Was it truthful? Based on the available facts, no. Did she do the best job for her client, AIU/WA? Probably. Does the fact pattern impugn her credibility? Absolutely.

I don’t know how about this. I think a lot of people put these professionals up on the pedestal. They are not perfect nor should they. They don’t always do everything right, the way they “should”, or what is ideal/optimal for top performance. They are humans after all, not machines. I’m sure they like to have a cheat day or 2 just like the rest of us.


I've met and been around Age-Group Endurance Sports Athletes who are WAY more rigid and locked down than some of the World Class Athletes I've known over the years.

As I mentioned in a previous post - like any population, you the the full range of types of people among the World Class crowd. Yes - people put them on a pedestal and because they do ONE THING really well - ride a bike really fast - we think they do EVERYTHING at that same level! That is simply NOT the case! Just on the intelligence scale alone, I've known National Champions in my own country who are Mensa/Einstein/PhD level of intelligence and I've known others who, seem to have not even been able to graduate from high school!

Maybe. But we don't know what she was asked, nor do we know what her answers were (in her actual words). We just have a snippet of paraphrased summary provided by CAS.

Also, all this has next-to-nothing to do with Houlihan. :). I'm still curious how the above poster seemed to have insider knowledge about where the sample was tested, and who testified before CAS in the Houlihan case.

Houlihan’s sample was tested in Ayotte’s lab. Ayotte was the one who decided to report the result of Houlihan’s test as an adverse analytical finding (i.e. a positive test), rather than an atypical finding (which would have triggered an investigation rather than suspension), as is done in potential food contamination cases. She testified as her own expert witness in Houlihan’s CAS hearing.

Quote:

Yes,the metabolites are detectable for months after an injection of nandrolone. However, the supplements of norandrostenedione and norandrostenediol, available for oral self-administration until January 2005 in many countries, were producing the same metabolites, detectable during approximately one week. This is the source of many positive findings since 1997, along with results due to supplements containing those steroids without mention on the label.

I keep seeing people saying this and it frankly makes no sense. Why would she not eat a carne asada burrito? What should an elite athlete who burns thousands more calories a day than the average American be eating?

And because she is a woman she should be a vegan, what kind of sense does that make?

I'm not trying to defend Shelby here as I think it's highly unlikely her positive test was the result of the burrito; I'm just trying to point out that some on here have some overly romanticized views of the diet of an elite athlete.

Yeah.

I don't understand this either.

Who doesn't love a good carne asada burritos from a food truck once in a while?

Ok true- there are some vegetarians and vegans.
And some of these are athletes.
But.....

Most athletes have a pragmatic view to nutrition, not a moral one.

And weirdly anal people are usually not great athletes.

And weirdly anal people are usually not great athletes.

I don't know. I attended a conference at a US Olympic facility, and went to the cafeteria. Olympic rower sitting next to me proceeded to bring out a gram scale and weigh every vegetable that was going into his salad. And he wasn't a lightweight rower.

I am not saying she should be a vegan because she is woman. I am saying in my experience, women are much more likely to be vegetarians and/or not eat beef and/or pork. I am saying I find the probability of this scenario to be low.

I am also saying that this proposed burrito sounds kind of disgusting and unhealthy (and I like burritos), so the idea that this elite world class athlete was putting something like this into her body just isn't the easiest thing to believe (not impossible, but sounds unlikely, very low odds on any given day that this happens). Was she regularly eating stuff like this (I think unlikely) or again, are we supposed to believe this incredibly bad luck, the very rare time that she cheats/splurges from the high performance, nutritionally controlled diet (that would be the normal expectation for a world class athlete in T&F) just happens to coincide with this drug test. And of all the things that could have been in the burrito, it just happened to be this one very obscure and unusual thing (pig offal, from an uncastrated boar) that provides cover for the positive test.

I am saying look at the total chain of unlikely events that had to happen to get here and ask yourself what is more likely, this chain of low probability events of she was doping

1. World class athlete eats really bad junk food. (not zero probability, but very low). I'll put this at 1/30, I'm sorry but if you are trying to win Olympic medals, you aren't eating greasy food truck meat burritos very often. This seems like an extreme splurge, way more than say drinking a coke or having an ice cream.

2. Junk food happens to have very obscure kind of meat in it. (not zero probability, but very low), I would put this at 1/100 for numerous reasons, including I think this is very non-standard meat. She could of had a veggie burrito, chicken burrito, fish burrito, so I may be overestimating the probability, first she had to get the pork burrito, then it had to be not just any pork burrito, but the one with the very special kind of pork meat.

3. Drug test occurs (again, I can't think these would happen any more often than monthly, so 1/30 chance)

I get a 1/90,000 chance of all three events happening concurrently. Please, challenge my numbers, tell me where my probability estimates are way off-base?
And again, low probability events can still occur (my 1/90,000 odds does not mean she is guilty, but it's my way of deciding what is the most likely situation)

I love the way I said vegetarian, which was strawmaned into vegan, and now it is a question of morality;)

a pragmatic view of nutrition for a world class athlete is to eat very healthy. And there is nothing moral about it, it is strictly a question of performance. And nothing is more practical than putting yourself in the best position to perform at the highest level if that is what you do for a living.

"Health" is a question of morality.

That's why there is soooo much b.s. surrounding the idea.

And it also why every single person on earth has a radically different idea as to what "health" means.

A "pragmatic view" of nutrition would be about protein, carbohydrates, vitamins, etc. About nutritional needs vs intake vs desired body composition.

Personally:

I think whole foods are "healthy".

I think if you eat meat it is morally imperative that you also eat liver, tripe, brain.

I think factory foods are "unhealthy."
I think vitamins are "unhealthy."

WHO CARES what I think is healthy or unhealthy!!!!

No doubt Houlihan could have broken the US record following "The packaged donut, vitamin and protein powder diet."

you omitted that she claims to have ordered a carne asada burrito, which normally is very dry, but when she unwrapped her burrito, it stunk, was very greasy, and didn't look like carne asada. when she bit into it, it tasted awful and nothing like carne asada, but then she decided to go ahead and eat the entire stinky burrito of unknown meat and all of this happens at like 9 or 10pm so it fits in the 10 hour window and she has nobody else to corroborate any of this. i think your denominator is missing a few zeros in it . . .

you omitted that she claims to have ordered a carne asada burrito, which normally is very dry, but when she unwrapped her burrito, it stunk, was very greasy, and didn't look like carne asada. when she bit into it, it tasted awful and nothing like carne asada, but then she decided to go ahead and eat the entire stinky burrito of unknown meat and all of this happens at like 9 or 10pm so it fits in the 10 hour window and she has nobody else to corroborate any of this. i think your denominator is missing a few zeros in it . . .

Frank Shorter reportedly ate pizza with mayonnaise. Said it was his way of getting enough total calories without overworking his gut.

Has anyone named or suggested this food truck? Are they avoiding that because of legal liability? Seems very suspect to me.

Still waiting for actual CAS report though.