Nobody likes:

1. publicity stunts masked as fundraisers
2. instagram models
3. crossfit (triathletes anyway)
4. arrogance
5. cheaters
6. people that can't admit mistakes/failure

iron cowboy was 1&5, maybe some of 4
lance was 4 & 5
julie miller 4, 5 & 6

AH was all of the above

Speaking only for myself, I think my interest and indignation is a bit different in each situation:

For the Iron Cowboy, for me it is all about claiming a world record of 50 ironmans in 50 days in 50 states, since he clearly did not do it. What he did do was EXTREMELY impressive from both an athletic and mental fortitude standpoint. But if you are going to claim a world record, you should be honest about it. I think I was interested in the extreme audacity of the goal. Then indignant about his attempt to essentially redefine what an ironman is to suit his personal desires. And you still see full page ads in USA Triathlon Magazine touting his 50-50-50. I think that's pretty absurd.

With Ashley Horner, it was a bit different. You've got someone who not has no experience, training or results to show that she could even accomplish a single fast ironman, much less 50 in 50 days - but you have a lot of evidence that she has lied about previous endurance achievements and received no push-back on it. People just seemed to accept that it happened. So my feeling was that someone with that background should not be able to waltz into triathlon, pretend to do a monumental feat in the sport with no evidence that it actually happened and take a media victory tour. I was very pleasantly surprised that she ended up posting the data. Some claim attention and push back from the tri community caused her to post data from this attempt - I have no idea if that is true or not, but I am glad that she did.

Edit: also, IC's extreme dishonesty (and possibly worse) about the charity donations really pissed me off.

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Ed O'Malley
www.VeloVetta.com
Founder of VeloVetta Cycling Shoes
Instagram • Facebook

well said above, but I think she epitomizes "2018"....where social media runs crazy. A world in which the Kardashians have made billions and our President (I'm not trying to make this political) tweets about important policy decisions.

So, AH puts her stake in the ground and everyone has a reaction to it, and then everyone has a reaction to the reaction, and well, its a chain reaction...

The mysogynistic and sexist tones of some of the members...been called a white knight, guess I'll own it, because I'm used to the triathlon community always being open to new people.

I get the whole "respect my sport" bullshit. But at the end of the day, triathlon like god does the humbling. Other triathletes don't do any humbling because this is an individual hammering on your own body.

---

Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.

i don't want to put words on your mouth, but what you're saying is that AH is the endurance sport version of the kardashian/trump world, where fame and infamy are now almost the same, everyone chooses his own reality, there is no penalty to pay for bad execution, and fame is a sort of fireproof currency? that as long as i somehow stay out of jail that i'm pretty much good to go, as long as i don't sexually harass an employee?

and you all have a problem with that? with someone getting away with it, using endurance sport as a platform?

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Dan Empfield
aka Slowman

In a word her hubris - "a personality quality of extreme or foolish pride or dangerous overconfidence, often in combination with (or synonymous with) arrogance. In classical Greek tragedy, hubris was often a fatal shortcoming that brought about the fall of the tragic hero. Typically, overconfidence led the hero to attempt to overstep the boundaries of human limitations and assume a godlike status, and the gods inevitably humbled the offender with a sharp reminder of his or her mortality."

This about sums it up for me.

can you explain to me the misogyny? in light of the iron cowboy thread, which seemed to me pretty similar.

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Dan Empfield
aka Slowman

Yes, That’s my take (on what got people going).

The outlandishness of the goal relative to her background/training/relevant experience, plus the brash, unwarranted confidence and dismissive attitude towards those who cautioned her that she was severely underestimating the difficulty of the task, all compounded by the fact that she got major media to believe this was a credible effort and give her exposure.

This was a textbook case of "hubris," in the Ancient Greek sense.

From Merrian-Webster's online entry for the word "hubris":

Quote:

In classical Greek tragedy, hubris was often a fatal shortcoming that brought about the fall of the tragic hero. Typically, overconfidence led the hero to attempt to overstep the boundaries of human limitations and assume a godlike status, and the gods inevitably humbled the offender with a sharp reminder of his or her mortality.

Many were happy to see the gods put her in her place, and quickly. When she failed to acknowledge that she had, indeed, been shown to be mortal, the indignation re-erupted.

[EDIT] While I was typing, JRTX posted more or less the same thing.[/EDIT]

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"They're made of latex, not nitroglycerin"

Part of that is down to it being a multi-day thing.

If she'd quit after the first one it would still have been a long-ish thread, but nothing like what it became.

It's like a soap opera, small daily updates just keep it rolling along.

so, net net, is she happy that the whole thing happened? did she come out ahead? or if she could roll back the clock, would she prefer she never did it? not what you would think if you were her, but what she probably thinks. is her brand better off or worse off?

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Dan Empfield
aka Slowman

My personal take is for people like AH, any attention is good attention. I had never heard of her a couple weeks ago. Now I have. I don’t think very highly of her but I now know who she is so her goal was accomplished

Schadenfreude, or the opportunity thereof

that's my hypothesis, at least.

The train wreck that was bound to happen. It was hard to look away from this one. Kinda like when someone is in a breakaway and you know they’re gonna blow up you’re just wondering when. Same idea but 10000x the blowup was expected.

hubris
from Greek tragedy - excessive pride and overconfidence, leading to nemesis.

it's theatre, and we the spectators rejoice in nemesis.. since there is so little justice to be found in real life..

I never really had a problem with IC's thing, though I wasn't really up on what was happening with his charity.

For me, the AH thing was more about the attitude going in -- it just smacked of a "look at me" attempt, along with the hubris that seems deep in the Crossfit community that you're training to "be able to do anything". Yes, she got smacked around a lot, and quite frankly accomplished something that few would even want to attempt, but the attitudes remain, and the irresponsibility of how it was carried out needs to be owned.

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Some are born to move the world to live their fantasies...

https://triomultisport.com/
http://www.mjolnircycles.com/

This is simple. She is far better off for having tried.

• More followers
• More brand awareness
• She created a divided...you are with her or against her = more loyalty and a willingness to defend her against all attacks. (This is literally the Trump strategy say something so crazy that people cant defend it...then watch them defend it to the death)

EDIT: I want to note that she started this quest because Hannah Eden told her she couldn't come to Iceland with her. This lead her to want to do something that would outclass Hannah.

I am probably too quick to see sexism... I did see it in the AH thread but it wasn’t prevent. There are always going to be those people...

I cannot believe that IC and AH are being lumped together. IC set out to do an incredible athletic feat and needed some publicity ($$$$) to get it done. AH wanted publicity so she invented an athletic feat that had no chance of success.

Fame and infamy are basically the same thing.... that is a great observation.

Only she can answer whether she is happy but no, she did not come out ahead. She failed in her athletic goal; she failed in her fundraising goal; and she tarnished her brand. Unlike her other claimed, but undocumented, feats, she was unable to produce when the spotlight was on her. Her hubris may bring her back to triathlon but if she was smart, she would look elsewhere to increase her "followers".

so, what you're saying is, there are 2 kinds of winners in the brand game:

1. the derek jeter winner, which is just when you straight up accomplish stuff, you are superior to the rest of humanity at a given skill, and the win flows to you regardless of your own promotional efforts;

2. be outlandish, outrageous, and/or skillful at presenting yourself as capable, as an arbiter, you drive a wedge between believers and detractors, and then you ride the fame wave of your believers. yes?

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Dan Empfield
aka Slowman

I think she is quite happy with this whole thing. She got her brand out there to a higher level

Soon there will be a "new thing" for her to promote, this will be forgotten other than in a format that she will re-write the history of it. "She came down with a life-threaten bacteria in Haiti when she was to begin her 50/50/50 and she miraculously powered through completely 3 long distance races in 2 states and Haiti before her medical team pulled her off the bike"

I thought failing was supposed to be a good thing?

iron cowboy = 1700 posts
ashley horner = 3200 posts

to my recollection both had a lot of admirers, a lot of detractors. and, like lance, each side was hard-attached to its views. quite a bit of negativity attached to the IC. obviously you're not one of them. but that's sort of the point: you have your own strong views unlikely to change. you may have paid pretty keen attention to both efforts. maybe AC has more in common with julie miller than to IC to you. i don't know. that's what i'm trying to uncover.

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Dan Empfield
aka Slowman

YES, BUT!


The wedge you drive has to be something your believers feel strongly about. For crossfitters, moms, girl power champions, men who like women who are fit with tattoos, etc. It is pretty easy to distinguish.

• Crossfitters - Believe they can do anything better than anyone else, they are the ultimate athletes. Check
• Moms - Love to see other moms do something that they are told they cant do. They dont care about the result as much as they care about setting out on the journey. Check
• Girl Power Champions - Much like the moms, but get behind her because she is a woman saying she will do something BETTER than a man who previously attempted the feat had done it. Check (except she didn't get it done better)
• Men - They just post nice things and follow her because they think she is...appealing

Note: I think a lot of people, in particular men, were mad about the attempt for the wrong reasons.

sadly, there is money to be made in being a social media celebrity. my 10 year old said he wanted to be a youtuber when he grew up. who can blame him. there are these guys that go into Walmart or Cosco and act all stupid, get a million clicks/views/likes and get paid big bucks for it. or the guys who make a living out of posting videos of themselves playing Minecraft/Fortnight/COD. it doesn't matter what you do, as long as people see you and click on your stuff, you get paid. that's what she's going for.

So, AH puts her stake in the ground and everyone has a reaction to it, and then everyone has a reaction to the reaction, and well, its a chain reaction...

-------------

Truthfully, to me it was the "reaction to the reaction" that caused the biggest stir on ST. Go look at the original pages and it was "yeah she's kinda crazy for taking this on and wont make it because XYZ".....Then suddenly people came on here as if they were defending her honor, and I don't think anyone actually slammed her. Then the in fighting began and the real negative comments from certain people came out. It was as if reality wasn't applicable here, we should have just blindly let her do her thing, and then comment. But of course all along she was trolling the event- It was she was going to add strength every few days...it was she'll do "whatever the f I want, i'll do it backwards if I want" with people asking for verfication. So in reality it kinda became more haters vs supporters for a while there, and then reality sat in and she shat the bed hard.

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

I think she is closer to Julie Miller here then IC. She has made some outlandish athletic claims before this effort with no proof. The 230 mile run and 200 mile swim. ( I know those numbers are slightly off). I think had this not garnered any attention she would have "completed" the 50/50/50. She might even be closer to Lance for some ST members.

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"I think I've cracked the code. double letters are cheaters except for perfect squares (a, d, i, p and y). So Leddy isn't a cheater... "

Seems like she has violated the rules of society. The citizens of Slowtwitch are enraged.
I believe you've created a 'people'. Common language, history and interest. It's like conservationists against an oil company, or Catholics against abortion.

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NO

I had typed out a response in the other AH thread - that to me, she comes across as a combination of Katrin Davidsdottir (Crossfit games multi winner), Kardashians and my 13 year old daughter.

She has respectable fitness, a whole lot of being famous for no reason with a fleet of delusional shallow followers (thank you social media) mixed in with the stubbornness, self-centered, "I know it all so I dont have to listen" own reality of a 13 year old.

I respect her fitness, shes sure fitter than I am. But I dont agree with the social media scene for the most part (#ashlete), and Im pretty sure my daughter drives me nuts with her attitude at times too...

Completely agree with your assessment re: social media. Except fame is currency, most youtubers with channels get paid per view or they have Paetrons, etc. They choose their own reality, in some of the cases it involves pathological lying... then their followers accept it and end up believing in it too - like a form of Stockholm Syndrome.

Its a weird one for sure.

I think it was the outlandish behavior that got it. I was in the IC thread, and I dont remember the "hype" before the event. I just remember the 1st few weeks we watched and basically only debated his charity...that was the issue because he had no "legit" charity attached until about the 2nd week in. Then the "bending of the rules" happened, and yet he kept on trucking with "50/50" idea.

Whereas with this attempt, this was the ultimate troll job. She had everyone hook line and sinker from USA Today, NYT, ESPN'W', etc. This was the ultimate hype job with absolutely no substance. And for her it likely doesn't even matter. That part doesn't matter because she's getting the likes/views/donations and so it seems this is simply a shoulder shrug result for her. Almost like "i dont know what you guys are getting so worked up over".

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

The ineptitude. We knew she was going to flame out and fast not because she was a fitness model, but the easy things she got wrong.

Not using a wetsuit. Not maximizing aero efficiencies on the bike. Attempting the hottest time of the year.

If she was really going to last 50 days or 10 days you have to get the low hanging fruit at a minimum. So to me it's an insult to your cause if you aren't going to do your part to have the staying power to last.

When the easy stuff is left out its time get the popcorn ready.

Only if you can monetize it. Apparently there is a lot of competition in the fit IG model space and I don't see how a spectacular flame-out helps her in the long run. She may have - temporarily - gained a few more followers in this stunt, but deep down they all know that she didn't come remotely close to the stated goal. That can't help sales.

I would agree with all this.

I felt the same way about Iron Cowboy until after watching the documentary, did you watch it? It gave me insight to just how impressive and what exactly made that 50/50/50 pretty much damn near impossible. It also shed light on the fundraising and how every dollar has by accounted for by the Jamie Oliver fund and that no fraudulent activity happened. It was just managed by his team poorly at the start.

I originally really did not care for IC and still have a poor taste in my mouth with him a bit. But he did listen and became more and more transparent as time has gone on. Ashley did at least start to upload data, how she moves forward will be telling more about her character, but right now it doesn't seem as if she is making progress on that end.

So with her attempt I have more respect and appreciation for IC, his transparency, honesty, and admitting his faults. I have appreciated Alex Viada in the same context and think he has done well being as fully honest the past 2 weeks and doing the right thing (pulling out his support, etc). Then there is Ashley and she at one point started to make me somewhat of a believer and she has since ruined that again to the point it was worse then before she even started.

I just try to keep up with stuff like this. I missed the entire trucker hat thing and now I feel like I'm missing out on a joke, years later still. Makes me sad :(

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--Chris

I never spent much attention on either one (IC or AH), so maybe I'm the wrong person to be answering. But my sense is that with AH, her hubris was seen as insulting to the community. People in this community have put in tons of hard work and sacrificed a lot to achieve their goals, whether that is completing iron-distance race, sub-10, whatever. And there are some legitimately amazing pros in the community who dedicate their whole lives to triathlon, many of them with very little recognition or monetary reward. I think to many, for her to walk in with no tri experience and act like what they have done is easy, that she can literally do 50 times as much, felt insulting. And then she became famous on just the claim of the attempt. It's hard enough for anybody in endurance sport to make a living, let alone get attention from so many media outlets (that could help them turn that attention into sponsorships, etc.). After all the media outlets hyping the 50/50 thing, incredible athletes like Ryf, Lange, Kienle, Charles, etc. seem kind of run-of-the-mill. Nobody can live up to the 50/50 thing, but that bar has been set as what a really impressive iron-person would do, so it diminishes everybody in the sport, in terms of what their accomplishments mean in the public eye / media.

I didn't follow what was going on with her attempt so I just Googled "Ashley Horner" and scrolled through the first few pages of results and only see positive news coverage I still can't find what has been going on (Edit: I just went to her Instagram account and found the post where she said she's stopping.) She's become famous and all the media outlets that hyped her aren't reporting on the attempt ending. So, I think that for her social media career it's been a success.

Can you fill me in, how did Viada stop supporting this?

I am having trouble figuring him out. My initial data - based on what others wrote - was that he is a meathead who claimed he ran a 4:15 mile. But I think there is a lot more to figure out? I'd read an interview of him...

One thing I would call out is that from very early on her endeavor was flashing warning signs that this thing was going to turn into a fraud. The stated goal, as picked up and reported by national press, was outlandish but then when people quickly started calling BS on her run around Haiti and crazy long swim it was signaling epic twitchunt from day 1. As soon as I read the first few posts and the espnw.com article it seemed to be a predetermined fate that she was going to wind up with a huge write up on marathoninvestigations.com. I'm pleasantly surprised by the transparency that we have gotten. I totally didn't expect it.


If some of her more impressive claims prior to this stunt had been better documented I think a lot more of us would have taken her seriously from the beginning. I would have been rooting for her. It would have been a crazy long shot attempt, but the possibility of someone that wasn't on the multisport radar pulling this off would have been thrilling. Instead, I was drawn in waiting for this self aggrandizing likely "cheater" to get torched.

the affectation. the insistence that everyone is stupid except for her. the self-righteousness. in these ways she's willingly cast herself as a villain. on the other hand: the charity, the inspirational story of a single mom small business owner military spouse incredible athlete, the determination and drive. in these ways she also wants to be the hero. she publicly maintained that she was holding two aces, when it seems like almost everyone could see her cards and they definitely weren't aces, so i think that's why there was a lot of interest in calling her bluff. and apparently extensively posting about her bluff.

He mentioned that he stopped supporting her as the medical team said it was not safe. So he pulled himself out of her camp when she decline the medical advice. So he was no longer supporting her or the event.

As for his 4:15 claim..

This is what he wrote yesterday via PTG on FB.

"Gerard- there was an interview published in 2014 where, in the bio/tagline, the guy writing the interview published PRs I'd related to him in conversation. Included in that conversation were a downhill mile PR, an unverified track PR, and a dozen other numbers I'd hit at various point over the years. The guy took a downhill unverified PR that I'd never had placed in my own bio and published it in the tagline, and thus a number associated with my name that frankly I would never mention was borne. At the time, I didn't know enough to simply state "No, remove this shit", and it blew up. Trying to defend this led to a level of blowback I never imagined- as I was completely new to the idea that others would actually CARE. For my own personal "claims", please stick to my own bio and words I've written and stand by on my own website."

I can currently do neither. There is a long story behind all that which I will go into one day, but this was also my first and biggest lesson in how private conversations about unofficial and unverifiable PRs get brought into the public spotlight without context. I would never state these in my own bio, and I'll leave it at that- this is a thread about triathlon.

Someone said he nows him and that at one point he was posting pictures of his Garmin claiming this. I have not seen those photos so I really cannot verify if that happened or not. Either way, he is not claiming it or anymore as of yesterday.

^^THIS. You nailed it nilloc.

My beef is that these people are not promoting a healthy lifestyle (not to mention the me me attitude of a 3yr old). Doing 50/50/50 is not healthy, even more so when you are ill prepared. Not a good role model for younger athletes.

Everyone likes Instagram models

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USAT Level II- Ironman U Certified Coach

There are arguments here about social media celebrities, making money off that, etc., to me that's all secondary or unfounded except on an individual basis. If an individual is bothered by the social media-centric status of society, I feel that's a separate discussion which does have value. But...

My take is the primary thing that AH did to irk Slowtwitch was break, in my view, an important unwritten rule of triathlon: she blantantly didn't respect what she was undertaking. Plain and simple.

Most of the sentiments expressed stem from that simple principle.

Never heard of Hanna Eden, had to google her

Is that what happened?

BTW Hannah Eden wow she is good looking

I agree.

But small question in between:
What is more difficult: KQ or doing 5 or 10 IMs in 16:59 on consecutive days.

Just another athlete with an unorthodox bike fit, claiming it was professionally done and feels great.

Exactly! When she came out saying she would also be doing squats and deadlifts while doing the challenge it was like holding up a red flag to a bull.

That comment alone was either deliberately a massive troll that she knew would spark backlash (and clicks..), or just an indication how how little effing idea she had about what she was about to take on.

Gaining over 200,000 followers is more than a “few” and it results in significant financial gains monthly. And it doesn’t matter how those 200,000 “feel”, all that matters is that they “exist”.

Not even joking, I think even if this were a rando ST poster who was open enough to proclaim "I'm gonna do 50 IMs in a row, with almost zero experience or credible training to back it up, and post it all over the internet for folks to follow!", there would be a similar volume of a zillion posts as people tune in to watch the public train wreck.

I actually think the internet star aspect of it as well as the fundraising only minorly changed it. Heck, I'd bet if I posted I'd be realistically attempting this and documenting it day by day, blow by blow, I'd get pretty close to her post number, especially once I start crashing and burning out in shame.

Of course, this is ST-specific. These comments don't apply at all to the rest of the world, who almost certainly care a lot more about her looks and personal publicity status.

holy crap would you stop boohooing about somebody getting criticized go find somebody else to stand up for.

Ah yes, the burned triathlete that continuously called her a man/dude/guy because she's just more fit than...perhaps a mirror would be nice for you.

---

Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.

I am not on IG which tells you how much I know about it. But yeah, 200K more followers signed up which lets her claim a bigger base. But let's see how many of them, and of her original followers she keeps after they watched her flame out. I prefer looking at the longer term, not the day after.

What planet are you from? I don't understand how saying what your thoughts are on someone's appearance is misogynistic or sexist. And to clarify she does look like a dude.....imo..
and yes her Level Fitness is outstanding you see how well it fared for her as well as her level of intelligence maybe you can find a way to defend the rest of her decision making.

At first. But there is a very short life cycle that one can put up with following them.

Lol strobro is either an epic troll or the ultimate white knight.

Either way AH has probably got bigger arms than 95% of the guys in this site and does have a masculine look,, that’s not misogynistic just fact.

Yes, Hannah Eden is just better all around...


...But have you seen Alexia Clark?

Ty!!!!

He is an epic white troll knight. Straight up LOTR.


...I bet he watches a lot of LOTR.

Lol, If you're into neon hair I suppose. But they're basically the same person. Alexia Clark looks exactly cut from the same cloth when it comes to instagram model fitness posts.

Looks like plenty of y'all know who they are.

---

Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.

Honestly, I think a lot of the post explosion was the fact that she's a woman. There was very little of what I see as sexism in it, but to a half dozen or dozen members, anything other than "great! good for her!" was sexist, so it was impossible to rationally discuss doubts as to her ability to complete (which were, as it turns out, completely and entirely correct). This is best exemplified by the people who tried to equate "attention whore" with "(sex worker) whore". In the best (worst) spirit of the internet, no one (including myself until recently) could stay away and certainly no one was going to be persuaded, so everyone refreshed and repeated the same thing they posted five minutes ago. It was not helped by the handful of people posting actual sexist comments, which was held up as evidence that all people who (correctly) doubted her ability were doing so out of sexism instead of rational analysis.

This is also why I think the whole affair was bad for triathlon: it was never about triathlon. She might as well have said she was going to be the first woman to win the full million on ANW, talk about it for weeks, and then trip on the second obstacle. No one who didn't think about triathlon before this is going to think about it two weeks from now.

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The point is, ladies and gentleman, that speed, for lack of a better word, is good. Speed is right, Speed works. Speed clarifies, cuts through, and captures the essence of the evolutionary spirit.

There are a group of guys who built their self identity and esteem around calling themselves ironmen and pumping themselves up by boring family, coworkers, neighbors, and anyone else they can put in a corner without a polite escape. Along comes a crossfitter with barely any experience swimming and cycling. She hops on a Huffy and knocks out the distance then does it again. To make it worse, it's a woman. The last thing these guys want is someone they've bragged to to point out this affront to the myth of the sport.

Pure horseshit. Many of the people you gleefully malign here are the very ones who would reduce the available finishing time in an IM to 13-14 hours if they were in charge. So Ashley Horner's ~16 hr IMs in a short pool are not interfering with anyone's self worth. And while her Huffy ride was initially impressive, the later evidence - at least from what I've read - suggests moto-pacing. She is fit, no doubt, but her one and only official IM70.3 finish in 2013 didn't rock anyone's boat; and her completion of just 2 (as in TWO) consecutive IMs is no earth shattering feat...but hey, she reached 4% of her goal. While most people do not want to do a double anvil in 48 hrs, I don't think I'm going to go out on a limb and argue that it is well within the physical capacity of many IM finishers. You find nothing but admiration here on ST for the likes of Chrissie Wellington, Danielle Ryf and other top women, for whom Ashley Horner with all her muscle is nothing more than BOP fodder.

I'm the one that equated "attention whore" with being a sexist remark and how it implies untoward things at the person it was directed to. I stand by that assertion because it's a flat out sexist remark directed at women. And it clearly draws equivalency to being a whore. I'll tell you what...Go home and call your female spouse a whore, but you can put whatever word you want in front of it or before the word whore. I don't care what word you use as a prefix or suffix...You pick. Afterwards, ask your spouse if she feels that it was insulting.

Our culture has a long history of objectifying women based on sex. Those stereotypes are played out by attempting to demean women for having sex and even more so for by being paid for sex. The use of the word whore only serves to perpetuate that stereotype.

The first 20 pages or so of the AH thread were clearly sexist. After several people called out this bias then the conversation turned to just her athletic prowess for this event. There is nothing wrong with discussing her ability/inability to complete an Ironman. But no man has EVER been called out on the forum for being ugly or looking like a person of the opposite sex. Because it has no bearing on our sport.

Ladies and gentlemen, Exhibit A. This is how that thread spiraled out of control. I will not get sucked into it again.

---

The point is, ladies and gentleman, that speed, for lack of a better word, is good. Speed is right, Speed works. Speed clarifies, cuts through, and captures the essence of the evolutionary spirit.

That thread was way out of control well before that.

She really has nothing in common with the IC, except for the fact she stole his race for her own self promotion. That dude was a super gifted and hard working endurance athlete, and nearly did this impossible task. She on the other had did not know one iota of what it would take to do it. She really is in the Julie Miller mold, cutting corners at will, as long as it appears to further her self promotion. She is not very bright, you can see that immediately in her writings, unless English is not her primary language. And not just how she says things, but what she says, points to a not so deep thought process.

I would hope that she goes away now, but it is quite possible that like some pathological liars, she actually believes her line of bullshit, and she doest see the end to this thing yet.(although we all do, mostly) And I think you also hit on something with the Trump comparison, if you have a core group of followers that believe you can do no wrong, then you will keep playing to that base no matter what happens in the real world.

Lol another white knight enters the ring to challenge strobro!

As for women being objectified-they do a pretty good job of that themselves. Was just having a look at the VMAS, I don’t even know why half of them bothered wearing an clothes at all.

Men are called attention whores also. You need to get a life son.

My view.. some of this is fear. The fear of somebody untrained (in the aerobic/endurance sense) undermining the image some of us like to portray of our sport being some kind of near-impossible heroic superhuman endeavour. Hey, if that Instagram model can just waltz in and finish one of these things, it can't be that hard, right? Wait, what if my friends find out and are less-impressed by me? "Oh, I thought it was meant to be difficult" we can hear people thinking.

Those in the know are less worried. We understand the difference between a 16 hr Ironman and going sub 10, or whatever your goal is. But if your sense of worth comes from the opinion of other people, and some of those other people don't know the difference, then this could harm that.

For some people. If this isn't you then don't take offense, there are other reasons why this Ashley thing might stir an emotional response in you. But I reckon this is one of the reasons.

I can testify that I experienced this a number of years ago when a local woman that has a program to help troubled high school kids announced that she was going to do a ride from the pacific northwest to Atlanta to raise money. My very first unspoken thought was extremely harsh and then I realized my character flaw. I realized that I was offended to think that all the long training hours spent training for some epic level cycling events and to think some woman that has barely ever been on a bike was going to casually ride across America. My being a skeptic had an underlying fear and a terrible emotional response.

However, I read her blog posts at the end of each day and quickly I started wanted to see her succeed. She accomplished something I probably will never try. Even if she had failed I ended up gaining a lot of respect for her early on. She experienced a lot of fear of cars coming close to her continually and the pains of saddle sores and fatigue. It was hard not to end up rooting for her to finish and that was a big change for me starting out as a harsh critic.

Skip ahead to last year when I saw people continually criticizing Amanda Coker while she was attempting to break the women's record for most miles cycled in a year. After the first experience with my attitude I now had a better perspective. Immediately I was impressed that she was logging about 230 to 240 miles per day at a 20 mph + average. People were being critical that she was on a flat 6 mile loop and would often switch to a recumbent bike. Still I had to respect to her because I know full well I wouldn't have lasted a day or two and she went a full year doing this almost everyday. Even on a day when a hurricane came close to Tampa she did 100 miles in the storm if I remember correctly. People were posting jabs at her left and right all over social media and many were encouraging her. I just wonder how many of those critics could have done a week at that distance and speed?

If anything this was a lesson about myself that I have already confronted and hope to refrain this time with Ashley. On the other hand I have been reading these threads and it has been interesting to see the various views.

AH looks in no way masculine.... she's a woman. She's hot AF. If you have a problem with how she looks, it says more about how you feel about yourself than it does about AH.

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Eric Reid AeroFit | Instagram Portfolio
Aerodynamic Retul Bike Fitting

“You are experiencing the criminal coverup of a foreign backed fascist hostile takeover of a mafia shakedown of an authoritarian religious slow motion coup. Persuade people to vote for Democracy.”

I think those comparisons are not quite apples to apples. AH’s stunt came with a huge level of self promotion and arrogance such as stating she would do strength training 3-4 days a week. Amanda Coker and I suspect your local woman did no such thing. Coker just posted her stuff to Strava.

I am disappointed that a new thread was started and is taking total comments away from the original.

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"If it costs you 30 minutes at Maryland so what" -dwreal

Simple... the nail that sticks out gets hammered. If you make a living if trying to draw attention to yourself, expect some of that attention to be negative attention.

Ok Mr Sensitive New Age Guy, attention whore is deeply offensive and I will try to refrain from using it. Can I simply say that she is a person who exploits her body by posting provocative images of herself online for attention and money?

Damn Slomwan, now T3_beer has to provide the synopsis for this daily in the summary thread!

Lance is offended that he did not qualify for for instagram model nor crossfit athlete. He's sending Hincapie for those parts.

Do you think it's possible for someone to observe the claim and come away skeptical for reasons that "it's very unlikely that she's capable of the feat, physically and logistically" rather than fear? Or is anything other than "good for her!" proof positive of "an underlying fear and a terrible emotional response"? Is this exclusive to women?

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The point is, ladies and gentleman, that speed, for lack of a better word, is good. Speed is right, Speed works. Speed clarifies, cuts through, and captures the essence of the evolutionary spirit.

Neck up or neck down?

I think it is possible for both type of responses and in combination.
It is not exclusive to women for me since I have been around more AH types than any other type of female athlete and have helped multitudes of women in the past prepare for bodybuilding competitions.

However, my post was inclusive to me on how I view someone else and taking another look at my response and see if it could be refined. My post was not about judgment of how others may respond because I am not omniscient. I agree that some are only doubting that she could accomplish the feat and it proved to be true in the AH case.

Ultimately, you can simply sum-it-up as Conceit.

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29 years and counting

I think you're going to need a very carefully written POLL to capture the responses of all your readers.

I'm sure there is a segment of st'ers who turned away from the saga to avoid AH's navel gazing and the related criticisms. Those folks aren't going to spend any time here, either. Only a poll will get their opinions.

i don't know for sure yet how to construct the poll. what it seems to me, the common thread that ties the heightened animation of folks to a particular person, is the perceived contempt or disregard folks have for the sport that we all engage in. whether you're doping, cutting a course, flaunting rules, or treating the difficulty of an effort with a cavalier attitude, that's what really sets people off.

so far. until i come up with another theory.

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Dan Empfield
aka Slowman

Ding! Winner winner chicken dinner.

A common question that gets asked is "why not just ignore the person". My response would be "it's hard to ignore someone following you around banging on a drum and symbols".

The "drum and symbols" are largely the social media platforms we engage in today, that we did not 20 years ago.

You could say, "sign off". I don't think that's fair. If you follow certain things closely enough with a healthy interest, it'll show up sooner or later.

Agreed and early on things about her history made it look likely that if this went on long enough she would be caught "doping, cutting a course, flaunting rules, [AND] treating the difficulty of an effort with a cavalier attitude"

I think you encapsulated it pretty well there.

I wonder how these types of efforts like AH-- an outsider or 'intruder' from another sport trying to take on very lofty goals-- are received in other sports? There are not many comparisons to make that are 1:1, Gwen moving from Tri to distance running seems to be the best fit, but even then there is strong overlap in skill set. Trying to come up with other examples, but something like Michael Jordan or Tim Tebow attempting pro baseball doesn't seem to fit compared to AH since there are hard gates and systems in place to determine skill level. Same with Usain Bolt making a possible go at a soccer career. I know many would not expect success from those athletes trying another sport, but there is also not likely the same personal investment between an intramural baseball or soccer participant and an amateur, but passionate, triathlete.

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I think you're right. I feel possessive about triathlon because it has meant something special to me for over half of my life.

The intentional course cutting, doping, sexualized self-promotion doesn't fit who I am or my image of triathlon. So, I understand the strong desire to set things right.

On the other hand, I feel like if a woman wants to be a moron and post a ton of crap about doing 50/50/50, let her. Whatever. It's really not about triathlon. What it means to be a woman with a body is tricky. Tons of women fight with their bodies. So, I see this AH junk as a well-intentioned but messed up effort to feel good. The mind-over-matter empowerment message is a ray of hope for some women, I guess. I don't want to be mean to my sister-women who are struggling. I have compassion for their nuttiness.

WTF?!? Get a grip, dude. That term jumped the gender shark years ago; it's not 1985 anymore. You ever heard of Lance Armstrong? Try a search here using "Lance" and "Attention Whore" and see what you get... I'd gladly bet that AH only garners a miniscule fraction of the hits LA gets.

It's still meant as a pejorative though, I'll grant you that.

Well let's be honest, would you let someone come to your house and shit all in it? Most people wouldn't so if your trying to identify this as some type of "triathlon" specific response, I think it's far more simple then that....it's simple human emotions- respect. That's why I laugh at the people who talk about how this is a bunch of triathletes who can't handle their feelings being hurt by someone coming in not like them.

Ever seen baseball reporters with their "holier than though" attitude who slammed the steroid era players 10 years back? Even fans were pissed off at the players for "cheating" them, unless it was a player on your team, then it was "oh man your just hating him because he's good".

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

i quoted you in a new post over in the womens forum.

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Dan Empfield
aka Slowman

Here is my take: Everyone would like to be important. Everyone would like to think that what they do is significant and/or important. There are very few occupations that allow one to be significant/important; and within those jobs, actually achieving significance/importance is another not insignificant hurdle. So….the sport of triathlon (and Ironman in particular) has a certain significance associated with it, even among the non-athletic crowd. AH attempt at doing what she was doing did not require success at the task to be successful (she received more attention, which seems to be the goal based on her displayed history) and it also potentially diminishes the significance of the accomplishment that fulfills the need to feel important/significant as a result of finishing an IM…….so it is very personal for everyone that feels put down by AH attempting this, and getting so much attention/significance attached to her. It is kind of like her personally saying to each person “hey, what you do is lame, and I can do it better”, and then not being able to rebut this statement…..except on a forum such as this. Im not even going to start into how this lacks a sense of 'fairness', as that is a whole other set of baggage.


At least that is what I get from it.
Personally, I feel kind of the same way about IC….he put his whole family on the line so that he could live his dream of being able to make a living off what most of us use as a hobby. I would love to spend more time doing this hobby, but I would be risking every other persons livelihood/future in my family if I did so; so it comes down to being jealous in a way… Jealous that I can not put my own priorities in front of those of my family, but I understand that is my problem (that darn guilt thing). But I digress.
Stephen J

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I believe my local reality has been violated.
____________________________________________
Happiness = Results / (Expectations)^2

As others said, it might chalk up to good ole skepticism on our part and a good dose of hubris on her part.
You can verify that by comparing the threads about AH with the one made about Maarten van der Weijden's attempt at swimming 200k non-stop. That guy is, beyond question, the real deal. He definitely knew what his challenge entailed and I think it was a bit sad that he couldn't do it. The reaction here to his attempted feat mirrors that.

But you see, Maarten didn't try to wheelie across the Americas or anything that he knew he wasn't prepared to do and - most importantly - didn't boast about that. Did he try to promoted himself? Most likely, but he tried it at something that he knew he had a realistic shot at. AH, on the other hand, looks like something that jumped straight out of that "The Secret" book that was all the rave some years ago. She's the contemporary manifestation of the "wishful thinking makes your dreams real" that seems to still be roaming around. She's not a fitness star, she's a new age guru in 21st century robes.

The saddest thing is the people that believe her garbage without question. I'm not religious, but as Americans might say, "God bless their hearts".

As much as it pains me to admit it, I'd have to agree with you here. I, too, think that it's a response to the feelings we as triathletes have regarding our own exploits. At first we fear that, what if, she actually pulls it off? What does that say about our accomplishments? Then, we realize she can't, sigh a big sense of relief, and attack like animals towards wounded prey. Whether the prey deserves it or not. It's more a mirror into us than anything she does since in reality what she does or does not do really shouldn't keep us caring about it so much. And yes, we can get self righteous and claim its about more than that- the lack of respect for the sport, the cheating, etc. But I think these things are just more of a way to avoid looking into our own insecurities-she becomes an example of a classic scapegoat . Just my 2 cents...

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"There are two ways to slide easily through life- to believe everything and to doubt everything- both ways save us from thinking "- Korzbyski

In the south we just say "bless your heart.". But there is a certain cadence and intonation to it.

especially when you're talking to someone, say a weight lifter or cross fitter, and they say "I know someone who did 50 ironmans in 50 days! they can't be that hard"

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808 > NYC > PDX > YVR
2024 Races: Taupo

I don't know about you, but I never, even for a fraction of a second, considered her capable of completing the challenge. If the 50/50/50 she was doing was in sprint or oly distance, I might've held my breath, but Iron distance? I don't believe in miracles.

At first we fear that, what if, she actually pulls it off? What does that say about our accomplishments?//

You really think this?? I believe that most if not all of us who commented on the impossibility of this task, had no reservations that it might just be possible. (by her) It never entered my psyche that this was in anyway achievable, in fact I didn't think it would go even a few days. 50, may has well have been a 1000 days in a row, it was just some number that made no sense, and as I like to remind my kids, was a nonsense comment..


In reality(where she doesn't reside it appears) she could have attempted an olympic distance each day and maybe got more than half way through, maybe a bit longer. At least a good college try, but no, she had to say she was flying to the moon on a paper airplane, so no, my accomplishments were never threatened..

Dan, I also wish I knew what it was that motivates the masses to respond, but it mystifies me. If I knew, Id bottle it and sell it. It does seem that IC and AH offend this forum in a way that people just cannot let it lie. But wow, the consistency of the responses and the longevity of the AH thread is quite remarkable. I would suggest running an algo mapping between the people commenting on the AC thread and your recent "time on ST" poll. The results might be interesting.

As an an aside, for all of the hatred that IC received over here, do we at least recognize that he put in a damned good effort? You run many nostalgic stories about people breaking ground back in their day, exploring unchartered territory. For me, IC did something extraordinary and deserves some respect. Is there a reason he was never interviewed here (or did I miss it)?

I think you nailed it. Practioners of any sport, be they pro or amateur or weekend warrior who are invested in their activity in general (and not just in triathlon) feel that those making the transition from another sport to theirs should go through the hoops of "approval".

As you mentioned Michael Jordan doing baseball (or should we say banished to baseball), or perhaps a better examples are athletes like John Elway (drafted in 2 sports, by the Yankees and Colts) or David Winfield who drafted in the MLB, NFL and NBA drafts. Winfield was actually drafted as a pitcher with the 4th overall pick by the Padres, but his hall of fame career was as a batter (>3000 hits, >1800 RBIs). Or Bo Jackson and Deion Sanders playing MLB and NFL. There is a gating system in other sports where people can claim to be "validated" by the other sport that they step across to.

Ashley, is stepping across sports, and "self validating" via social media.

If Tom Brady steps across and claims to be a better pitcher than Washington National's 2017 Cy Young Winner Max Scherzer, you can bet all kinds of people from the baseball world will be all over Brady. While Ashley is not claiming to be superior to Daniela Ryf, or Gwen Jorgenson, she's kind of implying that she can do way more than them and do deadlifts and squats along the way, and in effect putting the difficutly of the entire sport down.

So she's "self validating" while dismissing the level of difficulty of the sport she is stepping into...damn right people are going to call her on her self promotion.

I was trying to speak in a collective sense when I shouldn't have been. Overgeneralizations don't work, I know. I don't necessarily think she could have, no. But I also am a firm believer in "what ifs" I suppose. I'm not her, not in her body or mind, nor am I able to fully understand her motivations- nor could I honestly predict the outcome. I could only speculate, and I too took a negative approach to it and was proven correct. But what if she accomplished 10? At what point during the attempt would we sit back and think- " holy sh8t" . I personally think it was a car wreck from the start, and people love to rubberneck. But it also puts the IC's accomplishment in a different perspective in my opinion. And I don't for a minute think that you should or would think that your accomplishments would be threatened either. You kinda earned your ethos a long time ago.

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"There are two ways to slide easily through life- to believe everything and to doubt everything- both ways save us from thinking "- Korzbyski

She is dismissing the difficulties of the sport because she is ignorant/arrogant/uninformed etc. She did, what, 1 or 2 70.3 s and bunch of unconfirmed claims of spectacular accomplishments and then barges into Ironman. Her attempt does not threaten my IM accomplishments at all. What bothers me about her is her irresponsibility. Claiming IM is mind over matter and sharing it with half a million people is irresponsible. I would like to ask any of her followers to ride 180km and then ask them at, say, 70th km how is that mind over matter working out. I think she is also a personal trainer. Her claim that running uphill on a treadmill strengthens your quads for a bike is also irresponsible and should make here laughing stock in the personal training community.

I had a bone to pick with the whole thing because as somebody that has done 10 self-supported ironmans and a self-supported ultraman, for charity btw, I knew how insanely difficult they are to pull off even for somebody with lots of experience. The logistics and redundancy planning for contingencies is crazy. And you simply can't know what to plan for unless you've done lots of ironmans and know all the things that could go wrong. So here was somebody bragging how she is going to do 50 in 50 different places in a row with no experience? It was basically impossible, and we saw that on day one where Haiti wouldn't even let her bring her bike in. No amount of sweet spot intervals are going to get you past that. You have to have traveled to an Ironman and had your bike lost or smashed by the airlines to remember to have backup bikes. Yet here she was getting even more attention than our best pros for having done nothing yet.

So I had an idea for the thread - the Deadpool. There was a guy a few years ago that was going to swim the length of the Amazon River. Our office put up a bingo chart where you could put what week he would quit or die and from what cause. Weeks were down the left, reasons were across the top. You pick a spot and put in 5 bucks. 5 weeks, malaria. 2 weeks, killed by natives. 6 weeks, "that fish that swims up your peehole and thrashes around." Whatever week, whatever reason, we had it. It was a huge hit and people loved keeping up with his status.

I started the deadpool for this 50/50/50 thing and that took off, probably because everybody finally had a place to put their own reason why her goal was ridiculous and when it would happen. What was very interesting was nobody really gave her more than a few days. I was an outlier at "5 days, hydration issues." There was nothing like "30 days, blisters" not to mention 50 days. This really got people debating and the thread rolling.

And to the point some people try to make that her doing whatever doesn't affect your own accomplishments... yes it does. She didn't even have to do any to get the idea in a lot of people's head that she could, would, even did do 50/50/50. So when you say you've done and ironman, now you have to deal with the general public saying, "I heard they aren't that hard. Didn't some lady do 50 in a row with no training?" No, she didn't. She said she was going to, but couldn't. But the public doesn't remember that part. All they hear is you did (a proper) one but didn't somebody else on ESPN do 50 in a row? How hard could it be if somebody else did 50 nonstop? More than a few rounds of golf?

So once she got started, We kept repeating if you do them, you have to do the full distances or they don't count. Actually a lot of people started saying that. Then we got blowback from some people that don't know any better saying it doesn't matter. Yes, it does matter if you want to parade the ironman name around and get fame and fortune from it. And we have the technology to check. It's easy... do the whole distance and you can call them an ironman. Don't and it's not. And don't blame the pool owner or the airlines. You planned this mess, so own this and you can get the credit if you do it. We got a lot of pushback on that with all the "for the children" stuff whenever she had logistics and measurement issues, but she found no sympathy from us. If she had actually gotten some ironman experience, she wouldn't have had those kinds of problems. Her failures where totally her own making.

She did do two ironmans in a row, which got my respect for her fitness in general. That's pretty badass. And I think people should lay off of her now since she's retreated home and licking her wounds. There's a lot of unnecessary piling on and being mean now by people, and they forget she's a person and we all make mistakes and it's over so let it go. I don't think she's this horrible liar and fraud that intentionally wants to ruin the ironman world. I think she is a victim of the "social media as a career" disaster nowdays and got herself surrounded by yesmen that allowed her mouth to write checks that her lack of experience couldn't cash. It affects us, but it wasn't totally on purpose.

And that's the story.

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Zen and the Art of Triathlon. Strava Workout Log
Interviews with Chris McCormack, Helle Frederikson, Angela Naeth, and many more.
http://www.zentriathlon.com

Very well said

To me, the effect of "holy sh8t, she did (hypothetically) ten in a row" is indeed lessened when it falls short or far short of her claim. If she had said "I'll do one every day for a work week" and almost managed it, that's more impressive than a bald-faced ridiculous claim followed by the same result. Hubris is a thing, and it is a bad thing. So is ignorance. If I said "hey ST, I'm going to run a 90 minute marathon for charity", everyone would crush me for being an idiot, and they'd be right to do it. No matter what performance I turned in, it would be diminished by being far short of my boastful and ignorant claim. Or imagine if a college QB said "yeah whoever drafts me I'm going to take to 19-0 my first season". He'd be mocked for that, and probably called an attention whore. Which is indeed an insult, but not sexist.

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The point is, ladies and gentleman, that speed, for lack of a better word, is good. Speed is right, Speed works. Speed clarifies, cuts through, and captures the essence of the evolutionary spirit.

Great post IMO and what I would speculate.
I mentioned earlier that I come from the AH world and traditional lifters were some of the first to get a taste of a few crossfit types that truly and honestly believe they train harder than anyone and believe they can do any event at any time just as well as anyone. I've been around a lot of AH'ers that look very much like her and live as if a walking inspirational meme. Many that I personally know have indeed inspired themselves out of some sort of dark hole in the past, such as, an eating disorder, depression or being overweight. There are a world of these types out there that have a backstory that the general audience that will stay at a shallow level and like the story of fighting through the odds and the more people try to talk reason, like Ironman/triathlon is not that easy, the general audience just digs in even deeper as a fan. Those trying to reveal the truth only make the person seem more credible in their daily plight. The more the fans fight for her the more she will dig in to what she has built up even if it is totally delusional.

I agree and guess that she believes what she writes, the inspirational videos, pictures with children and all that to be genuine.
I am a former national level bodybuilder, but I always wore normal clothes in public and most of the time wore long pants and long sleeve shirts just to go away from the typical stereotype even in the summer. I see more and more females in the grocery store the past few years with almost thong like painted on shorts and a sports bra with tattoos from ankle to neck built equally as well as AH.

Am I against this? Not really. I very much admire the training it takes to get in that shape and stay in that shape year round. IMO the AH'ers are a dime a dozen now so perhaps she feels she has to raise the bar to stay above the multitudes of other women that look just like her. Meanwhile she is brand building and the more followers the more money, but again I believe she has convinced herself that it is not for the money but to help inspire people to overcome.


It all seems like a carnival freak show and yet there I was yesterday going out on the web looking at her posts and videos to see who she is. She won again because I couldn't help myself to see what all the talk was about so I paid the price at the carnival and she got another person (me) to take a look at her. That is ultimately what she wants. :-)

I believe that it is more than putting some pro triathletes down, or even putting the entire sport down...That would not get the visceral response that was elicited. I think what this did was make a personal jab at every person that felt a sense of accomplishment from completing an IM (or training to complete an IM). AHs attitude made completion of an IM seem trivial, which in turn called everyones efforts to compete/participate in IM trivial; and she had a platform to make this attitude spread to others...and that can get personal very quickly....because there are so few things in life that are viewed as non-trivial to anyone outside of our close circles, and the bar to outside significance is quite high. She no only was knocking IM competitors notoriety of accomplishment, but she was gain notoriety herself in the process...so it was adding insult to injury. People are quite simple when being brutally honest...they just want to feel good; and AHs effort was only going to make AH feel good by stepping on the perceived accomplishments of others which made it personal.

Or I could be completely wrong.

Stephen J

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I believe my local reality has been violated.
____________________________________________
Happiness = Results / (Expectations)^2

But most people are not self-validated. They are validated by others; and AH was cutting down the possibility of outside validation by making it seem less significant. That moves it to the personal arena. She could have been a hero to everyone if she was not acting/communicating in a way that was not stepping on the bodies of others to raise herself.

Stephen J

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I believe my local reality has been violated.
____________________________________________
Happiness = Results / (Expectations)^2

This is probably my first and probably my only post on this, unless some people want to join my challenge...ha

I think this rubbed me the wrong way because it was a joke from the start.

1) She made a claim that was going to belittle the accomplishments of a ton of great athletes who have spent years putting up impressive results and wouldn't get near the coverage she did just because she had a social media following.

2) There was also no accountability on her end. She guaranteed it was going to happen. When it didn't was she going to give up her social media presence? Instead she feel back on the "it's for charity" claim. Anytime she wanted to spar with someone who gave her flak on social media she brought up the charity aspect. You can support a charity, you just have to have accountability in it. Put up some of your own skin if you fail.

For example, there's a charity that I like to support that's been talked about on this forum involving two brothers who are doing Kona this year. My friend has been talking trash to me all year about how fast he did in ironman in 2014. I've told him that I'm going to beat his time this year. To make things interesting for every minute I go under his time (9:xx) he has to take the mins and multiply by ten and donate to the charity. For every minute over, I have to donate. The only caveat is if there is a bike mechanical. Others are welcome to join in on this.

Also, the best part of this was joke was watching it. On day 2/3 after she finished the swim she posted a video and she had that look I've seen on people's faces when they are on a 100 mile bike ride, riding with a group that is outside their ability and they have 40 miles to go and don't know how to get back home and it's 100 degrees out. I knew it would be over shortly then.

It is funny what you say....I'm probably one of the guys on this forum who has done the most Ironmans. I did 31 over a span of 25 years, not 31 in 31 days forget about 31 states. My best year was 4 in a year. That was huge mentally and for family and around work, but it sure was fun. Right now I am not able bodied enough to finish a sprint tri, so I look at all of you doing IM's with a really high bar since I cannot even walk to the end of the street.

When she said she was gonna do 50/50/50, I thought "why not, that would be awesome if a woman can come and do this more legit than Iron Cowboy". I thought he was studly, but his ethics were slippery on many counts.

I was kind of hoping she MIGHT one up IC and do it clean.

I'll say this.

If one is able bodied and fit and knows how to swim and ride a bike and can jog 10K, getting up to an Ironman is NOT that hard. But you have to be able bodied and do all components which discounts many of us from entering and competing (myself excluded at this time from even doing a super sprint tri).

I think if I coached her for a year, I could get her to 50/50/50 on a closed loop with no travel in between doing half IM's. I think she has the underlying athletic ability to pull it off, but she needs time. I don't think she has the engine to do 50/50/50. If IC did it on a closed loop, he would have done 50 legit IM's no problem. That guy was an 11 hour IM guy. An easy day for him is 13 hours. That leaves him 11 hours to get ready for tomorrow. If she is an 14 hour IMer right now, 16 is easy. This only leaves 8 hours to recover and get ready for tomorrow. There is just not enough time to pull it off.


. I think I could get coach most of you guys on how to pull of 50/50 half IM's. There is enough recovery time to pull it off and you can walk most of the daily run and still have plenty of time to recover. I am kind of an expert on being able to do big volume training for multiple days in a row and maximize recovery and start again the next day (anyone who has been to my epicman training camps will know what I am talking about).

Seriously, I wanted to see her pull it off. I had no idea of her athletic background and the crossfit/fitness model instagram culture until this entire thing. She's a Bullshitter with good athletic ability. My patience for people with slippery ethics is ultra low, so you know what I think about her attempt now. But as someone who did 31 IM's in 10 different locations over 25 year, I lean towards wanting to see people do a ton of these events. It makes me really happy to see people do what made me so excited for such a long time.

If she barged into the sport, played by the rules and did deadlifts every evening and completed daily legit IM's, then more power to her. Kind of like Macca mouthing off that Kona was nothing and getting some humble pie before he backed up his mouth twice and then won it twice. If she backed up her mouth and "won it", then more power to her. Guys like Peter Reid and Tim DeBoom were not entirely thrilled with Macca dismissing their Kona wins and rightfully so.

But like Bo Jackson switching in between football and baseball, dammit, you better do the sport by the rules and norms of the sport...step up and deliver!!!

Well said. But now I need to know how the Amazon swim ended, and whether a peehole fish was involved.

I really commend that attitude of being open minded; but you are not the ordinary IM finisher (and I mean that in a positive way). Let me ask this question...If an acquaintance asks you what you did over the weekend, and you tell them that you were racing, or even doing a workout, what is the response most of the time. In my experience, most people will reply with their own exploits, as opposed to asking more about how your race/workout went. Im not saying that this is a bad thing, but just a thing that I have observed. People like talking about themselves, and they like to feel important; and having others believe that something that you did is extremely challenging would understandably make someone feel important.
My negativity of AH is of the way she went promoting. By going about it the way that she did, my take is that it made a lot of people (especially on this forum) feel kind of crappy as I get the feeling that it diminished some of the pride that they felt in their accomplishment. It threatened their ability to have friends and family regard them as 'that crazy athlete who did and IM'...It would make it seem less special.

There are other things that I did not like about AH and IC, but many of those things are my own issues. I think that what I state above is what drew out the huge negative response here, as per the original questions posed by Dan.
But again, I could be completely wrong. Humans are notoriously difficult to extract interpretable results from.

Stephen J

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I believe my local reality has been violated.
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Happiness = Results / (Expectations)^2

She's attractive for a woman who takes steroids and lifts. But that has nothing to do with the derision she has earned.



Which is... self-promoting BS passing for accomplishment. It's all about publicity, and she has already succeeded massively with this stunt. I avoided all AH threads until yesterday because I'd never heard of the name and wasn't interested. But now I'm another person adding to her fame by "knowing who she is".

Hit the nail on the head. No matter the distance, triathlon tends to humble you. She seems to assume that since she's a cross fitter, no big deal.

I don't buy most of the sexism/misogyny stuff. I really believe the reception would have been identical for any male X fitter that tried the same stunt.

Awe man, now I gotta go catch up over there, too? Impossible to stay up to date anymore.

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To breathe, to feel, to know I'm alive.

I think this is the best post on the subject so far

Don't worry, in a few months I'm sure we'll all be saying "Ashley who?"