Just about any Shimano mechanical group could be on the podium. I'd say 9100 probably represents the pinnacle, but I have 7900 on a bike with 80k miles and it still shifts perfect. I think Shimano puts engineering and technology in their mechanical drivetrains that eludes the other makers. I am probably biased, but I sure like them. I've never had a desire to put something else on.

Eww. 7900 was a dark age for Shimano. 7800 great. 9000 awesome, electronic-like. 7900 was still trying to figure out the hidden shifting cable routing or something. Always had trouble with it. Friction, long throws. My gravel bike Rival is better than 7900 was.

The actual shifting process became an almost entirely solved problem when hyperglide was introduced thirty years ago. Even Tourney-level parts can shift pretty much perfectly when they're in good repair and properly-adjusted.
The biggest hitches to this have been things like when Shimano switched from "non aero" shift routing to under-the-tape, and took a generational cycle to work out the issues with the new design.

Assuming everything is compatible and well-adjusted, the question mostly becomes an issue of preferred shifter ergonomics.

Where are the campy guys?

Reminiscing about the '80s.

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This.

I actually went first went to Hyperglide with 8-speed and friction downtube shift levers (Simplex) and the shifting was crazy good.

Also, shift quality depends on set-up - derailleur hanger being aligned, housing in good shape, etc.

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It could be my memories improving things, but I remember thinking DA 7800 was the best thing I'd ever felt. There are faster shifts, but damn, that was smooth. I remember comparing it to Sram at the time (Force?) and thinking that Sram was faster, but it just hammered the gears into place. 7800 just gently glided into place.

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JustinDoesTriathlon

Owner, FuelRodz Endurance.

The DA 9000 on my Focus is the best shifting group I've tried. I have the new 105 on my trainer bike and I have to say it is close

You're going to struggle to beat Campy SR 11 or 12. IMHO, best mechanical of all time

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"Suddenly the thought struck me. My floor is someone elses ceiling"-Nils Ferlin

My DA 9spd (7700??) still shifts perfectly every time. Love it. It started life on my Serotta, then to my trek carbon, and I'll be moving it back to the Serotta over the winter since the trek is getting relegated to full time trainer duty.

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Shimano's shifting has been great for a long time.

Was it 9000 when they went to the longer "arm" on the front derailler? I think that really improved front shifting.

I like that they have different configurations, depending on where your front derailler cable comes from.

SRAM Red 10spd

Don't @ me

Shimano whatever with Zipp Vuka R2C levers... when they worked. Those were amazing.

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the new shimano xtr & xt is f@#$ing amazing but probably not what you're after

Yeah, if you have that, plan on rebuilding the R2C shifters at least half dozen times over a decade, or having a rear deraileur pulley wheel crack 4-5 x over that same period, or having the rear cage itself randomly explode on you in an aerobic training session. Likely one of the worst mech groups of all time. Same reason I'll be jumping to Shimano and staying there on the next bike. Sram Red 10 sp has been nothing but problems.

That hasn't been my experience. I bought a used set in the ST classifieds near a decade ago, rode it a shit-ton since then, and have done zero maintenance with zero issues.

agreed, i'd rate xtr 9100 as far better shifting than DA 9000
can only imagine that the new DA expected next year will be incredible

Now you have me interested. How is it actually labeled XTR 9100?

IMO: any Campy mech > everyone else mech

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Other than the Chip comment I was going to stay away and just read from this thread because I haven't used everything but:

When I started using the M8000 group (Shimano XT) it was better even when dirty than any other Shimano mechanical group I've used. (including 530, 770, 590, 4500 to 4600, 5500 to 5800, 6600 to 6800 and 7700 to 7900)

Since then I've built two R7000 bikes and one R8000 bike, all of which shift terrific.

I haven't used Campy since the late 80's C Record and have never had a SRAM drivetrain.

I think you are one of the lucky ones. I'm jealous. I don't ride near as much as some on here, and I am on my third front R2C shifter. SRAM was warrantying them for a while, but not since they went out of production. I have a replacement lined up for WHEN my current one fails.

Any post 90s Shimano on, 9000/9100 dura-ace being the very top.

Brand new pretty much every shimano shifts perfectly. Even Tiagra

Want to buy an 11spd Campy Super Record group? About to part out a Look build lol

As much as I'd love to, I'm no longer running any mech groups.

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yup! 9120 also but that's the trail/enduro group. fwiw, I removed the di2 on my other bikes (mtb as you might deduce) and now have the xtr & xt versions on all except the fat bike because it's eagle and just fine as is. Related, this shifts fine using an eagle cassette and (imo) better than a full sram drivetrain should you not be able to get the freehub for your wheels (Stan's mostly, they're "out" but not really available). I'm in love...

simplex retrofriction.

That's a shifter mechanism, not a group. What are you pairing it with?

I still don't understand why Shimano can't do some 11-speed r2c shifters

Probably because traditional bar-end shifters are vastly less mechanically complex than R2C, and TT/Tri is a shaky market where the high-end has moved largely to electronic. The other markets that buy bar-end shifters won't help the R2C cause either, since the drop-bar tourists and whatever who use bar-end shifters do so specifically because they're simple levers.

Well it's definitely Not SRAM. The front SRAM deraileurs I've had have been shiiite.

I've been on di2 since I went 11sp, so I can't speak for current mechanical stuff.

With 10 speed, it was SRAM Red for me and Shimano was a distant second. Shimano was smooth and reliable, but those long throws and ergonomics just isn't my thing. I put 10's of thousands of miles on SRAM red with never an issue. Love the quick double tap shifting vs. multiple levels with long throws on shimano. Maybe SRAM wasn't as smooth, but quicker and more precise. The yaw control FD was also great, no need to trim FD on cross chaining like Shimano. I still have SRAM Apex 10sp on my cross bike and it just works. All that said, I'm running Di2 on my road bikes and Eagle AXS on one of my MTBs and electronic is the way to go. I prefer Shimano over SRAM for electronic, even with the wires.

I found a NOS trek 5900 project one frame from about 2004 last year and sourced some new 7800 bits off ebay. Although I'm a sram guy, the 7800 is like butter, as good as I remembered from all those years ago. Sure, I have to trim the front derailleur but the bike is my retro cruiser so no issue there.

I can't really feel the difference in the gruppos at the high end now.

But on that note.. I had some 9 speed dura ace on a cross bike I bought second hand for a while. The big loopy cables out of the hoods. I still smile when i think about how that thing performmed. Perfect shift every time. Mud, snow, rain. Load, no load. Every shift was perfect.

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Train hard to Race harder

"To give anything less than your best is to sacrifice the gift" - Pre

I am one of the 2% of the world who rides campy. I have it on 4 bikes, and Shimano on 2 other bikes in the family. Campy 11 speed Chorus, Record, and SR is set it and forget it forever. Chains and cassettes last 5000 miles, and cables never fray. I question why I am doing it when I replace cables.

Anyone have any thoughts on the XTR m9000 rear derailleur????

Works the same as a M8000 but it's a little lighter.

I bent the link and cage on a M9000 and replaced it with a M8000, I didn't notice a difference is shift quality (from when the M9000 was new).

It could be my memories improving things, but I remember thinking DA 7800 was the best thing I'd ever felt. There are faster shifts, but damn, that was smooth. I remember comparing it to Sram at the time (Force?) and thinking that Sram was faster, but it just hammered the gears into place. 7800 just gently glided into place.


My regular ride has Shimano DA 7800 on it. It's starting to have an almost "vintage" look to it. Tuned up, the shifting is magical - smooth, efficient and almost effortless*. As others have noted, when Shimano then went to the under-the-bar-tape shifters, after this, the quality of the shifting actually took a step backwards. They did perfect it over time - but it took a couple of iterations before they did.

*Another advantage - if needed, gear cable changes are quick and easy to do and can be done in a few minutes if you know what you are doing! :-)

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I have all kinds of Ultegra, really like the 9 speed version the best. I find 10-11 speed to "smoothish". I also built a road bike with 11 speed Campy Athena when it went on sale before Potenza was released. It is my current favorite mechanical group.

Mid 90's vintage Shimano 105 (9-speed), on my steel Miyata. Oh, WHY did I give it to the son in law?????

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Totally agree, front SRAM is rubbish, rear there's not much in it.

I run Etap on my TT bike and front is ok, but not even as good as the Ultegra on my winter bike let alone the DA on the race bike.

I love my Campy stuff, and I've said recently on here that Campy 10 was my favorite for looks, with 11 being incredible in so many ways.

Never quite been enamored with anything SRAM I've had, and I have had a few over the years.

Shimano's stuff right now is marvelous and I won't argue against it, love my Campy but I've got a new 105 group on my travel bike and the performance I get from that level group is the most impressive thing out to me right now. I'm not saying it is a Record group or my bike with Di2 but for the money the value in 105 is very impressive to me.

I am currently riding GRX 600/800, 105 R7000 and XT 8000 on gravel/road/mountain, and they are all awesome. But the best shifting?


Shimano Claris 240!

With the exposed shift housing and wide 8 speed chain it is super easy and light to shift and the easiest to adjust. Had it on my first gravel bike and was quite impressed.

I have never used SRAM, but can't help but think about that the infamous A.Schleck front shift blunder at the 2010 TDF really was a marketing disaster (Degenkolb's 1x disaster @Milan San Remo did not help either). At the time they had seven or eight? pro tour teams using their groupset, those numbers have definitely come down. I like SRAM and consider it an innovative company and always like to see someone giving Shimano some competition. It would be nice if they could improve the operation of their front derailleur system.

Many years ago 105 was considered absolutely awful. However, I just got a gravel bike with 105 and I'm amazed at how well it performs for the price point.

Ernie you guys using Yoko cables and housing on any of your bikes. I've been reading a lot of good stuff about their products helping to improve the shifting on some of these groups.

For me it's a close call between 9 speed Record and Dura Ace 7800. Light, accurate, lovely to use. I give the slight advantage to 9 speed Record for the enclosed cables and multiple shifts in both directions.

I've recently used the 11 and 12 speed groups from Campagnolo and they are also excellent once worn in, even faster but not quite as light shifting. Same with 9000/9100 Dura Ace which has really closed the gap again.

I apologise to any fans but SRAM shouldn't be in the conversation, especially if you're using their chains, chainrings and cassettes.

I'm not a fan of SRAM but what do you have against their cassettes? I've had some good luck mixing their cassettes with other Shimano groups where I felt like the Shimano cassette was kind of the problem in conjunction with their chains.

Dura Ace 9000. Bonus: that polished two-tone aluminium finish looks amazing.

Red Cassettes, especially the earlier ones just didn't run as smoothly and sounded like a gun going off if you shifted while sprinting out of a corner. Hot dogs crits would sound like a firing range.

An Ultegra cassette was usually the easiest fix

10spd Campy Record.