was the original billed as "world championship"? I don't know. But there are plenty of ironman length races out there available to us mortals.
To me, when something is billed as world championship, I feel the athletes should be invited or qualify to go.
I would love to go Hawaii, but I am a MOP'er at best, and I don't think I want to lottery or bid to get in. I want to earn my spot. Who knows, maybe that will change.

hey, didn't channe mcrae get in last year?? i bet HE didn't do a IM qualifier ! and i bet giro or somebody paid, too !! evil ! wah ! end of civilization! etc !

Nope. A good history of the race is the book "Iron Will" by Mike Plant.

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clm
Nashville, TN
https://twitter.com/ironclm | http://ironclm.typepad.com

i dot is is laughing all the way to the bank. More free advertising for the charity slots.

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Slowtwitch bitchist place on planet earth

I suppose if it truly is the "World Championships" then they ought to eliminate all this age group nonsense & only let the very fastest go - the Olympics certainly don't have age groups.

An earlier post made the point that it is what it is. If someone doesn't think the lottery system is pure enough for them & doesn't want to go that route - cool. But the people running WTC set it up the way they see fit. If someone wants to set up their own race to be more elite or more charitable - go for it.

Well, I'm a latecomer to this particular discussion, but I have to ask this....how long have most of you been around Triathlon? I'm in a particularly pissy mood today so I'm going to risk pissing in a few peoples' wheaties on this one....If you haven't been around the sport since the 80s, then you really have no idea what you are talking about when you attack the lottery system. You are missing the big picture amid all your moaning about being able to make it to the sport's biggest day. By focusing on the name "world championship" you are missing what this race is in total. Unfortunately I'm at work or I'd pull together the history of the race in order to support the fact that you all are pissing up the wrong tree.

If we make IMH simply the "World Championships" and eliminate all but qualifiers as participating athletes it will become nothing but an elite race that has lost its connection to the greater triathlon world. This race was, is, and always will be a celebration of the sport. Call that fluff, call that idealism, call it whatever you want...but if you haven't been around then you probably don't understand the "magic" of this race. Its a lot more than a chance to "prove" that you are one of the best simply by being there.

Hell, the next thing we know someone will advocate draft-legal Ironman and we'll really go to hell in a handbasket!

talking about I could have been as young as 6 so no I have not really paid that much interest to it going back that far.

Personally I could not give a toss if the WTC auctioned off 50% of the slots to those with the dough to pay.

I dont think that their should be lottery slots, auctioned slots, slots for B rate actors and "stars" and I use both those terms verly loosely or this CEO challenge because we all know how much harder the CEO's work than their employee's and these slots would not in any way be used simply to make more revenue and MOP AG'ers feel better about themselves because they run companies. Hopefully Jeffrey Skilling will find employment and get to the show in October.

None of this bothers me, I could not give a toss if they add another 500 slots and charge 10k a piece for them.

At some point some bright spark is going to go to Roth, Ultramax, Nice, Cali Man, GFT and god knows how many other long course tri's there are and they are going to say look, we all should get together and offer these races as AG qualifiers for another race, one that is hopefully more centrally located like the south of France.

IMNA and the WTC are out to make Money, so are these other races, god bless them all but I'll be damned if I am going to continue to pony up the dough to subsidise or line the pockets of the owners.

It's a free country vote with your check book, it does not bother me that they offer these slots I'll simply not enter, ITU racing does not bother me, others enjoy it so have at it but dont bitch about this and at the same time continue to support it. You as consumers have choices and you can choose not to support an organization that is run this way.

whattup andrew, no MOO next year after all ??

Moo I got 2 for the price of one and plus Mooooo is my exception to the rule, I dont want to do any of the other races in NA but would pay to do Mooo but not for what they offer but because I want to go back to the neighbourhood...................

Other than that if you dont like it, vote with your check book.

A very interesting thread you've started. It's interesting that you seem to take such offense to Tom's comment on 'income disparity'.

You seem to be sitting on a bit of podium, just before taking what little discretionary income you have and taking it with you to watch the Tour de France! (I dream)

To compare a weekend warrior triathlete doing sprints and oly's to IM athletes that train and commit to IM distance is impossible. The time commitment alone means you need to be financially set. Training 15+ hours per week, along with the food and nutrition that goes with it is expensive. Now lets talk pool/gym memberships, four seasons of running/cycling gear, bike.....did I say BIKE, hmmmm, how many running shoes do we each go through in a training season. How about massage therapy and physio (we all get injured sooner or later), and very few of us live 'next' to an IM race, so travel is a given. Entry fees.... and more!

No matter how you look at it, IM racing is damn expensive, no matter where it is.

It seems the good old USA has proven that Capitalism has proven more effective than Communism, so it seems that no matter what welfare state is contrived, we can't make everyone equal.

With this said, I'm not one to be jealous of what other people have, and even though I couldn't keep up with a Bill Gates in the shopping department (or just about anyone else for that matter) it doesn't mean I want someone to hand me that ability (but if your out there and want to, go ahead) on a silver platter!

Now that I'm starting to ramble, I just want to say....... what's up with the hate-on for the WTC? Because of them we have the OPPORTUNITY to do some great races, both well supported and well laid out races. If they CHOOSE to give away, sell, auction, or otherwise disburse slots, great for them, it's their race. Why bitch about it. And hey, whether it's corporate greed, or honest and caring philanthropy, some charity, hence someone less fortunate than yourself will benefit.

My take, if you don't want to watch porn or survivor, turn it off, if you don't want to race M-Dot, don't. Why whine to those of us that do?

Joe Hostyn (not afraid to post my name either)

Edmonton, Canada

Yeah, I have some discretionary income--no kids/no house payment, instead, my money goes towards travel (plus, I can combine work travel and racing, plus 6 weeks vacation/yr; yes, I know I am lucky). I also know some people who scramble to makes ends meet, work a lot of hours, don't make tons of money, but still are able to train for and race IM races. And, if slots came down to throwing in an extra $5,000-$10,000 for charity, neither I nor they would be able to do it. I also prefer to donate to the charities of MY choice in the manner ~I~ like.

As for racing M-dot...I only race IM NZ. Technically it is an M-dot, but at least it doesn't have that M-dot money-hungry feeling. And yes, I've raced Vineman and Ultramax and aside from NZ (which is more the country than the actual race), they were a lot more fun than any IMNA event I've attended.

As for whining....I don't think I've ever whined in my life.

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clm
Nashville, TN
https://twitter.com/ironclm | http://ironclm.typepad.com

Personally I don't think it matters

I'm not rich enough to buy a place - not good enough to qualify. I did my Ironman (distance) at a small event - 50 competitors - a couple of years ago. It was not Kona - but who cares? to me it was still an ironman and I am still proud to have completed the event. Now I am busy at work and with a young family - I would like to do another Ironman but no time soon. I would like to have gone to Kona - but years ago when the spirit of the event was still true. Kona is not the event it was 20 years ago and never will go back to being that. Nostalga is nice but things change.

Triathlon and Ironman need to move on from the early days and rediscvouver themselves in the 21st centuary. Maybe one practical idea is to run Kona over 3 or 4 days with different age groups competing on differnt days? Thus keeping the Worlds but allowing mass participation?

In the end just do the races you want, enjoy them and don't worrry.

|tim

......"that M-dot money-hungry feeling"............

oooooooohhkay. perception is a wonderful thing, and in my experience you find what you look for ( if not reap what you sow ). in my case i went to the evil IMNA IMMOO race looking for adventure, freinds, excitement, challenge, color, pain, inspiration, competition, personal boundary exploration, glamor, organization, sprarkling comaraderie, and to race. that is what i found. i happily paid a dollar a day for a year for these things, and nobody appeared hungry for more to me.

hey lookee there - an updated profile !

Hi Tim,

;-)

I've heard Moo was a really great time. But, it's in Wisconsin (go Packers!). Maybe someday, but I think I'd rather use my travel funds to go to NZ (again and again), Brazil, France, etc. But, if the majority of my tri buds were going, then I'd definitely reconsider.

Out of here...101 work hours for the month is too many. Have a great weekend all.

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clm
Nashville, TN
https://twitter.com/ironclm | http://ironclm.typepad.com

alrighty then, cathy. even i won't argue ( believe it or not ) with a trip to NZ over wisconsin. rock on.

that if they were in Europe and looking for a tri abroad that they could do far worse than Moooooooo and I might know a little about being a foreigner :-)

That said I'd like to do NZ or OZ next year, so many things I'd like to do, so little time.

I wonder how long till they start showing up on ebay.

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I don't work here, I just live here