Thanks. I had a feeling the 600m on the website was wrong.

That's the climb from the swim finish to T1 lol

All 70.3 and 140.6 Ironman branded races in Canada this year use regular Gatorade. Not G2 not Endurance Formula. Plan your sodium accordingly.

Thanks Paul and M2, someone told me it was endurance but the other thread noted it was Gatorade.

So what kind of time will it take to KQ this year for Men 35-39?

Faster than the last non qualifier.

Rule number 1 about Kona Qualifying is just worry about getting the best out of your own body that is physiologically possible. The worst thing you can do is chase a 'goal time' in the sense that conditions can make things a lot worse. You can only control your own race. Get across the finish line and make sure you don't end up so cooked that you are in hospital and miss the slot allocation the next day. Then go to slot allocation and rolldown and hope that what you did is "good enough".

If you look at the 70.3 in 35-39 top 3 were under 4:46...subtract 7 min for the 4K long course and you are at 4:39. Double it at add 30 minutes and you are sub 9:50...but that assumes the same guys show up, but since there are KQ slots count on double to triple the density of studs, so now you probably need sub 9:50 just to get top 10.

Dev, I noticed you were doubling the time and adding 30 min. I always figured it was double the time and add an hour - the adding an hour seems to work in my case, but then again I suck. Is a + 30 min a better representation at the very pointy end for a
AGers? Does a really tough course such as Muskoka IM change the formula?

Also the IM bike course is only 170km, not the full 180km so the beginning/end out and back part is only done once.

Are you sure about that? I thought that the previous 170 km route was changed to 180 km. The IM Muskoka site shows a 180 km bike course.

,

yes, it is 180K now.

Very glad I found this out now. brb going to do hills.

If it helps, I was the 3rd 35 - 39 male at the 70.3 (4:46) and I will not be at the full.
I also do not feel that I have the ability to compete for a Kona spot yet... I would assume there will be 5+ guys around the caliber of the #1 and #2 35 -39 males from the 70.3.

Good luck!

Wanted to follow up and say that a room opened up at hidden valley (maybe someone decided after the 70.3 that 140.6 wasn't such a great idea) and I am in for the race.

I'm a little behind the eight ball but 48 days of polishing my fitness should get me where I need to be.

Thanks to all of the folks who are sharing their experiences with the course.

I did the inaugural Tahoe in 2013 and it almost killed me :) I figure this can't be any worse than that.

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Jason
None of the secrets of success will work unless you do.

anyone any idea how this course might compare to CDA? In particular the old bike course, the second incarnation, ie not the one with the dog track, and not the current one. the one around Hayden lake.

The run sounds as if it is comparable to LP, right?

Thought I'd use this thread in hopes to get some advice on gearing for IM Muskoka.

I raced Muskoka 70.3 a couple of weeks ago. The race went well (for me), I finished in 5:06 in the M35-39 group (37 swim, 2:45 bike, 1:38 run). This was 25 minutes faster than in 2013 when I finished in 5:31. Swim and run legs were a bit faster and I biked 20 minutes faster on the same bike setup. So I am happy with how my bike fitness has improved over the last 2 years. That said, I did not race a very smart race on the bike. AP was 193, NP was 221 and VI was a stupid 1.15. I can think of a few reasons for this:
1) Most of my training is done indoors on the trainer because of where I live and how I like to make the most efficient use of time as possible. Plus I guess I'm a bit loony in that I really enjoy the trainer, even 4 to 5 hour rides are no problem for me. In any case, my outdoor riding skills including power management leave a lot to be desired.
2) Related to the above, I realized I am not that confident utilizing my BTA setup on a course that is quite sketchy in spots and constantly rolling, so I came out of aero quite a bit to drink. My power would really dive during these instances and once back in aero I guess mentally I wanted to catch up so I would put in a surge. For the IM I am going to switch back to my Torhans Aero 30 and force myself to slow down and fill up a few times. Seems worth it to slow down for 20 seconds and then be able to spend the next 45 minutes to 1 hour in aero.
3) My gearing was a 50-34 crank with 11-28 in the back and reflecting on the race I did not shift to the small chainring once. Looking at my data I count many spikes well above FTP of 276 watts including a few over 400. Not the smartest way to ride I know.

Even though my VI was terrible my legs felt pretty good during the run. My open 13.1 PR is 1:24 on a flat course and that was less than a year ago. +14 minutes for a HIM on a hilly course doesn't seem that terrible. My question then is would it be wise to stick with the current set up and just try to ride smarter utilizing the small ring to spare the legs? Problem with that is I find the 34x28 to be too low on most climbs thus the 28 seems a bit of a waste and I'd be better off with tighter gearing. Alternatively I could try to use the small ring more often AND switch cassettes. I also have laying around a 12-25 and a 11-23. Do you think 34x25 or even 34x23 for this course would be plenty for climbing purposes? I did find myself using the 11 on a few of the descents. I am going to do my best to keep my power below 300 or so as much as possible.

Hopefully the post is not too incoherent, just trying to get some advice to race to my potential in my first IM. One other important piece of info I guess is I plan to race at 66 kg and hope to average around 2.9 to 3.0 watts per kg.

Do you really think that many really fast guys are going to be at the full? There were only 1200 people signed up as of July 1, and I just signed up today.

I figure that if I execute a smart race, and if the course is essentially the same difficulty as IMMT then I have the potential to be in the 9:3x range. I'm not counting any chickens before they're hatched though...you never know what the day will bring.

Just under 7 weeks of training still to go.

Ken

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"the trick is to keep losing weight until your friends and family ask you if you've been sick. then you know you're within 10 pounds. if they start whispering to each other, wondering if you've got cancer or aids, you're within 5. when they actually do an intervention, you're at race weight." - Slowman

The problem with the trainer is that it takes practice outside to ride a low VI ride. You have to get on the hills and practice keeping the power low on a climb, cresting the hill with the same power and then using the same power going downhill until you hit "terminal velocity" I.e. a cadence higher than 110rpm for me. During those phases mentioned above I probably change gears 20+ times including small to big.

What is the second lowest gear on an 11-28?

Ken

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"the trick is to keep losing weight until your friends and family ask you if you've been sick. then you know you're within 10 pounds. if they start whispering to each other, wondering if you've got cancer or aids, you're within 5. when they actually do an intervention, you're at race weight." - Slowman

The Muskoka course is harder than the Tremblant course and the field should be less deep as well. I would expect that the time necessary to get a Kona slot will be quite a bit longer at Muskoka for most age groups. I am guessing 10-15 minutes longer.

The 2nd lowest is a 24. The cassette has 11,12,13,14,15,17,19,21,24 and 28.

Yea I can see how it takes practice. I am going to force myself to get outside a few times before the race to try to get more comfortable. Luckily my parents have a cottage an hour north of Huntsville. Will have to pay them a few visits before the race. Beats the flat congested roads of downtown Toronto!

You can get away with a VI of 1.15 with a half IM but when it comes to a full your going to be toast on the run. Your going to see a lot of "fast" bikers walking on the run. Someone coming off the bike in 20th place can easily work there way back up to top 5 with a good run on this course.

Ken,

I think it was 1200 as of June 1 (thats when the athlete list on the website was last updated at least). Im curious to see what the numbers are now. Muskoka email guy told me they would release the current bib list on July 16.... I have not seen anything yet, I'm waiting on that.

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"It's nice to be great, but far greater to be nice"

I just rode what I believe to be the full course on Friday including the out and back section on sea breeze. A couple of notes - not many people have probably ridden sea breeze, but will be happy to know that I found it to be the flattest section of the entire course, great road conditions - one of the nicest parts of the course! I didn't see a marked turnaround so just turned back shortly after 4.5k down the road knowing that without the out and back the course measured 9-10k short.
If anyone is planning to ride between now and race day I would be aware that they have started work on Brunel south of Baysville. It was single lane and over the two loops it probably meant chilling for 5-10 minutes total waiting. Plan on delays. Some sections in the construction area had been torn up and dirt put down but it was packed enough to not be any trouble. Pretty sure I'll be signing up in the next week.

I road the full course yesterday. We were told it was 7 km out and back on Seabreeze, and those last 2.5 km are not flat. Several short but very steep hills. (At least as steep the steepest as the hills on S. Portage and N. Portage.) The road conditions were quite poor on in the troughs between hills. I saw two different people skid considerably before recovering.

Did your GPS measure 180 km? Mine was over because I doubled back couple of times and did not take note of the distance. The official course route does not specify how far down Seabreeze to go. Hopefully your 4.5 km is correct.

My guess is that there may be some fence sitters waiting till the last moment to sign up in the sense that they are still recovering from another IM earlier this summer, or they did the Muskoka 70.3 and are trying to figure out what more they need to do to "get ready" for the full. At least I have spoken to a bunch of people in that mode. Also I wonder how many people trying to KQ at IMLP who don't will say, "I was so close and have the fitness.....may as well give it another shot at Muskoka since it is also driving distance" and they can leverage one training build for two shots at the show (or if you are on on the 12 IM plan, one training block and notch two tick marks towards the road to Kona rather than one).

Dev

I am a fence sitter Dev

What's the weather likely to be if there is an average ? Hate the wet and cold

Cheers
Steve