I see lots of older guys that I race against that look like Kevin!! We all ask is it possible?

If I am paying 800 bucks to enter the AG race, I want part of my AG money to test the Kona Qualifiers in my AG to prove they are not cheating. The money to test the Pros
should be coming from Pro money, sponsors, etc.

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Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

Boom Nutrition code 19F4Y3 $5 off 24 pack box | Bionic Runner | PowerCranks | Velotron | Spruzzamist

Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep

Completely agree that all KQ should be tested! Maybe even add the cost into the Kona fee. It already is $750 or so, what is another $50 (or whatever a test would cost).

 
>Although there is a grey line when it comes to getting testosterone.

What grey line? Seems like a razor-sharp line to me.

No. I am not

But if you stand on the podium and wear that shirt and that pose and that expression, I'm not automatically going to know that you are talking about one person. Particularly if am not, say... someone who has thousands of posts on Slowtwitch, . Perhaps I might not know the doping story here. Do you think they announced his doping at the awards? Do you think most of that crowd was following it? If so, I think you dramatically overestimate them. I had never even heard of Colom before a couple of weeks ago and I do have thousands of posts on Slowtwitch. I certainly didn't know him by sight until this thread

So maybe, just maybe I might be a little confused as to who you mean. Do you mean all of them? Do you mean one in particular? Which one. Hell we had somebody on this thread ask that question. In the very least, if I'm one of the other athletes on that podium, I'm having my moment that I've worked so hard for brought down by your protest.

Recognizing the collateral damage isn't dismissing the value of the protest. I don't think Colom should have been allowed to compete at all.

I think this is how the system should work. Kona qualifiers pay for the testing....not a tax on everyman. Every person who signs up for Kona pays an extra $200 (pick your number). $200 x 2000 entries and you have $400K going to test next year's round of qualifiers (it is a bit late to test this year's round of qualifiers once they got their slot because if they doped to get it, they stole from someone else...need to nail them before they get their slot...although some testing between accepting the slot and Kona might not be a bad idea).

In any case although Colom is allowed to race, and gets his second chance at racing (although he no longer does it for money), as slowman says, easier acceptance to the tri community would come if he reached out to integrate into the community. I don't think that Nina Kraft gets quite the same wrath even though she arguably cheated Natasha Badmann out of the biggest prize in our sport. Colom has not technically cheated anyone out of anything in triathlon (let's assume for a second that he is clean these days). He only cheated out other cyclists of a Protour contract with the likes of Astana and Katusha (although one could debate that the field of dopers is so deep for those jobs that if one guy chooses to not dope, there is a lineup from here to Almaty district in Khazakstan to step up and fill that slot on the team). To some degree, I don't care that much that he doped while playing the dice to be a pro cyclist. But if he wants to race in competitive triathlon (which Kona qual is), we need to know that he's clean these days.

In fairness, as he is not in the English language media, perhaps in the Spanish media he talks openly with fellow athletes and competitors about how he has moved on, is racing clean and would be glad to be tested at any time. Does anyone know if he is talking that way in his home country?

People can get it for medical reasons....not just performance enhancing. Obvioulsy this has been abused, especially by Moats!

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http://twitter.com/willrc91 --- instragram.com/willrc91

KM didn't need a prescription for his mirror.

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float , hammer , and jog

I'm in no mood to pay for your KQ. You wanna go to Kona? Awesome! You pay the testing costs when you get your roll down and qualify. Sign the check and pee in the jar please... next! I'm not going to subsidize your dreams.

 
>People can get it for medical reasons....not just performance enhancing. Obvioulsy this has been abused, especially by Moats!

There is no gray line. TUE=OK. No TUE=cheating.

I'm having my moment that I've worked so hard for brought down by your protest. //

If you are the athlete on that podium who did not dope, then your who cares whatever place you got, that no one was ever going to know about or see(except for some family, friend, or the few that actually hang around awards) just got national and international attention. I would say they need to thank Sam for plucking them from obscurity to their 15 minutes of fame. Personally i applaud Sam, i would love to see video of that ceremony. Usually the winner goes down the line and shakes hands with everyone, it would be great to see him stick his out then do the pull up and hair slick back. That would be priceless, anyone there and see this ceremony close up?

You obviously don't know the actual costs for these tests.

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Question: Last week I had a cold and mild flue. I went to the pharmacy and got some 'sudafed' to help get better. I started taking it on Friday and by last monday I was fine and stopped taking it.

Now as an age-grouper (hoping to go pro later this year) do I really need to worry about either getting a TUE or going through the banned WADA list (Pseudoephedrine is banned) to make sure I am not ingesting something illegal for professional athletes??

I think it is a ridiculous situation for the average-joe! But perfectly acceptable, indeed 100% necessary for a pro, whose livelihood is tied to the sport.

The only time I could see a system of AG testing working, is WTC announcing that it would drug-test certain Agers at Kona. Since the majority of the athletes there are hard-core and could be expected to take note of what goes in their body and it was announced well in advance it could both work and be fair/reasonable. It takes out areas of ambiguity. Which there would be if AG testing and hence requiring TUE's and checking the WADA code was enforced haphazardly at only some races. A 12hr IM athlete shouldn't be expected to worry about TUE's etc.

Just my thoughts, feel free to tare me down.

EDIT FWIW before Noosa last year I came down ill, but out of respect for myself and others I didn't take sudafed.

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Well, do you? I have never ordered one nor done one. I can't imagine it would be more than a couple hundred dollars when bought and administered in a mass amount. Whatever the cost, build it into the Kona fee. I would be happy to pay it. When I consider how much money I spent in 2012 to qualify at IMNYC and then do Kona bringing along my wife and son for both trips, whatever the tests cost are miniscule to all my other costs.

A 12hr IM athlete shouldn't be expected to worry about TUE's etc. //

Well if you are 60 to 80 years old, 12 hours is a very good time, even a record in some AG's. Don't worry, if you are a MOP they are not coming after you, so you can sleep with your cold medicines at night. But for the pointy end of the race, they train like pros most of them, they get perks for performance, they should have to endure at least some of what pros have to. Tighten the list of banned substances, get rid of the where are you now rule that pros follow, and it would be pretty painless and easy. Except for those that are doping of course, but that would be the point, right?

 

>Just my thoughts, feel free to tare me down.

That's a different argument. I was just arguing that the line is clear. Not that the line is drawn in the right place.

I could listen to arguments that the bar is set too high to get a TUE, causing undue expense and stress on people with truly legitimate, severe medical conditions.

But with regards to pseudoephedrine, it's a threshold substance, like caffeine. 150 micrograms/ml, which is over the recommended dose of over-the-counter Sudafed. You were fine. Unless you were also on a diuretic, in which case pseudoephedrine is flat-out banned. (masking agent type stuff). That is a bit confusing. But in your case it works as it was supposed to. It lets you do commonsense stuff to help your flu, but would nail a doper using the stuff to dangerously cut weight or mask some other drug.

Of course making even more common-sense rules for AGers creates two problems. First, it creates gray areas. Second, it means that WADA, or whoever, has to maintain two separate rulesets. Both of those create more confusion.

I think the system, as-is, strikes a reasonable balance. I could see tweaking some things (lower-cost TUEs, maybe make a few more things threshold substances), but I think WADA, in general, pretty much nails it. (except for possibly being X years behind the state-of-the-art)

Some very good points, you summarise the issues very well.

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http://twitter.com/willrc91 --- instragram.com/willrc91

I'm not sure what the value is in testing Kona qualifiers, if it is only at the point of time of qualifying. KM was nailed by an OOC test, I suspect people of his ilk are smart enough to not 'glow' at the time of competition. OOC testing for age groupers would present additional challenges...

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Founder of THE TRIATHLON COLLECTIVE (Closed Facebook Group). A SBR discussion group without the white noise/trolling!

. [pink] Good to know Zoot doesn't take on dopers, otherwise I might have pegged the guy in the red shirt as JaJa

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Founder of THE TRIATHLON COLLECTIVE (Closed Facebook Group). A SBR discussion group without the white noise/trolling!

I guess you would never want to do Worlds as an AGer. They do random tests for finishers of all times. The first year they did this, a number of racers all of the sudden drop out from going.

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Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

Boom Nutrition code 19F4Y3 $5 off 24 pack box | Bionic Runner | PowerCranks | Velotron | Spruzzamist

Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep

lol I have, (well actually I got gastro night before and pulled out). I highly doubt taking sudafed when I'm sick makes me a cheater :-) Especially since I wasn't anywhere near a triathlon.

Worlds, like Kona are reasonable places where you could test athletes. They could be more expected to check what goes into their body rather then the casual athletes who make up the vast majority of WTC races.

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http://twitter.com/willrc91 --- instragram.com/willrc91

The benefits of EPO may not be long lasting BUT the benefits of the training you did for YEARS on EPO do last a lifetime.

From someone who coaches athletes who have to race (and have raced) against Colom what he did for years as a cyclist is still cheating the AG triathletes he races against today. He wasn't a hack cyclist either, he was winning stages and races from 2004-2009 (2009 Paris- Nice stage)

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Dave Latourette
http://www.TTENation.com

Agreed. One million times over. Not just the strength gain, but the preferential coaching, sponsorship, gear, race experience, and lifestyle gain to continue to train at a level far above a non-doper. A doper gets improvement in everything on top of everything repeatedly as he/she wins and wins. Lance took his doping winnings and used it to buy even more and better training to make him even better. A former doper is far faster for the rest of his life than he would be having never doped at all. Allowing once to race against normals is bullshit. Take a stand like this guy did. Bravo!

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Zen and the Art of Triathlon. Strava Workout Log
Interviews with Chris McCormack, Helle Frederikson, Angela Naeth, and many more.
http://www.zentriathlon.com

"He only cheated out other cyclists"

Hey Dev ... the training benefits he gained in his doped up years of training are life long.

As well ... saying he dos not do it for money any longer I would question. He has sponsors AND he has a business centered around coaching (HA), and a triathlon team called something like "Toni Coloms World" (its on his race kit)

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Dave Latourette
http://www.TTENation.com

I know you will all be well ahead of me at that point in the race and will probably be watching you pass by on the Queen K for sure. I can't wait to yell some shit at this first class douche as he cheats his way towards the finish.

That picture of him on the podium pisses be off beyond words. What a dick.

BTW, Sam has quickly become one of my favorite dudes in the sport. Fun guy to follow.

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