I suspect more of that crash has to do with pushing 470 watts at threshold, being F'd, by being tight on line by the barriers and maybe the position.

The biggest failure was somehow allowing him to continue riding and completely missing anything from the concussion protocols.

I hope you take on riding Merckx TTs and have some real fun going forward instead of trolling on here about nothing! ;)

What they mean by head down position is that the rider is looking straight down rather than even peaking a couple feet in front of them. A lot time trial specialist tilt their helmet up around 2 inches and look straight down, most of the time directly at the top of their front wheel or wherever they placed their bike computer.
He would have done the same if it was a road bike TT so the argument that TT bikes need to go is invalid. Most of the time it is because the team car behind the rider would tell them when a hazard or turn is coming up on the course so all they need to do is ride straight unless told what is coming up.

User error. Would happen on any bike. The bike isn't responsible for the poor decision-making of the rider.


A good TT position doesn't mean bad vision.....

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Jonathan Caron / Professional Coach / ironman champions / age group world champions
Jonnyo Coaching
Instargram

Why?

A guy crashed because he wasn't looking where he was going, and misjudged. Seems like a calculated risk, and the calculation didn't pan out. I don't see a need to legislate out reasonable risk.

This.

It looked like he still had some vision as he was following the road markings, it’s just the course didn’t follow them.

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My Strava | My Instagram | Summerville, SC | 35-39 AG | 4:41 (70.3), 10:05 (140.6) | 3x70.3, 1x140.6 | Cat 2 Cyclist

Yes, there is no need for drastic action here as the risk of the position is self regulating. Aerodynamically you should look straight down the whole time. But the contest isn't 'who is the most aero', it's 'who completes the course fastest'.

There is a debate to be had about the safety of that specific barrier placement.

Banning TT bikes won't help, in fact we need more of them. Everyone should ride a TT bike. We need more good guys on TT bikes to stop the bad guys on TT bikes.

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What's your CdA?

I only saw the clip, and it didn't look bad from that. But, I suppose that would depend on the course leading up to it. If it were a blind approach, without a sightline to the barrier on entry...maybe there's an argument, particularly if they weren't allowed to scout ahead of time.

Were they allowed to scout the course beforehand, or was it "blind"? Either way it still seems:

1. They scouted the course and should have known, or...
2. It was a blind course, and they should have been paying more attention.

Barring something egregious, I'm probably still on the side of "hey, watch where you are going."

A lot of races I've done will go around with spray paint and mark any egregious road hazards (potholes and such). Wonder if they could do the same in situations like these to warn the rider that the barriers are going to deviate from the road markings.

A friend sent me this and I thought of you

You say that like people wouldn't put their heads down on road bikes. You'll see hoods turned in, long stems, and heads down.

More interesting is the proposal made after bernal's crash regarding allowing more tilt, which may allow riders to have the same kinds of benefits and keeping their head down, but being able to keep their heads up.

After watching that clip several more times, there's just nothing to mark. The course literally goes straight, as the road markings are making a gentle bend. He literally road straight at the barrier for 5 full seconds before he crashed into it. A glance up the road at any time within the first 4 seconds should have been enough to slightly alter course and avoid a collision. The sight line is completely clear, there's nothing to prevent anyone from seeing anything and there's nothing sudden about the change in course direction, or the change in road direction. He literally just needed to keep going straight.

I probably come down on the 'watch where you're going' side of this one, just not sure what was the point of barricading off half the road. As far as I could tell it's straight road leading in, then a barrier gradually cuts off the left half over the span of 20m or so. Can't really see what it's blocking off though.

Let me follow the logic here: someone else assumes a known risky position on a bike, crashes, so you naturally got rid of a bike you own? I know you troll this board with Luddite opinions. Out of curiosity, when was the Golden Age? When was the sweet spot where there weren’t carbon shoes, or TT bikes, but we weren’t wearing outfits from Chariots of Fire? Or would it in fact be preferable to compete like the ancient Greeks, au naturel?

Looks to me like the course goes across the entrance/exit(not sure where this was...RH or LH drive?) ramp/or Fork-in-the-road and follows the right hand path. Sure the barriers could have been straighter....but, literally a single glance up the road at any point in the 10s leading into the section was enough to see what's coming, and basically not do anything.

Let's ignore the problems with synthetic's argument...

We all spend too much money on bikes...

Too much time shoppings, trying to fix new tech.
Driving around trying to find people who can fix new tech for us.

We should be cycling.

Not fixing weird sh#t.
Not shopping for new sh#t.

The constant obsession with new stuff...

In the long run, is a massive negative for bike racing and triathlon.

I fully support any effort to bring this problem in check.

That said I don't see anything happening..

Triathlon and bike racing is mostly about selling bikes and bike stuff

Having fun outside. Fitness. Racing...

All considered "necessary evils" by the bike industry.

Yeah the more I look at it the less I think the barrier was unsafe. It seems to cut off the entry to the corner a bit but there may be road furniture obscured behind it. I can understand why he didn't see it during short glances up, but it's got to be 99% on him. Based on his far left road position maybe he thought the course continued down the road to the left? Idk

Came to post this photo (or similar), leaving satisfied.

^^^^^This.

Some folks will ride head down regardless of what kind of bike they are on (ex. Fignon below). The UCI is also pushing the rider position angle to deflect from the issue over concussion protocol.

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ECMGN Therapy Silicon Valley:
Depression, Neurocognitive problems, Dementias (Testing and Evaluation), Trauma and PTSD, Traumatic Brain Injury (TBI)

yeah, watching the video you can see that although the slight kink outward in the barriers is what caught him, kung was veering towards them anyway - following the lines in the road that he could see looking down, rather than having any idea what was happening in front of him.

use of barriers with feet that stick out into the course is bad and having a kink in them is worse. they may also have closed off the entry to the upcoming corner more than necessary but none of these things would have been a problem if kung was looking ahead even a bit as might reasonably be expected. maybe barriers with advertising are good as they are more visible than thin metal.

as always head to escape collective where Ronan has a great article on this and why you can't make rules to mandate where a rider is looking

What a lovely hip angle this belgian has

What Belgian?

The ironic thing is that the UCI will likely use this crash to come up with even dumber TT bike rules. GCN published a decent article discussing this:

https://www.globalcyclingnetwork.com/tech/news/head-down-tt-position-dangers-back-in-the-spotlight-despite-new-uci-rules


I do agree with Dowsett's comments. They should eliminate the aerobar rise rule as it could be argued that this makes the riders lower their head too much to close the gap, whereas if they could angle the aerobars way higher ( Richard Varga or Vincent Luis) then they could close the gap and still be able to see the road.

ahh you are right, that a roadie TT which I have done, likely you will put the head down still. But at least you have hands closer to brakes for quicker reaction with a wider arm carriage for stability to turn / take a pothole






I have been hit by cars on a bike before. It really hurts, and thank god nothing worse than a broken bone or two. Unless you are training daily on some dreamland closed course, most of us have to train in areas with cars present. In this world, the amatures want what the top guys have...