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Re: PTO Amateur Events [TheStroBro] [ In reply to ]
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I think actions speak much louder than words and, in my view, IM’s actions are focused on value extraction whereas the PTO to date (that being the caveat) has been focused on improving the sport.

And what galls me is that they are so mealy-mouthed about it. Messick’s interview with Jack Kelly was a perfect example where he could have been totally honest about the fact that they will make more money with 2 IM WC races, although in this case it also benefits the sport by giving the women their own day. It would have been an honest answer and totally understandable, but no, Messick almost seemed affronted at being asked a totally reasonable leading question. Don’t get me wrong, I have no problem with IM’s actions as a monopolistic company, I’d probably do the same in their shoes. The reality, as evidenced by their actions, is that triathlon is a means to an end for IM whereas for the PTO to date, triathlon appears to the end itself.

My overall point is that it’s an odd, path dependant anomaly that has created the negative situation of a monopolistic company running the sport that appears to care more about their profits than the sport itself. That’s an unfortunate situation which I hope is resolved sooner rather than later and the PTO is a realistic chance to change things for the better.

Also why did no-one lose their shit about me dissing the stupid IM distances 🤔?
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Re: PTO Amateur Events [mark.cotgrove] [ In reply to ]
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mark.cotgrove wrote:
IMHO the PTO should be the future of long distance triathlon. Their pro races are already better than IM and the distances are way more sensible than the historical aberration that is the IM distance. In addition having a for-profit company de facto with monopolistic control of a whole branch of a participation sport is another aberration that we should be rid of.

In an ideal world IM goes bust, the PTO operates the name IM and races revert back to more local ownership, competing on race quality/price, using the name IM if quality acceptable to the PTO. The sport would be way better off run this way methinks.

You mena the future of middle distance,right? Because there is nothing long in 100km :)
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Re: PTO Amateur Events [rrheisler] [ In reply to ]
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rrheisler wrote:
...is the PTO *not* for profit? Or is the assumption that because World Triathlon is a partner that it is somehow more noble?

I don't think it's a bad thing for them to bring a competitive product to the table (and I hope, for the sake of our sport, that it is in fact a competitive option). But I don't think it's right to say that they aren't in this for profit when, well, they pretty clearly are at this point.

absolutely, its pathetic to say that pto is better than ironman or the other way round. the bias by people, towards or against one organization is crazy. and world tri is not better.
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Re: PTO Amateur Events [TheStroBro] [ In reply to ]
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TheStroBro wrote:
marcag wrote:
The points for 2023 were well documented. It was prize money and rankings largely from 2022 that dictated points allocated.
They're well documented and you're making an interpretation to fit your narrative. They also weighted long course worlds the same as 70.3 Worlds. Long Course Worlds have never been a legit race.
There are numerous examples where athletes have gained good points from non-PTO races: just spend time going through the ranking lists. Taking the juxtaposition of the WT long distance world champs with the PTO European Open. Mignon and Pierre gained excellent points, probably more than they'd have earned if they raced the PTO the day before, assuming same quality of performance.
As for " Long Course Worlds have never been a legit race" that's fair but in the past.
Next year the WT LD World Champs will be entirely legit and recognised as THE race to win for the mainstream FP amateur: single race.
NB topic of this thread. National tri governing bodies will (should) make sure that competitors are there on merit, not based on roll down and pressure selling in the euphoria after a good performance in an IM70.3.
National trisuits (or not) is a side issue. I expect that only the designated world champs race will require wearing a national trisuit/uniform per WT/NGB lodged design. Maybe 'even' the pros will race in those uniforms for that one race/venue.
The PTO Tour race alongside will be one of 6 or 7 races with serious prize money (way more than the IM 70.3 WC) and the top pro athletes' performances at those races will determine the 2024 LD world champion (scoring system tba). Those athletes who want a longer race than 100km have Roth and Nice/Kona to target: fitting that aspiration into a PTO Tour calendar is going to be a challenge. If they require 'validation' in 2024 for AQ'd athletes I cannot see how Iden and Blummenfelt can sensibly achieve that btw.
I hope Taupo December next gets a half decent field (iconic venue and trip). Because it will be outside the northern hemisphere racing season it might; but that will be the last "legit" middle distance 'world champs' (legit as in a field with most of the top athletes racing).
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