damage. And you can't be uninsured, get in an accident and then buy a policy expecting to get a payout (pre-existing condition).

On top of all that I don't think we should be forced to buy auto insurance either. I do believe, though, that drivers need to be financially responsible for possible accidents. Usually that comes on the form of insurance.

Btw, my wife got t-boned by a lady who ran a red light. The lady had the legal minimum of insurance (which covered about 10% of what was needed) so we tried to use our uninsured/underinsured motorist coverage. We had to sue our own insurance company (a company I've been paying premiums to for 25 years), went through arbitration, lawyers made a bunch of money, my wife got hosed.

We would have been no worse off (maybe even better) if there was no auto insurance involved at all.

So there's that.

---

Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

And there you go conflating health CARE with health INSURANCE.

Please stop doing this.

The vast majority of my own personal health CARE needs are taken care without insurance getting involved.

---

Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

the problem is that i'm going to end up paying for you. you won't let yourself go untreated. well, you will in terms of checkups. but not when it comes to cancer or a major accident. i will pay your bill. and it'll be an expensive bill because you didn't engage in a cram down process through your insurance company.

as with auto insurance uninsured motorist is me paying for the fact you don't have car insurance. you really do have car insurance. i'm just paying your premium when thru my uninsured motorist coverage. i'm already paying your car insurance. i don't want to also pay for your health insurance.



you're deflecting. auto insurance doesn't pay for oil changes. health insurance doesn't pay for fresh fruits and vegetables.



exactly! that's why you should do the honorable and prudent thing and buy health insurance for yourself, so that i don't have to pay for your insurance. but if you don't exercise prudence then the rest of us will exercise prudence on your behalf and force you to buy it. unless you have no money, in which case we'll help you buy it. but you will buy it. otherwise insurance doesn't work.



you aren't. but if if you don't buy insurance then you have to post a bond. i'd be happy for that to be the case with health insurance. post a bond. self insure. you'd an idiot if you do, but i agree that you should have that option.

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Dan Empfield
aka Slowman

The other issue related to mandatory insurance is the question of whether we really want premiums to closely correlate with risk. In that model the young and the healthy pay very low premiums. Older people or those with prior conditions pay astronomic premiums.

There are a few problems with that. The latter group includes a lot of people who with reduced earning power. Precisely the group that might have trouble paying high premiums. While young people are in their prime earning years.

I know the "S" word is bad. But the insurance model, to me, makes the most sense when risk is socialized across age and across risk. Yes, us, healthy, high-earners are generally unlikely to get a "return on investment". (but we might).

But a world in which people with cancer, diabetes, TBI from a bike crash, etc, are expected to be saddled lifelong with premiums deep into the 5 (or 6) figures while having reduced work capacity doesn't make much sense to me.

If we want to dump sick people into their own risk pool, then it's going to be billions in subsidies for the insurance companies to want to accept that pool (beyond the existing billions at risk now). Or dump them into Medicaid and massively increase Medicaid subsidies.

There's no free lunch unless you're willing, almost literally, to dump sick people on the street.

I never asked you to pay my bills, I don't want you to pay my bills and if at all possible I wouldn't accept from you payment of my bills.

Btw, I've had health insurance since I was 18. I currently find it easier and quicker to get care from doctors of my choosing by paying cash. You aren't paying my bills.


Are you drunk or something? I have auto insurance. Since switching companies I have the most generous plan available. I'm insured for myself and for anyone who doesn't have insurance. Nobody forced me to purchase uninsured motorist coverage. I did it voluntarily. I did because there are a lot of uninsured motorists driving around in Southern California. I don't have to buy that coverage. I could just get the minimum. You aren't paying me anything.


But it does pay for annual physicals, birth control, viagra, the sniffles, and other health maintenance products. And I'm FORCED to have coverage for those things.


But there are people who did not have insurance, got sick and now want to buy insurance, and expect it to be cheap.

That is exactly like getting in a car accident and then buying a policy for a regular price and then making a retroactive claim. That is not insurance.


Then you and agree on something.

I'm also of the belief that if you don't want to buy health insurance you should be allowed to take that risk. And if you get sick and can't pay for your care then bye bye.

There's too many people on this planet anyway. Why, on the one hand, we complain about overpopulation and the inevitable outcome of that (global catastrophe for us all!!!!!) and on the other hand we do everything we can to prolong every single human life?

Why do we feel we have "the right" to millions of dollars of other people's money just so grandma can be hooked up to a ventilator for her last six months?

Just pull the plug already.

It's one of the (many) reasons I have a pretty solid DNR. Let me go. I'm just not the important.

Trust me on this, mr slowxe, you're not paying for any of my shit.

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Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

Well, that's not really the issue.

One of the biggest problems with our system is that health insurance isn't used like any other insurance type. For auto insurance, if you have to do regular upkeep, if the wiper blades need to be replaced, if you get a flat tire, etc, you don't use your insurance to pay for that. Insurance is protection against unusual events that carry a higher than typical cost.

For health care, insurance is essentially required and used for everything. It's not protection for unexpected high cost, it's the default payment for every health care related expense that requires professional medical services. If you go to a doctor or hospital, you need insurance. Not the same if you go to a mechanic.

Because health insurance is used to pay for almost every health care item, hospitals and doctors can charge more and more for simple things. If a mechanic wanted to charge you $500 for a new wiper blade, you'd tell him to go screw. If a hospital wants to charge you some unreasonable amount for a Tylenol you took during your stay, most people will never see that charge or contest it, because it's paid through their insurance.

If we want to look at why health care costs are so high, we don't need to look much further than the screwed up way we approach health "insurance."

---

Slowguy

(insert pithy phrase here...)

Ding ding ding!!!

We have a winner.

---

Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

as with auto insurance what's important is that everyone is in the pool, but that personal behavior is either rewarded or discouraged. in the case of life insurance the basic principle - crowdsourcing the risk to hedge against catastrophic loss - is obeyed, but behavior slightly increases or reduces the payment.

likewise every kind of insurance. the catastrophic loss in auto insurance is the $1mm payment i make to your family for creaming you. the minor variation in premium i pay normalizes for the miles i drive, how many tickets i've had, etc.

auto insurance, if i'm young i pay more. health insurance, if i'm old i pay more. there should be some smoothing, while still honoring the fact that exposure increases risk. obamacare says that the oldest should pay no more than 3x what the youngest pay in premiums. house replacement says that should be 5x. this is a detail. the house feels that they want to smooth a little rougher than obamacare.[/quote]

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Dan Empfield
aka Slowman

right. that's what everybody says. my farrier, said the same thing as you. fell off a bull in a bull riding contest. leg unfortunately was pointing in the wrong direction. do you think he stuck to his principles?


well, i'm not paying YOUR bills. i'm using you as a proxy. for my farrier. let's turn it around. do you want to pay my farrier's bills? well, actually, you are right now. do you want to keep paying my farrier's bills?


this is where i'm very glad to see pubs and dems working together (those who finally are now working together). the operative theory of insurance is that it protects against the catastrophic loss by crowdsourcing the risk. the sniffles is not a catastrophic loss. however, the annual physical might be something the carrier WANTS to cover because the carrier might think that this actually reduces - in the long run - its chance of paying out a catastrophic loss. that's up to the carrier. but that should not be a legal requirement in the legislation. what you tend to see in skinny plans is the opposite: they pay for the sniffles but not for the hospital stay. legislatively we need the reverse.


bummer for them. the cost is what it is. you're right, there is a big difference between health care and health insurance. what we're talking about now is health insurance. if people want their insurance to be cheap, that feeds back into health care. happy to talk about that, but i think that's a different subject.


i just don't think that's palatable, because, well, see the case of my farrier. people are situational. look even at the highest levels of our govt. cheneys are hard right wing except for gay rights. why? reagans were right wing, including on social issues, except for nancy on stem cell research. why? because your imperatives change once it gets personal. my farrier said, before the 2000 bull hopped on his ankle, "i just won't go to the doctor." he BELIEVED that. he just couldn't see around the corner.

we need universal health care because you are going to pay my farrier's bills, because he couldn't see around the corner and we as a society are not going to turn him, or the person rolled in a gurney after getting cut out of a smashed car, or the person whose heart stopped in the swim of a triathlon, away from the hospital door.



do you shoe horses too?

---

Dan Empfield
aka Slowman

i have BX. i see in the claims explanations what the health providers charge and what they get. there is no way i'd ever be a doctor. i tell people who want to go into medicine to be a vet. there's nobody cramming down your billing rates.

in the case of my car and home insurance, i have VERY high limits and i have quite high deductibles. the high limits are there because i'm protecting against a catastrophic loss. the high deductibles are there because i'm not going to use the insurance for a $500 loss, or even a $1,500 loss. i'll never use it unless i really need it.

health insurance is different because it serves to valid purposes:

1. it protects against the catastrophic loss;
2. it's a buyer's cooperative, forcing down the costs of procedures.

what i would REALLY like is a plan that:

A. was a REALLY high deductible, like $25,000, if i could get a REALLY low rate in exchange;
B. but i still want that buyer's cooperative!

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Dan Empfield
aka Slowman

I think you may be high if you think our health insurance has resulted in decreased cost for medical procedures.

Health insurance is not "insurance." It's a massive system that forces basically everyone to use it for everything, results in an additional layer of bureaucracy that must be paid for (raising costs), and allows prices for medical goods and procedures to keep increasing. It only acts as "insurance" in the sense that insurance is designed (like for home or auto insurance) for those cases of catastrophic illness or injury.

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Slowguy

(insert pithy phrase here...)

Absolutely. I agree with much of Slowman's post, but take issue with that line. Health insurance in practice is anything but a "buyer's cooperative".