+1 I did the exact same ~ KK to Direto ~ huge difference in enjoyment, especially on zwift.

I don’t ride outside much anymore. 99% of my hours are on the trainer and it’s almost always before sun comes up

For me, I couldn’t ride the dumb trainer and hammer myself with sufferfest or TR like I used to. Back in the day, i would compliment outdoor riding with an occasional indoor session. It’s just not easy to do indoor TR / Sufferfesr 3-4x / week every week for months on end.

Zwift has fundamentally changed how I approach indoor training. I genuinely enjoy it. I look forward to races. Heck I have “friends” on zwift that I’ve raced with for 2 years now

So it’s not even a question. A smart trainer + zwift is a complete game changer for me. It’s a lot of fun

But depending on your use case I can see how you’d think the $ isn’t worth it. But for me, I would’ve stopped riding by now if I didn’t have the setup i have.

And the kicker... on 50% of the hours I used to train all my power metrics are highest they have ever been.

So anyone that says zwift racing isn’t effective... I just don’t see jt

I don't understand why a Smart trainer is a MUST, especially if you aren't using zwift. I get it in Zwift, the smart trainer makes it more immersive. But on a workout like trainerroad, what does a Smart trainer do that a power meter and a digitally controlled dumb trainer can't do? (Other than automatically changing the power as the workout changes...I just have to do that manually with my thumb on the remote of my trainer.)

I agree that a dumb trainer + power meter is the biggest bang for the buck and I really enjoy using zwift for structured workouts and I also find myself throwing in the occasional one hour race to really hammer for an hour. There is no way I could ride at my FTP for an hour if I wasn't trying to hold the wheel of some German douchebag, er, I mean, fellow Zwifter, ( :) :) : ) ) !!

2015 called and wants their TR vs Zwift argument back.

Zwift has a lot of training programs now, and has for some time. It doesn't have the current library that TR does but there's a lot of training programs and workouts available and it's always expanding. Plus you can make your own workouts, and more easily than you can on TR.

You may or may not like graphics and races and all that. To each their own in that regard. The "not a program to get the most out of your time on the trainer" comments are borderline stupid.

Zwift does everything TR does plus a whole bunch of stuff TR can't do.

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Favorite Gear: Dimond | Cadex | Desoto Sport | Hoka One One

I don't do either of them (yet) but I do like the TR podcasts / youtube channel, they are a pretty valuable source of information. They just released a new analytics component to the website that has some unique features that I quite like, at least in the demo they did.

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Swimming Workout of the Day:

Favourite Swim Sets:

2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly

I use both TR and Zwift and like both so I'm not dishing on Zwift - but one advantage TR has over Zwift is that in terms of actual structured training, TR is more focused and has no distractions. That appeals to some folks. Zwift offers you the opportunity to do what amounts to a group ride every day. That is fun, but anyone who is serious about training knows you can not "maximize your training time" just doing group rides. Not saying Zwift does not have the potential to be an awesome training tool but it leaves a lot in terms of choices up to the individual rider. There is a fairly large subset of riders who lack the discipline deal with choices and to stay away from the "candy" of endless group rides. (the same think happens outdoors too).

You hear this difference all the time in these debates. From the pro Zwift crowd - the argument is always that "it got me on the bike more often" but rarely "I religiously did their workout plans and got faster." You hear the opposite from the TrainerRoad camp - the argument is always "I did a plan and my FTP went up." That is not a difference in the programs or plan, it is a difference in the mentality of the riders. And, if you can get yourself on the trainer without candy, and your goal is maximizing your return on your training time, religiously sticking to the TR plan progression for the prescribed 26+ weeks is still the gold standard for indoor training.

Nobody says you just have to do group rides/races. You can just stick to structured workouts. Whenever I'm on Zwift I see just as many people in workout mode as free riding. I get what you're saying in that people could get caught up in the racing but, if we're being honest, the races are usually harder than any structured workout I do. Plus, why would anyone post about that awesome workout they did on Zwift in comparison to the awesome race they did. One has intrigue and excitement. The other one doesn't. Just because people aren't waxing on about their Zwift workouts doesn't mean they aren't happening.

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Favorite Gear: Dimond | Cadex | Desoto Sport | Hoka One One

My point is that "can" and "will" are two different things ;-)

I use Zwift for races now and then. It is a great tool. I just spend the other 90% of my time on the trainer doing interval work and I infinitely prefer the TR plans and program's simple interface for that. That is what works for me. I appreciate that other folks might like different things. Heck, I myself use both. I just get a little fed up with the "Cult of Zwift" that insists that it is the only way to get work done indoors. Y'all have the poor guy who started this thread thinking his life is ruined if he does not raid his retirement account to buy a smart trainer. There is more than one way to skin a cat.

Dude Zwift is amazing!

So I may be a bit unique in this, but I actually prefer doing my interval training in Zwift as opposed to TR, mainly because I hate watching a clock, but don't mind watching a "distance". What I mean is, if I'm doing a 10 minute interval, I know that will be approximately 4 miles on zwift. I know the landscape and the courses well enough now, that I have a pretty good idea where my interval will end, based on where I started. Watching the road go by, and having an idea of where the "finish line" is, is infinitely better for me then watching a clock tick.

And



Both of those describe my experience. I've been using my KK with a powermeter while waiting for the belt to repair my Kickr. I found Zwift just as engaging, as I was just doing intervals in workout mode, and wouldn't have been feeling increased resistance on hills anyway. Usually, I also do almost all my workouts on zwift in workout mode in ERG, on my Kickr. Occasionally someone will join up on me for a while, which is nice in a weird way. Otherwise, I just do my thing. Zwift is so much better though than staring at a group of blue bars. Also, as I often do the same courses, its fun to see getting faster on those courses. It might not be exact, but it's still fun.

The biggest benefit Zwift has for me is the competition and workout. Going for an hour at threshold is just something that is very hard to do outdoors in a high population area. Adding the motivation of a race adds to it. Adding a few interval workouts and its a great tool.



I find direct drive smart trainer the best way to train indoors. My big issue with the dumb trainers is the 'wheel on' aspect more than the actual smart portion. Direct drive just feels so much more realistic and smoother. The erg mode is just icing on the cake.

i'm like some of the other posters in here
i purely use Zwift to stop the boredom of doing my TR workouts.

I have only done 3 races in Zwift and i probably dont do much racing because i'm not much chop in them.

The times that i did race either i got dropped and am riding on my own which is boring or my sensors had a dropout and my rider has stopped, while watching the group ride off in the distance.

Ditto. Zwift for easy (IF) or longTR sessions, podcast or music for more demanding TR sessions.

Did some races last year, which I enjoyed. Did some races this year, which sucked.

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Swim. Overbike. Walk.

I agree with a lot of what you said but I think you're over-generalising with this bit, and it ends up a bit skewed. For the most part it's not a case of Zwifters versus TRers. I think for the most part people like both and see the value in both. Some pick one or the other because they don't want to be paying for or bothering with both. Others use both simultaneously so they can use TR plans in the Zwift world or because they use whichever they prefer on a given day for that days style of workout. So, for the most part I don't think it's 2 different camps.
However, then we get a thread like this one where someone asks if they should try Zwift. Inevitably there are those who do not like or have not tried Zwift who jump in and start saying how silly and gamey it is, while TR is for serious training. The two get placed in opposition. I think that's unfortunate and unhelpful. We end up with strawman arguments about only doing races not being the best training, etc.

Is it not fair to say the following:

TR is a workout management tool with a big library of training plans and workouts
Zwift is a place to train and facilitates both pre-programmed workouts like TR (though a smaller library), unstructured sessions, group rides, and races.

My point being, Zwift is not restrictive. You can use it similarly to TR, with TR or in a number of other ways. So, to make the argument that Zwift is for one type of rider and TR for another is barking up the wrong tree.

I just started training indoor last month with a fluid 2 no power meter. I use Zwift and ONLY do workouts.

Those workouts over the past 6 weeks have done wonders for my power. I don't have a power meter, just using the estimated power. But I can tell you that the power I comfortably hold now is the power at threshold when I started.

I'm going to switch to TR Monday. But I will probably just turn Zwift on as well. Why? I don't know.

I wear glasses but can't while indoor cause sweat gets all over them. So I can't see the game, just focus on the waters, cadence and time.