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Re: What's with all the talk about Serena Williams being the greatest athlete of all time? [imsparticus] [ In reply to ]
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Best female athlete is Marit Bjoergen.

But I love what Nike is doing.
The company is really good making fat white men feel uncomfortable.
A group of people that is not an important customer group for Nike.
Nike is getting young people to love the brand, and one of the reason is that the people that hate Nike now have no appeal to young people.
Great sports marketing.
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Re: What's with all the talk about Serena Williams being the greatest athlete of all time? [Lucky489] [ In reply to ]
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Secretariat only beat 3 horses in the Belmont, maybe 4? How can you add him to the list?
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Re: What's with all the talk about Serena Williams being the greatest athlete of all time? [ericmulk] [ In reply to ]
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Nope, most people outside of surfing areas have never heard of him
---
Wait. Kelly Slater's a dude?






Take a short break from ST and read my blog:
http://tri-banter.blogspot.com/
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Re: What's with all the talk about Serena Williams being the greatest athlete of all time? [runner66] [ In reply to ]
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Doesn't that make the fact he ran the fastest time in history a record that still stands today even more impressive. He could have coasted and not won by 31 and 1/2 lengths. Yes should have been in pink.

If someone can Beaman's jump at altitude in Mexico City makes him a jump in the rest of his career he never got within 2 feet of. Why not?
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Re: What's with all the talk about Serena Williams being the greatest athlete of all time? [Tri-Banter] [ In reply to ]
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For no reason, my personal favorite moments I've ever watched live on TV in sports:
5. Greg Lemond, final TT in the 1989 Tour de France. 32 mph avg on a steel bike, ladies and gentlemen. 8 seconds. Fignon likely lost because of his pony tail.
4. Katie Ledecky, women's 800 free, London 2012. Ledecky is 15 and was a complete unknown six months prior. No one knew who she was. Ledecky takes it out hard, everyone expected her to die. She was swimming next to the legend Adlington in front of a hostile crowd. She didn't die. The entire crowd was stunned into silence. In retrospect, we were watching the emergence of (undoubtedly) the greatest female swimmer in history.
3. Usain Bolt winning the 100m in Beijing. Absolutely astonishing. 9.69 at a trot. This was watching someone do something they were born to do.
2. Mariano Rivera's blown save in the 2004 ALCS. Midnight at Fenway, Game 4. Yankees up 4-3 in the bottom of the ninth, up 3-0 on the series. In comes Sandman, who was 6-0 in the postseason saves against the Red Sox. GD it, not again. Surely my beloved Sox are screwed. But no. The single greatest turning point in my life as a Red Sox fan. The world was suddenly not so dark.
1. 4x100 relay, Beijing. France in the lead, the absolute beast Alain Bernard on the anchor. Jason Lezak, long the workhorse of the US sprinting corps, a swimmer who's always been solid and reliable if not astounding, dives in with a half a body length to make up against a former world record holder. Bernard goes out hard, surely it's over. Suddenly, Lezak comes off the wall like an absolute torpedo. His kick is literally rooster tailing the water. Bernard starts to tire. The rest is history. 46.06 split. WTF. Lezak will have that on his tombstone. Phelps gets his 8 Golds. The single greatest relay swim of all time. Lezak said afterwards that he saw Bernard on the turn and thought "not this time". Inspirational. The greatest relay ever, and I saw both the 1984 4x200 and 2000 4x100 live.
Last edited by: hiro11: Sep 8, 18 10:59
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Re: What's with all the talk about Serena Williams being the greatest athlete of all time? [Tri-Banter] [ In reply to ]
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Nope, most people outside of surfing areas have never heard of him
---
Wait. Kelly Slater's a dude?


I watching prime time Saturday sports on CBS right now, and Kelly Slater's name is mentioned just about every couple minutes. IT is the first ever tour contest in a wave pool, that Kelly Slater helped develop, and it carries his name. Really cool show, if you are home and bored, take a look..

A whole lot more people know Kelly Slater after this morning..
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Re: What's with all the talk about Serena Williams being the greatest athlete of all time? [IT] [ In reply to ]
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 I agree with you.

If the question is - who is the world’s greatest athlete, many of those mentioned are poor choices. Joe Montana may have been a great quarterback, but being able to throw a football does not equal being a great athlete. The same with being a great golfer. It doesn’t mean you’re a great athlete. I’ve seen fat guys win major golf tournaments. I’ve seen lots of fat NFL lineman and MLB pitchers.

A great athlete must, at the very least, be fast (and quick), strong, have great balance, body control, and have endurance. Decathletes possess these traits. Gymnasts possess many of these traits. Boxers and wrestlers too.

If you can’t run a 5K in under 18 minutes, you’re not a great all around athlete. If you can't do at least 25-30 pull-ups, you are not a great all-around athlete. If you can’t run a hundred meters in under sometime (I don’t know what that time is), you are not a great all-around athlete.

Personally, I think the folks who excel on American ninja warrior are far better athletes than your average MLB, NFL, NBA, and NHL player. How do you think Serena William would do in a local 5K race or as an American ninja warrior contestant?
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Re: What's with all the talk about Serena Williams being the greatest athlete of all time? [hiro11] [ In reply to ]
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hiro11 wrote:
For no reason, my personal favorite moments I've ever watched live on TV in sports:

5. Greg Lemond, final TT in the 1989 Tour de France. 32 mph avg on a steel bike, ladies and gentlemen. 8 seconds. Fignon likely lost because of his pony tail.
4. Katie Ledecky, women's 800 free, London 2012. Ledecky is 15 and was a complete unknown six months prior. No one knew who she was. Ledecky takes it out hard, everyone expected her to die. She was swimming next to the legend Adlington in front of a hostile crowd. She didn't die. The entire crowd was stunned into silence. In retrospect, we were watching the emergence of (undoubtedly) the greatest female swimmer in history.
3. Usain Bolt winning the 100m in Beijing. Absolutely astonishing. 9.69 at a trot. This was watching someone do something they were born to do.
2. Mariano Rivera's blown save in the 2004 ALCS. Midnight at Fenway, Game 4. Yankees up 4-3 in the bottom of the ninth, up 3-0 on the series. In comes Sandman, who was 6-0 in the postseason saves against the Red Sox. GD it, not again. Surely my beloved Sox are screwed. But no. The single greatest turning point in my life as a Red Sox fan. The world was suddenly not so dark.
1. 4x100 relay, Beijing. France in the lead, the absolute beast Alain Bernard on the anchor. Jason Lezak, long the workhorse of the US sprinting corps, a swimmer who's always been solid and reliable if not astounding, dives in with a half a body length to make up against a former world record holder. Bernard goes out hard, surely it's over. Suddenly, Lezak comes off the wall like an absolute torpedo. His kick is literally rooster tailing the water. Bernard starts to tire. The rest is history. 46.06 split. WTF. Lezak will have that on his tombstone. Phelps gets his 8 Golds. The single greatest relay swim of all time. Lezak said afterwards that he saw Bernard on the turn and thought "not this time". Inspirational. The greatest relay ever, and I saw both the 1984 4x200 and 2000 4x100 live.


I just wanted to say thanks for replaying that Beijing 4x100 relay. Best post of this thread. I felt like I was in the water in Lezak's body torpedoing off the wall at 50m shutting Bernard down

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_QPYiHi_Vs4










Back to this thread, Serena on deck later today at Flushing Meadows for a crack at Grand Slam title number 24. Go Serena!!!!
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Re: What's with all the talk about Serena Williams being the greatest athlete of all time? [imsparticus] [ In reply to ]
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imsparticus wrote:


If you can’t run a 5K in under 18 minutes, you’re not a great all around athlete. If you can't do at least 25-30 pull-ups, you are not a great all-around athlete. If you can’t run a hundred meters in under sometime (I don’t know what that time is), you are not a great all-around athlete.

Back when she first started setting world records, I remember one of Katie Ledecky's coaches describing her as an 8 minute miler during running and dryland cross training time.
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Re: What's with all the talk about Serena Williams being the greatest athlete of all time? [FLA Jill] [ In reply to ]
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FLA Jill wrote:
imsparticus wrote:


If you can’t run a 5K in under 18 minutes, you’re not a great all around athlete. If you can't do at least 25-30 pull-ups, you are not a great all-around athlete. If you can’t run a hundred meters in under sometime (I don’t know what that time is), you are not a great all-around athlete.


Back when she first started setting world records, I remember one of Katie Ledecky's coaches describing her as an 8 minute miler during running and dryland cross training time.


The poster talking about pull ups and 18 min 5K and not having a clue about fast 100m run times?....where did he pull 30 pullups out of the air. I would actually be interested to see how many Phelps could do when he beat Cavic in the 100 fly at Beijing and how many say an NFL football running back could do, or Usein Bolt of someone like Federer (I doubt Federer would get much past 25, but maybe I underestimate him)

I see here that Phelps routinely does 34:

https://www.yourswimlog.com/michael-phelps-numbers/

It looks like in the 100 fly he takes around 20 pulls per 50 meters...so around 40 per 100m, in line with that pull up number(I am trying to figure out how much weight would be beneficial for lat pulldowns for around 50 pulls for 100m....so I am doing some sets of 50 lat pull downs, but have a long long way to go at 100% body weight (well, its kind of impossible because you leave the ground...trying to work up to 70% body weight for lots of reps.

I doubt Phelps could break 18 minutes for 5K....his knees and ankles just hyperextend to much to run with any degree of efficiency. But he does have one of the biggest engines on the planet so shuffling around at 3:48 per km should be OK
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Re: What's with all the talk about Serena Williams being the greatest athlete of all time? [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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The point is Dev, if you don’t have serious upper body strength, I don’t think you can claim to be the world’s greatest athlete. Same with endurance. Do you disagree with that?
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Re: What's with all the talk about Serena Williams being the greatest athlete of all time? [imsparticus] [ In reply to ]
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She is among the greatest for sure, but let's not mix up tennis, soccer and such sports with the tracks, cycling and swimming !

by the way hasn't IAAF pushed the 5nmol/L testosterone limit rule recently?

how does Serena fair in this matter it looks like there is some argument on the internet
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Re: What's with all the talk about Serena Williams being the greatest athlete of all time? [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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The poster talking about pull ups and 18 min 5K and not having a clue about fast 100m run times?


It's laughable. Does that mean a good athlete runs 18:00 and a bad only manages 17:45? Of is 25 pull-ups the line and if you only manage 23 you're useless?


What about the ability to jump? Or lift a certain amount of weight over your head? Or running speed? Or acceleration ability? Or hand-eye? Or the speed you generate in swing (tennis, golf, squash, cricket, badminton). Or co-ordination, balance, hand-speed etc.




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Re: What's with all the talk about Serena Williams being the greatest athlete of all time? [imsparticus] [ In reply to ]
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Personally, I think the folks who excel on American ninja warrior are far better athletes than your average MLB, NFL, NBA, and NHL player. How do you think Serena William would do in a local 5K race or as an American ninja warrior contestant?

-------

You think the average pro athlete in MLB or NFL or NBA couldn't do AN warrior? Half the obstacles are what balance/strength, and you think those type of athletes would struggle? I dont

ETA: Go watch a pro day and you'll see the athleticism from those type of athletes. Shuttle run, agility, power, etc. They'd have zero problem with an ANW course.

-USAT L2 coach, M.S. Exercise Physiology
https://www.instagram.com/alloutmultisport
http://www.aomultisport.com
Last edited by: B_Doughtie: Sep 8, 18 14:22
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Re: What's with all the talk about Serena Williams being the greatest athlete of all time? [imsparticus] [ In reply to ]
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imsparticus wrote:
The point is Dev, if you don’t have serious upper body strength, I don’t think you can claim to be the world’s greatest athlete. Same with endurance. Do you disagree with that?

OK do you think these athletes could do 30 pullups:

  • Shaquille O'Neill
  • Katie Ledecky
  • Simon Whitfield
  • Mark Allen
  • Mo Farah (maybe he could....due to his lightness, but I don't think so)
  • Andy Murray
  • Barry Bonds
  • Larry Bird
  • Wayne Gretzky (maybe borderline, as hockey players have crazy hand strength, which is super important for lots of pull ups)
  • Frank Shorter
  • Tiger Woods
  • Lionel Messi
  • George Best
  • Earl Campbell


I could go on. Some sports require leg endurance, some leg brute strength, some total body power to weight, some upper body power to weight. I think your random selection of pull ups is kind of arbitrary (I say this as someone who got tested on this exercise 3x per year as part of my armed forces fitness test.) Its a bit random because it is also dependend on fast twitch muscle fiber and bone geometry. I bet you that Sarah Sjontrom (100m free and fly gold from Rio) can't even do 30 as pullups are generally much harder with the bone geoemtry that women have (which is why in the military the women had a different standard from the guys).
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Re: What's with all the talk about Serena Williams being the greatest athlete of all time? [Lucky489] [ In reply to ]
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Lucky489 wrote:
Doesn't that make the fact he ran the fastest time in history a record that still stands today even more impressive. He could have coasted and not won by 31 and 1/2 lengths. Yes should have been in pink.


If someone can Beaman's jump at altitude in Mexico City makes him a jump in the rest of his career he never got within 2 feet of. Why not?


Thank you for giving me the excuse to post this moment. Chic Anderson's call as Secratariat pulls away on the far turn: "He's moving like a tre---men---dous machine" will never be matched as a real time description of an all time performance and even after hearing it hundreds of times never fails to raise goosebumps.


Last edited by: zekgb: Sep 8, 18 14:31
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Re: What's with all the talk about Serena Williams being the greatest athlete of all time? [imsparticus] [ In reply to ]
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Can Serena hit a baseball?
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Re: What's with all the talk about Serena Williams being the greatest athlete of all time? [jimatbeyond] [ In reply to ]
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she's looking great at the open today
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Re: What's with all the talk about Serena Williams being the greatest athlete of all time? [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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So what is your answer to the question Dev? Do you think someone without serious upper body strength can claim to be the world’s best athlete? We can debate how that is measured.

And by the way, it appears the United States Army Fitness test has lower run standards for woman too. Is that because the bone geometry of woman?


devashish_paul wrote:
imsparticus wrote:
The point is Dev, if you don’t have serious upper body strength, I don’t think you can claim to be the world’s greatest athlete. Same with endurance. Do you disagree with that?

OK do you think these athletes could do 30 pullups:

  • Shaquille O'Neill
  • Katie Ledecky
  • Simon Whitfield
  • Mark Allen
  • Mo Farah (maybe he could....due to his lightness, but I don't think so)
  • Andy Murray
  • Barry Bonds
  • Larry Bird
  • Wayne Gretzky (maybe borderline, as hockey players have crazy hand strength, which is super important for lots of pull ups)
  • Frank Shorter
  • Tiger Woods
  • Lionel Messi
  • George Best
  • Earl Campbell


I could go on. Some sports require leg endurance, some leg brute strength, some total body power to weight, some upper body power to weight. I think your random selection of pull ups is kind of arbitrary (I say this as someone who got tested on this exercise 3x per year as part of my armed forces fitness test.) Its a bit random because it is also dependend on fast twitch muscle fiber and bone geometry. I bet you that Sarah Sjontrom (100m free and fly gold from Rio) can't even do 30 as pullups are generally much harder with the bone geoemtry that women have (which is why in the military the women had a different standard from the guys).
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Re: What's with all the talk about Serena Williams being the greatest athlete of all time? [stevie g] [ In reply to ]
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Big loser today.
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Re: What's with all the talk about Serena Williams being the greatest athlete of all time? [runner66] [ In reply to ]
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runner66 wrote:
Secretariat only beat 3 horses in the Belmont, maybe 4? How can you add him to the list?


No horse has beat his time at the major races. Frankly, none were really even close. Man'o'War was close but the records were not being kept at the time.

Of course he is a horse, not a human so it may not be applicable to the OP's question.
Last edited by: NealH: Sep 8, 18 15:17
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Re: What's with all the talk about Serena Williams being the greatest athlete of all time? [B_Doughtie] [ In reply to ]
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Well, you would be wrong. Several have tried. None move on past the first round. https://www.americanninjawarriornation.com/...erican-ninja-warrior




B_Doughtie wrote:
Personally, I think the folks who excel on American ninja warrior are far better athletes than your average MLB, NFL, NBA, and NHL player. How do you think Serena William would do in a local 5K race or as an American ninja warrior contestant?

-------

You think the average pro athlete in MLB or NFL or NBA couldn't do AN warrior? Half the obstacles are what balance/strength, and you think those type of athletes would struggle? I dont

ETA: Go watch a pro day and you'll see the athleticism from those type of athletes. Shuttle run, agility, power, etc. They'd have zero problem with an ANW course.
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Re: What's with all the talk about Serena Williams being the greatest athlete of all time? [imsparticus] [ In reply to ]
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Daley Thompson
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Re: What's with all the talk about Serena Williams being the greatest athlete of all time? [imsparticus] [ In reply to ]
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And they did that on how much practice? If you think the (i guess you said the ANW athletes who excel) AN warrior athlete is better athlete than an NFL/MLB or pro league sport, we'll just agree to disagree. I dont give 2 shits what your link says.


ETA: I'll put money none of those AN Warriors could "make it to the next round" in any agility/strength set that those types of athletes do. Shuttle/bench/sprint/agility, etc.

ETA #2- 2/3rds of the ANW athletes don't make it to the end of the course, so do they suck at it?

-USAT L2 coach, M.S. Exercise Physiology
https://www.instagram.com/alloutmultisport
http://www.aomultisport.com
Last edited by: B_Doughtie: Sep 8, 18 15:35
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Re: What's with all the talk about Serena Williams being the greatest athlete of all time? [imsparticus] [ In reply to ]
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imsparticus wrote:
Well, you would be wrong. Several have tried. None move on past the first round. https://www.americanninjawarriornation.com/...erican-ninja-warrior

Ninja Warrior/Sasuke isn't so much about pure strength as strength-weight ratio, which puts a large athlete at a disadvantage compared to a smaller person with a background in something like gymnastics or rock climbing where they've long worked to find the perfect balance between muscle and body weight.
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