I agree that trans women have no place competing against biological women in sports. It goes against the entire point of having men and women separated in sports, which is done to allow women a fair chance of competition.

I’m not sure that the lack of *current* trans women competing is a reason not to address the issue. It is very likely that a trans woman/girl will want to compete in the future. This prevents that, which is apparently what you want to see.

So I’m slightly puzzled by your objection to an action that supports your stance. Sure, pushing for an open division where trans women can compete is a potential solution to give them a place to compete, but that can still potentially happen.

I’m also always puzzled by those who support trans women’s right to compete against biological women. Rarely, if ever, do they address the elephant in the room, which is the inherent unfairness to biological women. They talk about the rights of trans women, and they talk about “bullying” trans women, but they never address the unfairness to biological women of allowing trans women to compete against them.

So I can’t get too worked up about this. Sure, maybe this is essentially an effort to create outrage over a current non-issue, but I have much more sympathy with this ban on trans women competing against biological women than I do with those critics who say this is trans-phobic or bullying, while ignoring the obvious unfairness of not protecting the rights of women.

And, what makes you say (imply?) trans women can’t train at the facilities? They don’t need to “train in an open division” to train. They can just go and a train and not race. They can enjoy swimming, or running or whatever activities they want to, but they can’t compete against biological women because they aren’t biological women. But sure, introduce an open division too…

The Republican county leader said his order only applies to female competitive sports — not co-ed sports, or sports where biological females want to compete against males.


Did you bother reading the article you posted?

You’re not representing the executive action properly. It doesn’t ban trans athletes from all facilities and it doesn’t say that teams cannot have trans athletes on their teams.

The executive action strictly limits trans individuals on from competing on female teams and team representatives must affirm that they are not placing trans athletes on their female teams.

It specifically says in the article that the order only applies to female sports and not to co-Ed sports or boys sports where biological women can compete against boys.


I also share much of Kay’s view including that I see no problem with them preemptively taking the proverbial bull by the horns here.

Damn you beat me to it.

I read the first article about this last night. Then I saw it on CBS news this morning. Then I found the Post article. Team leaders and race directors will have to sign a pledge to keep trans women off of their teams.

This is just another wedge issue to for the bankrupt R party and it's only brought up to ratchet up the hate a fear. It's like taking a sledge hammer to kill a mosquito.

This is just more miss-handling by this buffoon who has nothing to offer except his name on big signs all around the county.

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This county bars teams from publicly owned facilities unless they sign a pledge to keep all trans people off of their teams.

One thing I dislike is government laws using people to do the dirty work of discrimination. This particular law puts the burden on teams to exclude trans-athletes or lose the right to use public facilities. I consider that an ugly move that makes teams personally engage in unlawful and hurtful discrimination. Remember Texas’ anti-abortion law that relies not on the government but on private citizens to enforce? Vigilante laws really turn my stomach.

To what extent trans athletes participate in any sport (non-competitively, low-level competition, mid-level competition, high-level competition) should be determined by the governing bodies of sports, not the families of kids on teams or coaches.

Regardless of competitive/non-competitive participation of trans athletes in sports, this law appears to broadly exclude the entire population of people from publicly owned facilities. Public facilities are for the public, and it is highly improper to exclude an entire class of people from using the public facilities.

Regarding the elephant in the room, I realized early in my athletic career that there are many measures of success in sports. To this day, I love discovering that truth each time I participate in sports. We can have rules controlling who competes against whom. Those rules should be carefully drafted by sports’ governing bodies to allow for the maximum benefit to all athletes. We should be writing rules carefully— not asking teams to exclude trans athletes entirely.

Aren’t public schools publicly owned facilities also? There are many states in the country that don’t allow for trans females to compete against biological females.

And for the third time now in this thread this actions doesn’t prohibit trans individuals from being in their teams nor does it ban them from the facilities. It bans them from competing against biological females. Trans individuals are all still welcome to compete co-Ed or against males.

It’s weird that this point isn’t clear enough. It’s all right there in the OP link and windy even pasted the exact wording in a very short easy-to-read reply.

So is the block quote I provided inaccurate? It seems you actually would agree with the policy quoted, but don't like the messenger so are going off the handle.

That is not what it says at all.

This is unfortunately the current state of politics. Both sides of the aisle are letting the extremists have the loudest megaphones and that makes it easy for the others to throw the baby out with the bathwater.

I will say that the republicans are taking the charge on this on many fronts. It does nothing to help fix the solutions. Though I’m not sure they all want to fix things.

If we know anything, it is that "repub leaders" are not to be trusted in any way, shape, or form. They have proven to be unadulterated liars again and again.

The devil will be in the details. I want to see the exact wording of this "pledge" that teams will be forced to adhere to.

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Discrimination via vigilantism: The executive order states that sports leagues, organizations, teams and other entities in the Long Island County must expressly designate teams based on an athlete's sex assigned at birth, when applying for a "use and occupancy" permit at a Nassau County Parks property for a sporting competition or event on all levels.

Permits will not be given to any event or competition that allows transgender women or girls to compete in girls' or women's sporting events. The order allows transgender men and boys to play in competitions for men and boys. https://abc7chicago.com/...g-in-women/14460111/

Bottom line: the whole team is denied access to the facility (for competition or event on all levels) unless the team excludes trans athletes.

As I stated above: vigilante discrimination is a particularly ugly thing to introduce into a team. The teams are not the proper people to make decisions about who can play. We have governing bodies for a reason.

Blakeman, a Republican, said he believes the designation of separate athletic teams or sports based on sex assigned at birth "is necessary to maintain fairness for women's athletic opportunities."

Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha haha !!!!

Because, you know, repubs have always been champions of more and fair athletic opportunities for women. (Well, kind of: the ones where women are barefoot and pregnant!)

That's comedy gold!

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These two paragraphs contradict each other. I’ll let you find where.



I disagree as I believe since the athletes and coaches are the ones directly affected by the issue then they are exactly the ones to decide what they believe as fair and equal and deserve a say. After all, the governing bodies are supposed to legislate the will of the people and apparently the constituents in this area have spoken up.

This social issue is about fairness in competition and to think teams don’t already make decisions or at least voice opinions on what is best for the sport is naive. Just because you disagree with that opinion doesn’t make it wrong.

But again this doesn’t prohibit teams or trans individuals from competing or entering the buildings. At all.

I’m not going to assume that RINO aren’t genuinely motivated by a desire for fairness. I competed against my two older brothers growing up, and I realized very early that they had advantages because of their gender. Believe me, I would have kicked their asses had I been a boy! A girl in sports needs rules to ensure fairness.

I support efforts to find compromise and fairness. The word fairness means without discrimination of favoritism. In order to arrive at the proper balance, everyone will have to compromise to some extent. We’re not going to give broad, blanket favoritism to any single group.

MAGA are not motivated to find fairness. They are different. They look to upend the rule of law in order to advance their interests.

Here, we have an attack on the rule of law! It is not proper to ask teams to exclude teammates in order to go to a competition. That’s shittiest and meanest way to effectuate a public policy.

Public policy should be effectuated by carefully crafted rules, not executive orders that empower discrimination.

As we try to find fairness, we need to be very careful about the route we take. We need to preserve the rule of law.

Reading that double negative, so you are assuming that RINOs are genuinely motivated by a desire for fairness?

Because, if that is what you are assuming, unfortunately, that is a profoundly faulty assumption. Fairness is the very last thing on this moron's mind ...

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Feel free to provide the text

I am splitting republicans into two groups here: those who respect the rule of law and those who do not.

I think there are RINO who have sincere concerns about fairness. I think they are able to appreciate the rights of trans people in sports, although they might disagree with me about where the line should be drawn insofar as competition. I think they would disavow efforts to exclude trans athletes from sports entirely.

With regard to MAGA, these republicans don’t understand/ don’t value the rule of law. The rule of law is the basic building block of our country, and these people don’t feel any special respect or reverence for it. Most people understand that we should preserve the rule of law even if that means we endure a degree of unfairness because we know that we will eventually move closer to fairness. That is the hope and promise of “in order to form a more perfect Union.” We know there is a way to achieve fairness and it requires the rule of law.

Yes, looking forward to you providing it.

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The only goal here was to force Democrats to protect the rights transathletes. To that extent, this was a political stunt. Ask Alabama how this can turn out.

Was this well thought out policy that protects both the integrity of women's sports and legal protections for transathletes? What state laws does this ban violate, and how much time will be wasted in court fighting over this?

 
Turning this into a political discussion about RINOs and MAGA Republicans is a distraction from the underlying issue. So is complaining about breach of laws and unfairness, while ignoring the unfairness on girls and women of allowing trans women to compete against them.

Those defending the rights of trans women to compete against biological women rarely acknowledge the inherent unfairness on biological women, and instead talk in vague generalizations about discrimination and fairness without discrimination.

It’s all BS. Either you believe there should be separate genders for most human physical sports, in which case you NEED to exactly discriminate against biological males competing in women’s sports, or you don’t believe there is a need for separate genders in sports. End of story. Can we please stop with the woolly language and sidetracking of blaming the messenger?

I have found common ground with you and it appears most everyone on this thread is in agreement. That would be a first. The agreement is biological males should not participate on women's sports teams. End of the day, that is all that matters. And on that we all agree.

I have not heard or seen anyone that believes bio males ( other than those bio males attempting to do it) should be on women's teams. And that is a rare agreement on such a big issue.

I think fairness for all athletes matters. Especially fairness to female athletes.

But I think using "fairness" as a cloak for what is clearly a political stunt is profoundly disingenuous. And I think that is what is going on here. Until I see the text of this document.

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Blakeman could have run on an anti-trans platform, or they could have tried to bring it up as a ballot question. And if that question set up properly I probably would vote to ban trans athletes from woman's events.

But he took the cowardly way out. He's laying it on the team presidents and race directors. It's all a stunt to wake up the R voters who didn't come out for the R candidate who lost to Suozzi. Maybe the problem was that the anti-emigrant candidate was an emigrant herself and that she didn't do any campaigning.

Blakeman likes to put his name all over everything in Nassau County, maybe he can put up a billboard in front of the Nassau County Aquatic Center that says ''This improper handling of an important subject is brought to you by Bruce Blakeman''!

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Your mistake is assuming both things cannot be true and that the political stance of this hot social justice topic automatically disqualifies it from being genuine.


The reason we know this to be true is because this topic has grown in prevalence over the last few years and this is not the first stance taken on the matter, however is does happen to be the broadest stance to date. But that doesn’t automatically make is disingenuous.

So much to unpack.

Not sure where you have been for the last 50 years, but repubs / family values religious folks / conservatives then and now supported more (and more fair) athletic opportunities for women about as much as putin supports Ukrainian independence. So, yes, republicans' new found interest in fairness in women's sport is profoundly disingenuous.

But, you're totally right, "this topic" has definitely grown in prevalence in recent years because repubs despise trans people and try do everything humanly possible to make their lives a living hell. In schools, in bathrooms, in work, in sport, and just walking down the street. The "fairness in women's sports" bullsh*t is just a thinly-disguised cloak for repubs unbridled hatred.

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You're a fucking idiot

This.

Hatred is a powerful motivator for certain folks.

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You are sweet, kind, and spiritual catholic who shines a light on everything and everyone. Keep it up, Jesus would be so proud.

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None of which takes away from you being an idiot

The order:

https://www.nassaucountyny.gov/...EC-ORDER-2-24?bidId=

Yeah, you trump repubs make every effort possible to stand up for oppressed folks. It's in your DNA. It's what Jesus would do.

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That should be non-controversial to all but the ideologues

Not to go too far down the road of theology but this kind of argument is so blatantly false, it has to be addressed. Jesus did in fact stand up for the oppressed and loved the sinners. But he also demanded the sinners stop sinning and turn from their wicked ways. It was not just a blanket, "OK, I love you just the way you are stuff." He told the prostitute to go and sin no more. He didn't tell her to go and make some more money by whoring and it was OK.

The bible is clearly against homosexuality, infidelity, and sexual perversion. If Jesus were here today, based upon the bible, he would indeed embrace all of those folks, but he would not condone or accept what they were doing was right or further that they should keep doing it. He would likely say, turn from your wicked ways and go and sin no more.

Oh boy, I don't think you want to go down this rabbit hole ...


https://www.youtube.com/...CPjWd4MUXs&t=75s

or,
start at 1:15

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There may be a drafting error in that, read literally, the order does not preclude a trans woman from being counted as a woman for purposes of determining the composition of a coed team. It only expressly bars treating that person as a woman in an all-women competition.

If you source is a youtube clip from a TV Show based in Hollyweird when discussing biblical theology, I will chalk that as up as I am correct and you quit before you started.

You're just exposing your idiocy more and more.

Perhaps, perhaps they don't care since the competition is mixed

Kinda hard to watch, isn't it?

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Public schools also lease out or all private organizations to use their facilities. This seems to go beyond school or county sponsored programs. Basically, it seems that a trans friendly women's softball league, can't lease out the field to practice.

I suspect the participants in a co-ed relay race might care. I suspect it’s just a drafting error.

So you think someone that is organizing a causal softball game should get copies of all the participants original birth certificates?

That seems fucking nuts to me.

Really how do you possibly enforce this?

Also why should a group be forced to ban trans participants? If the people in the league don’t care, why should they not be allowed?

Lots of adult leagues are specifically none competitive and are just a way to meet people. I doubt those people are going to be against have trans players in the league. Why should they be forced to exclude them?

It was. So much ignorance. https://forum.slowtwitch.com/...ost=7875423#p7875423

Link taken down.

Maurice

Interesting.

So the bible (both old and new testaments) is FULL of various directives, admonishments, examples, guidelines and commands on how to live and behave. If you are familiar with the book, that fact is quite clear.

And yet, today, christians are quite selective in which of these directives they choose to follow.

That's the point of the video clip.

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You know that. I know that.......TMI appears to be, once again, exhibiting willful ignorance.

So what?

You're a funny guy, captain obvious.

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My point is that many people, including you, are not familiar enough with the book to discuss it intelligently. Care to explain why you are so concerned that Christians don't follow the book you don't believe in? Or why you won't study the thing you criticize so you will know what you are talking about?

The point is that you criticize in ignorance.

No seriously why do you care what parts of people's religion they follow?

Sure.

Because many nutty people use that book in completely arbitrary ways to express their nasty hatred for their fellow human beings (even though Jesus would most definitely not approve). And many nutty people want to force all americans to follow their highly selectively chosen arbitrary directives in that book.

And l like the choices that l make. I value my freedom and the values that l choose. I dont want to follow some nut's highly selective willy-nilly directives of the book.

As others have said, don't tread on me.

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Sure, there are nutty people out there.

Care to give an example of an "arbitrary" use of the Bible's teachings?

AL Supreme Court

Yes, arbitrary in what christians choose to follow, and what they choose to arbitrarily ignore. Like, for example, being obsessed with the homosexuality of others, but ignoring the prohibition against the wearing of clothing made of multiple materials. And, of course, many christians totally ignore Matthew 25:35-36. And Proverbs 14:31. This is just scratching the surface, if you know the bible well, then you know there are many, many more biblical guidelines that are completely ignored by most american christians.

By the way, have you every given or received oral sex in your life? Yes? Well your have committed the serious biblical perversion of sodomy. Whole cities were leveled because of if it. You're quite lucky god has not destroyed you for it.

And then, of course, there are the actions of perhaps the world's most demonic christians:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=EKSwdJwEmrE

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Why do you care?

Why do you argue with yourself so much?

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This executive order will be challenged and will hopefully fail for this reason bolded above (assuming we don’t see a further descent into theocracy).

I previously said that I dislike that teams are asked to implement the discrimination. I think it’s good to consider what this type of break from or dismantling of the normal hierarchy of authority for important decisions is. What is it? There is probably a name for it, but I don’t know the word. The book Lord of the Flies contains the theme, although there it was the result of a calamity not a strategic political maneuver.

The executive order in Nassau is too broad and not narrowly tailored. County facilities are used for a wide variety of competitions and events, and it doesn’t make sense to write this rule to solve the problem which is found only in some competitive sports.

Why do you care if people adhere to their religion's rules?

🙄

Morality and religion doesn’t have to be an issue here. I think we should be able to agree on the basic framework for laws (the rule of law) even if we don’t agree on the content of laws.

See my posts above, question was explicitly answered in between all of your christian insults.

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If the county doesn’t want trans athletes to use county facilities for competitions or events and implements this rule to effectuate that policy, I would prefer they put a sign on the door that says: “no trans athletes allowed.”

Let’s be straight forward and honest here. Pushing the discrimination onto teams is cowardly and ugly.

Aww, c'mon, let's Make America Great Again!

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Which post specifically

I only care when those people are judges making judicial rulings based on their religious opinions.

This is the most tiresome retread of an argument. The Jewish Christians of the early church had a hard time understanding that they no longer had to keep the Old Testament laws. Paul spilled much ink in his writings to dispel this false teaching. You are about 2,000 years behind the learning curve.


The Bible is quite clear about sexual relations between people of the same sex. I am not aware of any verses in the New Testament that relate to what a husband and wife may or may not do as long as they are faithful to one another. Provide a citation and not an opinion.


You will know them by their fruits. Those who claim to be Christian but don't follow His commands are in for a rude awakening on judgment day. Matthew 7:15-23

However, your entire complaint is muddled. If Christians were completely faithful to Jesus' teachings, would you stop complaining?

Do you disagree with the ruling, or only object to the judge's invocation of religious language?

What is the difference between someone who wants to live according to their faith and someone who wants to be on the right side of history?

Ok, this is novel to me, as no christian has ever said or implied this to me. So, are you saying that no directives or guidelines of the old testament need to be followed by christians?



Again, as I have said previously, I have no complaints against how christians believe or live (within limits). As long as they do not try to apply their rules upon others. Don't tread on me.

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Except for the Nth time that is NOT what the county is saying. Trans athletes are absolutely allowed to use the facilities.


You mean this rule that allows trans athletes the opportunity to compete and at the same time prioritizes the fairness of biological female competition...



Again...that is not what is being done. All trans athletes are welcome inside their doors.


I played NCAA division 1 and I had to fill out a lot of paperwork and sit through presentations. Some of the paperwork I had to fill out was a code of conduct and paperwork pledging not to break the rules of the NCAA. It was up to our school's Athletic director and team laison to ensure our promise to the leagues rules.

So there are absolutely times when putting the onus on teams is not cowardly or ugly.

Can you acknowledge that this executive order does not in fact ban trans athletes from competing? And in fact admit that trans athletes are allowed to enter the facilities and use the facilities as long as they are competing on a co-ed or male team? And then admit that your issue is that you disagree with the approach to protecting biological female athletes and not that they're banning trans athletes altogether...are you able to do that?

Right. Which is why this order is being given so much attention as it is far more broad than other approaches that are already in place. It is a hard line approach to prioritizing fairness female sport.

Regarding the bold, that does not mean rules don't have to be adhered to. For instance, there are facilities owned by school districts that are leased for use in higher level sport that do not allow for the sale of alcohol. Nor is it allowed in the parking lot even during non school-related functions. I know this because I coach and the stadium my team used to use was owned by the district and we were not allowed to do X, Y, or Z.

I understand that it prohibits even the most non-competitive and inclusive leagues from using it should that need arise but that is simply just the rule the local govt is putting in place to protect what they (and many others) believe to be fair for women's sport and not jeopardize all the work done for women in sport.

I also used to play men's open soccer and there were too many issues with injuries and hot heads so a number of the facilities in town no longer allowed men's leagues for <23. Co-ed was allowed at any age as was women's open, and men & women O-30.

Agree or disagree with the topic but it is not out of the ordinary for this approach to be taken.

I think I need to speak carefully here, but the short answer is yes. The Old Testament law, generally contained in the books of Exodus through Deuteronomy, is not applicable to Christians. However, Jesus reaffirms in His own teaching many of the principles contained in the OT, and even raises the bar on what God expects from His followers. The Sermon on the Mount contains some famous passages explaining one's thoughts and intentions are just as important as one's actions. Instead of a list of laws and sacrifices to be made when the laws are broken, we are given principles to guide holy living. This is a very short answer to a theologically complex question.

Every law passed implies a moral standard. Whose moral standards are going to be enforced through laws is up to the voters.

Well, this is completely new to me. In my many conversations with christians I.R.L., I have never ever been told this, as they very frequently quoted to me the many laws and directives of the old testament (not being gay, not eating lobster, and so on). Do all christians agree with this interpretation? If no, upon what theological basis do you decide to toss out the moral guidance of the 10 commandments and all the other stuff in the old testament?



And up to the constitution. More specifically in the religious law arena, the 1st amendment.




Somewhat related, if you commit sodomy with your wife, are your a sodomite? Did you ever give or receive oral sex prior to being married?

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I disagree with the ruling. Also, I disagree with the judge invoking Christian teachings as a rationale for the ruling, which is clearly unconstitutional. Do you agree the ruling is unconstitutional?

Anyone can live by their own beliefs, as long as in doing so they don’t try to impose them on others, especially from the bench.

As to being the right side of history, I’m not sure what you’re talking about, but it sounds subjective.

The sale of alcohol is highly regulated and we have many laws regarding who, when, and where alcohol may be sold. It is quite a different thing to exclude certain members of the public from using public facilities. Discrimination on the basis of gender is not an ordinary thing, like the regulation of alcohol sales.

Who are you okay with attempting to apply their rules on others?

Yes, this is in line with the MAGA movement to allow discrimination from businesses and, now, organizations and public facilities that refuse to serve non-conforming people.
https://www.motherjones.com/...ng-website-colorado/

Start with Acts chapter 15. It recounts the council of Christian leaders held in Jerusalem around A.D 51. In summary, if the Old Testament laws weren't binding on Gentile Christians, they couldn't be binding on Jewish Christians, either. If the Old Testament laws were still binding, wouldn't Christians still be making animal sacrifices as commanded?

Besides being a bit creepy, it seems like you are fishing for a reason to cast me as a hypocrite. That's too bad.
Try this instead. https://www.gotquestions.org/...anal-sex-sodomy.html

My wife and I are friends with a Christian couple who went the IVF route for their second pregnancy. They ended up with twin girls, but they also have unused embryos in storage. I am not sure what their long-term plans are. I am glad we don't have to make that decision because I don't know what we'd do. Although I generally do believe life begins at conception, IVF and the theoretically infinite suspension of development takes things into an area where the right answer is unclear to me.


I think criminalization of certain drugs is exactly imposing a belief system on others. And I agree about the subjectivity of the right side of history. Some people use it to justify their beliefs, but it doesn't have any real substance and seems to be a substitute for a morality based on religion.

No, l'm not fishing. But l noticed you avoided the question, which is in itself an answer.

But the real point: as you know, it is very easy to find flaw in anyone's behavior. It is always easy to look outside ourselves (condemning gays, etc.), but far less easy to look inward.

Someone far wiser than me once said,
"Let he who is without sin throw the first stone."

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Absolutely correct. And our drug laws have proven to be an especially stupid and vicious set of laws.

Help drug users? Absolutely yes. But criminalize them? Absolutely no.

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I was talking about the ruling being unconstitutional because the AL Supreme Court used Christian beliefs as a basis for it. That is a clear breach of the first amendment, regardless of whether you believe a clump of cells should be considered as a human being or not.

As for your friends, do you believe they should be forced to pay to keep those clumps of cells alive indefinitely or face criminal prosecution? It’s not cheap to keep frozen embryos alive.

Not really. Though it's no one's business, I can honestly say that my wife and I were both virgins on our wedding day. As it should be. No regrets.

Sure, from the Sermon on the Mount again is the reference to the beam in one's eye. And, don't judge unless you also want to be judged. In this case, maybe I do have the high ground.

That portion of Scripture, in John 8, is one of two NT passages that most scholars believe aren't authentic. Some use this phrase to come to the ridiculous conclusion that you can't say anyone or anything is wrong.

Thanks for answering my questions, this has been useful. Can you help me with these?

This is interesting. This is how a conversation with a christian sometimes goes:

christian: the bible is the holy word of god! we should follow it!
me: ok, what about this part in the bible?
christian: no, no, not that part, we only need to follow the new testament!
me: ok, what about this part in the new testament?
christian: no, no, not that part, that is a passage "that most scholars believe isn't authentic." So you don't need to follow that part either!

Can you see, perhaps, how an ignorant person like myself can get super confused by all this?




Does the bible (new testament of course, the "authentic" parts!) have anything to say about being prideful?




Is that really our job, to judge others? I thought that the bible (new testament of course, the "authentic" parts!) admonishes us not to judge others, but let god be the judge? Or, am I understanding all that incorrectly?

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you really need to go read some basic Christian Theology. TMI has been very patient with you explaining things I would expect you would already know, but I guess not. You need to educate yourself at this point.

Kind of like I need to "educate" myself about the stolen 2020 election, perhaps ?

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if I had all the memes handy, this is where I put post a big display of the goalpost being moved all over the field. And, yes, maybe you should learn more about 2020, I have no idea what your knowledge is, but not relevant to Christian Theology.

Are you going to go "educate" yourself about the global warming crisis?

February has been so nice! Will be 70 degrees here today in chicago!
(historical average for right now: 30 degrees)

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What's next, are you going to bring up gun control in your next post? You are all over the place today. Maybe go have some coffee.

I am very informed on the global warming crisis that is going to kill us all in the next few years per AOC and the little gnome girl that protests school on Fridays. Having said that, still waiting for those beach front properties in Florida to reflect what we all know, right?

Telling someone to "educate oneself" is inane. What it usually means is that you don't know the answer to the question asked.

And I can read all I want about theology, but none of that reading will give me Mr TMI's opinion, which is what I am interested in.


But thanks for your wonderful contributions to this discussion.

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Uh, it's not Mr. TMI opinion. It's foundational Christian theology that has been agreed upon for thousands of years. Seems you might want to know a little more about that before posting your tripe from Hollywood that has been addressed a million times by a million theologians.

Question: why do you consume so much hollywood tripe?

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some of the women are really hot.

Isn't lust kinda a not "bible-approved" thing?

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Been doing some research already? Good for you. Keep at it and you might figure out what TMI was talking about.

So, if you are a sincere christian, why are you quite intentionally indulging your lust with what you yourself call 'hollywood tripe' when your bible very clearly tells you not to do this?

Or, is this a case of, "do as I say, not as I do" kind of thing?

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you can't think a women is hot without lusting after her? Get your mind out of the gutter. Maybe spend some time reading the good book and prayer will help with that.

You are impressive in evading the question.

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Blakeman was ripped today by the Editorial Board of Newsday, the Long Island newspaper.

https://www.newsday.com/...letes-lgbtq-ijy7ye2r

They said that he should be doing his job, working on his campaign promises, not issuing a probably illegal order, trying to elevate his national image.

''What could be Blakeman's motive for this bizarre move, other than an addiction to national attention? It's yet another example of government by performance. Running Nassau County is a tough job. He should start doing it. He has yet to fulfill his campaign promise to fix the county's assessment system, attend to aging South Shore infrastructure that cannot handle increased rainwater from storms, or, most urgently, save Nassau University Medical Center which is on the brink of running out of money. Instead of picking on kids in such a deplorable way, the county executive should act to solve his own grown-up problems.''

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''Sweeney - you can both crush your AG *and* cruise in dead last!! 😂 '' Murphy's Law

Do people think it is very “small government” for the government to require someone running a casual softball game to get copies of the original birth certificates of everyone that wants to participate?

That doesn’t seem very small government to me.

I've been quite so far in this discussion, but it is time to call BS on this entire "discrimination outrage" that is going on.

Bruce Blakeman Executive Order

Nowhere in that order is a "casual softball game" even remotely implied. It involves organized women's sporting events and competitions. It clearly explains that.

I don't know where or when keeping a biological male out a women's sporting competition became an afront to LBGTQ rights, but the entire thought process behind it, and justification for it, is wrong. If that was fair why do we have women's divisions in those sports? Why do we have Title 9?

By most standards I'm as liberal in my thinking as anyone, and I have no problem with that lifestyle, none what so ever, but I raised a girl that participated in sports, and I have a wife that still does, and neither should be expected to compete against a biological male. Period. No discussion needed.

PS - I think Blakeman is a shithead.

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"...the street finds its own uses for things"

Why do you think a casual softball game is excluded from the rule?

Obviously an informal pickup game where people don’t care if they are interrupted and kicked off the facilities isn’t subject to the ban. But everyone who wants to reserve the facilities and have the right to play, competitively or not, for their hour or whatever will need to comply.

Do not give what is holy to dogs, and do not throw your pearls before swine, or they will trample them under their feet, and turn and tear you to pieces. - Jesus

I can't tell whether your tone is adversarial or frustrated. You seem pretty trollish, but maybe that's just the LR. I'm still trying to decipher whether you have a genuine interest or if you have as little use for spiritual wisdom as a wild boar has for jewelry.


Learning requires time and humility. See how much you have learned in such a short amount of time?


Your website clearly states "we will repair the product at no charge" Do I have that right?



Do you understand the concept of moral high ground? One slave-owner can't condemn another slave-owner for owning slaves. They are on equal footing.

When parents who smoked/drank/took drugs tell their children not to smoke, drink, or take drugs, they will have little ground for denying their kids from doing the same.

Because I have not engaged in certain behaviours I can't be accused of "being no different" than those who have.

I agree with you as do most sane people.

Now be prepared for the ideologue lunatics that inhabit this place to attack you personally.

Not trollish, sincerely interested. But the arbitrary and evasive answers are a bit frustrating, yes.



Agreed, yes, it does require both. But, with all of the evasive answers, l am not at all sure you really want to share any info, opinions, knowledge, or insight. Unfortunately.



Yes, it does. We correct or fix defects, absolutely. But what does this have to do with the price of tea in china?



I agree that if one is a flawed teacher, one can't take the moral high ground. (Although many, many do anyway.) But can not a nearly flawless teacher also deliberately choose to not take the moral high ground as well? Because that seems to be a far more challenging (but powerful) exercise in humility, no? Hypothetically, even if l think that l am more moral than my student, can l not still humble myself before my student anyway? I thought the Bible highly looked down on the prideful, no?

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Aren't you a lawyer? You are asking me to prove a negative.

Lets take Eisenhower Park, the largest county park on Long Island (bigger than Central Park) as an example. You need a permit to use a pavilion for a pick nick/family gathering, etc. You are not having an "organized Women's sporting event." You can use the softball field as you wish, and anyone can play. You don't need a permit just for that.

Where this EO applies is for all the county, city, and state sanctioned events that take place in the park. The park contains an Olympic quality pool with USA Swim, AAU, etc. There are 5K/10K races. There are bike races. There are golfing events. Pretty much any sport you can think of is played there. The EO only applies to permits for organized competitions.

Please post a quote from the actual EO that supports your conclusion that a casual softball game is included, and remember that you don't need a permit for a casual pickup softball game between friends and family.

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"...the street finds its own uses for things"

As far as I can tell, the executive order denies equal access to people based upon their gender. The order clearly denies permits to certain people.

We know that denying certain members of the public access to public facilities is a big deal.

Do you think using a softball field without a permit is the same as using the softball field with a permit? Are you telling me that you think the trans athletes have equal access to the public faculties?

Jack, I'm with you that men should not be allowed to compete in woman's sports or woman's divisions just because they feel the need to be a woman. They can be a woman all they want, they just can't compete in a woman's division. It's no different that steroids or some anti aging treatments. Do what ever you want, just don't race.

I don't like most of the stunts Blakeman has pulled and this is another stunt. It's probably illegal, and most likely unenforceable. When a race director goes to the county for a permit for a 5k race at Eisenhower, does he or she, have to show the birth certificates for everyone or every woman who will be racing?

It's just another stunt by Blakeman to get his name of Fox. It took him three tries to get elected. I sure hop we make him a one-termer next time.

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''Sweeney - you can both crush your AG *and* cruise in dead last!! 😂 '' Murphy's Law

So you like the message just not the messenger?

I'm still waiting on you to quote the section of the EO that supports your opinion.

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"...the street finds its own uses for things"

There is so much wrong in this post and I’m not sure why you still cannot grasp that nothing in this EO denies trans individuals equal access to the facilities.

The order denies access to teams looking for permits to compete in an organized fashion.

Moreover every single organized league I’ve ever been a part of makes me register and fill out paperwork with respect to liability and insurance so I’m not sure why people are losing their shit over this other than the fact that it deals with transgender individuals.

Don’t throw the baby out with the bathwater.

As I said to B&P at least some amount of paperwork or proof is required for most organized entities’ events for liability coverage. And the fact that this specific situation being discussed is a bit more complex and nuanced than in decades past means that a bit more complex paperwork isn’t all that unrealistic. It just so happens to be more involved than anything before and like anything more restrictive or anything entering new territory it will be met with criticism.

Why would you think this is illegal? I as a ~40 year old male cannot jump into a women’s soccer league match or decide to run around with HS kid’s soccer games if the rules specifically don’t allow for it. And if I repeatedly tried to do it I’m sure I’d get removed from the premises and probably not be allowed to return. Moreover a coach that registered a team in the youth or womebn’s leagues with me on the roster would probably be asked to remove me (with some massive complaints from competitors) and if the coach refused then I’d imagine our team would not be allowed in the league to compete.

What about this EO do you think is illegal? Disclaimer: im not a lawyer and could very well be naive to any past case law that sets an illegal precedent here so Im genuinely asking. As per my silly and simple example above I cannot see how this would be different.

I don’t deny that alcohol is highly regulated. Nor did I say that alcohol and trans individuals are the same. In fact my point has nothing to do how regulated any issue is.

Roger said that public facilities are leased to private organizations all the time. And the point I was making was that this doesn’t eliminate the fact that those private organizations must still adhere to rules in place even if that rule is more restrictive than elsewhere. Banning something from a public facility that is otherwise legal elsewhere is not new nor is it an issue.

My point was to show him that it happens and has happened already WRT banning private organizations from doing otherwise legal things in a public facility. To show an example: not to equate.

Not weighing in on the legality.

The statements in your paragraph are reasonable. Teams, coaches, players, sports federations, governing bodies should all have a say in this. And you and l will likely agree with what they come up with, and how they will enforce it.

But you know who shouldn’t have a say? The owner of the lawn they're playing on.

That's the whole point of this thread.

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Then I’ll direct you to the list of states that ban transgender girls from competing in girl’s sports across multiple levels of school competition that use public facilities.

I am confused, are you in support of those states, or not?

Also, you didn't really give me your opinion about what l just wrote.

Do you agree that the folks that should really be having a say (and enforcing their decisions) are the teams, leagues, coaches, players, sports federations, and governing bodies? And not the lawn/pool/gym owners?

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Also I’d like to point out that the taxpayers elect their local officials. The locals have expressed their concerns and made their wishes known. So the owner of the lawn is the taxpayers who have spoken. That’s what elections are for.


Organizations, coaches, parents, athletes, and taxpayers have all spoken. This is perhaps the most restrictive (in terms of paperwork) and also the most fair as it still allows trans athletes and their teams to compete while respecting the fairness of the women’s sports. Yet many people and some in this thread cannot see that. And still think this means “trans athletes aren’t allowed in facilities” regardless of how patently and obviously false that claim is.

See my reply above.

And yes I support states and rules that protect women’s sport by not allowing biological males to compete alongside biological women. And I am absolutely for strict rules to ensure this until we can get a better handle on this if that ever becomes a reality and other developments occur in the future, whatever they may be.

People have certain rights of free association. The government needs a compelling interest to strip people of those rights. If the government wants to organize a women-only event, that is one thing. The government has a legitimate interest in keeping the event competitively fair for participants. But, what is the government’s interest when a trans-friendly women’s or girls’ group wants to use government facilities to host their event? If the participants (or maybe their parents, if the event is for youngsters) want to show their support for trans women/girls, don’t they have the right to express that?

I am not at all sure the order is illegal. But to grapple with its implications we need to recognize that it goes well beyond setting rules for a county- organized league. It’s basically saying that no matter how much your participants want to show their support for trans rights, they can’t use county facilities for their sporting event unless they declare the event to be co-ed. However, co-ed and trans friendly are not the same thing. Why is the government dictating who the participants can play with, if it’s contrary to the participants’ wishes?

Forgive me, but this sounds a lot like one of dear leader's word salads.

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Bingo, exactly this.

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Someone renting out a towns field for a softball game would clearly be held to this order. So I don’t see how you can claim it would be affected by this order.

chaparral wrote:

Someone renting out a towns field for a softball game would clearly be held to this order. So I don’t see how you can claim it would be affected by this order.

Since no one is actually reading the EO:

[quote}ORDERED, that any sports, leagues, organizations, teams, programs, or sports entities must expressly designate as one of the following based on the biological sex at birth of the team members/participants when applying for a use and occupancy permit to utilize Nassau County Parks property for the purposes of organizing a sporting event or competition:

1) Males, men, or boys; or
2) Females, women, or girls; or
3) Coed or mixed, including both males and females;



and it is further,
ORDERED, that Nassau County Department of Parks, Recreation & Museums shall not
issue any pennits for the use and occupancy of Nassau County Park's property for the purposes of organizing a sporting event or competition that allows athletic teams or sports designated for females, women, or girls to include biological males; and it is further,



ORDERED, that Nassau County Department of Parks, Recreation & Museums may issue permits for the use and occupancy of Nassau County Park's property for the purposes of organizing a sporting event or competition that allow athletic teams or sports for males, men, or boys to include biological females; and it is further,


ORDERED, that for the purpose of this Executive Order, an individual's gender is defined as the individual's biological sex at birth; and a statement of a team member's/participant's biological sex on the team member's/participant's official birth certificate is considered to have correctly stated the team member's/participant's biological sex at birth if the statement was filed at or near the time of the team member's/participant's birth.[/quote]


Where in this document do you think that renting the field for a casual event is covered by the EO? If I wanted to rent a field for a co-ed softball game it does not fall under the EO. That is the equivalent of having a trans gender athlete on the team, and that is OK.


What is not OK is renting out the field for a softball tournament that has the sexes split - men's bracket and women's bracket. Then the EO applies.


If I'm wrong then point out how you can read this differently.

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"...the street finds its own uses for things"

Excellent deflection away from my answers to your questions.

And that is hardly difficult to digest. I support strict rules to protect women's sports. And seeing as how this is very new territory as of the last few years I also support strict blanket rules and regulations until developments may unfold to provide us better information. If that is too difficult to grasp then I can't help you.

But as always, you deflect when people answer your questions.

Not in any way trying to deflect, I just didn't follow what you are writing.

In any case, I guess I disagree with you. Because I am totally ok with the people that have a very big compelling interest (the teams, leagues, coaches, players, sports federations, and governing bodies) sorting this out. Since it affects them and nobody else.

I am not ok with the govt dictating who the participants can play with, if it’s contrary to the participants’ wishes.

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You could sure put it that way, but I don't like messenger or the way he's going about it. It's a BS order that does nothing. It's only there to try and set up the Democrats to defend trans people. It's all about Blakeman's re-election.

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''Sweeney - you can both crush your AG *and* cruise in dead last!! 😂 '' Murphy's Law

Again, those people who are affected HAVE spoken. They are constituents of a locale and their elected officials heard them. Hence the ruling on certain facilities.

Other states have taken similar approaches for public school sports. The local govts spoke and dictated who can compete in some instances regardless of the participant’s wishes.


Does this EO ban trans athletes from existing legally? No

Does this EO prohibit trans individuals from entering or using facilities? No is does not.

This EO prohibits trans females from competing against biological females in designated female events. That is very straight forward.

Edit for typo not content.

Why not just let the people that have a big compelling interest (the teams, leagues, coaches, players, sports federations, and governing bodies) sort this out, since it affects them and nobody else ?

How are random county residents (who do not play sports in the these groups), how are they affected?

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Since you are so keen on asking questions, why are you in support of biological males competing in women's sporting events? Why is this even a consideration? Because someone is dressing like a woman makes them eligible?

I'll say it once again, why did we put so much effort into creating teams for men and women, as well as title 9, if all that is needed to circumvent those efforts is to put on a dress?

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"...the street finds its own uses for things"

The same reason we don’t let neighborhoods decide their own property restrictions.

The same reason we don’t let businesses decide their own zoning requirements.

The same reason we have standards for safety and don’t let factory workers decide their own building codes and regulations.

The same reason we don’t let people sort a lot of things out on their own.

It’s called having a govt and laws and how elections work. And this is one of the beneficial reasons we have elections and rule of law.

It is weird that you don't address my questions above, but instead you just try to divert with unrelated questions.

But, if it helps, I am not in support of biological males competing in women's sporting events. It is not a consideration. No, dressing like a woman does not make anyone eligible, but I will always defer to the teams, leagues, coaches, players, sports federations, and governing bodies sort this out since it it primarily affects them and really no one else.

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The amount of irony in that one sentence as posted by you is immeasurable.


That being said they are not unrelated questions at all.

You spend 95% of the time discussing the messenger, but you don't seem to enjoy actually discussing content.

Your personality and communication style is interesting (so is mine I guess), but that's not why we are here, so why not just focus on the issue? You very, very frequently allow yourself to get sidetracked by your emotions. Let's just try to address this thorny issue instead.

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If your calculations arrive at 95% of my time spent addressing your ineffective discussion style then let’s say I’m thrilled you’re not a math teacher.

People. Including myself, have spent countless posts back and forth with you being patient as we can be entertaining your relentless questions and deflections. At a certain point it cannot go unaddressed.

That being said people ask YOU to address questions that you do not. And you claim he had unrelated questions that are in fact very pertinent yet you felt the need not to address them. I said this in my previous reply and that is content.

You claim I don’t argue content yet I’ve been in d read multiple threads where multiple posters call you out on your disingenuous posting and deflecting.

So I reiterate the irony and my chuckling at these claims.

Perhaps it is only 93.7% of the time, please forgive me.

But your post here is still all about the messenger and not the issue at hand. Why do your emotions drive you so much? Or, if you have a bunch of emotional stuff to say about my communication style and personality, just pm me instead?

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It has nothing to do with my emotions and everything to do with hoping to participate in reasonable discussions with individuals who utilize sound communication strategies. It is the opinion of many posters here that you do not fit into that category.

I have no need to pm you. I say what I say in public, and I choose not to say things behind people’s backs that I would not say to their face or in public.

For the record it is possible to both address content as well as the messenger at the same time without issue. If that pill is too hard to swallow then that’s your issue to overcome.

Excellent. Understood.


Back the topic at hand: why not just let the people that have a big compelling interest (the teams, leagues, coaches, players, sports federations, and governing bodies) sort this out, since it affects them and nobody else? How are random county residents (who do not play sports in the these groups), how are they affected?

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lol exhibit A of what I’ve been alluding to. This question of yours has been asked and answered multiple times by me already.

Asked and answered.

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Slowguy

(insert pithy phrase here...)

Weird, l just thought that you were talking about taxpayers ans so on.

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You think you're clever but really you often show how obtuse you are with subsequent posts. I suggest you re-read the thread as I'm not doing your homework for you.

Ah, l wish l was clever, but l'm not. Will re-read as you suggest.

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Where in this document do you think that renting the field for a casual event is covered by the EO? If I wanted to rent a field for a co-ed softball game it does not fall under the EO. That is the equivalent of having a trans gender athlete on the team, and that is OK.


What is not OK is renting out the field for a softball tournament that has the sexes split - men's bracket and women's bracket. Then the EO applies.


If I'm wrong then point out how you can read this differently.[/quote]
Can you not read this part that?


If you wanted a permit for a casual women’s softball game, this applies to you! You would need to get copies of the original birth certificate for those participating if you want to be in compliance.

I certainly can, and a casual softball game is not an "organizing a sporting event or competition..." You are reading into it what you want it to say. Having gotten a permit to use a field for a casual game, it only asks who is responsible for the field (and some other stuff, but not who is playing).

You are arguing details with a local. You should probably walk away.

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"...the street finds its own uses for things"

This is helpful as I was curious but didn’t want to assume. Can you confirm this is still the case now? Not sure when you last applied for field use and this EO just came out.

Jack, you're arguing the past and not the present. This is just one of the reasons that this is ''for show''. What happens with the Long Island Marathon? Do all women have to show their papers?

Who enforces it?

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''Sweeney - you can both crush your AG *and* cruise in dead last!! 😂 '' Murphy's Law

Where does it say birth certificates must be produced to play and why not just list your event as co-Ed if you want to skip all the paperwork?

I’d imagine it is the responsibility of the event organizer (in the case of a marathon) to ensure compliance with all regulatory obligations. And they must enforce it. No different than if I wanted to race in a different category than I belong as per the rules of the event that I am willfully and voluntarily participating in.

Does this EO mandate everyone present their BC or does it spell out that compliance means you must refer to you the details on your BC to ensure you are in the correct category?

I’d also imagine this becomes an issue and people only have to “show papers” if they are flagged or reported by someone else: like an aggrieved competitor or someone else.

The Long Island Jovia Marathon is RRCA certified, if I'm not mistaken. That is a lot different from a pickup softball game and would certainly fall under the executive order, but I think the RRCA already has rules regarding trans-gender. Plus you are running through the park. I'm not sure how it is permitted with Nassau County Parks and Rec. I know that IRunThisIsland is involved.

Regardless, that is not what I'm arguing. It looks like we are now discussing who has to burden of responsibility. That is obviously the race director. In a foot race all you need to do is police the results, not the actual race.

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"...the street finds its own uses for things"

You can imagine anything you want. That's why this is BS. It's all showbiz, and nothing else.

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''Sweeney - you can both crush your AG *and* cruise in dead last!! 😂 '' Murphy's Law

You judged Christians earlier because they weren't following Jesus' teachings.

Are only Christians prohibited from judging, or is it wrong for everyone?



I lifted a select portion out of your warranty policy, but I should read the whole thing, correct?

Likewise, when people clip a mere two words - Don't judge! - from the rest of Jesus' teaching and the rest of his life example, we get a false idea of what judging is in the first place. At least read the verses in context. Here they are.

"Do not judge, so that you won’t be judged. For you will be judged by the same standard with which you judge others, and you will be measured by the same measure you use."

Does this mean that one can't call out someone else's sinful behaviour? Or does it mean that one can judge, but be prepared to be measured by the same standard if one decides to do so? The latter is the real meaning.


Consider some real examples. Jesus spent nearly a whole chapter blasting the many ways Pharisees were perverting the Law to their own ends and burdening others with unnecessary rules of their own creation.

On the day of Pentecost, Peter preached to the crowds in Jerusalem, many of whom were among those who called for Barabbas' release and Jesus' crucifixion. Peter accused them of Jesus' death, and when they heard his words, they were convicted of their actions and repented.

Some time later, Peter was guided to the home of a Gentile, a Roman soldier named Cornelius. A Jew would have never entered the home of a Gentile, but God was trying to teach Peter that the Gospel was for everyone. Peter led the way in the early church embracing both Jews and Gentiles.

In the time before the church leaders' council I mentioned earlier (Acts 15), the Jewish Christians did not all abandon their practice of the Law, and some tried to make the Gentiles follow the Law, too. When Peter, who had been associating with the Gentiles in Antioch, withdrew from their company because he was afraid of what the Jewish Christians visiting from Jerusalem would think, the apostle Paul had to call out his hypocrisy publicly.

In these three examples, certain individuals needed to be called out for their actions for the benefit of either themselves or others. Was this judgment wrong?

Indeed. "God is opposed to the proud, but gives grace to the humble." I Peter 5:5

Are you suggesting that a sign of humility is to water down God's message? Does your definition of being humble require saying nothing when wrongs are being committed?


I understand that people really bristle when they are told they are doing something wrong. Especially when it is true.

The proud aren't willing to admit fault.
The proud aren't willing to accept instruction or correction.
The proud aren't willing to change.

The humble know they are sinful.
The humble know they aren't better than anybody else.
The humble are willing to be judged.

Biblical teaching usually flies in the face of conventional thinking. Perhaps you could rethink your ideas on pride, humility, and judgment?

Yes

I did some checking and the best that I can find is that RRCA and NYRR are promoting a ''non-binary'' division. It seems like a good solution, but I didn't see if it's mandatory or not.

There is a whole page of letters, for and against this subject in Newsday today. They point out how hard life is for trans people and how they are not whole people if they are treated differently, and others point out how unfair it is for a natural woman to have to compete against a biological male. In my opinion, the people doing the most damage to the trans cause are the formerly male athletes who compete against women and don't see the unfairness and the damage they are doing to other trans people who just want to live their lives.

I also admit that I can't stand Blakeman, but his EO does nothing except raise the flag of hate with no solution.

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''Sweeney - you can both crush your AG *and* cruise in dead last!! 😂 '' Murphy's Law

This. Almost no one gives a fuck about trans folks except when "activists" or idiots get involved.

I'm convinced some of these actions are intentional to just garner attention by narcissists.

Another “this.” Even many of the LGBTQ community that I’ve interacted with state their frustration or annoyance by the “over the top” or “in your face” approach taken by members of their community. They admit it sets them back and is the opposite of the message they want to send.

And another “this”.

Very few people have any kind of intolerance, and certainly not animosity, towards transgender people. Indeed, most have much respect for their choices and bravery in making them. Unfortunately, many who support trans people like to mischaracterize those who seek to protect women’s and girls’ rights for fair competition in sports, as being trans-phobic, or dismissing the rights of trans people. This is disingenuous and frankly offensive.

How do transgender females (or those who support their right to compete), not understand that they are being disrespectful to the rights of biological females when they choose to compete against them?

My guess is the pervasive “me me me” or victim mentality to score sympathies has become the default mindset or approach to difficult or unfavorable situations for many individuals. Especially younger ones and this minority group.

Certainly not an explanation that applies to all, but I feel that it’s not too far off the mark.

A follow up to my reply to say that it’s far easier to take to social media and play/appeal to the emotions and sympathies of others to validate your feelings and get support than it is to be introspective and perhaps adjust your own attitude or feelings. That seems to be very difficult nowadays. Thick skin seems to be wasting away.

My last post ran long, but I feel I should address one more thing - the element of motive.

Confronting someone with their self-destructive behaviour in an attempt to belittle or demean that person is judgmental. I think we can all agree that's wrong.

Confronting someone with their self-destructive behaviour in an attempt to help that person is difficult, but compassionate.

Who are you trying to help?

Good question. Seems DSW has lost interest.

Definitely have not lost interest, just wanted to give your thoughtful post a reasonable reply.

No sir, not exactly. I have no agenda on whether christians follow Jesus' teachings, that is up to them. But I do have an agenda if christians want to impose their fairly arbitrary beliefs on other people (like me). Then I look far more carefully at what they say, and what they do. And, unfortunately, often, I find that these conflict hugely.


I cannot say what is "wrong", but I do think that avoiding judging others is probably a good practice. Back to that (I guess fake?) biblical quote, 'let he who is without sin throw the first stone' etc.


Ok, but even with all of that context didn't Jesus just say, "Do not judge, so that you won’t be judged."? That seems pretty clear that judging others is something to avoid. Or, if not, what did I miss?


Very hard to say. Ultimately, all I can do is to try not judge others and focus more of my attention on my own behavior. Is that approach wrong?


No, not not at all. But if I am doing something "right", it seems wrong to me to lord it over someone else. And it seems prideful. Some people have had a very rough life. And I feel it might be better to have empathy for their life and struggles rather than judging them. Is that not a good approach?


I would agree with this. But often people know exactly what they are doing wrong. Do they always need someone to point it out to them repeatedly?


I agree with this, makes a lot of sense.


You bet. All of my ideas are subject to continuous rethinking. This conversation and your input is part of my learning journey.

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https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/local/ny-attorney-general-sends-long-island-exec-cease-and-desist-over-transgender-athlete-ban/5185940/


NY AG calls on Blakeman to rescind the EO citing it as discriminatory and transphobic.


"The law is perfectly clear: you cannot discriminate against a person because of their gender identity or expression. We have no room for hate or bigotry in New York,” James said Friday. “This executive order is transphobic and blatantly illegal. Nassau County must immediately rescind the order, or we will not hesitate to take decisive legal action.”

I'll be interested to see how this plays out and what ground there is to make this claim that it is illegal as 24 states currently have laws banning transgender student-athletes from participating in sports consistent with their gender identity.

I am no expert, but a prohibition against participating in a certain sports event or sports division is, l think, quite different from a prohibition against using an entire sports facility.

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The E.O. does not prohibit transgender athletes from using an "entire sports facility." It prohibits the county's Department of Recreation from issuing permits for the use of county Park property to be used for organized sporting events that explicitly permit biological males (defined as male sex at birth) to participate in events otherwise designated as being for women, females, or girls.

It doesn't prohibit transgender athletes from using parks, or from visiting facilities, or from participating in sports. It doesn't prohibit any transgender athletes from participating in any sports. It just doesn't permit the county to issue a permit for a women's/girls'/female event, if the permit requester allows biological males (again, defined as male sex at birth) to participate in those sports.

The E.O. is less than 2 pages. It's not difficult to read.

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Slowguy

(insert pithy phrase here...)

Sorry, l misspoke. I meant, a prohibition against an individual participating in a certain sports event or certain sports division is, l think, quite different from a prohibition against a sporting event being able to use a public sports facility, based solely on the gender of the participants.

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