0/10, very bad math. Would not read again...

My point is very simple: the promoter should not make a profit on a cancelled event. Yes, the athlete should absorb some of the cost, not arguing that. But this promoter made his normal profit + a bonus by not incurring race day expenses.

I own my own business. All of the order confirmations to our customers are very explicit....it is their responsibility to confirm the specifics that they gave us are correct. Several time every month the customer gives us the wrong information and when the product gets into the field, it is wrong. I ALWAYS remake the product and sell it to them at our material cost...no labor or profit added. I do/have done this for 2 reasons: I feel it would be unethical to profit from it and I have built a very loyal customer base over the last 17 years. But that is just me.

Now, wipe up all the spit off of your keyboard and go for a run. You obviously need to release some stress that we have caused you.

What's your angle here? Do you support the decision to only give 25% off, or what?

To me it's all about customer service. Company like this has to think fiscally, logically and in the future. If this is all they want to do, then I think they have to be able to take the complaining.

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@brooksdoughtie
USAT-L2,Y&J; USAC-L2
http://www.aomultisport.com

And that's the airlines policy. Besides, I'm only in this thread to keep the fire going, this popcorn is tasty! ; )

Internet forums exist so we can bitch into an echo chamber. Its the nature of the beast. I cant do anything to change the industry right now from my chair. But I can talk about it here and get people to say stuff that they would never consider saying in real life.

I do what I can to keep it buttery. Let me know if it gets stale, I'll pop some fresh corn for you.

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The Home of Advanced Running
Advanced Running Instagram Page
My narcisstic training log

Soooo..... you really enjoy being an asshole but are too cowardly to do it when you are not anonymous? Is that the logic here?

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Ed O'Malley
www.VeloVetta.com
Founder of VeloVetta Cycling Shoes
Instagram • Facebook

Dude...you got 25% off another race, but the RD, legally and ethically, didn't have to give you anything. Now, would it have been better if you had gotten an entry into another race? Of course. But it seems like you're just complaining because the credit that's been given doesn't match your preconceived notion of what you should have gotten.

Honestly, it makes you come across as an entitled jerk. But that's just my opinion as an outside observer, other people can feel free to disagree.

Hell, I dont even have any skin in this game. I am not looking for a refund - this race cancellation doesnt affect me at all!

(Unless you count the potential for IMLT to be cancelled for the same reason as this one was, I guess)

I'd agree with the people thinking its a bit on the cheap side. I happen to work for a race company on the weekends, and I can honestly say IF something like this happened with one of our races the RD/owner would be a bit more accommodating. I have no idea how many people were signed up for the cancelled race, but if they allowed everyone to enter the same race for free the following year, that just wouldn't fly. Getting a comped race entry up to a certain value seems more reasonable. But to everyone here thinking the money is just sitting in the bank, that's just crazy. Races are so damn expensive to produce well. No point in beating a dead horse. /rant

I understand they didn't have to give me anything. I entered an agreement when I registered and that's that.

I don't make much money, so this race was expensive for me.

To me, 25% off another race isn't much since they're still making a profit.

I guess my goal here is to vent and see what other athletes on this forum think about the situation. I've achieved my goal and hope all of you have a wonderful rest of the season.

I didnt realize that an expectation of getting what I paid for was "intense ignorance", but by all means continue with that notion. You can talk all you want about "how the industry works" or about the waivers I signed saying I didnt have a right to a refund. In the end its simply wrong to effectivly take money from your customers (ones who I presume you want to be repeat customers) and not provide the service, or its equivalent at a later time.

All the quasi legalities does not negate the business factor. Offend your customers and they will not return. In fact, you will have created a vocal force that will bad mouth your business.

In my view, if I buy a concert ticket and it is cancelled due to a storm, then I expect a refund for services not rendered.

Last year, when the NY marathon was cancelled they initially wanted to not refund the entries based on the "we've already spent the funds" argument. The public and their customers (the runners) were vocal and offended ... and they changed their policy.

As to the WTC ... they have a "brand". What the public will tolerate from a "brand" is different than a "just another" business. Hell, I am volunteering at IMFL this year to gain entry for next. There is no way in hell I would go down to my local Exxon and ask "can I volunteer here for a few hours because you refuse to pay for an adequate staff" yet make hundreds of millions of dollars in profit. But I will for IMFL because I covet it. Most businesses, including races, cannot get away with that.

If I felt this race was being abusive ... if I felt offended by it ... they would lose my future business and I would be negatively vocal every time this event came up in a conversation.

CPA and Noofus,

I agree with y'all both. I think you may have missed that in my diatribes. To say, you get no money because you agreed to it and I owe you nothing in return is HORRIBLE business practice and asking that no one return to your race. But there is a fine line as to what you can give back to the consumer as expenditures are real and profit margins in triathlon/running races are next to zero. So as I just asked badger, what do you do?

In my eyes, I'd say 25-35% discount is more than fair. It's acknowledging the unfairness of having the race cancelled and trying to compensate you if you'd like to return while also not sinking the business.

Agree?

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The Home of Advanced Running
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I don't personally work on the financing side of race production, do mostly race timing, event set up/tear down and bike/run course support, but I've seen the invoices and its always eye opening. I do know that the further out a participant pays for a race, we can provide a steeper discount. Things become more expensive closer to race day, which is pretty obvious. In terms of the OPs situation, I'd think a more fair offer would be closer to 50%, but like I said, I'd really have no good estimate of how that would affect the bottom line of the business.

edit: that 50% expiring well in advance of the next years race. It'd be a good way of the RD saying "it sucks we had to cancel. If you decide to race next year by XX date, this is what we can offer" sort of thing.

AANNNNDDDDD.....after reading all six (and counting) thoroughly entertaining pages of this thread, I think I will stick to trying to overtake the KOM's on Strava.......

Seriously.

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W

Pop's trippin'...He wants me to ask for my bike back...You know I wouldn't trip...

The underlined, how do you know this is true? I don't disagree at all with your first sentence but it would seem that we lack the knowledge to know whether or not the RD made any kind of profit. To me, that's what makes it impossible to say (for someone who believes in the first part of what you wrote) whether an RD is right in refunding 25%, or 50%, or whatever, or offering a 25% or 50% discount to a future event. As an RD I can tell you that offering a discount to a future event poses a lot lower risk to me.

What is your cancellation policy?
No refund is available after July 25th. Challenge Penticton wants athletes to feel comfortable registering for the race. A refund less $100- administration costs is available up until July 25th, 2013. Or you can defer your registration fee to 2014.



Seems the Challenge has a very friendly refund policy

I have three (local) examples of canceled races where things rolled over 100%. This represents all of the local races that have been canceled in the past few years.

Lake Tahoe Tri is one where it didn't.

3>1, so LTT is the outlier. Fact!

I do wonder what the percentage is nationwide that have registrations roll over versus just being washed away. Yes, we all sign the waiver and say that the registration isn't valid if the event is canceled. But I do wonder how often the race directors actually hold true to that (or give just a marginal credit).

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speedySTATES