Slowman, I've sent you a private response. I have said what I believe in my heart is the right thing to do. Nothing more to post. Peace Out ; M

Yep, that is YOUR opinion. Others have the right to have their opinions, and not be attacked.

I did think the question about your drawings is and was fair. No person can look like that without taking drugs, period. So is it fair for some to imply you might support using drugs when it is to your benefit?
So many get all worked up about what a word or drawing or whatever could imply. So again, seems like it was a very fair, honest question, if you can step back and look at it objectively, but by your response,
not sure that would be possible.

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Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

Boom Nutrition code 19F4Y3 $5 off 24 pack box | Bionic Runner | PowerCranks | Velotron | Spruzzamist

Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep

1. Read my response. Who have I attacked? Lance, I guess. I'm sure I'll hear from his lawyers if he takes offense.
2. What was the "fair, honest question" that I did not respond to? I didn't see any question and I didn't try to respond to one.

There comes a point where opinions are not allowed and facts have to be accepted. That Lance has lied, has bullied, and has cheated is such a circumstance.

I think most simply want to see the sport respected and if Lance continues to blur the lines, that many may have an issue with that. As I posted before, I find it kinda irronic that everyone now is talking this event up as if it's the Woodstock of cancer charity events, when 1 week ago, all this cancer attention, *seemed* to be lacking.

ETA: It's great that this is going to be a tremendous event that will really raise the awareness that the race and Rev3 want to bring attention to. I'm just surprised that a race took a chance on the lighting rod that is Lance with as much issues he has with getting into a race. But now reading the details of who's in control of the race, and what not, it doesnt surprise me, that they de-sanctioned to allow Lance to race. Which is going to be great for this race and the awareness they raise, I'm just a bit surprised they went from a "race" setting to now talking as if this is really an cancer only "event" that no real results matter.


And this idea that you are going to get slammed, just seems like a troll attempt on your part, and not really discuss the merits of the discussion.

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@brooksdoughtie
USAT-L2,Y&J; USAC-L2
http://www.aomultisport.com

Dave, who's opinion did he attack? He was attacked by someone himself as it was implied that his Savageman caricatures were somehow 'for doping' but I didn't read the part where he attacked another person with a different opinion.

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Founder of THE TRIATHLON COLLECTIVE (Closed Facebook Group). A SBR discussion group without the white noise/trolling!

Yep, your opinion is your last sentence. My opinion is your statements are not fact, just your, and a few others, opinion.

Yep, your response, especially your last 2 sentences, makes my point about your post. But, of course I am 100% wrong.
Why damage your brand? How is making these kind of posts going to get you more people that want to do your business?

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Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

Boom Nutrition code 19F4Y3 $5 off 24 pack box | Bionic Runner | PowerCranks | Velotron | Spruzzamist

Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep

You could not resist the last sentence. Oh well, my point was made.

Your post hits right on the point some of as are trying to make. So many jump to conclusions on their emotion, rather than waiting to get all the facts. Now that you have the facts, seems you are a little more
understanding?

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Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

Boom Nutrition code 19F4Y3 $5 off 24 pack box | Bionic Runner | PowerCranks | Velotron | Spruzzamist

Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep

I've been understanding from the get go, because the moment Rev3 de-sanctioned, it was absolutely legit that Lance could "race" in that event (and I said that a week ago). I've got some issues now that the team I coach is racing in an non-sanctioned race including what the rules will be as well as how are the rules going to be governed. So, am I understanding? Absolutely, but I also think people can be criticial of the decision, without somehow being anti-cancer or anti-Rev3.

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@brooksdoughtie
USAT-L2,Y&J; USAC-L2
http://www.aomultisport.com

Dave playing the victim, is a favorite posting tactic of his.

What he somehow, inexplicably, does not seem to get, is the ironic juxtaposition of him, the Ultimate Rules Nazi;
who has posted voluminously about how people who miss timing mats should be DQ'd, period, and course-cutters, drafters, etc need harsher penalties -
yet, he would gladly toe the line, and go out of his way just to do so, to race with perhaps the greatest cheat in endurance sport history??

That his brain doesn't explode from the cognitive dissonance of these 2 competing moral positions, startles and amazes me.

I guess if Lance cut the course or something, he'd hold him in disdain.
But doping? Meh.

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float , hammer , and jog

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Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

Boom Nutrition code 19F4Y3 $5 off 24 pack box | Bionic Runner | PowerCranks | Velotron | Spruzzamist

Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep

He's not damaging his brand at all. His race is considered epic by most and in my useless opinion is a 'heart and soul' of triathlon type of race. He's expressing an opinion (which you clearly disagree with) and somehow he's damaging his brand? I'd actually point out that Kyle's race raises quite a bit of money for cancer itself. Perhaps his race isn't quite as corporate as WTC races and he is more concerned about a principle than mere $$ and branding? Then again I could be completely wrong....

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Founder of THE TRIATHLON COLLECTIVE (Closed Facebook Group). A SBR discussion group without the white noise/trolling!

Please show me the post where I "posted voluminously about how people who miss timing mats should be DQ'd, period, and course-cutters, drafters, etc need harsher penalties -"



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Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

Boom Nutrition code 19F4Y3 $5 off 24 pack box | Bionic Runner | PowerCranks | Velotron | Spruzzamist

Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep

For me, he damaged his brand. But again, just me. I just see not reason to attack any person like that, and would spend my money in ways that would support this opinion.

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Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

Boom Nutrition code 19F4Y3 $5 off 24 pack box | Bionic Runner | PowerCranks | Velotron | Spruzzamist

Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep

At what point is a fact a fact and an "opinion" to the contrary ridiculous?

This harkens to me back to 2003 when the 16 security agencies released one of the consolidated national security reports which concluded that there was no evidence of WMD in Iraq. George W stated that in his "opinion" he disagreed with the report. I didn't understand that. How is he allowed to disagree? How can he have more or different facts than his 16 security agencies on which to form an opinion? Isn't the consolidated report of his agencies the "fact" on which he must operate? Can you just say "I am of the opinion the earth is flat" and expect credibility?

Lance doped. That has been determined by USADA and Lance's acceptance. Thus he lied. And, evidence is more than overwhelming that he has bullied in suppressing the truth for over a decade. None of this is opinion.

I'll worry about my race's brand. I'm not concerned that my stating that LA is not welcome at the race because he is a liar and a bully will sully it. Or, if it does, I do not particularly care.

Some people think the Earth is 6000 years old. It's an opinion.

My experience is similar...I don't have 15 years in cancer research, but still...it's incredibly frustrating to read some comments...not to mention that the prevalence of cancer is such that no one can say I've never been touched by cancer one way or another.

I wouldn't send any money to any organization that worships the devil.

We just clearly have a different opinion on this topic. Nothing wrong with that.

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Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

Boom Nutrition code 19F4Y3 $5 off 24 pack box | Bionic Runner | PowerCranks | Velotron | Spruzzamist

Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep

You are a master troll. Kudos to you. You got me worked up. Feel free to giggle away at your keyboard over it.

And, that, is a fact.

Never been called a master troll, whatever that is, but I assume it is positive coming from you.

Why would I be giggling away at my keyboard? I love to have adult debate on any topic with anyone if they want to keep it non personal and non emotional. But SO few can which is why I make a point to try and stay out of
so many conversations.

I really was just trying to offer some thought for another view, which is what debating is all about. I could easily take the side of Lance hate, but I just do not see that as something I want to be known as in my life.
So if trying to find balance, and really asking what topics are worth all the negative energy on is being a master troll, well thanks I thought what I try to do is add wisdom, age, maturity, a lot of which I did not have in my younger days!!!

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Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

Boom Nutrition code 19F4Y3 $5 off 24 pack box | Bionic Runner | PowerCranks | Velotron | Spruzzamist

Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep

Luckily the folks on their high horse are just a few vocal minority!! I would gladly do any race Lance was in. As I have said before, if I were in his shoes, and ALL the others that raced before, during and STILL, I might have done the same thing.

Do not let the few distract you from the bigger picture. This is the tactic I see on TV all the time. The few think if they are vocal enough, and get TV time, they can get their opinion forced onto the rest of us.
If someone does not like what a business is doing, just go to another business. No need to try and destroy it for ones ego or what ever reason drives them.


Dave, this was your 1st post on the topic today ^, so can you honestly say you were simply trying to add merit to the discussion, because to me it comes across as simply stirring the pot. If that's your style of posting, great, and I hope you dont think I'm "attacking" you. I asked you before who are all these people that are attacking in this thread? I've said that many on here simply have brought up some legit concerns, just as others have countered those concerns. I think kny said it best when he said Rev3 will likely be fine in the end with all the potential negative with this move, but I dont think they are immune from criticism. I know a lot of people respect Rev3 and what they do for the triathlon community, and I think Rev3 just wants to make it known that this is more of a cancer awareness opportunity than a "race" setting. I just think if it's that, then let's have that from the beginning, surprised they waited so late in the game for this race, to now make it the event they seem to want to push now.

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@brooksdoughtie
USAT-L2,Y&J; USAC-L2
http://www.aomultisport.com

That is the exact conclusion I came to about hbim. The contradictions, the passive aggresive then changing the subjects. Took me awhile to catch on. Why I will not even reply to him.

My conclusion is that he is a freaking idiot, and he's best left alone.

I'll bite. I know I shouldn't, but I'm sick of tagging SavageMan photos and the break is welcome.

If you are not trolling, a claim of which I am skeptical, then there is certainly little in the way of debate occurring. And, you don't seem to respond to questions posed of you, such as who I attacked other than Lance, but here goes. Let's debate:

You state we have a difference of opinion. I state that my opinion is accepted fact, but I will step back from that claim and allow you to provide the reasoning behind your opinion, whatever it is.

My opinion is that Lance is a lie, a bully, and a cheat. My basis for that opinion is as follows:
1 - Lance cheated. USADA has opened a case for this and Lance chose to not contest it. He is thus sanctioned. He is thus a cheat. It is intellectually dishonest to have an opinion that differs on this account.
2 - Lance lied. Lance has said time and time again publicly and to people's faces that he never doped. Given 1 above, he is a liar.
3 - Lance bullied. Without rehashing the infinite stories of Lemond, Andreu, Landis, McIlvaine, Andersen, Krimmage, Bassones, Simeoni, I will base my opinion on the numerous accounts of these folks and others that illustrate Lance's tendency to bully those who speak out against either LA or doping in cycling.

You never actually state your opinion, but rather just claim that our opinions differ. It is hard to debate someone who does not make their opinion clear, so I will assume simply that your opinion is that you believe the opposite: that Lance did not cheat, did not lie, and did not bully.

So, h20fun, if you are not simply trolling but are really here to debate your difference in opinion, please provide the basis behind your opinion. And, because you never responded to my inquiry as to whom I attacked that put my race in a bad name, please also respond to that as well.

Thank you,
Kyle Yost
SavageMan Triathlon Founder and Race Director

Ha...i'm convinced