I bet if you raced crits for a summer your descending would improve dramatically.

I don’t disagree with that. But might also be out all summer with a broken collarbone! I was just saying that not everyone has the ability to get the descending skills needed for technical riding even if they ride outside all the time. It helps but can’t prepare someone for twisty fast descents.

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Twitter - Instagram

I was sure that this was a parody when I first read it:
“Now, I get up at 3am and ride in the sunroom in total darkness and silence, with only the TR graph in front of me. “

I’m still not entirely convinced that it isn’t.

I'm pretty sure everyone here goes to work, and back, driving their cars.
It's by far the most common death occuring transport system in NA, probably worldwide.
Never heard of anyone simulating driving to work in their garages because it's too dangerous ....

OP, are you sure your wife doesn't forbid you to ride outside ;-P ? ...

Louis :-)

You can’t be serious. In England, cyclists are 15 times more likely to be killed on UK roads, and far more likely to be injured, and that’s most likely the case anywhere in the world.

You should get your facts straight before you post.

AHermrmmm !!

http://pedbikeinfo.org/...res/facts_safety.cfm

That's more than 80% for motorised vehicles, less than 20% for both cyclists and pedestrians (lots more pedestrians than cyclists).


Louis :-)

One race recently suggests you are very much wrong: Nice 70.3 WC. That course had a moderately technical descent and people (noted here) and at the race were totally unable to ride it without huge drama or fear. I went past people who were almost not moving at times (when I was full out) and it blew my mind that they were in the WC with such terrible skills.

More and more triathletes can pedal but cannot ride, and the indoor trend is exacerbating that problem.

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"Only those who risk going too far can possibly find out how far one can go." T.S. Elliot | Cycle2Tri.com
Sponsors: SciCon | | Every Man Jack

Fitness is not skill.

Damn straight.

I get training indoors, I really do - it's so time efficient, weather doesn't matter, and it's superb for sprint drills or simulating very long climbs when you live in a flat area. But after too much indoor, when you get out on the road, there's so much that's off: your braking distance, technical handling, skill in the wet, speed judgement etc. Sure, increased fitness may lead to a clearer head which is great in certain situations, but man, I wouldn't want to be anywhere near the OP in a crit...

A lack of high speed situations is usually the reason for poor handling. Learning to hold position and corner in a group going 40kmh+ for extended periods can easily make up for no downhills. If you only ever ride indoors, how often will you get that?

If I ride outside how often does one get to practice going into a corner with a group at that speed? Only when riding with a group. And I rarely ride with a group because I need to get my rides done on my family’s schedule. Not everyone has the benefit of being able to ride with groups even if they ride outside all the time. Some of us have families and jobs and cannot wait for a group ride and some don’t have good group rides around them.

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Assuming the original post isn't a joke . . . I'm going to come down in the middle of this discussion, but ONLY when it comes to no-draft triathlon. When you go an entire year without ever once turning, holding your own balance, evaluating road conditions, reacting to wind, rain, etc., you cannot keep from losing skills and confidence. I don't want to race anywhere near somebody with that skill level / lack of practice. There's a reason racers can't wait to get away from the crashfest that is Cat. 5 racing.

BUT having said that, in a no-draft triathlon, it shouldn't be dangerous to me. We should never be that close to each other. It should actually help those with bike handling skills be more competitive. So, as long as you don't try to race close to anyone . . . to each their own.

It is NOT a joke. I love my 3:30am workouts. Im excited about them when I go to sleep. Even my 3-6 hour rides on Sun, im on the bike by 4am at the latest.

I love watching the sun come up.

You're comment about my comment makes no sense. I was specifically asked about skill, not fitness.

But... I would argue that structured TrainerRoad indoor workouts are more beneficial for fitness than riding outdoors. I don't think I would have ever completed Ironman's if it wasn't for the TR high volume full distance triathlon plan.

Does your friend have anything to say about you "exploring new places" with his wife?

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"They know f_ck-all over at Slowtwitch"
- Lionel Sanders

I will get the bigger problem there by farrrrrr were people using their carbon race wheels for the first time on a real descent and being shocked at how much less braking power they had compared to rim wheels.

I seriously doubt people who train for Im races can't descned at at least 15mph. My friends who are regular folks who ride maybe three times a year can descend atspeed on twisty mtn trails no problem.

"As far as the elements - I ride in a non-temp controlled sun room with the outside door open. So, I am always training in the elements - only without a comforting wind :)

Setup is a Dumb Trainer."

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If you are riding a trainer without a fan or a means of measuring power, I can assure you that you are not getting as good of a workout as you would outside. It is very hard to generate the same amount of watts indoors as you do outside and takes a lot of practice and discipline.

The first time I rode a trainer with no fan and a powermeter, I struggled to maintain the watts that would be recovery pace outside, even though sweat was pouring out of me (and I'm not a heavy sweater).

To be efficient, I found even watching a movie was difficult unless I'd seen it before. When you see people say "I did a 6 hr trainer ride" chances are what they did was the equivalent of riding around outside at 12 mph for 6 hrs. Not without benefit, but not exactly optimizing their training either.

Except for one thing, that descent hardly required any braking for a skilled rider.

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"Only those who risk going too far can possibly find out how far one can go." T.S. Elliot | Cycle2Tri.com
Sponsors: SciCon | | Every Man Jack

I'll agree with that, but you also don't hug the brakes until you're doing <15mph on a steep downhill unless you are unconfident in your brakes, which is the case with people riding their carbon rims for the first or near-first times on a big downhill which is 10x more likely than people being just so scared that they're doing <12mph on a twisty downhill.

Even my 8-year old daughter who doesn't even like riding fast can take a curvy downhill over 15mph on a kids bike, so I'd say that it's more likely that these riders on that IM course, while lacking good descent skills yes, were farrrrrr more limited by unexpected equipment limitations. Even when I've ridden with totally-retired non-racing casual bicyclists on charity rides, they can take the descents at a surprisingly fast pace.

I once swapped out my brakes for an markedly inferior one (I didn't know it would be that inferior at the time - but it was cheap!) and while it worked ok on flats, I was horrified on a 8% downhill that I was barely able to stop once I was over 17mph. I took that descent at under 10mph, and I'm a pretty confident descender (I'd go over 2x as fast with ultegra brakes). That's what you're dealing with.

I know people should absolutely hard-test their equipment before race day, but I think a lot of folks don't bust out their race wheels with the carbon-type brake surfaces on truly big descents as much as they should before attempting it in a race situation.

I don't really see any other way to sensibly interpret your responses other than an attempt to correlate or conflate skill and fitness.
I thought exactly as 42x16ss appears to, that you were somehow confused about the difference.
You've stated "I feel I have more skill" [presumably since starting to ride only indoors?] and you then only talked about training plans, workouts and fitness. How could your skill have improved, and what's your basis for feeling it has, when you have ceased using it?

Bravo. I don't understand why those who talk of choice and freedom while living in fear don't understand that freedom itself is primarily just a choice you make.
True freedom has little to do with personal wealth, the right to own/use guns, or where you live. Some of the least free people are simultaneously some of the richest and most powerful.
None of that refers to the OP, but a comment on society as a whole.

So one of your arguments for indoor training is that you can watch the sun come up? You must be able to see how some of us find that strange, right?

WOW.
I hope you are correct

I haven’t risen outside since getting Assioma duel sided pedals

If the wattage numbers are correct I am already happy with my power

Are you saying it will be even higher outside?

Do you think Assiomas are reliable/accurate?

I have no idea about the pedals, but if you are riding inside without a fan, I would expect to see significantly higher watts when riding outside at the same RPE.

And nobody should ever be completely happy with their power...you should always want more!

I dont see why that is strange. I train at the time I am most productive in training. For me, it is before daylight. This also goes for swimming and running. Pool opens at 5am. I am at the door at 4:50am in case the lifeguards get there early.

I had to come up with this plan and mentally prepare for it every night in the beginning. This was my trade off to doing an Ironman. Training couldnt impact work. Training couldnt impact family. That left one area that I could impact... sleep. Train when everyone else is asleep. I grew to love it.

Btw, today was strength day and I was at the gym at 4:40am.

Also for the poster above about watching movies. I also CANNOT do it. I cant even listen to music. The only thing I have is an Ipad with TrainerRoad and the hum of the trainer to keep me company.