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Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded
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Its probably the single most boring desolate unimaginable course that anyone could put on the big Island of Hawaii...every other road on that island is seemingly more interesting. I think the course was just designed because logistics were easy when they moved off of Oahu to the big Island, but after the Ironman arrived on the big island, they pretty well chose the worse riding and running options on the island.

Soooooo....if there was a race on the exact course with no Ironman branding, would you even bother doing it. There are probably 50 140.6 races around the world (both Mdot branded and not) which have more interesting courses.
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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I'm pretty sure that the appeal of Kona is not the course, but the exclusivity. The challenge and prestige of qualifying has value. It's not about the course.

Now, to answer your question... unlikely. But that decision has nothing to do with the WTC, branding, or the what-not. It's doubtful that I'll be willing to spend the extra money on a full distance in Hawaii when there are so many more logistical-friendly options on the mainland.






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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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Absolutely not, and anybody that says "yes" is lying to themselves and to you.
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [jkhayc] [ In reply to ]
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jkhayc wrote:
Absolutely not, and anybody that says "yes" is lying to themselves and to you.

Aside from my first time at Kona, I have never ridden on the QueenK or run there other than race day. There are a zillion better places on that island for exercise. So to answer my own question, no I would not do a 140.6 on that Island on the Ironman course. I would do a 140.6 on a variety of other courses on that island if I was fit and able (currently that is not an option, but that's another story).
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [Tri-Banter] [ In reply to ]
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Tri-Banter wrote:
I'm pretty sure that the appeal of Kona is not the course, but the exclusivity. The challenge and prestige of qualifying has value. It's not about the course.

Now, to answer your question... unlikely. But that decision has nothing to do with the WTC, branding, or the what-not. It's doubtful that I'll be willing to spend the extra money on a full distance in Hawaii when there are so many more logistical-friendly options on the mainland.
Yeah, nothing against WTC. I've done and enjoyed races within driving distance of my home in the CONUS that were and also some that were not MDot branded. Maybe the course for Kona is boring, but I've never been there so I don't know. However, I wouldn't be willing to spend the money, deal with the travel, and take the extra time off from work in order to do a race there, MDot or otherwise.

"Human existence is based upon two pillars: Compassion and knowledge. Compassion without knowledge is ineffective; Knowledge without compassion is inhuman." Victor Weisskopf.
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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Everyone knows the Kona course is shit.
So no.
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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The swim is nice. :) And running on Ali'i drive isn't bad.
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [NordicSkier] [ In reply to ]
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NordicSkier wrote:
Everyone knows the Kona course is shit.
So no.

Having done Kona I totally agree. But it's easy for me to say that, I've done it. Others will argue until they have done it. With so many Ironmans around the world, there are heaps that are much better. Both the course and the feeling.

BTW There already is a NON MDOT in Kona on the exact course every February.

http://www.teammango.org/monster_map_rules.html

Rhymenocerus wrote:
I think everyone should consult ST before they do anything.
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [PJC] [ In reply to ]
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Yes. Hawaii is a great place to wrap a holiday around. I’m not bothered about a dull course during the race, I’m there to test myself: the heat, humidity, wind and lonely desolate tedium are a set of challenges I’d like to face. How would I fare in the Energy lab etc.

There are other races with a different set of challenges that would also be on the bucket list, so it wouldn’t be top of the list but it would be on it.
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [jkhayc] [ In reply to ]
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jkhayc wrote:
Absolutely not, and anybody that says "yes" is lying to themselves and to you.

Pretty much what I was going to post. Though you could replace whatever North American location for Kona in Dev's post and the same rule would apply. For example, "Would You Do a 140.6 on the Penticton Course that is not MDot Branded?" The answer was no. :-)

Favorite Gear: Dimond | Cadex | Desoto Sport | Hoka One One
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [The GMAN] [ In reply to ]
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As someone who will never qualify for Kona, I'd do it just to say I've done the course. Many will never have that opportunity.
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [The GMAN] [ In reply to ]
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The GMAN wrote:
jkhayc wrote:
Absolutely not, and anybody that says "yes" is lying to themselves and to you.


Pretty much what I was going to post. Though you could replace whatever North American location for Kona in Dev's post and the same rule would apply. For example, "Would You Do a 140.6 on the Penticton Course that is not MDot Branded?" The answer was no. :-)

So then the question is what is it about the Ironman brand that means you do a race you wouldn't do otherwise?
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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devashish_paul wrote:
Its probably the single most boring desolate unimaginable course that anyone could put on the big Island of Hawaii...every other road on that island is seemingly more interesting. I think the course was just designed because logistics were easy when they moved off of Oahu to the big Island, but after the Ironman arrived on the big island, they pretty well chose the worse riding and running options on the island.

Soooooo....if there was a race on the exact course with no Ironman branding, would you even bother doing it. There are probably 50 140.6 races around the world (both Mdot branded and not) which have more interesting courses.

I found it the most boring ironman course i have ever ridden on and the run on queen k was beyond boring

however it gets 10 out of 10 for races i have done and the support was fantastic

in answer to your question NO
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [The GMAN] [ In reply to ]
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Re Penticton, my answer was yes. I did the rather lonely Challenge race. I wanted to do that single loop swim, bike, run. I don't need giant crowds but wouldn't want to travel back to back years for lonely experiences.

But my answer for Kona is no b/c I've already been to Hawaii twice (unrelated to the race, which I haven't done), don't think biking in a baking & windy lava field sounds fun, and certainly wouldn't be interested in that course as a lonely sufferfest.

To breathe, to feel, to know I'm alive.
Last edited by: Tsunami: Apr 29, 19 9:31
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [OddSlug] [ In reply to ]
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OddSlug wrote:
The GMAN wrote:
jkhayc wrote:
Absolutely not, and anybody that says "yes" is lying to themselves and to you.


Pretty much what I was going to post. Though you could replace whatever North American location for Kona in Dev's post and the same rule would apply. For example, "Would You Do a 140.6 on the Penticton Course that is not MDot Branded?" The answer was no. :-)

So then the question is what is it about the Ironman brand that means you do a race you wouldn't do otherwise?

The tattoo, duh. (Pink)
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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I am a bit of a unique case as I grew up in Hilo and so the draw for Kona for me is the fact that it is home. However, without it's history and grandeur, I think I agree that I would not do it, nor any other IM and I would just happily be racing 70.3 distance only. I might even have not been hooked to triathlon if Kona wasn't Kona... I would have done that first sprint tri in boulder and said "that was fun, I'm gonna go back to running because bikes are expensive"

808 > NYC > PDX > YVR
2024 Races: Taupo
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [PJC] [ In reply to ]
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I'd rather go ride some of the upcountry gravel around Mauna Kea.
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [jkhayc] [ In reply to ]
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jkhayc wrote:
Absolutely not, and anybody that says "yes" is lying to themselves and to you.

I would consider it as a vacation destination race, I guess I'm lying to myself. I traveled from the midwest to race Lavaman primarily because it is on the Kona course. That's not a trip I would make for an Oly otherwise.
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [jkhayc] [ In reply to ]
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jkhayc wrote:
Absolutely not, and anybody that says "yes" is lying to themselves and to you.

I thought about this and I imagined if you rewind this back to 1982. They move the race from Oahu in February to Kona in October. They had two Ironmans the same year.

The first guys "making the race" did not do it because of any branding, BUT I THINK it was the only Ironman available. There was no prize money either. Just bragging rights on a stupidly boring course.

Now we have options that we can do a 140.6 race in a locatiton other than Kona. When they moved the original 140.6 from Oahu to Kona, there was just one race to go do. For the original guys if there was another race made at the same time say in Penticton, or Roth, would they rather go there....it turns out that by the time those options came up, they were part of the same "series" a few years later and the Kona race was the "original". So that entire road to Kona pull was already happening by 1985. When I did my first half Ironman in 1986, they had Kona slots back when you could do general registration up to around June. After that, you have to "qualify". I almost died in that first half IM from effort (I was just 20) and declined the rolldown. 1991, in Penticton I did my first full Ironman, and felt exactly as bad as after my first half and declined the roll down.

Wildflower 1996, I missed a slot by 8 seconds. Finally 2006 after 15 years of trying since my first Ironman I got a slot in Lake Placid...did Kona that fall...enjoyed it for the competition. 2007, got in on rolldown, but let it roll. After that I tried something like 20 times and only got slots 2 more times. Looking back at it, I was certainly not trying because I loved the course. I enjoyed race week in Kona and racing some of the top athletes in the world...the course....without the championship race, I would not be drawn to it.

Lake Placid, Nice, Roth, Whistler, South Africa, Tremblant, Penticton....I am drawn to those courses. Kona....any other course on the island would be interesting other than the Queen K centric course.
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [Thom] [ In reply to ]
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Thom wrote:
jkhayc wrote:
Absolutely not, and anybody that says "yes" is lying to themselves and to you.


I would consider it as a vacation destination race, I guess I'm lying to myself. I traveled from the midwest to race Lavaman primarily because it is on the Kona course. That's not a trip I would make for an Oly otherwise.

"Because it's on The Kona course" wouldn't be a thing if it wasn't The Kona.
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [jkhayc] [ In reply to ]
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jkhayc wrote:

"Because it's on The Kona course" wouldn't be a thing if it wasn't The Kona.

But it is. Sorry, I'm having a little trouble following your cryptic debate style.
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [Kula] [ In reply to ]
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Kula wrote:
The swim is nice. :) And running on Ali'i drive isn't bad.


We went there for a vacation and I thought it would be great to do a little swimming, biking, and running. It wasn't that great. There were quit a few people also having the same idea, but not being a 'race situation' it didn't seem like a great place to do any of these. Ali'i drive was terrible in terms of traffic and pedestrians, and getting the bike out to the Queen K was downright dangerous (now under race conditions these would be closed off). Even taking the car through the whole bike route just to get the 'on ground' feel was sort of boring. It was fun to visit, but I don't think I would ever do a race there other than the championship.
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [vonschnapps] [ In reply to ]
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vonschnapps wrote:
Kula wrote:
The swim is nice. :) And running on Ali'i drive isn't bad.



We went there for a vacation and I thought it would be great to do a little swimming, biking, and running. It wasn't that great. There were quit a few people also having the same idea, but not being a 'race situation' it didn't seem like a great place to do any of these. Ali'i drive was terrible in terms of traffic and pedestrians, and getting the bike out to the Queen K was downright dangerous (now under race conditions these would be closed off). Even taking the car through the whole bike route just to get the 'on ground' feel was sort of boring. It was fun to visit, but I don't think I would ever do a race there other than the championship.

+1 and would anywhere else be as fast a course? Other roads while more scenic would be hillier, slower and more narrow from what I remember.

Indoor Triathlete - I thought I was right, until I realized I was wrong.
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [Thom] [ In reply to ]
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Thom wrote:
jkhayc wrote:

"Because it's on The Kona course" wouldn't be a thing if it wasn't The Kona.

But it is. Sorry, I'm having a little trouble following your cryptic debate style.

The whole premise of this thread was what if it wasn't The Kona.
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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If I had finished 25 or 30 other ultra distance tris around the world in all the spots I wanted to travel and hadn't done IM Kona, I think I'd probably seriously consider doing a 140.6 in Kona that was no longer MDot branded just because of the history of the course. There aren't that many that finish 25 or 30 ultra distance tris around the world. I didn't.

I've trained all around the Big Island so I agree that the Kona course isn't the most beautiful or challenging that could be created on the island, but I don't think the course is ugly. I loved looking at the ocean on one side, the mountains on the other and the warm sun almost always on me. It's certainly a challenging course with the weather conditions. The run along Alii is certainly not boring.
Last edited by: Mark Lemmon: Apr 29, 19 18:48
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [Mark Lemmon] [ In reply to ]
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Mark Lemmon wrote:
If I had finished 25 or 30 other ultra distance tris around the world in all the spots I wanted to travel and hadn't done IM Kona, I think I'd probably seriously consider doing a 140.6 in Kona that was no longer MDot branded just because of the history of the course. There aren't that many that finish 25 or 30 ultra distance tris around the world. I didn't.

I've trained all around the Big Island so I agree that the Kona course isn't the most beautiful or challenging that could be created on the island, but I don't think the course is ugly. I loved looking at the ocean on one side, the mountains on the other and the warm sun almost always on me. It's certainly a challenging course with the weather conditions. The run along Alii is certainly not boring.

I think its a "relative boring". Given all the other riding and running on the big island the Hawaii Ironman is the most unimaginative course given all the options on the big island. Its definitely more exciting than freeway in Houston.
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [stivrunning] [ In reply to ]
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stivrunning wrote:
however it gets 10 out of 10 for races i have done and the support was fantastic

Really? there is no one on the bike course for over 165km and no one on the course for about 17km of the run. There is no support there other than the drink stations.

devashish_paul wrote:
Looking back at it, I was certainly not trying because I loved the course. I enjoyed race week in Kona and racing some of the top athletes in the world...the course....without the championship race, I would not be drawn to it.

Perfectly put.

Mark Lemmon wrote:
The run along Alii is certainly not boring.

Yeah because dodging cars when the race isn't on is so much fun. 100% not boring with the goal to survive

Rhymenocerus wrote:
I think everyone should consult ST before they do anything.
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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I didn't write that the bike course wasn't boring. I wrote that I didn't think it was ugly.

If I was someone who has been doing tris for more than a decade including multiple IM finishes but no IM Kona attempt I think I'd jump at the chance to do the Kona course if the MDot branded race suddenly disappeared and was replaced by an event organized by a well-known race production company. But I like history and tough conditions.
Last edited by: Mark Lemmon: Apr 29, 19 19:18
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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I don't particularly care that it's Ironman branded, but I do care that it's a world championship and that's why I would like to qualify (I most likely won't, I'm slowly realizing I don't like them all that much). Frankly, I would prefer that it wasn't in Hawaii at all...

I'd rather go to France, Spain, or Switzerland for a race. I just prefer those places.

Dan Mayberry
Amateur a lot of things, professional a few things.
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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Sorry to correct your history, but they raced in Kona in ‘81 and both times in ‘82 in Kona. John Howard’s winning in ‘81 and Tinley (Scott) in Feb ‘82 before Dave won his second race in October. Remember Julie crawling on Ali’i In Feb. ‘82?
Yes, it is miserable and no I have no desire to race there unless it is the Ironman World Championships.

Team Zoot So Cal
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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If the course is so bad, I probably wouldn't do it either way. The only factor in it's favour seems to be that Hawaii would be a nice spot for a holiday.
The brand is of no importance to me. The location, course, price, and date all are.
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [PJC] [ In reply to ]
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PJC wrote:
stivrunning wrote:
however it gets 10 out of 10 for races i have done and the support was fantastic


Really? there is no one on the bike course for over 165km and no one on the course for about 17km of the run. There is no support there other than the drink stations.

devashish_paul wrote:
Looking back at it, I was certainly not trying because I loved the course. I enjoyed race week in Kona and racing some of the top athletes in the world...the course....without the championship race, I would not be drawn to it.


Perfectly put.

Mark Lemmon wrote:
The run along Alii is certainly not boring.


Yeah because dodging cars when the race isn't on is so much fun. 100% not boring with the goal to survive

Yes really !

i thought the support out on kona by anyone and everyone was fantastic ,i not saying the course was lined 3 deep with supporters ,i mean the support you got from the people on the island volunteers the events officials and locals
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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Always good to check back in at Slowtwitch and see what interesting hypotheticals are flying. To belabor the point, no, no one would build a race around Kona today. In the same vein, no, the Cubs would not build Wrigley Field today, nor the Red Sox build Fenway, or Liverpool build Anfield. These places are valued for other reasons.
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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devashish_paul wrote:
Its probably the single most boring desolate unimaginable course that anyone could put on the big Island of Hawaii...every other road on that island is seemingly more interesting. I think the course was just designed because logistics were easy when they moved off of Oahu to the big Island, but after the Ironman arrived on the big island, they pretty well chose the worse riding and running options on the island.

Soooooo....if there was a race on the exact course with no Ironman branding, would you even bother doing it. There are probably 50 140.6 races around the world (both Mdot branded and not) which have more interesting courses.


I wouldnt call it that bad, you have nice views of the ocean etc. That said, I have nver selected a race because of the course. Having a nice spot for a vacation afterwards or something my family would lke, yes, but the race course itself, doesnt matter. Training in nice places, sure.

Ok, maybe correction, I will do a Swissman this summer, thats pretty spectacular and different, so in this case the course certainly made a difference.

So would I do Kona if it was just another race (Mdot or not), probably not, too far away and too expensive to get to
Last edited by: markko: Apr 30, 19 5:39
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [PJC] [ In reply to ]
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PJC wrote:
Mark Lemmon wrote:
The run along Alii is certainly not boring.


Yeah because dodging cars when the race isn't on is so much fun. 100% not boring with the goal to survive

Have you run Alii during non rush hour traffic at a time other than the weeks surrounding IM? I've done it multiple times and the traffic wasn't too bad.
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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Not a chance would I do an indie on the same course. And if it were just another IM in the series, and not the WC, I doubt I would do it either. That said, I am going on a Legacy spot this October and very much looking forward to the travel/tourist aspect because I've never been to the big island and have been planning on all the places my wife and I are going ... and I'll fit the race in too as a sidebar. But this is not a course I would select to do apart from the hoopla of the World Championship because of the heat.

When it's all over, I very much doubt that Kona will make the top 5 of the IM destination races I've done. If I can hold myself together three more years I would really like to end my full distance career at IM Wales at age 65. It looks so much more epic than Kona in just about every aspect.
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [Mark Lemmon] [ In reply to ]
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Mark Lemmon wrote:
If I had finished 25 or 30 other ultra distance tris around the world in all the spots I wanted to travel and hadn't done IM Kona, I think I'd probably seriously consider doing a 140.6 in Kona that was no longer MDot branded just because of the history of the course. There aren't that many that finish 25 or 30 ultra distance tris around the world. I didn't.

I've trained all around the Big Island so I agree that the Kona course isn't the most beautiful or challenging that could be created on the island, but I don't think the course is ugly. I loved looking at the ocean on one side, the mountains on the other and the warm sun almost always on me. It's certainly a challenging course with the weather conditions. The run along Alii is certainly not boring.

I totally agree with you Mark. As a photographer, I see tons of beauty there. However, on race day, sorry Dev, but if you're admiring the scenery you sure as hell are not racing (yourself or others). I've raced a number of courses throughout the world, but if I want to see the course it's a trip before or after. Race day is blinder time unless it's going in the tank for you.....
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [ggeiger] [ In reply to ]
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I think its a really pretty course and if I ever wanted to do a full ironman again and they had one there that was non M-dot I would want to do it. In the meantime, I will happily go do Lavaman every year - awesome olympic-distance race on part of IM course starting at Waikaloa Village. Also, Waikaloa Village is nice place for a vacation where you can get a bunch of training in.
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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I thought about this and I imagined if you rewind this back to 1982. They move the race from Oahu in February to Kona in October. They had two Ironmans the same year. //

I believe someone already corrected you, there were only 3 races on Oahu, last being in 1980. I went to Kona in 1980 for the first February race that was held in 1981, then two more in 82 to change the date to October.


And keep in mind that when the race course was first implemented, there was on stop light on the island, there were no hotels or things along the hwy out by Waikailoa, and the Queen K hwy was the only one with a shoulder for bikes. And as far as I can tell, it is still the only road on the island with a shoulder. So not sure why you think the saddle road, or the one to south point would be a better choice, other than some climbing and trees. But for practical purposes, the widest road with a bike lane is really the only choice for so many people. And also keep in mind that the swim basically had to be where it was/is, that little downtown of Kona was all there was there, with the few condo complexes along Alli drive out to the Sheraton. So the bike and runs had to start and work their way through that 7 mile stretch of town, only question was which direction to go afterwards. They chose right, and it remains the right course for that race.


Now if you have only 30 people, then the Ultraman is fine to go out on the other roads, there really is no impact with a few dozen people. But in the 1000's, you have to consider what impact that is..
Last edited by: monty: Apr 30, 19 9:07
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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As a “what if.” What if IM pulled off Championship Saturday as it is today, with open registration Sunday the next day. With say, a $1,000.00 entry fee you can race IM-Kona non-pro day? You get to experience championship week, but your day is Sunday. No pros. Just race. Same course, same brand, next day? Hmmmm. I’d probably be down.
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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Yes, but only because Hawaii also provides a great vacation spot. Personally, I think the "beautiful scenery" aspect of any in-race experience is highly overrated so I don't care that it is desolate. I barely notice the terrain around me. Bike, computer, water bottles, maybe a few athletes. I really don't pay much attention to anything else.
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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I would, absolutely.. the swim is iconic, the lava fields are glorious for those of us who like low stimulation environments..
(though the run would be unpleasant as I've lost my heat acclimatization)
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [stevecycles200] [ In reply to ]
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stevecycles200 wrote:
As a “what if.” What if IM pulled off Championship Saturday as it is today, with open registration Sunday the next day. With say, a $1,000.00 entry fee you can race IM-Kona non-pro day? You get to experience championship week, but your day is Sunday. No pros. Just race. Same course, same brand, next day? Hmmmm. I’d probably be down.

What if Kona denied the permit? What if the volunteers said "Just say no!"?
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [monty] [ In reply to ]
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They have added bike lanes and shoulders on some roads, and the whole climb up from Waikoloa has a bike lane/shoulder now. Palani has a bike lane once it passes the Queen K all the way up to the mountain road. There are others too. I went to Kona this past October for a holiday with some training, and I rode every day, but only a bit on the Queen K (to get to where I really wanted to ride). It is the worst road by far to ride on the island, in my experience.

Jack



"Only those who risk going too far can possibly find out how far one can go." T.S. Elliot | Cycle2Tri.com
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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For me, I would race a non-Ironman branded on the Kona course. In fact I would rather do a non-Ironman iron distance race on the Kona course, especially if it is in a significantly reduced field, say 1,000-1,500. It is about the challenge of the course conditions that would bring me to race in Kona and not the prestige.
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [CPT Chaos] [ In reply to ]
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It is the worst road by far to ride on the island, in my experience. //

I agree with you Jack, I have ridden every single road on that island, many times. I too enjoy the climb over to Hilo, or the tree tunnels that go to south point way more than the Queen K. But I think we are talking about hosting 2k + athletes in a race here, aren't we? I just don't see how any of those great "solo" rides would suit a big time race. I believe they got it right the very first year, and with the improvements over the years, still have it right. I suppose they could go right at kawaihai, instead of going to Havi, but that would not change the course that much.


But doing a Saddle road race across the island and back, or some loop, would certainly change the dynamic, and maybe the top 20 would shuffled up a bit...
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [monty] [ In reply to ]
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Yeah, I think the course should change to go straight up Palani to the mountain road, then left to where it meets Waikoloa and back down to the road that leads to Kawaihai then to Hawi, then it could come back via the Queen K. The climb up Palani is 8-11% sustained and the mountain road is super lumpy so the field would get very broken up in the first 40-60k which would allow the Queen K to be a cheating free road for once.

I keep dreaming about that course, and I think it would be workable, as the Queen K would be open early (while the Mountain road is partially closed), which I think would be easier on the locals than the current impact on the roads... (this is just in my imagination, I have not studied the traffic patterns nor asked any locals about this, but it seems better!).

Jack



"Only those who risk going too far can possibly find out how far one can go." T.S. Elliot | Cycle2Tri.com
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [CPT Chaos] [ In reply to ]
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I hadn't thought of that route, so the road that all the fans have to drive to go out and see folks at waikailoa and kahawai, then down the steep and winding road to be back on the original course. I like it. That way they could keep the airport road open longer too, and that stretch to town is now the busiest road on the island. And they could have one way traffic on it all day too!! Sign me up!!!
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [monty] [ In reply to ]
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monty wrote:
But doing a Saddle road race across the island and back, or some loop, would certainly change the dynamic, and maybe the top 20 would shuffled up a bit...

There is such a 140.6: Alohaman Extreme on Dec 7.

Regarding the original question, one exception to that rule might be Epic5 - the Big Island leg is the final one, and they do (pretty much) the IMWC course, just much later in the day. Your buddy Tim Sheeper had home-field advantage on that day.

Ian
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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [PJC] [ In reply to ]
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From http://www.teammango.org/monster_map_rules.html !!!LOL!!!

"SWIM: Swim Fins and Wetsuits allowed. Large and Unusual Swim Caps (Cowman Horns) ALLOWED. While
on the SWIM course GOOD SPORTSMANSHIP will be observed at ALL TIMES."





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Re: Would You Do a 140.6 on the Kona Course that is not MDot Branded [CPT Chaos] [ In reply to ]
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CPT Chaos wrote:
Yeah, I think the course should change to go straight up Palani to the mountain road, then left to where it meets Waikoloa and back down to the road that leads to Kawaihai then to Hawi, then it could come back via the Queen K. The climb up Palani is 8-11% sustained and the mountain road is super lumpy so the field would get very broken up in the first 40-60k which would allow the Queen K to be a cheating free road for once.

I keep dreaming about that course, and I think it would be workable, as the Queen K would be open early (while the Mountain road is partially closed), which I think would be easier on the locals than the current impact on the roads... (this is just in my imagination, I have not studied the traffic patterns nor asked any locals about this, but it seems better!).

Jack

This would be a very cool course and doable, but nothing is going to change any time soon!
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