Maybe lauf anywhere.

i think you have it about right.

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Dan Empfield
aka Slowman

There are a number of different bikes that would fit in either, a few off the top of my head...

Road bikes which work fine for a bit of gravel (i.e. can handle tires up to ~35mm wide):
Cervelo Caledonia
Trek Domane
Canyon Endurace
Allied All-Road

Gravel bikes which work well at mimicking a road bike (i.e. similar in weight, aero, geometry/handling):
Cervelo Aspero
3T Exploro
Open UP/UPPER

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Matt

Domane can fit up to 38s, so that could almost fall in either category. Two other All-road candidates would be the Roubaix, which is is supposed to clear 33s, though the Road.cc review says it is tight. Another is Fuji Gran Fondo that will fit 38s on the stock 19mm internal width rims. I picked up one of the Fuji’s with Ultegra for $1000. It was too good a deal to pass up for a new all carbon bike, but I had to drop to 36s on a 25mm internal width rim (a good example of Why 3t’s WAM is a good idea).

Given the move towards similar geometry between road bike and the racier gravel bikes, maybe the real division between All-road and Gravel should be whether you can swap wheels and get a 650b rim and useable tire in there. A goofier factor would be whether or not they have built in bosses for fender or panniers.

I'd call that a stretch. It's an "endurance road bike," period. It has no more "gravel bias" than any other endurance road bike sold in the last 5+ years that can comfortably fit 32c tires. Some people ride gravel on 32c or 33c tires but most people would consider that inadequate for the task, even on an occasional basis. This is the tire clearance the R-series should have. An all road edurance/gravel tweener ought to clear over-sized 35's at a minimum.

FWIW, the new 2nd- and 3rd-tier Orbea Orca's announced today have more claimed tire clearance (35mm) than the Caledonia. Haven't yet seen see a single mention of gravel in the marketing. These are positioned (correctly, I'd say) as performance/race bikes with a room for bigger tires for on-pavement comfort.

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"They're made of latex, not nitroglycerin"

In the CyclingTips article I linked to in the OP, Dave Rome said he put on 35mm gravel tires for some of the testing and they worked fine.

In terms of what width is needed for gravel, it depends almost entirely what the gravel you are riding on is like. 35mm is really all I need for the gravel I ride on (northern ID, central and western MT). The flint hills would be a completely different story. I think I linked somewhere above (or maybe it was in another thread) an article about placing gravel into 4 categories in order to help people understand what bike or tire is ideal.

But I totally agree that all endurance/tweener road bikes should (and likely will in the next couple years) allow for at least 35mm tires. This would mean they could fit 30-32 (which I think a lot of riders will find as a sweet spot for all around road riding) with room for fenders (for those who like to run them when riding in foul weather)

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Matt

[for me, most often, gravel means a 650b wheel and a 53mm tire. the caledonia will not do that. not even the aspero will do that. however, on my gravel bike i can put on a 700c wheel and a 30mm tire. in fact i have a couple of features for the front page over the next week or two that shows exactly that: how a bike can be both a road and a gravel bike successfully, and by "gravel" in this case i'm talking about my kind of gravel, set up my way. 1 bike and 2 sets of wheels.]

Okay, it won't take a 53mm but for my graveling purposes I'm asking will the Caledonia accept a 40mm tire on a 650b wheel?

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Find out what it is in life that you don't do well, then don't
do that thing.

i don't know. i kind of doubt it. i don't think there would be enough chain stay clearance.

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Dan Empfield
aka Slowman

Ordered a Caledonia from MyBikeShop yesterday in the same purple carbon color that Dan wrote about (gorgeous)! Looks like it ticks all the boxes for what I'm looking for in a road bike, except from the BB (wish it was threaded based on what I've read about PF, but figure it's a small thing).

One thing I am getting a little nervous about–especially since I'm buying the bike online–is the reliability of the FD for SRAM Force AXS, which I've read is prone to dropping chains. My current tri bike drops its chain all the time no matter what adjustments I or my LBS mechanics make to it, and as silly as it sounds, I'm a bit scarred by the entire experience, so much so that I was considering 1x just to avoid the issue altogether!

For those of you who have experience with Force AXS, how big of a problem is this really? Can it be rectified at home if I'm less than mechanically inclined, or would I be better off switching over to Ultegra Di2?

Did you get your bike yet?

Did Cervelo release any quantified claims regarding the aero qualities of the bike?

I just placed on order for the Dura Ace Di2 bike, I wanted the Ultegra Di2 but couldn't actually get one within a reasonable timeframe as I am told it has been oversold in my market.

I am unable to find any decent photos online of the "Carbon Chameleon" colour though so hopefully it isn't gross looking, I'm not into the blingy colors. Most of the photos online are stock photos and it seems most reviews used the other trim levels. I am a little hesitant with the gearing combo of the DA bike, it comes with 36x52 and an 11-30 cassette, I was hoping for at least a 32.

I am coming off a Domane SLR 9 that I had set up with 32mm tubeless tires and was an amazing bike for long endurance rides, I think the Caledonia will be similar but lighter and with an increased aero benefit. I just really like the cable management of the Caledonia and having a stock power meter is an added bonus which made the cost difference between the DA bike and the Ultegra bike a little more palpable.

Regarding dropping the chain, just install a K-Edge chain catcher and it will solve the problem.

Recent R5 builds from Cervelo come with their in-house screw together BB and their in-house chain catcher. I’d guess they’ll do the s@me for Caledonia builds. Not sure what they’ll use for DUB BB support. Perhaps just thin reduced bushings for the 30mm BB bearings?

In terms of what width is needed for gravel, it depends almost entirely what the gravel you are riding on is like. 35mm is really all I need for the gravel I ride on (northern ID, central and western MT). The flint hills would be a completely different story. I think I linked somewhere above (or maybe it was in another thread) an article about placing gravel into 4 categories in order to help people understand what bike or tire is ideal.



This.

Indeed - what is YOUR gravel?

That is going to vary. I get that.

MY gravel is pretty tame - rail-trails on a fine aggregate when it is packed down it's better than more than a few paved roads in our parts and gravel/dirt roads that are often in not too made shape and, again, sometimes have that smooth-groove where most of the cars tires have been that is smoother than some paved roads! That describes about 85% - 90% of the gravel that I ride on and right now I'm doing that on my road bike with 700 x 25 tires!!

I was in the market for a new bike this year - then the Pandemic hit, and took away almost all my work and all my income, so New Bike Year will have to be some other year. But I had targetted a couple of true All-Rounders like the 3T Exploro and the Cervelo Aspero, and some true road bikes that could take wider tires in the 32 range - like that 3T Strada, or now the just released Cervelo Caledonia.

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Steve Fleck @stevefleck | Blog

I live in Austin and the gravel here from my doorstep is small too. In fact if any Austinites know of some great gravel routes, I'd be all ears, but I digress.

Anyway, I'm in a similar situation where I'd like something that can handle gravel, but also something I'd feel comfortable taking to the group ride and not being left in the dust. One bike I was looking at that no one has mentioned is the BMC Roadmachine X. Can't beat the price at $2,000.

Was that meant to be pink? :)

I found the 3T difflock is precise and zero hassle to install - I was impressed by the design after having fiddled, wrestled and dropped many style seat clamp parts before. My pet peave is when you get the saddle on, knuckles bleeding, and you discover to tighten the saddle in horizontal you have to wind out the adjuster bolt until the whole thing is hinging on only a tiny bit of thread and you keep thinking its going to snap off. The 3t design is just as secure with any degree of tilt.

the chameleon color is amazing in person and very understated. you will not be disappointed.

My wife has a current generation Domane SL5. I've test fitted 42s (43mm actual measure width) and they fit with a little room to spare. I think 45's would even fit. As a counterpoint, I saw someone on another forum report that 45's didn't fit their Di2 Domane because it hit the front Di2 derailleur box.

My testing was for naught because my wife hated riding the Domane on gravel, which in our area is pretty chunky, so she uses a mountain bike now for gravel riding.

Hey... I picked the bike up yesterday and built it up today. It’s amazing! I will be taking it for a casual 60k ride tomorrow but just after 20k today I actually doubt I’ll ever ride my S5 again!

Just got my Caledonia 5. Love it! super snappy and responsive along with being comfortable. It just seems to work. Running the stock 30c tires on it.

Got a Caledonia 5 also , I’ve had it 4 weeks and love it also .A bit late to the the show but I got Ultegra DI 2 and can’t believe the difference.
May go 28mm in the spring , but like you happy with the 30mm even after riding Conti 25mm for years .
.

How so? And what year S5 is that?

I have a '13 one with very cheap components, and it's still awesome to ride. Considering Caledonia 5 and haven't ridden it at all, but I'm curious how it compares.

I also can’t find any pictures of the chameleon colour frame set - any chance you could snap a pic?

My S5 is a 2020... it's a fantastic bike but I don't race and for the type of riding I do the Caledonia just makes more sense for me. I did a few 300km rides this summer on the S5 and it was completely comfortable and fast but I definitely would have enjoyed them more on a bike like the Caledonia. I also have the S5 set up with 28mm GP 5000 tires and tubeless so it's a comfy ride as well but obviously more aggressive and a harsher than the Caledonia. It's also super hilly where I live and the road condition isn't the best.

Dan, in your long term review of the Cal5, you write that the base Ultegra DI2 model has a 36 x 30 lowest gear. However, it actually comes with an 11–34 cassette, just like the mechanical versions. I know, since I had my LBS swap it out for an 11–32 on my Ultegra/GRX mashup. Apart from that, I went for the regular Caledonia over the Cal5 for, well, all the reasons that you give.

One thing that I have not read in any of the Caledonia reviews is how freaking silent the bike is. My R5 race bike is like a rolling sound board; when accidentally hitting large potholes, the front end in particular can make terrifying "bang" sounds. In comparison, the Caledonia is quiet as a mouse, which I believe makes a big difference in the sense of smoothness and confidence it gives on rough surfaces. I can't help but think that Cervélo must have specifically worked on acoustic damping.