Skinsuit. Aero helmet. Aero shoes. Tires. Bike fitting. Just some things off of the top of my head at the moment...

Edit: And I know those will not be practical to test, I just think that people sometimes forget about cost when testing the absolute top of the line bikes. In reality, I think setting the budget a little lower than top of the line would be more useful to more people.

Huh? All of those are included with the Venge? I must've missed that...

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http://bikeblather.blogspot.com/

If someone is spending $12.5k on a bike, you don't think they are going to spend an extra $1k on all the bits you are suggesting. It is no different than someone spending $10.5k on a different brand. Compare the bikes in their top specs. Nothing more, nothing less.

The idea is actually kind of a good one. Tell every manufacturer they can setup a bike + dummy for $x000 with the fastest overall setup in the wind tunnel. We would learn a lot about clothes, helmets, etc. maybe even give them a few shots(so if they know certain helmets and certain clothes are sometimes fast and sometimes mid pack, they could try their best three).

By limiting the dollar amount you could see where dollar priorities went. Presumably, we would see "low end" frame sets, with mid range wheels, and lots of attention to detail when it came to helmets, tires, and clothes.

I vote for Tom to attend as our neutral third party as I believe almost everyone on here would agree he is a great rep for ST. Maybe if Jack could make the trip as well and maybe post about it on his website as well. I know those two would keep everyone honest!

lolwut

must take new madone too ofcourse ;)

We designed for both drag and stability. They're not mutually exclusive and targeting one doesn't necessarily mean trading off the other. For example, promoting flow attachment on both halves of the rim will result in greater stability in gust conditions. It also happens to minimize drag across a wider range of yaw angles.

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Chris Yu
Applied Technology
Specialized Bicycle Components
@chrisyuinc

Just to clarify, the S-Works Venge ViAS bike does come spec'd with a Quarq (Specialized model) power meter as standard.

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Chris Yu
Applied Technology
Specialized Bicycle Components
@chrisyuinc

I really, really like the bike (and the Felt AR for that matter).

Here is my problem.
My local Spec dealer here in Oz is an absolute asshat. And those within a few hours drive arent much better.
Im hoping it isnt a prerequisite that in order to sell Spec bikes you need to act like this, but it does sure seem like it.
The Felt is pretty much impossible to get. Felt Oz either sold out fast, or received next to no stock.

Giant screwed the pooch with the early brake problems on the Propel so I forgot about that

Leaves me with an S5.
Luckily not a bad problem to have....

Control bike to be be...? Tarmac?

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http://www.nicksquillari.com.au
@Tinea_Pedis

+1, send forth the crr wizard.

And if Specialized is measuring their turbo cotton tire crr, be sure and thrown in some Conti Super Sonics on the the other test bikes as a fair comparison.

In reference to your past tests. Do the Felt AR and the new S5 (i.e. the one with a truncated down tube for a bottle) fit in the same 'band' as you define it when you put two round water bottles on the frame?

What I want so see is a completely equal test between all the bikes tested.

For this I would specify exact saddle height, bar height and reach for all the bikes, the exact specs for components including the wheels, except for bar which should be the one which is supplied if it is an integrated unit and then give that to the manufacturers so they can send a completely prepared bike. This would mean they have taken the time to make sure the cables are all the exact right length and taken the care to ensure all is optimized on that bike per the design.

I think that the same wheels and a bike carefully prepped would start to equalize some of these claims.

Thanks for the rec, but Dan and I have universally agreed that JT Lyons and/or Tom A. are the guys who should be the "arbiters" in such a shootout if ST were to be involved.

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"Non est ad astra mollis e terris via." - Seneca | rappstar.com | FB - Rappstar Racing | IG - @jordanrapp

Steel Allez...or, I'll volunteer my '86 Bianchi Sport SX :-)

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http://bikeblather.blogspot.com/

They aren't included with the Venge and that's the point. I could buy all those other things and overall be faster on a slower bike for the same amount of money.

Then your budget isn't really $12.5k is it? It's $13.5k, and that's an okay budget to set. Just be conscious of the price. If my budget was $12.5k, I could go faster with the S5 and additional things than just the Venge ViAS, even if the bike itself is faster. You have to look at the whole system which is the point that even Specialized is pushing.

As I attempted to hint at, and Chris directly pointed out...you're forgetting that a big part of the ~$2K difference between the top line S5 and the Venge VIAS is the inclusion of a top line power meter.

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http://bikeblather.blogspot.com/

No, I get that. I just think more can be done to even out the cost. I just mentioned the cost of the Venge specifically because this is the Venge thread. The Felt AR FRD is $13k with no powermeter. You can replace the Venge in any of my previous comments with that one if you'd like.

Sure, but all those other things you mention are separate from the bike. If we're comparing bikes, then limit it to bike features/changes. You can do those other things no matter what bike is under the rider...and as was pointed out previously, at that high end of the market, those other things are typically not a budget constraint.

Now then, if you want to do a comparison like "fastest overall road setup under $4k", or something...then, that's all to be considered since "bang for the buck" is a much bigger performance driver.

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http://bikeblather.blogspot.com/

\I'm not sure this would benefit the manufacturers who have more to lose if they test their bikes and they are slow. It seems to me that if they keep a bit of mystery and gray area to bike tests, there is more room to maneuver in marketing the bikes. So I think this is all a pipedream by everyone here and we'll never get a true fair test. At least not with the manufacturers involved.

I can't buy a skinsuit if I blew my budget on a bike.

I guess the point I'm trying to make is that I don't see any difference between a bike or a skinsuit or an aero helmet. They're all tools to help me go faster. To me the most important question is if I had $5k or $13k or $20k to spend on a complete system, what's the fastest system I could buy?

Was the Evade tested against any other aero road helmets ie Giro Synth. Any data on that?