"required" and necessary I think are 2 things....from your list I would "require" these:

-Emergency, controlled stop
-Look over either shoulder while traveling down the road.
-Remove, drink from, and replace water bottle while looking ahead.


Those are just basic every day moves that will make you safer and more predictable out on the roads and in races.

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

Taking body contact and not panicking.

For AG triathletes.

- Able to negotiate a turnaround on a 2-lane road without falling down.

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"Human existence is based upon two pillars: Compassion and knowledge. Compassion without knowledge is ineffective; Knowledge without compassion is inhuman." Victor Weisskopf.

Years ago part of the Lifetime Triathlon in Miami had a turnaround at the dead end of a two lane road. A large group that was ahead of me by ~100 yards bunched up and went down in the turn. I was very tempted to cut the course by ~20’ to avoid the mess. They should probably advocate “single file” for such turnarounds.

Stay to the side of the road. Don’t ride the center line. 5 wide is not acceptable and against the rules.

Makes sense, but all too common that these are ignored.

I would add predictably hold a line on a curve....this seems to be real problem from what I’ve observed with triathletes.

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___________________________________________________
Taco cat spelled backwards is....taco cat.

How is riding rollers a mandatory skill? Riding rollers makes you good at riding rollers.

Trackstand is pretty pointless, too, save for maybe a specific track event.

As I noted I think some things are "mandatory" to help make you a safer rider and some are necessary.

But riding rollers will make you a better/safer rider, it's much more than just "riding rollers to ride rollers well".

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

Experience riding will make you a better/safer rider. No need for rollers in the least.

Stopping in wet conditions with carbon brake tracks.
Riding with a side wind
Looking over shoulder
Removing/putting back bottles from where ever you store them (behind the seat?)

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http://www.sfuelsgolonger.com

And experience riding + rollers will make you a better rider. Rollers give you confidence that's in itself hugely helpful for on the road riding.

As is a track stand. It's more a "confidence" transitive skill than anything. You become better by becoming better at higher quality skills. End of story.

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

You're really, really stretching here. Confidence? Seriously? Riding on rollers, again, has to do with riding on rollers. Cornering, descending, riding in groups, dodging obstacles, real-life riding?!; all of those things take actual experience doing. Rollers have nothing to do with any of that.

And trackstanding? In a dozen years of riding with dozens of cat 1s, 2s, and 3s, I can count on one hand the number that could actually trackstand, and those few guys were mountain bikers as well.

Just imagine how much more confident and better at higher quality skills they'd be if they could trackstand!... but...oh...

End of a story that you're making up as you type your responses, perhaps...

As Doughtie mentioned above me, riding rollers translates well into general bike handling skills (if you can dodge a wrench you can dodge a ball!) and track standing translates well into low speed handling.

...so maybe not “mandatory” but helpful. I did try to list things in a hierarchical order.

I've never once said that rollers make up for on the road riding. I simply said that they are a very specific higher level skill that improves the confidence of a rider and thus makes them better on the roads. You stated you need to know how to turn and miss obstacles- riding on rollers can improve your bike handling; I'm not really sure how you can sit here and debate that. Doesn't really make a whole lot of sense actually. Never once said they replace anything. Just said they do a hell of a lot more than just make you a better rider on rollers that you claimed.


You dont think those skills are transitive skills for better riding, I do (and others disagree with your assessment even on this thread) . End of story.

*As m original note, there are skills that were noted that I think are "required" and some that are more "necessary" for better quality of riding. I noted that neither of the skills we are discussing are "required" skills. Just that they make you a better rider if you do them in addition. And they certainly add more skills than just riding rollers that you claim.

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

+1

I took a skills session before my first Cat 5 race where we practiced this, and it blew my mind how much body contact you can take without thinking you're just going down.

Also as previously mentioned, being able to hold your line while looking over both shoulders is a big one.

What are you dodging on rollers, exactly?

The notion that rollers help "smooth out pedal strokes" and "improve handling" is archaic silliness rooted in 1970s cycling lore.

If you like riding rollers and trackstanding, by all means do it and enjoy. But don't pretend like it's necessary component for riding well, aggressively, or successfully. Because it's most assuredly not. .

You and the OP disagree. But the OP somehow thinks that being able to trackstand should be a mandatory riding skill. I question how many bike races he's participated in if he genuinely thinks that.

No, but you've said multiple times they're necessary for whatever "very specific higher level skills" are.

What are those, exactly?

Please explain. Please also explain the "more skills" rollers provide that you couldn't get out on the road.

I mean, you thinking that isn't the "end of story". It's just you thinking it and trying to be dismissive without providing any rational or realistic reasoning to back it up.

Like I said above, archaic silliness.

As a 200 pound man the only bunny hop you're getting from me is on a mountain bike, that shit will pop your tires and our damage your race wheels.

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Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.

OP said "mandatory" and in general it's more of an discussion point. Which is what I pointed out to him that there really are "mandatory" skills AG triathletes should learn and then there are skills above and beyond that will only help them, but aren't necessary.

Trackstand/rollers would fall into the skills not needed but helpful. They are skills that are helpful in your comfort and ability to handle a bike-I'm sorry you don't understand that. You think it's archaic silliness, and I see opportunity to get better. So I'm showcasing how it's been helpful, you dismissed being "confident". There's nothing else really to discuss with you. You have your theory, I have mine.

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

Rollers?? WTF for??

I've never ridden rollers in my life, and I'd put my bike handling skills up against any triathlete's.

Bunny hop is "nice, but not necessary" - certainly not a mandatory skill, but a good semi-advanced one to have up your sleeve for when it's really handy.

I'd agree with your Top 3, and the riding hands-free.

And add - holding your own damn line, and not weaving all over the road like a drunken squirrel.

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float , hammer , and jog

I'm not talking about mandatory. I'm genuinely curious how rollers help you improve.

You've said the above at least three times now. I pointedly asked you how rollers are helpful and you've repeatedly said nothing other than some generic lines about confidence and comfort.

I still don't know what your theory is because you still haven't adequately described what these magical roller and higher level skills are.

Can you not explain them? Can you not describe a concrete way that rollers help you become a better rider than you'd be if you didn't ride rollers? What are these skills and how are they so helpful?

+ infinity. correct cornering technique, including how to apex needs to be learned. The way most triathletes attempt 180* turnarounds is pathetic and unsafe in a group/race setting. Someone executing the line and turn flawlessly can be wiped out by their idiocy

 I pointedly asked you how rollers are helpful and you've repeatedly said nothing other than some generic lines about confidence and comfort.

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I've pointedly said that anytime you can improve your confidence and comfort on a bike is a huge thing (I'd assume most bikers would understand that and I didn't need to explain in specifics why balance and control is important). The fact that you dismiss that, then there's nothing really else to discuss. Again I've never once said that rollers or trackstand or required to be a bad ass biker. I've said they are skills that will help you become a bad ass biker if you practice them in addition to a whole bunch of other things- like just generally riding your bike.

But I cant help it that you can't comprehend how improving confidence and comfort on your bike is a bad thing. That's your lack of comprehension, not my lack of explaining. Just seems we are on 2 different levels of understanding, and that's ok.

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

Perhaps the question here is “mandatory” vs “helpful”. I agree that rollers and ability to do a track stand are not mandatory, but they are certainly quite helpful. Both of those help develop and tune stability muscles that help with many aspects of cycling (just as core and stability work help swimming and running). These skills definitely improve ability to hold a steady line, keeping bike stable when looking back, dealing with a bottle, or nutrition, changing position, etc.
For safety of all on the course- very basic skills like being able to look behind on either side while keeping a line, getting a water bottle or nutrition while keeping a line, braking- while keeping a line...basically keeping a line while doing all things one would do while riding is clearly number one.
I would add to the list how to destabilize your bike when something effects your balance, pot hole, gravel, wind, another rider...AND, when you reach the point of no return- how to fall, ie proper tuck and roll.
With new riders, I always try to set up skill sessions in a grassy park, including slow speed handling and falling :-)
One other request is having triathletes learn how to ride at a draft legal distance. The vast majority of triathletes ride in groups, clinging to a wheel, with fear of being dropped, which makes them very uncomfortable riding a legal distance back. I think this is a huge factor (but not only) factor in the formation of packs.