Yea. I'm hearing you. Unfortunately, the historical definition of racism no longer applies. It's been redefined. Come on, you know? With white privilege and all......
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Re: Slavery Repetitions - The dem's plan to win in 2020 [Steve Hawley]
[ In reply to ]
Re: Slavery Repetitions - The dem's plan to win in 2020 [Steve Hawley]
[ In reply to ]
Steve Hawley wrote:
no problem amigo Go read up on the amount of tax payer wealth that has been paid into public housing, vouchers, food stamps, ebt cards, etc etc.
Lyndon Baines Johnson was in no way a good man. But he embodied the modern Democrat Party.
It almost sounds like you believe the only recipients of those programs are descendants of slaves. This was your response to LBJ using the Great Society to pay reparations in full, wasn’t it? You forgot to give credit to subsequent Republican admins that corrected this Democrat atrocity. Kidding, both Nixon and Ford actually expanded the programs. Seeing as the recipients included quite a few of their rural constituents it shouldn’t come as a surprise.
Re: Slavery Repetitions - The dem's plan to win in 2020 [Justgeorge]
[ In reply to ]
Justgeorge wrote:
tri_yoda wrote:
Justgeorge wrote:
Is he correct that's what the bill has in it? If so, he is correct, it has nothing to do with covid-19 and it's picking choosing who to give money to based on the color of their skin.The aid is for "disadvantaged farmers" which is not a racial group. Just because this group contains some % of African Americans doesn't make it targeted based on race. By your insane logic, if we have programs to help poor people and poor people are disproportionately black it is "racially targeted aid". Well, if you want to play that game, the Trump tax cuts were "racially targeted" at whites and dwarfed this stimulus bill (because the Trump tax cuts were not a one time thing, they give away hundreds of billions every year until we change the tax laws).
About 70% of Americans are white? Do we call programs that everyone is eligible for "White Stimulus programs" because a large percentage of whites benefit from these programs?
If the Republicans want to criticize the scope of this stimulus package, that is a fair criticism and should be heard. But as far as calling contents of the aid package (no matter how much of a scope expansion they may represent) "reparations" it is truly disgusting race-baiting. I't talking lower than Al Sharpton.
While I will agree that the term reparations should not have been used, by the definition in post number 133, I don't believe any white people will qualify for this Aid.
What is "ethnic"? Are there no white "ethnic groups"? This is a terrible definition, it can mean almost anything, which means it almost means nothing.
Re: Slavery Repetitions - The dem's plan to win in 2020 [Steve Hawley]
[ In reply to ]
Steve Hawley wrote:
no problem amigo Go read up on the amount of tax payer wealth that has been paid into public housing, vouchers, food stamps, ebt cards, etc etc.
Lyndon Baines Johnson was in no way a good man. But he embodied the modern Democrat Party.
Steve, I'm disappointed in you. This is an uninformed take.
First, White people make up the majority of those on food stamps or WIC:
https://www.huffpost.com/...mographics_n_6771938
https://www.fns.usda.gov/...enrollment-data-2016
Second, millions of Black people are NOT in public housing or on food stamps. Therefore, if they are paying taxes, it is going to support programs that support White people than any other group.
Let's deal in facts or not at all.
Re: Slavery Repetitions - The dem's plan to win in 2020 [spudone]
[ In reply to ]
brother
i am still trying to figure out how i can document my 'racism' encounters on Oahu. Since I'm a white guy, it's not a priori thing like my brown or black brothers. So i am somewhat disadvantaged here. Just want some of this free $$ President Biden is throwing around for disadvantaged farmers.
Steve
i am still trying to figure out how i can document my 'racism' encounters on Oahu. Since I'm a white guy, it's not a priori thing like my brown or black brothers. So i am somewhat disadvantaged here. Just want some of this free $$ President Biden is throwing around for disadvantaged farmers.
Steve
Re: Slavery Repetitions - The dem's plan to win in 2020 [Tri2gohard]
[ In reply to ]
Tri2gohard wrote:
First, White people make up the majority of those on food stamps or WIC:
Let's deal in facts or not at all.
Not for the particular argument. But in the Huff Post breakdown it seems that out of all races that receive food stamps, the percentage on food stamps represents half of that race's total percentage of the population. Except for blacks/AA in which case it is double. They represent 13% of the total population but represent 26% of those who use food stamps.
Whites: 76% of total pop but 40% of food stamps.
Black/AA: 13% vs 26%
Hispanic: 18.5% vs 10%
Asian: 5.9% vs 2.1%
Native American: 1.3% vs 1.2% (about equal)
Re: Slavery Repetitions - The dem's plan to win in 2020 [Yeeper]
[ In reply to ]
Yeeper wrote:
Tri2gohard wrote:
First, White people make up the majority of those on food stamps or WIC:
Let's deal in facts or not at all.
Not for the particular argument. But in the Huff Post breakdown it seems that out of all races that receive food stamps, the percentage on food stamps represents half of that race's total percentage of the population. Except for blacks/AA in which case it is double. They represent 13% of the total population but represent 26% of those who use food stamps.
Whites: 76% of total pop but 40% of food stamps.
Black/AA: 13% vs 26%
Hispanic: 18.5% vs 10%
Asian: 5.9% vs 2.1%
Native American: 1.3% vs 1.2% (about equal)
Steve's argument was that these programs were reparations that had been paid to Black people over the last fifty years or so. The above clearly illustrate that Blacks are not the sole recipients of the benefits and many Black Americans have paid plenty into the system without receiving any of these benefits.
The programs exist to serve all citizens, not solely Blacks. And certainly not as a form of reparations.
Re: Slavery Repetitions - The dem's plan to win in 2020 [Tri2gohard]
[ In reply to ]
Tri2gohard wrote:
Steve Hawley wrote:
no problem amigo Go read up on the amount of tax payer wealth that has been paid into public housing, vouchers, food stamps, ebt cards, etc etc.
Lyndon Baines Johnson was in no way a good man. But he embodied the modern Democrat Party.
Steve, I'm disappointed in you. This is an uninformed take.
First, White people make up the majority of those on food stamps or WIC:
https://www.huffpost.com/...mographics_n_6771938
https://www.fns.usda.gov/...enrollment-data-2016
Second, millions of Black people are NOT in public housing or on food stamps. Therefore, if they are paying taxes, it is going to support programs that support White people than any other group.
Let's deal in facts or not at all.
Pretty bold move on your part there?
I made no mention of race nor do i intend to. Don't give a shit whether those sucking at the public tit are white, black or yellow. We need to give them a hand up and then get them off the rolls. Yes, I do believe that Great Society legislation was very detrimental to the nuclear black family. Universal basic income (another Democrat endeavor) will just create more of a dependent class of broken families (irregardless of ethnicity) that they can count on for sure votes. It sickens me.
Steve
Re: Slavery Repetitions - The dem's plan to win in 2020 [Yeeper]
[ In reply to ]
Yeeper wrote:
Tri2gohard wrote:
First, White people make up the majority of those on food stamps or WIC:
Let's deal in facts or not at all.
Not for the particular argument. But in the Huff Post breakdown it seems that out of all races that receive food stamps, the percentage on food stamps represents half of that race's total percentage of the population. Except for blacks/AA in which case it is double. They represent 13% of the total population but represent 26% of those who use food stamps.
Whites: 76% of total pop but 40% of food stamps.
Black/AA: 13% vs 26%
Hispanic: 18.5% vs 10%
Asian: 5.9% vs 2.1%
Native American: 1.3% vs 1.2% (about equal)
Of course the argument for reparations is that the centuries of slavery and denial of rights has denied blacks generational wealth which is what causes them to be inordinately impoverished and on food stamps.
Steve's comments are the first I have heard welfare programs referred to as some sort of reparations. That is an odd take on them.
I'm beginning to think that we are much more fucked than I thought.
Re: Slavery Repetitions - The dem's plan to win in 2020 [Steve Hawley]
[ In reply to ]
Steve Hawley wrote:
I made no mention of race nor do i intend to.This is a thread about Slavery Reparations.
You referenced The Great Society policies as a form of reparations.
Slaves in America were Black.
Re: Slavery Repetitions - The dem's plan to win in 2020 [Tri2gohard]
[ In reply to ]
Tri2gohard wrote:
Steve Hawley wrote:
I made no mention of race nor do i intend to.This is a thread about Slavery Reparations.
You referenced The Great Society policies as a form of reparations.
Slaves in America were Black.
What? You got me there?
Of course Great Society Legislation was designed almost entirely to repair or restore the lives of Black Americans. I didn't address it in my post as it's entirely transparent to the casual observer.
So with the hundreds of billions of dollars that have been spent on Great Society legislation---entirely to help/aide/transform the lives of Black Americans. How're we doing. Is it enough?
"DYNOMITE"
Steve
Re: Slavery Repetitions - The dem's plan to win in 2020 [j p o]
[ In reply to ]
j p o wrote:
Yeeper wrote:
Tri2gohard wrote:
First, White people make up the majority of those on food stamps or WIC:
Let's deal in facts or not at all.
Not for the particular argument. But in the Huff Post breakdown it seems that out of all races that receive food stamps, the percentage on food stamps represents half of that race's total percentage of the population. Except for blacks/AA in which case it is double. They represent 13% of the total population but represent 26% of those who use food stamps.
Whites: 76% of total pop but 40% of food stamps.
Black/AA: 13% vs 26%
Hispanic: 18.5% vs 10%
Asian: 5.9% vs 2.1%
Native American: 1.3% vs 1.2% (about equal)
Of course the argument for reparations is that the centuries of slavery and denial of rights has denied blacks generational wealth which is what causes them to be inordinately impoverished and on food stamps.
Steve's comments are the first I have heard welfare programs referred to as some sort of reparations. That is an odd take on them.
Come on now? The first SNAP/EBT/"Food Stamp" program began back in in '39 under a noted socialist name of FDR whom my grandparents hated almost as much as Tojo.
Steve
Re: Slavery Repetitions - The dem's plan to win in 2020 [Tri2gohard]
[ In reply to ]
Tri2gohard wrote:
Yeeper wrote:
Tri2gohard wrote:
First, White people make up the majority of those on food stamps or WIC:
Let's deal in facts or not at all.
Not for the particular argument. But in the Huff Post breakdown it seems that out of all races that receive food stamps, the percentage on food stamps represents half of that race's total percentage of the population. Except for blacks/AA in which case it is double. They represent 13% of the total population but represent 26% of those who use food stamps.
Whites: 76% of total pop but 40% of food stamps.
Black/AA: 13% vs 26%
Hispanic: 18.5% vs 10%
Asian: 5.9% vs 2.1%
Native American: 1.3% vs 1.2% (about equal)
Steve's argument was that these programs were reparations that had been paid to Black people over the last fifty years or so. The above clearly illustrate that Blacks are not the sole recipients of the benefits and many Black Americans have paid plenty into the system without receiving any of these benefits.
The programs exist to serve all citizens, not solely Blacks. And certainly not as a form of reparations.
In my defense, my first line was "not for the particular argument." I see now more where you were coming from. I thought that while it does serve all, it serves blacks/AA much more than any other race. But in retrospect it seems like thats irrelevant to this discussion at hand. Carry on.
Re: Slavery Repetitions - The dem's plan to win in 2020 [j p o]
[ In reply to ]
j p o wrote:
Yeeper wrote:
Tri2gohard wrote:
First, White people make up the majority of those on food stamps or WIC:
Let's deal in facts or not at all.
Not for the particular argument. But in the Huff Post breakdown it seems that out of all races that receive food stamps, the percentage on food stamps represents half of that race's total percentage of the population. Except for blacks/AA in which case it is double. They represent 13% of the total population but represent 26% of those who use food stamps.
Whites: 76% of total pop but 40% of food stamps.
Black/AA: 13% vs 26%
Hispanic: 18.5% vs 10%
Asian: 5.9% vs 2.1%
Native American: 1.3% vs 1.2% (about equal)
Of course the argument for reparations is that the centuries of slavery and denial of rights has denied blacks generational wealth which is what causes them to be inordinately impoverished and on food stamps.
Steve's comments are the first I have heard welfare programs referred to as some sort of reparations. That is an odd take on them.
Yea I saw I was a bit off there.
Re: Slavery Repetitions - The dem's plan to win in 2020 [Steve Hawley]
[ In reply to ]
Quote:
Of course Great Society Legislation was designed almost entirely to repair or restore the lives of Black Americans.Source?
-----------------------------Baron Von Speedypants
-----------------------------RunTraining articles here:
http://forum.slowtwitch.com/...runtraining;#1612485
Re: Slavery Repetitions - The dem's plan to win in 2020 [BarryP]
[ In reply to ]
BarryP wrote:
Quote:
Of course Great Society Legislation was designed almost entirely to repair or restore the lives of Black Americans.Source?
He’s already addressed this. “Go read up on it” because you are clearly not a “casual observer”. For being such a historian one was to wonder what his motive is for framing it as making good on full reparations.
Re: Slavery Repetitions - The dem's plan to win in 2020 [Steve Hawley]
[ In reply to ]
Steve Hawley wrote:
Pretty bold move on your part there? I made no mention of race nor do i intend to.
So let me get this straight. Below are your contributions to this thread and then you respond to a post citing that reparations (a word that has specific meaning in the context of this discussion ) have been paid in full. Somehow you expect us to believe you never mentioned race? The casual observer would disagree.
“I'd argue that the nuclear black family was much better off before LBJs Great Society than they are here today. “
“Can I declare myself as a person of color? I'd like some of that 'free' money they're handing out. “
“God damnit I am a socially disadvantaged (context of discussion) farmer. I want some of this free money President Biden is handing out!”
“So i can refer back to my time of racial discrimination on Hawaii and i am now a disadvantaged farmer since i've been the recipient of racial animus?”
“Since I'm a white guy, it's not a priori thing like my brown or black brothers. So i am somewhat disadvantaged here.”
Re: Slavery Repetitions - The dem's plan to win in 2020 [TimeIsUp]
[ In reply to ]
replying to no one in particular, I googled (I know, wicked scientific) Great Society Legislation and the majority of the hits related to the "main goals" of the program were "the elimination of poverty and racial injustice"...I'd bet dollars to donuts that if this legislation had been rolled in today's political climate instead of the 60's, Graham and the rest of race dog whistlers in Washington would be shouting "reparations" loud and clear.
"one eye doubles my eyesight, so things don't look half bad" John Hiatt
"one eye doubles my eyesight, so things don't look half bad" John Hiatt
Re: Slavery Repetitions - The dem's plan to win in 2020 [Steve Hawley]
[ In reply to ]
Steve Hawley wrote:
Come on now? The first SNAP/EBT/"Food Stamp" program began back in in '39 under a noted socialist name of FDR whom my grandparents hated almost as much as Tojo."Human existence is based upon two pillars: Compassion and knowledge. Compassion without knowledge is ineffective; Knowledge without compassion is inhuman." Victor Weisskopf.
Re: Slavery Repetitions - The dem's plan to win in 2020 [Alvin Tostig]
[ In reply to ]
the hatred was pretty awesome to observe
Once i graduated from West Point I went out to Calif to visit my Grands. If I had driven up in a japanese vehicle i think my grandfather would have turned me away. Fortunately for me, back then I was driving a IHC Scout.
Steve
Once i graduated from West Point I went out to Calif to visit my Grands. If I had driven up in a japanese vehicle i think my grandfather would have turned me away. Fortunately for me, back then I was driving a IHC Scout.
Steve
Re: Slavery Repetitions - The dem's plan to win in 2020 [moneydog59]
[ In reply to ]
moneydog59 wrote:
replying to no one in particular, I googled (I know, wicked scientific) Great Society Legislation and the majority of the hits related to the "main goals" of the program were "the elimination of poverty and racial injustice"...I'd bet dollars to donuts that if this legislation had been rolled in today's political climate instead of the 60's, Graham and the rest of race dog whistlers in Washington would be shouting "reparations" loud and clear.Given the scope of the program one has to dig deep to cherry pick reparations from it. I wonder if the same level of disdain is held for say, all of the rural farmers who benefitted from it.
Re: Slavery Repetitions - The dem's plan to win in 2020 [TimeIsUp]
[ In reply to ]
TimeIsUp wrote:
BarryP wrote:
Quote:
Of course Great Society Legislation was designed almost entirely to repair or restore the lives of Black Americans.Source?
He’s already addressed this. “Go read up on it” because you are clearly not a “casual observer”. For being such a historian one was to wonder what his motive is for framing it as making good on full reparations.
I could write a dissertation on the subject and it would be casually dismissed by the LR left here. So why should I make the effort?
YOU have zero desire to look at any source I might reference. Your call for 'a source' is a transparent dodge in a arguement you don't like and don't think is going your way.
In the case some other readers are wondering about source material for my ideas here I'd steer then towards Doris Kearns Goodwin's award winning bio of LBJ and the Great Society
https://www.amazon.com/...ding=UTF8&btkr=1
Steve
Re: Slavery Repetitions - The dem's plan to win in 2020 [TimeIsUp]
[ In reply to ]
I guess my point was, that in this political climate, as soon as the race dog whistlers see "eliminating racial injustice" the response is "reparations". In the 60's, I'd like to believe that congress and the house (and LBJ) actually thought these programs would actually accomplish what the intent of them was, and not, cynically, just a massive "vote grab", amongst other things.
"one eye doubles my eyesight, so things don't look half bad" John Hiatt
"one eye doubles my eyesight, so things don't look half bad" John Hiatt
Re: Slavery Repetitions - The dem's plan to win in 2020 [Steve Hawley]
[ In reply to ]
Steve Hawley wrote:
I made no mention of race nor do i intend to. Don't give a shit whether those sucking at the public tit are white, black or yellow. We need to give them a hand up and then get them off the rolls. Yes, I do believe that Great Society legislation was very detrimental to the nuclear black family. Universal basic income (another Democrat endeavor) will just create more of a dependent class of broken families (irregardless of ethnicity) that they can count on for sure votes. It sickens me.
UBI is the most efficient and least detrimental way to ensure that all Americans receive healthcare, food and a roof over our head. We are wealthy enough as a country that those basic things are rights. And in practice, we already provide those things, just through very inefficient and demoralizing avenues. UBI can eliminate the "welfare experience" from welfare. Many researchers have concluded that a lot of welfare dependency is a result of the difficulties in administering the programs. Getting and maintaining the benefits becomes a job.
I don't think you are wrong about the detrimental effect of welfare. I acknowledge that that believing healthcare, food and shelter are rights is controversial to some. But if we are going to have welfare - and we are - we should do it right.
Re: Slavery Repetitions - The dem's plan to win in 2020 [Steve Hawley]
[ In reply to ]
Steve Hawley wrote:
TimeIsUp wrote:
BarryP wrote:
Quote:
Of course Great Society Legislation was designed almost entirely to repair or restore the lives of Black Americans.Source?
He’s already addressed this. “Go read up on it” because you are clearly not a “casual observer”. For being such a historian one was to wonder what his motive is for framing it as making good on full reparations.
I could write a dissertation on the subject and it would be casually dismissed by the LR left here. So why should I make the effort?
YOU have zero desire to look at any source I might reference. Your call for 'a source' is a transparent dodge in a arguement you don't like and don't think is going your way.
In the case some other readers are wondering about source material for my ideas here I'd steer then towards Doris Kearns Goodwin's award winning bio of LBJ and the Great Society
https://www.amazon.com/...ding=UTF8&btkr=1
You quoted me, but sounds like you addressed BarryP’s post asking for a source, although you may consider our inquiries similar. I won’t speak for Barry or anyone else, but I feel like I have a lot to learn from you which is why I’ve posed questions. Again, personally, I read a ~600 page book based on a recommendation and your approval of content so I don’t think I’m in the boat of not caring. That said, my general experience is that academics don’t like to be questioned by someone whose knowledge base they consider to be inferior. It is the internet and tone can be deceiving, but you give off that vibe. Thank you for the book recommendation.