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Re: How Do I Train for a Sub-18 5k in my Winter Run Focus? [NordicSkier] [ In reply to ]
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This really does not seem like a good workout, that would be 5k at 3:35/km (5:47). I don't feel 200s are the best for 5k and def not with 15s rest.
I would recommend just doing threshold work with a few strides 2-3 times per week. Start with 3x100m strides and build your way up to 6x100. If you do that you will get 1800m of weekly "fast" mileage, plus a 20 min tempo around 4:10-4:15 (6:48). Tempo's and threshold intervals will get you 95% of the way with a lot lower risk of injury.

Terrible Tuesday’s Triathlon
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Re: How Do I Train for a Sub-18 5k in my Winter Run Focus? [awenborn] [ In reply to ]
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not for that specific 5k time but structure of a plan can look something like this:

8-12 weeks of base building. Focus is increase mileage every week w/ 4th week a down week. could look something like: 20-25-30-25(Down)-30-35-40-35(down). Then each week you have 1-3 key sessions and rest is just easy mileage with an off day, maybe 2 on your down week. The 3 sessions would be 1 run that is longer. 90 minutes is a good benchmark, but not really needed until you are hitting 30-35 and up on total mileage. Then 2nd key sessions i hill repeats. starting at 8 and increasing up and doing a hill that is 20-30 seconds to run up hard. these can be done where you try and go a little faster every few reps, or can try and hold a pace, or be more focused on form and getting in a solid knee drive and bouncing off your feet and less concerned with speed. the variety is good. Last session is either a light tempo or fartlek. for tempo think 20-30 minutes where you finish and feel like another 10 minutes would have been doable, fartlek just doing 8-12 x 1 on/1 off and increasing it up to 2 on/1 off is sufficient. Though the priority during this phase is doing the mileage, then long run, then hill session and the tempo as lowest priority.

next phase of 4-8 weeks is where you hold onto that 35-40 mileage you built up to but now you do a different style of workouts. id say 2 workouts a week in addition to long run) and run a 2 week cycle through them. doing a workout of short intervals at faster than 5k pace, workout at 5k pace, workout at slower than 5k pace and tempo/fartlek. so first week may have something like 16x400@5k pace-30 seconds per mile w/ 90 seconds rest on tuesday then 20 min tempo on thursday and the next week you have 6x1k @ 5k pace w/ equal time rest on tuesday and then a fartlek of 4 on/1 off with on portions being around half marathon pace or something of that nature.

thats the most general advice I could give but feel free to reply to this or DM me if you want me to point you in direction of good sources to look at or more info. best of luck
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Re: How Do I Train for a Sub-18 5k in my Winter Run Focus? [onboost91] [ In reply to ]
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onboost91 wrote:
Sorry to drag this thread up again but just wanted to give an update. I cut my mileage back and increased intensity - including joining a group of younger folk that does track workouts 1x a week with intervals that fall between 1 mile pace and 5k pace. My last 3 5K's have all been in the 18:5X range so the addition of hard intervals has really helped (it didn't help so much with a half mary that I raced/struggled thru recently though..no surprise there). Thanks for the advice! I am going to keep it up and see if I can get it my time lower (and I bought a pair of next%).

This is effectively the opposite of what I'd recommend. I struggled to run 18:20 off of the low-mileage, high quality approach. Jogged 40-50mpw on 6-7 runs/wk and did striders maybe 3-4x/week for a while, took it down to low 17mins and low/mid 36 for 10km (probably under on the right course), without any sharpening phase at all. Bake the cake, then frost it. You're going straight for the frosting right now.

"Don't you have to go be stupid somewhere else?"..."Not until 4!"
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Re: How Do I Train for a Sub-18 5k in my Winter Run Focus? [rucker] [ In reply to ]
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Well I tried that approach for several years and was always unable to break 19 (couldn't hold the pace). Feedback from others in this thread was that the long slow mileage approach doesn't work for everyone (and I am injury prone when it comes to adding mileage - constant calf and feet issues) so everyone told me to add more race pace work. So far that seems to be working. I am in the middle of my running racing season with about 4-5 5K's and maybe a 10K left to go. Once the season is over (late spring and summer) I plan to cut intensity again and start doing more LSD. Thanks for your thoughts though, I appreciate it!
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Re: How Do I Train for a Sub-18 5k in my Winter Run Focus? [oscaro] [ In reply to ]
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oscaro wrote:
This really does not seem like a good workout, that would be 5k at 3:35/km (5:47). I don't feel 200s are the best for 5k and def not with 15s rest.
I would recommend just doing threshold work with a few strides 2-3 times per week. Start with 3x100m strides and build your way up to 6x100. If you do that you will get 1800m of weekly "fast" mileage, plus a 20 min tempo around 4:10-4:15 (6:48). Tempo's and threshold intervals will get you 95% of the way with a lot lower risk of injury.

Guess what pace an 18min 5k is? 3:35km.
So you are doing the distance you want to at the pace you want, but getting 15s of rest per 200m.
This is about as specific as you can get.
The caveat is the 200's should be doable at less than 95% effort and you always hitting 45s. If you fall off pace for more than a couple intervals, stop the session and try again next week.

n=1 I hit my PB of 17:15 for 5k doing this workout weekly for two months. I have also done 50x200 on the track.
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