Just got a 2010 Plasma LTD and have three rides on it. AMAZING bike, super stiff yet confortable. Coming off a P2C the Plasma is waayy faster. My bike weighs 16.4lbs

Very happy with the bike, light, stiff, aero, everything that I hoped it would be. Only rode a P3 once so can't really comment.

Can't wait to race it!!

Besides the paint is there any difference between the 2009 and 2010 models?

Thanks,
Rex

Absolutely love mine, very stiff, light and fast. Built with SRAM Red and Zipp 808's with Bontrager Aero Bars. Faster and stiffer than my original Plasma.

Any chance you could post some pics of it? I used to ride an '08 Ltd. and loved it.

I got a plasma 08 and it really stiff and light but make sure the seat is the right height before cutting it really

Ummm...do you have any objective data to back up that assertion? An "apples to apples" comparison of some sort, of course... ;-)

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http://bikeblather.blogspot.com/

Ummm, I climb faster with the Plasma 2 because it is lighter, it also handles better at speed...I'm noticing a significant improvement in responsiveness in the BB area, it is stiffer. More comfortable for my body as well.

Sorry Tom if my post offended you ; )

Naah...no offense. So, the only objective, measurable improvement you noted is that it's lighter. Cool...do you recall by how much (assuming equivalent equipment hung on it?).

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Lighter
Stiffer
Better Handling
More confortable

3/4 lb lighter.

Right...but you stated that it's "waayy faster" than your P2C was...yet you've got nothing objective to back that up. Is that 3/4 lb. lighter measurement just in the frame/fork alone, or do you have different equipment? Besides, that 3/4 lb. difference alone isn't going to make you "waayy faster" unless all of your races are pure hillclimbs at greater than 10-12%.

I'm disappointed...I would expect that if someone was to claim something was "waayy faster" that they would have something like power vs. speed numbers or something to back that up. What if the aerodynamics of the Plasma LTD aren't as good as the P2C? That lower weight could be easily "trumped" by lower drag in most every condition except the pure hillclimbs described above.

Also, when you say it's "more comfortable" and has "better handling" are you comparing the 2 bikes set up equivalently? The same equipment (bars, saddle, wheels, etc.) AND the exact same position relative to the BB on both? If not, you're not making an "apples to apples" comparison...

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You my friend either need to take a vacation or you need to get laid....

Philly, you know that you are upsetting the balance of the Slowtwitch forum room by claiming the the Plasma or any other bike is faster then the P2C or the P3C right?

Shame on you, you should know better then that...... ;o)

You, my friend, are "projecting" ;-)

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Naah...there are quite a few bikes that are faster than the P2C and P3C right now, including potentially one made by Scott...but I haven't seen anything that says it's the Plasma LTD.

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Tom, you are right in that there are a bunch of good performing bikes it looks like right now (based on all of the ones we are seeing on the Pro Tour), but we might not be able to afford most of them (at least not me) when they do make it to the market, and the wind tunnel data will be interesting when and if we see it. I would love to see the data on the Plasma 2 as well, it is claimed to be 20% or more better aerodynamically, but really where does this put the bike now compared to the others that you can buy right now.

It seems as tho the Felt DA has been tearing it up lately, at least here in the USA with Dave Zabriski racing it. If I recall that bike has shown good wind tunnel numbers and is close to the top of the list right?

Well...if you believe the chart below, and believe the claim that the Plasma 2 is 20% better than the old Plasma, then that could potentially put the frame in the same "class" aerodynamically as the P2C/P3C...which is a far cry from "waayy faster", aerodynamically speaking.

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No, you, my friend, need to realize that he had many legitmate points and that you answered none of them. You in no way qualified your statement, "It is way faster." 3/4 makes almost no difference in the performance of a bike. I added five pounds just out of curiosity one day and even five pounds was not enough to make my two 10K TT runs differ by more than 2 seconds, which I find is well within the "noise" of road and wind variations.

So, were I a newbie and read that the Scott was "way faster" then I might be tempted to go out and pay the fairly high pricetag, only to find out that it was not, in fact, way faster than a P2C. Which, BTW, cost the same for full bike as the Scott does for a frameset.

I commend Scott for improving their original Plasma, which was a brick in the tunnel, but I'll withhold judgement until the new one comes out well in tests.

Chad

Well I am not going to appologize for not conforming to the 'nerd herd' here on this forum. Maybe I overlooked the 'rules' to posting here...I missed the part that said I wasn't allowed to post any personal opinions without having to qualify every word with an essay on aerodynamic pricipals or graphs to back it up.
I responded to the original poster in a way that he was satified. In fact he contacted me about the bike and we had a very good conversation.

You guys can look at charts and graphs and do whatever you wish with the propaganda that is presented on the site, I will be RIDING my bike instead. I have ridden both bikes and can comment on the differences better than yourself....Unless you have ridden both?!?!?!

And what about the "fairly high price" ...The Plasma 2 frame is comparable to a P3.....price is the same across the board.

You can keep waiting for the 'tests' to come out before you judge....just make sure the tests come from cervelo ; )

I'll be at the Interbike Trade Show next week and can't wait to see the Plasma 3. I will tell the folks at Scott you are waiting for the test results.

"Philly, you know that you are upsetting the balance of the Slowtwitch forum room by claiming the the Plasma or any other bike is faster then the P2C or the P3C right?

Shame on you, you should know better then that...... ;o) "


I know....after the usual 'nerd attack' I suddenly feel the need to go on a shooting spree....

Now who is the one who sounds like he needs to get laid?

I have ridden both bikes and can comment on the differences better than yourself....Unless you have ridden both?!?!?!

You are totally correct. So what are the differences, other than an meaningless 3/4 pound?

Chad

I'll be there too...I'll make sure to ask the Scott folks for numbers as well ;-)

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There is no issue with posting subjective opinions - more comfortable, better looking etc are examples of such.
Lighter and faster are things that can be measured objectively. So you gave a figure for the weight loss to qualify the claim that it is lighter - that's not a matter of opinion - it's a fact. Likewise faster is not a matter of opinion. And since faster is a topic of some passion for many of the members of the forum it is something that will tend to get jumped on.

Remember that other members can't assume that every bit of feedback about equipment is offered in an altruistic manner, so it is something of a service to newbies for the "nerds" to be pointing out the flaws in claims made about equipment.

Philly, Shooting Spree ... I like it, just too funny, you really do need a sense of humor here on ST, with all the crap people throw around. It is a shame that the P3, and now the P4, is not talked about much here on the forum anymore being that Fabian Cancellara is not making it be a winning bike. To make matters even worse, the October issue of Velonews had a TDF report on Aero bikes and they only included the new Scott, Specialized Shiv, Giant, and Trek TT bikes, what does that tell you about all the other bikes? I know, I know, those teams had the biggest engines on the team, it really is not about the bike, well it just might be a tiny bit.