Did he not post a 22 km run @ 4 min / km the day after LBL. Don’t think his run has fallen off a cliff just yet!!!!
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Re: Cameron Wurf is riding the Vuelta! [Shambolic]
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Re: Cameron Wurf is riding the Vuelta! [Zuckerzeit]
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Would love it if we see him going for a brick run at the top of the Tourmalet.
Re: Cameron Wurf is riding the Vuelta! [Zuckerzeit]
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He runs occaionally, but 4min/km for 20k's is nothing at pro level just an aerobic jog. I'm not saying its terrible for Cam to do a grand tour for ineos because as others said its a big paycheck in a proffesional sport much bigger than triathlon and he gets to ride with some of the best ever.
All im saying is that if Cam was ever to win kona or get top 3, this is not the way to do it. i suspect top 10 maybe 2 more times.
The real winners from this are Joe skipper, sebi, and lionel. Cam will do all the work on the bike at kona again but be maybe a little stronger, but will just drag all these guys along in the draft, and they will then be able to deliver with a top run spilt.
in cam's position he doesnt have the time availble to stop running for months at a time, not swim consistently to work on his stroke and keep progressing as a triathlete. bike racing = more crashes = more time not training for tri. but atleast he loves doing it which is the main thing as riding a grand tour in ineos would be epic.
All im saying is that if Cam was ever to win kona or get top 3, this is not the way to do it. i suspect top 10 maybe 2 more times.
The real winners from this are Joe skipper, sebi, and lionel. Cam will do all the work on the bike at kona again but be maybe a little stronger, but will just drag all these guys along in the draft, and they will then be able to deliver with a top run spilt.
in cam's position he doesnt have the time availble to stop running for months at a time, not swim consistently to work on his stroke and keep progressing as a triathlete. bike racing = more crashes = more time not training for tri. but atleast he loves doing it which is the main thing as riding a grand tour in ineos would be epic.
Re: Cameron Wurf is riding the Vuelta! [LordFarquuad]
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Yep if he wants money this could be it. As far as goes winning Kona, this would be the time to improve the swimming and running.
Not even sure that if he didn't do the tour that he could take 5 minutes of his swim and 13 minutes of his run in one year of very focussed training.
These are big gains to be making towards the end of a career! But he has few pay days left and only he knows what is important to him.
Would be interesting to get the coaches perspective if someone posted I have an awesome bike leg, but I'm behind the pack and a bit gassed with my swim and while I've had some good runs I get left behind when the pace lifts and die a bit in the back half of my run.
So I'm going to stop running and swimming for a few months and bike more
Not even sure that if he didn't do the tour that he could take 5 minutes of his swim and 13 minutes of his run in one year of very focussed training.
These are big gains to be making towards the end of a career! But he has few pay days left and only he knows what is important to him.
Would be interesting to get the coaches perspective if someone posted I have an awesome bike leg, but I'm behind the pack and a bit gassed with my swim and while I've had some good runs I get left behind when the pace lifts and die a bit in the back half of my run.
So I'm going to stop running and swimming for a few months and bike more
Re: Cameron Wurf is riding the Vuelta! [jondavid]
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I reckon it's pretty possible the race won't go ahead
Re: Cameron Wurf is riding the Vuelta! [t1mmy]
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Here’s a link to a decent interview with Cam back in July, it may give more insight if you’re interested- https://badboyrunningpodcast.com/cam-wurf
Re: Cameron Wurf is riding the Vuelta! [stevie g]
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Haha...the summary of this thread on ST is that Cam is an idiot for not working on his weaknesss (run) and riding in a Grand Tour in a real professional sport with his good buddy Froome. Lionel is a hero for not working on his weakness (swim) and doing the Canadian Hour record on a lark. Lionel is a hero for sacrificing Kona next year for a chance at a payday at Challenge Daytona, Cam is an idiot for taking a paycheque to ride for Ineos.
OK OK, but do you see the double standard floating around ST? And the assumption is Cam is ignoring his run for many months when he clearly is not. Lionel has been explicit that he's been avoiding his swim.
OK OK, but do you see the double standard floating around ST? And the assumption is Cam is ignoring his run for many months when he clearly is not. Lionel has been explicit that he's been avoiding his swim.
Re: Cameron Wurf is riding the Vuelta! [devashish_paul]
[ In reply to ]
devashish_paul wrote:
Haha...the summary of this thread on ST is that Cam is an idiot for not working on his weaknesss (run) and riding in a Grand Tour in a real professional sport with his good buddy Froome. Lionel is a hero for not working on his weakness (swim) and doing the Canadian Hour record on a lark. Lionel is a hero for sacrificing Kona next year for a chance at a payday at Challenge Daytona, Cam is an idiot for taking a paycheque to ride for Ineos. OK OK, but do you see the double standard floating around ST? And the assumption is Cam is ignoring his run for many months when he clearly is not. Lionel has been explicit that he's been avoiding his swim.
Lets add in that someone thought this is a publicity stunt. Like Ineos needs publicity from an athlete that people outside of Slowtwitch barely know.
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Re: Cameron Wurf is riding the Vuelta! [Billabong]
[ In reply to ]
Billabong wrote:
devashish_paul wrote:
Haha...the summary of this thread on ST is that Cam is an idiot for not working on his weaknesss (run) and riding in a Grand Tour in a real professional sport with his good buddy Froome. Lionel is a hero for not working on his weakness (swim) and doing the Canadian Hour record on a lark. Lionel is a hero for sacrificing Kona next year for a chance at a payday at Challenge Daytona, Cam is an idiot for taking a paycheque to ride for Ineos. OK OK, but do you see the double standard floating around ST? And the assumption is Cam is ignoring his run for many months when he clearly is not. Lionel has been explicit that he's been avoiding his swim.
Lets add in that someone thought this is a publicity stunt. Like Ineos needs publicity from an athlete that people outside of Slowtwitch barely know.
And in fairness to Lionel, big kudos for going for the Cdn Hour record knowing he has not had enough velodrome time and given that bike handing on the velodrome is critical to efficiency of distance (do you guys remember at Kona 2018 when he got dropped by Cam and Sebi coming down from Hawi because he could not handle his bike and had to work all the way to Waikaloa just to catch back up). So Lionel is working a weakness for Kona next time, so there is that!
Re: Cameron Wurf is riding the Vuelta! [devashish_paul]
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devashish_paul wrote:
And the assumption is Cam is ignoring his run for many months when he clearly is not. Lionel has been explicit that he's been avoiding his swim.His Strava data suggests he is ignoring his run. 16k per week for the last 10 weeks, with 3 weeks of zero. Same time last year, he was smashing it - 80 to 100k weeks.
IMO, purely in terms of winning Kona (which is all he seems to want from Triathlon), another year of massive swimming & running volume was required. But, I certainly do not begrudge the guy for what he has done this year, for himself & his family.
Re: Cameron Wurf is riding the Vuelta! [NAB777]
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If I could choose between riding as a domestique for Ineos or being a top level pro triathlete I would choose bike racing every time.
Re: Cameron Wurf is riding the Vuelta! [Dinsky11]
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Dinsky11 wrote:
If I could choose between riding as a domestique for Ineos or being a top level pro triathlete I would choose bike racing every time.See my last line above... hard to argue against it.
Re: Cameron Wurf is riding the Vuelta! [NAB777]
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Yeah, we see it the same. Mine was just a general reply to the thread. Sorry I didn’t make that clear.
Re: Cameron Wurf is riding the Vuelta! [devashish_paul]
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Did not post at all in the Lionel Thread,
This:
His Strava data suggests he is ignoring his run. 16k per week for the last 10 weeks, with 3 weeks of zero. Same time last year, he was smashing it - 80 to 100k weeks.
IMO, purely in terms of winning Kona (which is all he seems to want from Triathlon), another year of massive swimming & running volume was required. But, I certainly do not begrudge the guy for what he has done this year, for himself & his family.
I did not say Cam was an idiot. I said I get that he may have reasons for doing this, money, motivates him, good for him for doing it. It is quite awesome that he is that good a rider that he can ride a pro tour at all, let alone at his age after not doing it full time for so long. I expect he will have a ball and his team will be happy with him.
As far as goes a single minded focus on working the weaknesses to bridge for 2021 it is maybe not the optimal use of his time. As NAB777 pointed out, its not three weeks it is 3 months putting run in the back pocket and then there is some time off after.
His opponents for 2021, JF, AB, PL and others won't be doing that.
I did ask if I was to say hey ST I am off the pace swimming and while my running has improved I'm still more than ten minutes behind the guys faster than me, so I've decided to not swim and run for three months to improve my bike which is already about as good as it can get, how would you respond.
The answer in true ST style is to answer well Lionel Sanders is doing some thing
This:
His Strava data suggests he is ignoring his run. 16k per week for the last 10 weeks, with 3 weeks of zero. Same time last year, he was smashing it - 80 to 100k weeks.
IMO, purely in terms of winning Kona (which is all he seems to want from Triathlon), another year of massive swimming & running volume was required. But, I certainly do not begrudge the guy for what he has done this year, for himself & his family.
I did not say Cam was an idiot. I said I get that he may have reasons for doing this, money, motivates him, good for him for doing it. It is quite awesome that he is that good a rider that he can ride a pro tour at all, let alone at his age after not doing it full time for so long. I expect he will have a ball and his team will be happy with him.
As far as goes a single minded focus on working the weaknesses to bridge for 2021 it is maybe not the optimal use of his time. As NAB777 pointed out, its not three weeks it is 3 months putting run in the back pocket and then there is some time off after.
His opponents for 2021, JF, AB, PL and others won't be doing that.
I did ask if I was to say hey ST I am off the pace swimming and while my running has improved I'm still more than ten minutes behind the guys faster than me, so I've decided to not swim and run for three months to improve my bike which is already about as good as it can get, how would you respond.
The answer in true ST style is to answer well Lionel Sanders is doing some thing
Re: Cameron Wurf is riding the Vuelta! [devashish_paul]
[ In reply to ]
devashish_paul wrote:
Haha...the summary of this thread on ST is that Cam is an idiot for not working on his weaknesss (run) and riding in a Grand Tour in a real professional sport with his good buddy Froome. Lionel is a hero for not working on his weakness (swim) and doing the Canadian Hour record on a lark. Lionel is a hero for sacrificing Kona next year for a chance at a payday at Challenge Daytona, Cam is an idiot for taking a paycheque to ride for Ineos. OK OK, but do you see the double standard floating around ST? And the assumption is Cam is ignoring his run for many months when he clearly is not. Lionel has been explicit that he's been avoiding his swim.
I suspect that,if Cam was American,we would be seeing a vastly different attitude to what he is doing here on ST and we would have to find a bloody huge bandwagon to fit everyone on board.
Re: Cameron Wurf is riding the Vuelta! [ThailandUltras]
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ThailandUltras wrote:
devashish_paul wrote:
Haha...the summary of this thread on ST is that Cam is an idiot for not working on his weaknesss (run) and riding in a Grand Tour in a real professional sport with his good buddy Froome. Lionel is a hero for not working on his weakness (swim) and doing the Canadian Hour record on a lark. Lionel is a hero for sacrificing Kona next year for a chance at a payday at Challenge Daytona, Cam is an idiot for taking a paycheque to ride for Ineos. OK OK, but do you see the double standard floating around ST? And the assumption is Cam is ignoring his run for many months when he clearly is not. Lionel has been explicit that he's been avoiding his swim.
.
I suspect that,if Cam was American,we would be seeing a vastly different attitude to what he is doing here on ST and we would have to find a bloody huge bandwagon to fit everyone on board.
and if he was european (though possibly not german), everyone would take it for granted that he was doping.
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Re: Cameron Wurf is riding the Vuelta! [stevie g]
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Hey, I think all you guys are assuming that everything he does gets on Strava. For all we know he is jogging 15-30 min here and there many times per week around his bike work just to not lose too much run adaptation. I don't think we can say he does nothing based on his run AFTER Liege Bastogne Liege the next day. Just think about his run at 4 min km's the next day right after one of the hardest monuments on the planet, so he has likely been doing some jogging to do that type of running the day after a monument. We may not see all that on Strava.
As for the Lionel angle, guilty as charged....I was just pointing out that on ST Lionel is a hero for ignoring his swim and doing a pro cycling event and Cam is a goat for ignoring his run and doing a pro cycling event :-)
As for the Lionel angle, guilty as charged....I was just pointing out that on ST Lionel is a hero for ignoring his swim and doing a pro cycling event and Cam is a goat for ignoring his run and doing a pro cycling event :-)
Re: Cameron Wurf is riding the Vuelta! [NAB777]
[ In reply to ]
NAB777 wrote:
Dinsky11 wrote:
If I could choose between riding as a domestique for Ineos or being a top level pro triathlete I would choose bike racing every time.See my last line above... hard to argue against it.
If I may paraphrase: "If I were a sports agent, and my client could choose between riding as a domestique for Ineos [or Boels-Dolmans] being a top level pro triathlete I would talk them into bike racing every time"
Of course, I don't know if this is how things work in pro bike racing or triathlon, but ...
It's a good decision, especially in these uncertain economic times
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Re: Cameron Wurf is riding the Vuelta! [RandMart]
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I was thinking about the money, yes, but also how cool it would be to ride in the pro peloton.
Re: Cameron Wurf is riding the Vuelta! [Dinsky11]
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He has already finished three grand tours though, so riding such big race isn't really that new for him. Riding one with one of the biggest teams might be different though.
Re: Cameron Wurf is riding the Vuelta! [devashish_paul]
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devashish_paul wrote:
Hey, I think all you guys are assuming that everything he does gets on Strava. For all we know he is jogging 15-30 min here and there many times per week around his bike work just to not lose too much run adaptation.)Cam himself has said numerous times says that he puts everything on Strava.
And 15 minutes here or there is not months & months of a 30k run once a week.
Re: Cameron Wurf is riding the Vuelta! [NAB777]
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Cam himself has said numerous times says that he puts everything on Strava.
And 15 minutes here or there is not months & months of a 30k run once a week.
This
He wont improve his bike time at Kona but he will miss an opportunity to be a runner or swimmer for three months
Re: Cameron Wurf is riding the Vuelta! [NAB777]
[ In reply to ]
NAB777 wrote:
devashish_paul wrote:
And the assumption is Cam is ignoring his run for many months when he clearly is not. Lionel has been explicit that he's been avoiding his swim.His Strava data suggests he is ignoring his run. 16k per week for the last 10 weeks, with 3 weeks of zero. Same time last year, he was smashing it - 80 to 100k weeks.
IMO, purely in terms of winning Kona (which is all he seems to want from Triathlon), another year of massive swimming & running volume was required. But, I certainly do not begrudge the guy for what he has done this year, for himself & his family.
I know I may sound old school and totally out of touch with the present, but what if he didn't record all his runs on Strava? Is that really totally out of question?
Re: Cameron Wurf is riding the Vuelta! [Diabolo]
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Diabolo wrote:
NAB777 wrote:
devashish_paul wrote:
And the assumption is Cam is ignoring his run for many months when he clearly is not. Lionel has been explicit that he's been avoiding his swim.His Strava data suggests he is ignoring his run. 16k per week for the last 10 weeks, with 3 weeks of zero. Same time last year, he was smashing it - 80 to 100k weeks.
IMO, purely in terms of winning Kona (which is all he seems to want from Triathlon), another year of massive swimming & running volume was required. But, I certainly do not begrudge the guy for what he has done this year, for himself & his family.
I know I may sound old school and totally out of touch with the present, but what if he didn't record all his runs on Strava? Is that really totally out of question?
This is what I was getting at. Does everyone actually record every workout all the time these days? I only record key workouts that I want to look back at. But maybe he records every step to see his overall training load if he does a lot of easy workouts all over the week around his key bike training and he wants to see their cumulative impact. Old school method you just recorded all those by hand.
Dev
Pretty sure he'll be (and told to) preserving all his energies for riding his bike for the next 17 days - especially if the rest of the vuelta is anything as intense as stage 1.
Also pretty sure the income of a world tour rider is considerable higher than most professional triathletes. Especially this year!
Also pretty sure the income of a world tour rider is considerable higher than most professional triathletes. Especially this year!