BLeP wrote:
What, exactly, is a white nationalist? And what do they want? Is it as simple as a country of just whities?They are just everyday Americans who want to MAGA through genocide and ethnic cleansing.
Lavender Room
Login required to started new threads
Login required to post replies
Re: Pardon my ignorance [BLeP]
[ In reply to ]
They are just everyday Americans who want to MAGA through genocide and ethnic cleansing.
Re: Pardon my ignorance [schroeder]
[ In reply to ]
schroeder wrote:
BLeP wrote:
What, exactly, is a white nationalist? And what do they want? Is it as simple as a country of just whities?They are just everyday Americans who want to MAGA through genocide and ethnic cleansing.
Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.
- Chinese proverb
Re: Pardon my ignorance [BLeP]
[ In reply to ]
If only the president had the courage to label this what it is.
Radical islami... oops
Radical White Nationalist Terrorism.
Reminds me what a comedian said (can't remember which one):
"Not all Trump supporters are racist, but all racists are Trump supporters"
Play to the base, baby!
===============
Proud member of the MSF (Maple Syrup Mafia)
Radical islami... oops
Radical White Nationalist Terrorism.
Reminds me what a comedian said (can't remember which one):
"Not all Trump supporters are racist, but all racists are Trump supporters"
Play to the base, baby!
===============
Proud member of the MSF (Maple Syrup Mafia)
Re: Pardon my ignorance [CaptainCanada]
[ In reply to ]
Quote:
"Not all Trump supporters are racist, but all racists are Trump supporters"Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.
- Chinese proverb
Re: Pardon my ignorance [CaptainCanada]
[ In reply to ]
Quote:
Reminds me what a comedian said (can't remember which one): "Not all Trump supporters are racist, but all racists are Trump supporters"
Slowguy
(insert pithy phrase here...)
Re: Pardon my ignorance [CaptainCanada]
[ In reply to ]
Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.
- Chinese proverb
Re: Pardon my ignorance [Duffy]
[ In reply to ]
Duffy wrote:
Quote:
"Not all Trump supporters are racist, but all racists are Trump supporters"Where do I send my money?
How does Danny Hart sit down with balls that big?
Re: Pardon my ignorance [slowguy]
[ In reply to ]
slowguy wrote:
Not sure why the Attorney General of the United States would have jurisdiction here, but as far as Virginia goes, hate crimes require that the crime was committed against someone because of race, religion, ethnicity, or national origin. As far as I can tell, assaulting someone because they believe differently than you isn't covered.atty general would have jurisdiction if he broke a federal civil rights law. you're right, assaulting someone because they believe differently than you isn't necessarily a federal civil rights crime. but if you assaulted folks because of their "actual or perceived race, color, religion, national origin of any person" then you fall afoul of the statute.
the problem with white supremacists, nazis, neonazis, et al, is that they tend to rope in some pretty large swathes of undesirables, such as jews and catholics. therein may lie the problem. as well as if black people were in the group and it can be shown that it was a particular hatred of black people that motivated him (unless, as i think you suggested above, he didn't intentionally run into these folks, rather he was texting or apply his eyebrow liner or whatever).
Dan Empfield
aka Slowman
Re: Pardon my ignorance [slowguy]
[ In reply to ]
slowguy wrote:
Quote:
Reminds me what a comedian said (can't remember which one): "Not all Trump supporters are racist, but all racists are Trump supporters"
Luscan is pretty racist. I guess he supported Trump.
How does Danny Hart sit down with balls that big?
Re: Pardon my ignorance [BLeP]
[ In reply to ]
"Your Attitude Determines Your Altitude."
Re: Pardon my ignorance [BLeP]
[ In reply to ]
"Your Attitude Determines Your Altitude."
Re: Pardon my ignorance [Slowman]
[ In reply to ]
Slowman wrote:
slowguy wrote:
Not sure why the Attorney General of the United States would have jurisdiction here, but as far as Virginia goes, hate crimes require that the crime was committed against someone because of race, religion, ethnicity, or national origin. As far as I can tell, assaulting someone because they believe differently than you isn't covered.atty general would have jurisdiction if he broke a federal civil rights law. you're right, assaulting someone because they believe differently than you isn't necessarily a federal civil rights crime. but if you assaulted folks because of their "actual or perceived race, color, religion, national origin of any person" then you fall afoul of the statute.
the problem with white supremacists, nazis, neonazis, et al, is that they tend to rope in some pretty large swathes of undesirables, such as jews and catholics. therein may lie the problem. as well as if black people were in the group and it can be shown that it was a particular hatred of black people that motivated him (unless, as i think you suggested above, he didn't intentionally run into these folks, rather he was texting or apply his eyebrow liner or whatever).
Federal civil rights violations are not punishable by the death penalty.
I'll ask you the same questions if you're going down that road as the nonsense posted that started this tack: What are your thoughts on the folks tossing bricks off the roof of a garage at people going to the Trump rally in Chicago and your position on the Weather Underground?
Re: Pardon my ignorance [rob2681]
[ In reply to ]
rob2681 wrote:
Well if that isn't definitive proof of motive, I don't know what is.
How does Danny Hart sit down with balls that big?
Re: Pardon my ignorance [rob2681]
[ In reply to ]
You just going to ignore my questions or you don't want to admit your intellectual dishonesty?
Re: Pardon my ignorance [BLeP]
[ In reply to ]
BLeP wrote:
windywave wrote:
rob2681 wrote:
I'll make it simple for you. Did a white nationalist murder that innocent woman? Yes or no.Did the protesters throwing bricks off of UIC's parking garage commit attempted murder?
Depends. Were they white nationalist? Or lefty anti protesters?
lefty protesters
Re: Pardon my ignorance [Slowman]
[ In reply to ]
Quote:
...or apply his eyebrow liner or whatever....I think you're on to something here...
We should get Mike Pence on this...
Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.
- Chinese proverb
Re: Pardon my ignorance [windywave]
[ In reply to ]
windywave wrote:
BLeP wrote:
windywave wrote:
rob2681 wrote:
I'll make it simple for you. Did a white nationalist murder that innocent woman? Yes or no.Did the protesters throwing bricks off of UIC's parking garage commit attempted murder?
Depends. Were they white nationalist? Or lefty anti protesters?
lefty protesters
No. That's just civil disobedience.
How does Danny Hart sit down with balls that big?
Re: Pardon my ignorance [windywave]
[ In reply to ]
windywave wrote:
You just going to ignore my questions or you don't want to admit your intellectual dishonesty?He's too consumed with his RAGE!!!
How does Danny Hart sit down with balls that big?
Re: Pardon my ignorance [BLeP]
[ In reply to ]
BLeP wrote:
windywave wrote:
BLeP wrote:
windywave wrote:
rob2681 wrote:
I'll make it simple for you. Did a white nationalist murder that innocent woman? Yes or no.Did the protesters throwing bricks off of UIC's parking garage commit attempted murder?
Depends. Were they white nationalist? Or lefty anti protesters?
lefty protesters
No. That's just civil disobedience.
It's only "civil disobedience" if the ruling class considers it disobedience. These lefty protests are part of ruling class. They aren't fighting the man, they are the man.
Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.
- Chinese proverb
Re: Pardon my ignorance [Duffy]
[ In reply to ]
Duffy wrote:
BLeP wrote:
windywave wrote:
BLeP wrote:
windywave wrote:
rob2681 wrote:
I'll make it simple for you. Did a white nationalist murder that innocent woman? Yes or no.Did the protesters throwing bricks off of UIC's parking garage commit attempted murder?
Depends. Were they white nationalist? Or lefty anti protesters?
lefty protesters
No. That's just civil disobedience.
It's only "civil disobedience" if the ruling class considers it disobedience. These lefty protests are part of ruling class. They aren't fighting the man, they are the man.
'Twas sarcasm.
How does Danny Hart sit down with balls that big?
Re: Pardon my ignorance [slowguy]
[ In reply to ]
slowguy wrote:
rob2681 wrote:
That's the most stupidest bullshit I ever heard. That motherfucker is a white supremacist domestic terrorist and killed that innocent woman intentionally in broad daylight. Sessions should charge that sub-human monster with a hate crime and death penalty.Not sure why the Attorney General of the United States would have jurisdiction here, but as far as Virginia goes, hate crimes require that the crime was committed against someone because of race, religion, ethnicity, or national origin. As far as I can tell, assaulting someone because they believe differently than you isn't covered.
Maybe, instead of calling in the Federal govt and insisting on hate crimes prosecution, we should wait for the actual fact of the case to be put forward.
I know, that's not nearly as much fun as just venting and demanding justice, but it is kind of how our criminal justice system is designed to work, so....
Much of the federal civil rights criminal legislation requires action "under the color of law." Not the case here.
But it's also my understanding that there is federal hate crime legislation covering actions based on particular protected categories, including the perception of those protected categories. There very well may not be jurisdiction here, but I see no problem with an investigation into that. I'm a little baffled by those here who so adamantly conclude that this wasn't a hate crime when we have so little information about the guy's motives. Seems a bit premature.
Re: Pardon my ignorance [AlanShearer]
[ In reply to ]
AlanShearer wrote:
slowguy wrote:
rob2681 wrote:
That's the most stupidest bullshit I ever heard. That motherfucker is a white supremacist domestic terrorist and killed that innocent woman intentionally in broad daylight. Sessions should charge that sub-human monster with a hate crime and death penalty.Not sure why the Attorney General of the United States would have jurisdiction here, but as far as Virginia goes, hate crimes require that the crime was committed against someone because of race, religion, ethnicity, or national origin. As far as I can tell, assaulting someone because they believe differently than you isn't covered.
Maybe, instead of calling in the Federal govt and insisting on hate crimes prosecution, we should wait for the actual fact of the case to be put forward.
I know, that's not nearly as much fun as just venting and demanding justice, but it is kind of how our criminal justice system is designed to work, so....
Much of the federal civil rights criminal legislation requires action "under the color of law." Not the case here.
But it's also my understanding that there is federal hate crime legislation covering actions based on particular protected categories, including the perception of those protected categories. There very well may not be jurisdiction here, but I see no problem with an investigation into that. I'm a little baffled by those here who so adamantly conclude that this wasn't a hate crime when we have so little information about the guy's motives. Seems a bit premature.
My position is that assuming this was a premeditated action there is no way he could have perceived or known that the victims were a protected class.
ETA also the victims were not a protected class
Re: Pardon my ignorance [AlanShearer]
[ In reply to ]
AlanShearer wrote:
slowguy wrote:
rob2681 wrote:
That's the most stupidest bullshit I ever heard. That motherfucker is a white supremacist domestic terrorist and killed that innocent woman intentionally in broad daylight. Sessions should charge that sub-human monster with a hate crime and death penalty.Not sure why the Attorney General of the United States would have jurisdiction here, but as far as Virginia goes, hate crimes require that the crime was committed against someone because of race, religion, ethnicity, or national origin. As far as I can tell, assaulting someone because they believe differently than you isn't covered.
Maybe, instead of calling in the Federal govt and insisting on hate crimes prosecution, we should wait for the actual fact of the case to be put forward.
I know, that's not nearly as much fun as just venting and demanding justice, but it is kind of how our criminal justice system is designed to work, so....
Much of the federal civil rights criminal legislation requires action "under the color of law." Not the case here.
But it's also my understanding that there is federal hate crime legislation covering actions based on particular protected categories, including the perception of those protected categories. There very well may not be jurisdiction here, but I see no problem with an investigation into that. I'm a little baffled by those here who so adamantly conclude that this wasn't a hate crime when we have so little information about the guy's motives. Seems a bit premature.
Well, I'm not insisting that it isn't a hate crime. In fact, I'm asking people to hold off from insisting one way or the other until we have the details. That's how our system works. You don't assume it's a hate crime until the crime is investigated and you determine that the requirements are met. You certainly don't start from an assumption that it IS a hate crime, and then wait to find out the guy's motives.
That said, my understanding of federal hate crimes laws are that they require the crime to have been committed against someone because of their race, religion, ethnicity, nationality, gender, sexual orientation, gender identity, or disability. None of those would seem to apply here, and VA hate crimes seem to require race, religion, or national origin, so I'm fuzzy on why people are leaping to the conclusion that it qualifies for hate crimes prosecution, other than that people just figure if you hate someone, then it must be a hate crime.
Personally, I fucking hate the concept of hate crimes legislation. Somehow, if this guy ran over pedestrians because he's a psycho, it's better than if he did it because he didn't like their skin color. Ridiculous.
Slowguy
(insert pithy phrase here...)
Re: Pardon my ignorance [Slowman]
[ In reply to ]
Quote:
atty general would have jurisdiction if he broke a federal civil rights law.Your civil rights protect you from the govt. Unless the driver was acting on behalf of the govt somehow, I'm not sure a civil rights case would be pertinent.
Quote:
but if you assaulted folks because of their "actual or perceived race, color, religion, national origin of any person" then you fall afoul of the statute.No, then you might run afoul of federal hate crimes statutes. Not the same thing. And nobody is alleging that this man drove into pedestrians for any of those reasons.
Slowguy
(insert pithy phrase here...)
My position is that assuming this was a premeditated action there is no way he could have perceived or known that the victims were a protected class.
"No way?" I could see how someone who is a white supremacist, bigot, whatever, assuming that any counter-protester must be n***** or n*****-lover (and yes, as typing that, the Louis CK routine went through my mind), which in his or her mind might be the same thing. The perception of being in a protected class is just a protected as actually being in the class. If someone equates white sympathizers as the same as a minority, then is it protected? Or if someone views a white sympathizer is either on a level field as the minority, or perhaps even worse, is that not protected?
"No way?" I could see how someone who is a white supremacist, bigot, whatever, assuming that any counter-protester must be n***** or n*****-lover (and yes, as typing that, the Louis CK routine went through my mind), which in his or her mind might be the same thing. The perception of being in a protected class is just a protected as actually being in the class. If someone equates white sympathizers as the same as a minority, then is it protected? Or if someone views a white sympathizer is either on a level field as the minority, or perhaps even worse, is that not protected?