Maybe from now on don't bring it up?

I don't... they bring it up to me.

A women, mother of my daughter's friend, also I never met her before comes up to me and says "so ironman isn't as tough as everyone claims it to be... right? !!"

A good number of those are only condescending should you choose to interpret them that way.

Perhaps the lens through which you view the world has a bit of a bias in the direction of condescension from others?

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Eliot
blog thing - strava thing

this. get over yourself.

Like the last commenter wrote, plus - get yourself some new pals. People saying stuff like that sound like assholes.

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In fact, I don't think any of them actually meet the definition of "condescending".

They are just declining to tell you that finishing an ironman makes you awesome.

I love how people come in here looking for validation, only to find that they share the same sentiment. Maybe you need to surround yourself with more genuine friends and family. I get/got nothing but support and praise after doing major endurance events, and ST is the last place I would frequent seeking reassurance.

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"I would definitely smell her seat after a century ride"

Likewise.

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----------------------------------------------------------------

Yup... family, friends, coworkers, doctors.

My first IM, I have completed a number since, coworkers placed bets on whether I'd finish or not.

The first time I went sub 4 hours on a marathon, my father-in-law ask me to join him in getting food.
I never brought up the marathon. He brought it up. He seemed aggravated by it and said a friend of his said it is not hard to go sub 4. He then told me that he could do it and beat me. (the most he ever ran at one time was 5 miles when he was young)

You are lucky your family is supportive !

I actually find this genuinely sad. Your right, some of us our lucky with out support, but athletic accomplishments we are proud of shouldn't be belittled by friends and family irrespective of how hard or not others may or may not find them.

I often find people's reactions are the opposite, largely due to the distances involved in IM are still difficult to comprehend to some. I'm fairly modest when discussing it though, and I often find I have to up play what the other person believes is possible in reference to there own ability. To paraphrase your last quote 'if you trained you could do it'.

But like someone has already mentioned, this is the last place you should be coming to seek validation... ;)

Why isn't your time improving?

I never bring up my 'athletic achievements' during a conversation let alone fish for confirmation of my awesomeness. When the subject does come up and people are interested (and/or in awe) I actually tell them that anyone in normal health can finish an Ironman if he or she trains for it and spends the hours. It's my experience that most people are amazed by the physical performance while the mental part is key.

In this place, anything over 4.30 for a half or 10 hours for an ironman, is considered "slow".

I actually think it is harder for those people going slower as they are out there for so much longer!

I know my hardest races have been those where I have completely blown up due to cramp, medical issues or an injury.

Those three aren't that far of the truth, in my opinion. I make these remarks myself when people ask about ironman and training for one. As long as you don't get to OCD about them, they are quite managable IMHO.

On the face of it these don't seem particularly condescending. In fact they all seem like legitimate questions or comments except the wetsuit one which is rather silly.
If someone was saying them in such a way as to undermine your pride in your achievements that would be rather unpleasant but the words themselves don't look like an issue to me.
I think this is probably more about the attitude of the people saying these things to you or how you're interpreting them rather than what's actually being said.
Be proud of your accomplishments regardless whether those around you are inclined to reinforce or undermine that pride.

You have to remember we are a small niche within life. 99% of people couldn't care less and know very little about endurance sports. If you perceive others being negative towards you take it with a pinch of salt. You should do IM for *you* and no one else.

Where's that? Boulder? :D
Nice brag BTW. ;-)

Sounds to me like the people around you don't hold you in high regard and therefore need to undermine you achievement of completing an Ironman. Many of the comments are true, but they wouldn't be the things I'd say to any friend who had just completed one. I might say them to an co-worker who brought the subject up at every opportunity to display their awesomeness.

Triathlon is for people who suck at all 3 sports, get used to the condescension from swimmers, cyclists and runners (and maybe a few other people who sit on their ass and think how easy it must be).

I wear my finishers medals at work, doesn't everyone? Seriously, I have mixed thoughts on those types of comments, but at the end of the day I could care less what others say, I race for myself. Except for the few competing to win, this sport we play is a competition with ourselves.

Completely agree. I tell people that Ironman isn't that tough and that just about anyone who is healthy can finish one if they wanted to.

Do Ironman for fun. Don't do it to make people think you're awesome - as most don't care and some will just be mean anyway.

I'm not sure I find those incredibly condescending... and are the brackets your insinuations? In fact they sound pretty truthful outside of the wetsuit thing.

I digress, who cares, welcome to life... people make statements about this kind of thing in all facets of our lives. Your kids, your job, you wife, your car, your house, your education, etc.

Then maybe don't wear all your Ironman gear every time you leave the house...

"I swear I never bring it up..."

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How does Danny Hart sit down with balls that big?

Pretty standard human behavior. It's the "Tall Poppy Syndrome". People knocking others down a peg so they don't feel inferior to them. Sad, but typical.

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------------------
My business-eBodyboarding.com

I sure hope that's not the OP.

Probably not. But they said it happens at work so it's probably this guy.

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How does Danny Hart sit down with balls that big?

"You are lucky your family is supportive ! "
----------------------------
I highly believe and have found that you create your own circle of support. The support you receive is typically a reflection of you, not them. Are there some dissenters out there, sure - just smile and agree.

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David
* Ironman for Life! (Blog) * IM Everyday Hero Video * Daggett Shuler Law *
Disclaimer: I have personal and professional relationships with many athletes, vendors, and organizations in the triathlon world.

The first time my father-in-law watched me finish a marathon, the first thing he said was, "why didn't you just sprint the whole thing, you would have been done faster." Some people don't get it. I am there for myself and have an awesome support group and personal Sherpa! Power on.....

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Start slow and taper off....

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Not everything is as it seems -Mr. Miyagi

"When are you getting your tattoo?"
"You're gonna put a stupid sticker on your car now, right?"

---

"What's your claim?" - Ben Gravy
"Your best work is the work you're excited about" - Rick Rubin

I was talking to one of my fellow employees a couple of months ago. This guy is 30 years old a know-it-all and nobody likes him, he does run a little, probably 40 miles a year. He was asking me if there was a time limit for finishing an Ironman and I replied usually around 17 hours, he let out a laugh and said, hell I could do that! I told him to go ahead and join us and see what he thought, I even went as far to offer and pay for the entry to a race, but if he did not finish he would have to pay me back. The word Ironman has never been mentioned again since that day.

1) a guy at my gym who is easily 100 lbs overweight has done 3
2) that is true about everything. I feel like training 14 hrs a week, though.
3) wetsuit optimal swim? Yeah, you're a wuss. : )
4) hmmm, ouch.
5) so the point is.... It is the journey not the destination.

There's nothing BCtrigirl and I enjoy more then making snide comments about people who show up to race packet pickups wearing all their IM or Boston gear.

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Long Chile was a silly place.

I'm a relative newbie, still building to my first IM, planning on doing my first HIM this year, but it's always struck me as funny that friends who don't participate in this type of sport have such a warped view of what is involved, both in training and in the actual race.

I've run a couple full marathons, Sprint and Olympic Tris, and dozens of 13.1, 10k, 5k, etc. My week is generally 30-50 miles of running, 100 or more on the bike, and at least a mile swimming, 3-5 days a week. On top of that, if I have the time, I'll do an hour or so of strength training, 3-5 days a week.

What impresses people the most?

The Tough Mudder. People think you've got to be some kind of Navy Seal to survive that.

I was completely underwhelmed by it. I had a lot of fun, plan on doing more, but the whole thing requires very little athleticism. It's mostly about doing stuff that you'd normally avoid...like getting wet, getting dirty, and getting cold. It's the "Fear Factor" of sports...the physical equivalent of "eating something gross."

Again, not to slam obstacle runs, they're a good time, but training for what's essentially a half marathon with 15 or 20 "rest breaks" would be better spent sitting in a bathtub full of ice water than actually exercising.

But this is the danger. To people without much of a history in long distance athletics, a HM distance obstacle race is an accomplishment. That's fair enough and they deserve to feel good about it. To you a HM distance obstacle race is pretty trivial and just for fun. If you tell them that, they're likely to feel pretty hurt and understandably so. It's all relative. It makes no sense to superimpose your experience and ability on someone else's accomplishments. That's why most of us change the challenges we put before ourselves and try and go further or faster.
So those of us who think we do know what we're talking about should be careful not to see others' accomplishments through our own lens or we risk being even more insulting and unfair than anyone who's just ignorant of the subject.

On the other hand, I really can't understand someone with no relevant experience telling you an IM, marathon, or whatever, is no big deal. That's just mean and ignorant and it deserves to be ignored. However, it's not something I can remember ever encountering. In my experience most people seem to think long distance runs, cycles and triathlons are either impressive, or crazy. The most negative remarks are no more than comments about how they can't see how it would be fun to torture yourself like that or how the training must take up so much time, and is my partner alright with that. They're not criticisms or minimisations at all, just queries about my sanity!

Nothing happens in a pure vacuum. Take a step back and contemplate either the source of the comment or the intended direction of the comment.

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What I do: http://app.strava.com/athletes/345699

Triathlon is not a mainstream sport, so you can't expect the general population to understand the sport. Most of those people you're interacting with could not even think of finishing one sprint triathlon, so consider the source. Don't worry, I get a lot of haters at work. Those people are everywhere and their thoughts are irrelevant. Join a local running club, cycling club or masters swim club and you won't have to search for positivity.

I always get a weird opposite sort of problem.

I had the following conversation with my mom yesterday while the family was gathering:

Mom: So what did you do this morning?
Me: Oh we went and did a Turkey Trot race, then just hung around the house for a while before coming over
Mom: How long was this one?
Me: Oh it was a 5k
Mom: Well that's like nothing at all to you right? It's like a stroll to the fridge compared to the Ironman you just did!
Me: Well I was racing it so it was pretty hard.
Mom: But it's not like it's a marathon. How hard can that be?

She doesn't at all realize that there is a big difference between racing a 5k and simply going out for a 3.1 mile run. Or that racing a 5k can be "hard" compared to doing Ironman. Doesn't matter how many times we have that conversation, or how many times I explain that racing any distance is supposed to be incredibly difficult.

A few years back my then-boss asked me if I "achieved nirvana" after completing an ironman. I am still baffled by the comment.

Since then I began to be more thoughtful about who I share my training pursuits with:
- My training/racing buddies - YES, that's 60-80% of what we talk about anyways
- Family and (non-tri) friends - MAYBE, if it comes up in conversation and don't dwell on it for more than a few minutes
- Co-workers - NO, I do still talk about going for a run or a swim when it's appropriate, but in general I avoid mentioning triathlon

I agree that almost anyone can do it. The 17 hour time limit allows this.

Any reasonably healthy person could train and finish.

You only need validation for yourself, not from everyone else.

Beat your old time and stay healthy should be the only reason you do it

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Yellowfin Endurance Coaching and Bike Fits
USAT Level 1, USAC Level 3

Well she is right, it isn't.

Triathlon is a very selfish sport -- especially Ironman. I really dont talk about Ironman with family or coworkers. Occasionally a few bits of training for the cyclists/runners I know. I stick with this forum and my Triathlon club for my outlet on geeking out about Endurance sports and my accomplishments within the sport. I honestly dont blame people for being annoyed by me. I find some Ironman athletes a bit conceited.

No kidding... This week I had some contractors over to install a heatpump. One of the guy was coming from a bodybuilding background, at fairly high level. He had no clue what a triathlon was. He was extremely nice and interested about it though, nothing condescending. But just to say that to the main population, they have no clue...

I coach youth soccer. I had a few soccer moms ask me if Ironman was that race in the mud they heard about... Most of the time though, if I take time to explain, they seem genuinely interested.

I agree, there's a world of difference in a hard 5k for a PR or podium spot and the typical 5k that people do for fun. A hard 5k can be every bit as challenging as a longer race.

I agree and disagree... they can both be hard, but I never questioned whether or not I would finish a 5k, where I had to use some mental skills in marathons...

Sure, but for a 5k simple completion isn't the goal. I would have considered it a total failure if I couldn't run within, let's say, a minute of my PR. Like if I knew I was already way behind by mile 2 I would have shut it down and jogged in since there is no need to bury myself. I would have considered that a DNF in my mind even if I did "cross the finish line".

I agree, and I still feel like it was an accomplishment (scratch that off the bucket list!). It's just that relative to a tri, full or half marathon (even an honest, all out 10k for time), it's not nearly as physically demanding. I think the perception is due to a very well done marketing campaign by the Tough Mudder company; kudos to them. They sell it like it's the final exam to SEAL school, and I think that's how it's viewed by a lot of people.

The point I was trying to make is that many of the people I've talked to about exercise in general seem to view a Tough Mudder as some kind of fitness pinnacle. In my opinion, it's really something that most people who aren't obese or have a health condition or physical disability could accomplish with a minimum of preparation. The group I ran it with weren't heavily into exercise, didn't train or prepare outside of a couple trips to the gym and a few moderate runs, and they finished with no problem.

I didn't mean to trivialize it at all, I had more fun doing that than almost any race I've ever done, and if it gets people off the couch, bonds a group of coworkers together, or even makes for a great story over beers, it's a good thing. It's just one of my pet peeves that the thing I put the least amount of effort into is the thing that most impresses people.

I've never heard one condescending remark in the 10 years. Probably because I've never brought it up at work.

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Remember - It's important to be comfortable in your own skin... because it turns out society frowns on wearing other people's

That's sad.

Dear OP, I think this is an interesting thread title, which is why I clicked on it. My responses will be tacked on to some other useful response below. I just wanted to give you a thumbs up since the fastest people out of the gate on this one seemed to be feeling a bit bitchy this morning.

So, serious question here. Where IS it ok to wear all the darn shirts you get at each race? I've started saying no thanks when handed one at packet pick-up and always have some in my charitable donation pile.

Apparently you can't wear it to another race? And certainly not to work. How about to work out, is that ok? Or does that also make one an egotistical D-bag?

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To breathe, to feel, to know I'm alive.

I don't know. Honestly the teck shirts I wear as layers under a jacket in cold weather, yard shirts, etc. Hoodies get worn around the house on occaision. Also, its one thing to wear a shirt. It's another to see a husband wife couple picking up their packet for the local charity sprint tri in matching Boston hats, full Boston track suits, shirts, shoes and IM socks. At that point Why not just wear your finishers medal too, or just carry around a sign that reads "IM AWESOME". It's ridiculous behaviour.

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Long Chile was a silly place.

Whenever you feel like it. I got a lot more important things to worry about other than people making snide comments about my attire.

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Proud Member of Chris McDonald's 2018 Big Sexy Race Team "That which doesn't kill me, will only make me stronger"
Blog-Twitter-Instagram-Race Reports - 2018 Races: IM Florida 70.3, IM Raleigh 70.3, IM 70.3 World Championships - South Africa, IM North Carolina 70.3

Sounds like you need new friends :)

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Rodney
TrainingPeaks | Altra Running | RAD Roller
http://www.goinglong.ca

I'm not gonna lie, I've been known to wear the finisher's medal all day after a race. It's like a "Tiara" for grownups, lol.

I've got 2:

"You really think you can finish that?" (in reference to my first full IM)
"You should go for Boston. Well, that pace is probably a stretch anyway."

I'll confess this last one bothers me based on the baggage I carry, which is my interpretation that the things I enjoy and chose to do are not as worthwhile as the things my father suggests are better, with 'better' being based on the meaning I take away from his non-stop bringing up of activities that are similar to but not actually the ones I am interested in. Clearly there's nothing wrong with the words 'you should go for Boston'. But man, does it rub me wrong.

---

To breathe, to feel, to know I'm alive.

I'm just going to leave this here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=THNPmhBl-8I

I really is not that hard for many.

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Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

Boom Nutrition code 19F4Y3 $5 off 24 pack box | Bionic Runner | PowerCranks | Velotron | Spruzzamist

Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep

What are you saying here? I really...do you mean 'it'?

What's even easier than an IM is a sprint or Olympic distance race.

LMFAO, that is one of funniest things I've ever seen. I'll see your video and raise you this one, about a guy named Speedo:)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tbfbj6Y2Mss

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"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."

Wow....you're cool. I bet you p*ss awesome sauce, too.

---

Chicago Cubs - 2016 WORLD SERIES Champions!!!!

"If ever the time should come, when vain and aspiring men shall possess the highest seats in government, our country will stand in need of its experienced patriots to prevent its ruin." - Samuel Adams

Nope, I'm a pretty normal dude. BCtrigirl regularly podiums her races, so she could brag if she wanted to, but we are both quiet people who don't understand why some feel the need to make the choice to scream "HEY EVERYONE IN CASE YOU DIDNT KNOW I RAN BOSTON" with their choice of clothing.

Like most things in life, do what you want, identify however you want, but for gods sake try to be a bit humble about it.

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Long Chile was a silly place.

I do not seek social acceptance when I engage in Ironman racing, therefore I do not even know about the ones you are listing. I am deaf to people's comments entirely. They have no effect on me at all. I recommend the same to you. Find the reasons from inside and let the motivation be intrinsic. You will never bring this up again in social forums, there will be no need.

Some people are proud of their accomplishments. Why mock them for it? It's no different than folks with a M-dot tattoo. It's a form of self expression.

Just in your post, you are backdoor bragging that BCtrigirl regularly podiums her races. One can also say that maybe you should have been more humble and not put that statement in. Pot calling the kettle black, no?

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__________________________________________________________________________
My marathon PR is "under three, high twos. I had a two hour and fifty-something."

you are backdoor bragging that BCtrigirl regularly podiums her races..

I don't think you understand what a backdoor brag actually is...

---

Swimming Workout of the Day:

Favourite Swim Sets:

2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly

What are you saying here? I really...do you mean 'it'?

"I" is the only word that matters. The rest is probably typos.

these are all true

---

Eric Reid AeroFit | Instagram Portfolio
Aerodynamic Retul Bike Fitting

“You are experiencing the criminal coverup of a foreign backed fascist hostile takeover of a mafia shakedown of an authoritarian religious slow motion coup. Persuade people to vote for Democracy.”

You just need inspiring responses... Suggestions below.

"Ironman isn't as tough as everyone claims... right?" Yeah... but eating all those donuts during training sure was tough. Oof! This one time, I had to eat 3!!!
"You train when you feel like it... right? " {you don't actually have to sacrifice time} Totally! So long as training doesn't get in the way of my donut eating.
"You aren't really swimming because you wore a wetsuit" The wetsuit was just to keep my donuts dry. Next time I think I'm going to get a bigger one though, because they kinda got a little smushed.
"You had a long day out there." {compared to everyone else} I'm a slower donut eater than most. I'm really working on my speed-eating though. How about we go for a training trip to Dunkin'?
"Your time isn't improving so why bother doing more" You are so right... maybe this Ironman silliness really isn't going to help me eat more donuts. Thanks for the tip!
"I am sure if I trained I'd finish one too" Heck yeah! How about we go to Dunkin and then go do an easy breezy HIM? Those don't really need any training at all.

#1 remark for IM and ultra runners: "you guys are crazy". This one marginalizes the accomplishment by twisting into something more akin to a personality disorder vs. an achievement requiring great sacrifice, discipline and determination. I haven't done a full IM and it's not likely I ever will but not because I am sane, rather because I don't think I have the other attributes.

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�Bloom wherever you are planted"

It's funny and ironical that all the ST internet toughguys in here talk shit about boston gear and Mdot tats, but I have yet to see anyone talk shit to anyone wearing said boston gear and or Mdot tats at any race or event I have ever been to. The speedo wearing, shaven leg tri crowd just doesn't invoke fear into anyone in person........shocker

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"I would definitely smell her seat after a century ride"

I totally get what you're trying to convey. It's an attempt to diminish someone's accomplishment (albeit passive-aggressively). A close friend recently completed his first marathon, which took over 6.5 hours. I'm not going to pile on and tell him anyone can run-walk 26 miles like some of our other friends did (most of whom don't even run). Instead, just congratulated him on the effort and encouraged him to keep at it.

thats a great link Dilbert :)

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I edit my posts, a lot.

That is correct. Old ladies do them. Old men do them. People who can't even walk do them. Fat people do them.

Thousands have completed 140.6 triathlons. How tough could it be?*


Yup. When I did them I train when I feel like it. And I feel like training 9-16 hours per week.


Yeah, that's fairly accurate.


In my book doing anything for more than 8 hours is a long day.


Yeah, man. What's the deal? How come you aren't getting any faster? Maybe you need a new bike.


Yeah. If you train for it you an finish one. Do you think you're special in some way that makes you believe that only a few people are capable of training and completing an IM?

Do you have an M-dot tattoo?






*Doing it in under 9 hours is really tough.

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Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

I believe you get the award for most creative response, but you are shorting Krispy Kreme with your focus on Dunkin. I'd go with KK over DD any day, but maybe that's b/c I grew up in Carolina. KK has their HQ at Greensboro, NC:)

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"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."

+1. No need to make comments to people's faces (and I think some people on here are misinterpreting your post in that manner).

>> It's the "Tall Poppy Syndrome". >>

knowing that, you're one of them bloody Oz's , eh ?? :-)

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RayGovett
Hughson CA
Be Prepared-- Strike Swiftly -- Who Dares Wins- Without warning-"it will be hard. I can do it"

Well...my wife is.

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My business-eBodyboarding.com

>>Like most things in life, do what you want, identify however you want, but for gods sake try to be a bit humble about it. >




How very Canadian of you ,sir. :-)

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RayGovett
Hughson CA
Be Prepared-- Strike Swiftly -- Who Dares Wins- Without warning-"it will be hard. I can do it"

?? about 1980s era expression if I recall ??

---

RayGovett
Hughson CA
Be Prepared-- Strike Swiftly -- Who Dares Wins- Without warning-"it will be hard. I can do it"

these people wouldnt comment as much if ironman/marathon standards in usa werent so low.

For instance in roth, cut off is 15 hours - no matter who you are. Many marathons shutdown at 5:30 after the start - no matter your wave.

Unfortunately this is classic Slowtwitch. Life is too short to worry about judgmental people like you. Now people have to worry about what they wear to races just in case someone like you is going to disapprove?! Jeez... You would die if you went to a NASCAR race. All those posers! C'mon man. Some people love everything about the sport, including the swag, the medals, the race momorabilia, the apparel, everything. They are FANS of the sport and they love to wear it on their sleeve. Some even get tatoos, which I think is crazy, but hell who am I to tell them how fanatical they can or can't be about their sport. You come across as insecure since you obviously are making careful, meticulous decisions as to what you wear to races. "We wouldn't want to offend anybody! Goodness no..."

Let people enjoy their sport however they like. We'll never grow the sport if we don't let ourselves and others be fanatical about it without passing judgment about every little thing.

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http://dontletitdefeatyou.blogspot.com

I don't think you can infer that those who wear an all-IM or all Boston attire are necessarily "bigger fans" than the guys who do not wear said attire. The IM/Boston folks are simply more show-off-ish, that's all. I think BC makes a valid point but I know how it is, gotta let people do what they wanna do, as long as they're not hurting anyone else:)

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"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."

I must have missed something, these are all truisms...

---

===============
Proud member of the MSF (Maple Syrup Mafia)

+1 and thanks! If triathletes where I live had BCtriguy's attitude I wouldn't be in this sport.

One time I often wear finisher shirts is when I go to out of town tris - amazing the people you meet because they saw the shirt and said 'are you racing tomorrow?' or 'how did you go yesterday?'

I wish more people were interested in triathlon tho i do get good comments when it does come up but I wish people would wanna talk about it more and were interested in everything it's about

Don't worry this has been going on for a long time. Triathlons for some reason are supposed to be this secret thing that if you want to talk about them to other people you're a loser and a typical triathlete. I've never seen this in another sport or any other activity I've ever done. I know some people go overboard and talk about every since training day they have ever had. But overall I don't at all understand this attitude when it comes to this sport.

 in my experience from observing others do this, there are 2 main situations where the non-triathlete glazes over and loses interest, or tries to knock you down a peg. Assuming that the nontriathlete isn't just an asshole.

1) you are just using tri (or whatever sport) as a way of bragging and propping yourself over your audience.
2) you get overly technical and lose them.

If you keep it fun and relevant to the audience, then there is rarely any backlash. No one gives a fuck what your FTP is, they don't even know what that means. Wanna tell them how much your �ber super bike costs? Mention that you've put off getting a new car for 2 years to be able to afford it.

Do that, and you can talk about just about anything with anyone.

---

Swimming Workout of the Day:

Favourite Swim Sets:

2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly

I'd say lots of people remember they used to be athletic in their teens and twenties, but are in denial they're fat and out if shape. Hearing you talk about finishing an ironman probably make them feel shitty about them selves. Keep in mind most people don't even know how long a marathon is, so even less will appreciate what's involved in completing an ironman.

I ran a local 5mile race on Thanksgiving. After the race, to stray warm, I looked for a jacket in the car. It just happened that the only one I found was my Boston jacket. So, there I was, at a local Turkey Trot that didn't have chip timing or corrals, rocking my jacket. I thought about it for a few minutes, hoping I wasn't "that dude" at the local race. But then, I thought about my accomplishment, and the fact that I had done a bunch of training and lifestyle changes, and I also thought about keeping warm, so I soon dropped the thought. Besides, several other dudes were wearing their teq kit from Boston.

These days, I wear the teq shirts I get at local races, mostly because I'm a cheapskate and don't want to spring for other shirts. I'm still using an old IM finisher hat for training because I'm not going out to buy other non-logo hats so I don't look pretentious.

I mostly swim these days. Everybody needs to realize that goody bag items for swimming completely blow compared to road races or triathlons. Usually the gifts are latex caps that last a few days. I know Euro and international races give away silicon caps. I just do my "bragging" in the pool by wearing caps I was given: the 2006 Australian Pan-Pacs team cap or the Stanford cap. Again, gifts, since I'm a cheapskate. I think of it like wearing a team's baseball cap.

Pretty much this.

I guess I'm fortunate that all of the people I run into are generally impressed with what I've accomplished. For most of them, just finished a 5k would be hard, so they can barely comprehend the distance and understand how much training that must take.

Maybe the difference is my approach. I don't initiate the conversation, they do and I pay attention to my audience and try and stay relatively modest. People respond better to modesty than self promotion. But I do still get a little swept away at times in my own pride...it happens.


I've also been guilty this week of knocking down the tall poppies that are known as Iowa Football fans. Just can't help myself. On the flip side, I'm not sure I'd be bragging about a 12-0 season that hasn't included at top ranked opponents is the smartest thing either. Its like the poppy yelling 'hey look at me, I'm taller than all of you!". Maybe that's what occurred to the OP, even if they didn't realize it.

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TrainingBible Coaching
http://www.trainingbible.com

I wear them mainly working out in warm weather or the gym. Occasionally when out and about. Funny thing is that 1/2 the time i wear them in public, someone stops and talks to me about it.

I look at it this way, I spend a lot of time, money and energy competing, why not promote it a little. No different that guys that hunt and fish wearing related clothing, or people wearing college or pro sports gear.

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TrainingBible Coaching
http://www.trainingbible.com

Not at all. Most people who know us don't know specifics about our athletic accomplishments (or in my case, lack thereof ;) ). I mentioned it here because it's a board that discusses these things. That's not exactly a backdoor brag. I was using her performance as an example.

It's one thing to be proud, which is a normal, healthy feeling to have when you overcome a challenge, or set a goal and follow through with it. It's another entirely to broadcast that pride out to every other person around you. How you choose to do that says something about you. No one is coordinating their whole outfit because they have a warm fuzzy feeling about having run Boston. It's narcissistic, plain and simple.

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Long Chile was a silly place.

I know a lot of people who have finished an ironman. They never mention it . Who are you referring to ? Most people who train at that level are very nice humble people.

ericmulk wrote:

The IM/Boston folks are simply more show-off-ish, that's all.

So are you saying that in your world, people should not wear Boston or IM gear anywhere at any time? I wear them whenever I feel like: to work out, go to the store, go out to eat, etc.


Most of them are nice shirts, why would I want to just leave them in the closet all the time? I don't disparage people who wear a shirt they got when they visited Rio or Hong Kong or something like that which I have never done.



Well not a whole outfit, but I will wear the stuff because I have a warm fuzzy feeling about the race. I thought those races were great and enjoyed them immensely. If you did not, well I guess different opinions is what makes the world go round.

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Proud Member of Chris McDonald's 2018 Big Sexy Race Team "That which doesn't kill me, will only make me stronger"
Blog-Twitter-Instagram-Race Reports - 2018 Races: IM Florida 70.3, IM Raleigh 70.3, IM 70.3 World Championships - South Africa, IM North Carolina 70.3

I always remind myself that I don't get a paycheck for this. I'm doing for the love of the sport.

Well said Dev.

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What I do: http://app.strava.com/athletes/345699

You're taking my comment out of context, but perhaps i did not sufficiently explain: in BC's original comment he made the distinction between just wearing a shirt and wearing a whole outfit with hat, shirt, jacket, and pants all saying Boston, IM, or whatever. Neither BC nor I are saying that there's anything wrong with wearing one item of clothing at a time but rather it's the over-done complete outfit.

I wear T-shirts, sweatshirts, jackets, etc, all the time that have some relation to my various athletic, educational, and/or military endeavors but generally just one at a time:)

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"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."

When people bring up that I am an Ironman athlete, I would never bring it up, I always say "Ironman is not as tough as everyone thinks it is, have you ever considered doing one?". I have really only been slightly offended once when someone said in a very specific negative tone, "why would anyone do an Ironman?". Clearly they had never crossed that line.

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At thanksgiving my brother in law asked me what my marathon time was (for my ironman)- then proceeded to tell me how much faster his stand alone marathon time was ..... (the one marathon he completed 20'years - and I would guess 50 pounds- ago).

I just congratulated him and took a bit more wine & turkey.

 
Nice NYT article about Imposter Syndrome today:
[http://www.nytimes.com/...ytimes&smtyp=cur]

I'm wondering if you might have the opposite of that? And if so, what might it be called?

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Sharon McN
@IronCharo
#TeamZoot
Clif Bar Pace Team 2003-2018

Love the connection here. The opposite of the Impostor Syndrome is Dunning-Kruger effect:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/...unning�Kruger_effect

I had to double check to make sure I wasn't reading an article in The Onion. Thanks for the excellent info! I had no idea there was a name for that.

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Sharon McN
@IronCharo
#TeamZoot
Clif Bar Pace Team 2003-2018

You are interrupting these statements wrong, you should use it as a educational session for non-triathletes. e.g.

"Ironman isn't as tough as everyone claims... right?"

It all depends were you are coming from, how old you are and what you are willing to overcome. It's a personal thing only the individual can experience. last race I was on pace till the run because I over biked to be on pace.

"You train when you feel like it... right? " {you don't actually have to sacrifice time}

That depends on your goals and what you think the challenge deserves. just like running a 5 km very fast takes more commitment then just finishing a marathon triathlon is the same. When I am not training though I spend lot of time typing on triathlon forums and looking at bikes that would make me faster if I was a better biker, so I am limited for time.

"You aren't really swimming because you wore a wetsuit"

of course a wetsuit makes you faster just like runners improve running over slippers or dress shoes. you have to have the right gear for the sport. That's why the top coaches tell you to train in rubber shorts and with paddles because it can get tough.

"You had a long day out there." {compared to everyone else}

Yeah it is a tough race with no guarantee I can finish. That's why it motivates me I have to deal with new adversity every time. BUT I GOT MY MONEYS WORTH.

"Your time isn't improving so why bother doing more"

It doesn't need to be, but improving helps people enjoy the pursuit more. this sport is a life style and every day I wake up with goals knowing I need to focus daily on maintaining health and the race is just a date to make sure I stay focused. If I wanted to get really fast I would get latex tubes and a disc cover, then I can train less and spend more time looking up bike aerodynamics.

"I am sure if I trained I'd finish one too"

YOU COULD and Believe me it will give you just as much pleasure every day making yourself healthier and goal oriented. The test of an Ironman isn't in the finish but in daily with the daily build and obstacles you will face because in a 8 plus hours day noting will go perfectly and you be challenged.

if you want to more about getting started I can help refer you to a great website where forum posters help boost beginners confidence and expand the sport to new athlete is call... and if you give your opinion they are very supportive if it doesn't match their own views.

Any others?[/quote]
Lots like how do you spend so much time on a bike. I am good at it how do you sent 3 hours in a mall or 3 hours watching crappy TV.
That sport is so expensive. NO it isn't, these sports are expensive golf, skiing, boating. I pay nothing to train daily.
I could never do that. That's what I thought but you have to look at is as small improvements that add up not at the big picture.

Please don't reply this is my opinion and I don't care what your opinion is..... this is meant to be funny and educational about including people into the discussion on your sport and helping people understand that anyone can do it and anyone can become obsessed with it too.

When someone asks you a question or makes a statement about triathlon and you blow them off like it's not important you are the elitist that is a jerk because you don't want to include them in the sport or discussion. Please want to know more include them and show them your pictures and tell your stories.

.

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Technique will always last longer then energy production. Improve biomechanics, improve performance.
http://Www.anthonytoth.ca, triathletetoth@twitter

It must be tough being that big of a sensitive sally.

Can you not tell the difference between wearing a race shirt somewhere and the situation I was previously discussing?

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Long Chile was a silly place.

I wear my race shirts anywhere I want, make sure you call me out on it next time I am signing in for the local sprint. Any other of your rules I should follow.

I even talk about my hobby without stressing about it, just like the guys who play golf have a chat about what they did on the weekend, and nobody stresses or cares either way

Mike Rossi?

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"What's your claim?" - Ben Gravy
"Your best work is the work you're excited about" - Rick Rubin

Jeez, some of you guys are being real babies about this.

Wear your race shirts to a job interview for all I care. I wont call you out on it, because it really doesn't matter. I just think people who over do it look ridiculous and mainly do it out of narcissism. Do you 'call out' everyone you come across who you think is doing something that looks ridiculous, but is otherwise harmless? I sure don't. That doesn't change the fact that I still think it looks ridiculous though.

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Long Chile was a silly place.

Jesus Christ, thank you. It's amazing how people will take "I think it's ridiculous when people dress up from socks to hat in Boston gear" and somehow translate that in to "No one should ever wear race clothing or talk about their involvement in triathlon ever outside of an actual triathlon event".

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Long Chile was a silly place.

This thread makes you sound ridiculous

To people who are taking what I'm saying largely out of context. I can live with that.

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Long Chile was a silly place.

So race shirts are OK, head-to-toe gear is not.....can you please illuminate us as to the break even point so people don't offend you at your next event?

Is it just a single piece of garb that is deemed acceptable, but anything over that is uncool? What if they mix-and-match....an IM shirt and a Boston hat (or vice versa)....what's the ruling there?

/pink

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Chicago Cubs - 2016 WORLD SERIES Champions!!!!

"If ever the time should come, when vain and aspiring men shall possess the highest seats in government, our country will stand in need of its experienced patriots to prevent its ruin." - Samuel Adams

It depends:
1 piece of IM gear is ok
2 is a stretch
3 is a NO NO

Now, I have not BQ'd or KQ'd so, in my eyes, Kona/Boston branded stuff is ok to wear up to 2 pieces (each individually) 3 or (mix/match). Any more than that, and there is a risk that the room may spontaneously combust because of the wearers awesomeness.

On one hand I am a believer that a real gangster that doesn't need to flex nuts because a real gangster know he's got them.

But then on the other hand you are pretty much drawing a line in the sand under the premise that people who do this are narcissists and I don't need to do this because i'm all warm and fuzzy on the inside. Which is a bit narcissistic in its own right, you can't understand everybody's motivations nor can you just make blanket statements that put you on the side of being well rounded without it being a bit self serving. And I'm not giving you crap about it because its pretty normal to do so. I have one friend who has to let facebook know he went to the gym every single time he goes. I judge, I ignore.

Side note, I did an IM and I bought a shirt, a baby hat (this was an inside joke) and a decal at the expo. Since then I have received a hoodie, lanyard, and a running beanie as gifts. Now, my son seems to have claimed the shirt and my wife has worn the hoodie on numerous occasions so I have no idea if I'll get either of those back but the point is some people buy themselves a ton of stuff and for some its gifts. And really, if I show up to my local sprint with M-dot backpack, which I will because its nicer than my current back pack, thats ok I think. It'll hopefully draw attention from my m-dot tattoo which I only have because other mother fuckers need to know. They need to KNOW!

I wear my ironman backpack everywhere I go to uni so it's just my backpack don't wear anything else but I did deck out head to toe in im gear the first day so I could meet athletes in my class.. Worked now a cute girl sits next to me in my math class and talks to me about endurance !!! So fuck all of you it's all good discussion over I talk to people about triathlon I'm swagged the fuck out I'm awesome I crush the im inflate my ego plz thanks we're a superior breed just accept it

Glad to hear you don't actually openly make snide comments at packet pickups to people who look ridiculous but otherwise harmless. I like to see people celebrate their sporting achievements (up to the point they become boorish 'poor winners'), but each to their own.

8.75/10

(the extra .25 is for quoting the Geto Boyz. OTOH, real gangstas cain't [sic] run fast.)

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_____________________________________
What are you people, on dope?

—Mr. Hand

I actually don't get this very much. I hear way more of :

"Oh ironman. That's so hard I don't know how anyone could do it"... And "I could never ride (swim / run) that far..."

I actually find myself saying stuff like what you hear back a lot. As in:
Well anyone could do it if they train for it... And
It's a long day but it just takes a commitment to get ready if you want to do one.

Do you see the irony in your response to a complaint that people belittle the accomplishments of endurance athletes by you belittling the accomplishment of other endurance athletes?

Just like triathlons, 5k's, and any other endurance event, there's a difference between completing and competing in obstacle races. I have some athletes who do a combination of running training and strength training specific to the obstacles with the goal of racing as fast as possible. For them, obstacles aren't a "rest break". They're part of the race. They train to blast through them without losing rhythm. Their objective is the fastest time start to finish. It's like a steeple chase with a greater number and variety of obstacles. Try truly racing one some time, and you'll find them on par with other endurance events. No harder or easier. Just different.

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____________________________________________
Don Larkin
Reach For More
http://www.reachformore.fit/
USAT Lvl1 Coach, NSCA-CPT, NASM-CPT, BS Exercise Science

Fill in the blank:

The length of this thread is directly proportional to __________________ .

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Hard work beats talent when talent doesn't work hard.

My intent was not at all to belittle the accomplishment, I did one, had a blast, and am proud of the fact. I'm already signed up for next year's, since I had so much fun doing it.

My point is that the perception of what's involved in a Tough Mudder is a lot different than the reality of what's involved, mostly due to hype and slick marketing. The physical ability necessary to complete one is significantly less than a lot of other, less "exotic" activities...(half) Marathons, Triathlons, Century rides, etc.

The TM is difficult in its own ways, but the challenge is more between the ears than in the body. It is intentionally NOT timed, and entrants do not compete for time. There's no penalty for skipping obstacles (you could run around every obstacle on the course, and turn it into essentially a 10-12 mile trail hike), and most of the obstacles are bottlenecks, where you have to wait your turn, sometimes for several minutes at a time, depending on how many are there at the same time.

It's mostly about working as a team, and overcoming mental obstacles, rather than physical ones. There's nothing physically challenging about getting muddy, getting hit by dozens of cattle prods, or going down a slide into a dumpster full of ice water, it's just extremely unpleasant, and getting over that is a big part of the challenge. Most sane people have at least an aversion to these things, some are probably near phobic, but sucking it up and pushing through is to be congratulated.

Again, I'm not slamming or criticizing the event itself...it's probably got more people off the couch than triathlon ever will, and it's a TON of fun to do with a group of friends. I'm just expressing my frustration that the LONG hours I've invested into training for more run of the mill events seems to be trivial when it comes up in conversation, and the event that requires the least amount of training and preparation (physically) makes people think that anyone who finishes is an Olympic tier athlete.

Ask yourself how much harder an IM would be if the last leg were a 26.2 Tough Mudder. It doesn't matter anyway. After all is said and done, the only person that an event's results are important to is the person doing that event. No one else cares.

If it makes someone happy and does not impact you in any significant manner, why care? To quote the brilliant philosopher, Kunu, "Do Less."

That's probably about 80% of the field then...

Likewise. I'm training for my first full IM in March, and whenever people say they couldn't do it, I just tell them that they absolutely could - if they put the time in and aren't injured/in poor health.

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Nicely stated. TR

+1

As you know fulla, I'm waaaay slower than you. The hardest thing for me is living up to my own expectations. I know I should be running at the 30km mark but I am just so FK'd that the simple act of not lying down and crying, is about all I can manage. Walking, and not even briskly, is all I can manage at that point. Looking spectators in the eye and seeing the pain they feel when they look how slowly I'm going just crushes me.

Sure, the physical part of going slow is difficult but the metal anguish I suffer is even worse. I had some good training buddies back in the day. We'd swim train and I'd crush them all. On the bike we'd do bike rides and 1/2 the time I wasn't even the slowest (1/2 the time I was, but I was within sight of them). In standalone marathons I was only 5-10 min behind them. But at IM I'd be anything from 1 to 2-1/2 hours behind them! That was devastating to me. Being useless is bloody hard work let me tell you.

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TriDork

"Happiness is a myth. All you can hope for is to get laid once in a while, drunk once in a while and to eat chocolate every day"

When bumping into an acquaintance prior to IM Boulder last year was asked "you have to train for that?"

Going back to your original comment

It did get misconstrued a bit. We seemed to have missed the "all" in regards to their gear. However, you definitely brought some of this upon yourself, by coming off as snarky and condescending by admitting to enjoying making fun of people.

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Proud Member of Chris McDonald's 2018 Big Sexy Race Team "That which doesn't kill me, will only make me stronger"
Blog-Twitter-Instagram-Race Reports - 2018 Races: IM Florida 70.3, IM Raleigh 70.3, IM 70.3 World Championships - South Africa, IM North Carolina 70.3

It's an interesting discussion. I have more race gear than most as I was a sucker for the expos in the past, but over the last few years of seeing what I don't like about the sport or type of person it can attract, I find it near impossible to wear any IM finisher, Boston jacket, NYC jacket, etc. You'd see me in my local sprint tech shirt now days over anything IM/Boston/Epic related. To each their own for sure but all it takes is knowing some of the darker side of the crowd to tamper one's opinion about wearing all or any of the gear.

What... you don't want to be associated with people like this ?:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3hhAh-BtA0U

That's fair enough. And I'm sure I brought it on myself too by seeming like it's something that really bothers me, or that I "enjoy making fun of these people". Usually what happens (and I'm giving the example of what frequently happens at race pick ups) is we walk by someone, or even better, a couple, in matching head to toe gear from some event, we look at each other, roll our eyes, and carry on with our day. I'm not offended by it. I don't even really care.

Are they, in fact, just a huge fan of the sport? Are they ego maniacs who take themselves and their hobby way too seriously? Some of the people I know personally, having been a part of our endurance community for around a decade, and I know the answer leans towards the latter explanation. Either way, it's really no skin off my back and I don't really care what people do with their clothing. I've done one IM, and I bought a hoodie and a mug. I lounge around in the hoodie once in a blue moon, but I love the mug. I don't think I've ever worn the finishers.

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Long Chile was a silly place.

I think what is getting you into trouble here is comments like "snide remarks" , "roll our eyeballs" etc etc.

Everything else, I think if we were sitting around in a cafe we'd actually agree somewhat with. I'd end up laughing at myself and it would be all fun because I'd likely have some IM branded gear (I did 7 WTC races this year, so you just end up with a lot of their stuff). Right now I am on crutches, and cannot walk across a room on my own. I bought a 2014 IMC Whistler finisher jacket on sale at IMC 2015 because if was a nice jacket on clearout for $50 that said "2014" on it. Unfortunately what I did not realize is that it has this big huge "FINISHER" embroidery on the back. Really I don't need to tell the world I finished the stupid race, if I am wearing the jacket I am because I finished the race. In any case getting around on crutches and my left leg spasming from a nerve problem no one would visually look at me and think I could finish an IM and I don't want anyone talking about it and make snide remarks either on the side. So I don't wear it.

I go to the pool and I wear my Ironman branded swim caps inside out because I dont' want to be "that guy" at the pool. But you know what, right now, the only time I feel like an athlete at the moment is in the pool. So today, I reversed my tradition and put the cap on with "IRONMAN" on the outside. It made me feel like an athlete the moment I was in the pool. 4500m later I crawled out, grabbed the crutches and made it back to the shower, then to my car, back to day to day life....but for 4500m, on this day, putting on the cap one way versus the other way, just made me feel awesome.

In the end, it is a personal journey unique to everyone.

I think what is getting you in trouble is a few comments that tend to caste judgement. Minus the "snide" and "roll the eyeballs" and I think we know the difference between just wearing the gear and "way over the top" and probably a subtle in between. Its like when I go meet guys working at Intel or Microsoft, I don't really want to see them head to toe in corporate gear either, so I THINK we all get the drift of what you are trying to articulate.

Am i allowed to wear my "qualified 70.3 world championship" hat? It fits good, it was free (kinda of), and i like it. I promise if i am allowed to wear it i will not wear my AWA swim cape at the same time when going to pool. Sorry to joke but Paul could not really have said it any better and to each there own.

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2024: Bevoman, Galveston, Alcatraz, Marble Falls, Santa Cruz

I actually don't mind that type of person. It's still a bid deal to do an IM. However, the extent people will go to enhance their performance through PEDs, course cutting, and the 800 pound gorilla knowing as drafting does make me wonder why some people even do this stuff at all.

I don't really see a problem with that statement. There is a big misconception with Joe Public that you have to be ultra-fit to do an Ironman, its almost a con. And I think triathletes allowing non-triathletes to believe this are being deceptive. You do not need to be fit to complete an Ironman in under 17 hours. You can breaststroke the swim, ride at a leisurely pace and then walk the marathon. Although in saying that, if someone is simply saying that in order to denigrate someones achievement, then that is not on.

I think you took things out of context... not like this thread went there either. Anyway heading to your thought...
I know you don't have to be ultra-fit... I finished. But please feel free to demonstrate on your next IM: "You can breaststroke the swim, ride at a leisurely pace and then walk the marathon."

"The bike ride and run would be easy, I just don't have time to train for the swim".

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I guess I just don't like the fact we're conning the public. I get embarrassed when people are in awe of the fact I've done an IM and declare how fit I must be. I'm having to constantly correct them and explain how there are some very unfit and very overweight people competing and completing full Ironmen events.

At best walking when fried is 5 kph. So walking the entire marathon is 8.5 hours right there. Breast stroke the swim is 2 hours, so you're at 10.5 hours. That leaves only 6.5 hours to do the bike. People always use the "walk the run wording" to downgrade late day finishers, but pretty well all late day finshers still have to do a certain amount of running to hit the cut off if they took 9-10.5 hours to get to T2 and then start the run.

Yup... that's what I am saying... 6.5 hours to do the bike, is far from leisure.

I have the opposite problem... people look at me and think oh hey... "I can do one to."

I have never understood the dick-swinging of wearing race or tech or workout gear at packet pick-up.

YOU ARE NOT RACING.
YOU ARE NOT TRAINING.
YOU ARE STANDING ON LINE, OR SITTING AND LISTENING.

Why do you need the wicking fabric or the visor or the waterproof shell?
And yet I'm the guy who sticks out, wearing a polo shirt and jeans.

Do you wear the IM gear while registering for a race on your computer? Be as kinky as you like but otherwise, save it for the race, brah

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_____________________________________
What are you people, on dope?

—Mr. Hand

I probably do wear IM gear when on my computer signing up for races. I'm actually sitting here in a Richmond Marathon shirt and Beach 2 Battleship pajama pants. I have more race gear in my closet than anything else. It's comfortable and it's just what I tend to wear when it doesn't matter what I'm wearing.

So Dev, JOOC since i know you were in the Canadian Air Force, do you think my wearing military oriented stuff is in the same category as the IM stuff??? I don't quite see it as the same as some people think military guys are just dumb asses and/or suckers. OTOH, I am pretty proud of my service since there are lots of people out there who would never volunteer for the service in a million lifetimes.

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"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."

Be proud of it, but it is a little like a physician wearing a stethoscope to a party....

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Swimming Workout of the Day:

Favourite Swim Sets:

2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly

that is gold

Well, i do see your point:)

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"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."

You can wear it, but you should know that it isn't that hard to qualify for the 70.3 worlds

You hit the nail on the head. Exactly how I feel, I've seen some very out of shape people do ironmans. My mom tri friends all day how they could never do one, and I'm like, yes. Yes, you could

Yep. I work with a triathlete, so we gab about training and racing a bit. As for the rest of the co-werkers, they don't understand, they pretend to feign interest. There's one runner in my department of 30 or so, he gets it.

And you sounds like a whiny biatch. Next you'll complain that BC is bullying you.

Go put on your finishers medal and look in the mirror. It will make you feel better.

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How does Danny Hart sit down with balls that big?

oh yea good point, that does really annoy me.

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2024: Bevoman, Galveston, Alcatraz, Marble Falls, Santa Cruz

I don't know what to think here. Could more people physically handle it, complete it in 17 h, than are aware, if they trained? Probably. But I've seen enough "seemingly fit" people dragging bags on wheels behind them (briefcases and, this really gets me, hockey bags) that I kinda wonder how many people are un-lazy enough. That so many people can train to do it is clear from the finishers (myyself included) that don't/didn'tmatch the Iron Joe/Jane physique. But out of the entire population, not many routinely demonstrate the inclination to do much of anything considered physically taxing.

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To breathe, to feel, to know I'm alive.

It's not a matter of fitness, or athletic potential. It's a matter of commitment. Most people could finish an ironman if they really, really wanted to. I've seen extremely overweight people finish, a guy with one leg finish, etc. It's a matter of will.

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Long Chile was a silly place.

Go ahead. Wear the race gear. If it encourages just one person to ask you about endurance sport or take even the vaguest bit of interest in physical activity, it will be worth it. You don't have to hide your interest in endurance sport (but no need to ram it down people's throats either). The race is a start, but it is the conversation you have with them that will be the key. (Hint: it should avoid talk of FTP and endless reminiscence about your own personal achievements). The best advocates for people leading healthier lives are passionate enthusiasts for sport.

COI: MD who sees tons of couch-potatoes every day and tries to encourage them to live better. But I don't wear my stethoscope at parties ;)

There's certainly a difference between capability and motivation.

I've done 6 IM's. Did my last one in 10:45, mid-40's, B effort for each one. People tell me all the time that it's super human or they couldn't do it or whatever. Just not true. I always tell them finishing an IM is not really that difficult per se. 17 hours is a long, long time. I tell them as long as they can swim without drowning and make that cutoff that finishing the last 138.2 miles in 15 hours or so just isn't that difficult. Yes, it would suck to ride for 8 hours and walk for 7 hours or whatever but it would physically not be all that difficult for someone in decent shape.

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Favorite Gear: Dimond | Cadex | Desoto Sport | Hoka One One

Careful. I said this exact same thing in another thread and was skewered and called all sorts of names that would be insulting had they not been made by slowtwitchers. Ironman is religion to some people and unless you are filled with awe at the accomplishment of merely finishing one, you are pissing in their holy water.

I did an IM in 2003. The students at the school.enjoyed asking about training, they would see me swimming at pool , riding bike, running. After the race the local news paper did a small.article on my experience. I taught a sprint triathlon class at the fitness center, after a few years we had a large diverse group of triathletes. I think 7 or 8 of them have finished a IM. Now some of them are coaching a kids running group, some teach swimming, they have a multisport club in town. Their children are active. The LBS has grown.
tuesday: crit
wed. : MTB ride
thurs: pub run and gravel road ride
sat: long road ride
E VERY ONE wear you gear , encourage people to give it a try. Teach a class, organize a small race, invite people to the town training .

What is people's problem? Dont' they understand they should be in awe of your accomplishment and build a small shrine to worship an idol in your name? It is not like a couple thousand people did the exact same thing that same day.

This. ^

You're right. Most people can do it. When asked about how hard the races are, I tell them that training is the hard part, and that racing is the reward for completing the training.

I'd caution the sweeping comments made by some others in this thread, though, that it's easy and everyone can do it. I work with a lot of athletes and personal training clients with health issues that make it very difficult, or in some cases impossible, to beat the cut offs. Personally, I'm much more impressed by my 50 year old female athlete with an artificial hip who we got across the line at Challenge AC in just under 15 hours than I am a healthy person who finishes under 10 hours.

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Don Larkin
Reach For More
http://www.reachformore.fit/
USAT Lvl1 Coach, NSCA-CPT, NASM-CPT, BS Exercise Science

I wont speak for others, but my comments about how finishing an IM is not that great of an accomplishment are specifically addressed to the healthy American of middle age...or in other words, the average IM finisher. I am very impressed by those, like Matt Long, who overcome disability to finish. The most impressive person I met in an IM was a guy who had type 1 diabetes. I have a daughter who lives with that disease, and finishing an IM while dealing with trying to maintain blood sugar seems impossible for me to fathom. I also just cam back from Guatemala and can tell you most people there lack the health, nutrition, time, or money to finish an IM. For some of them, an average day is harder than finishing an IM would be for an average American. So, yes, you are correct that sweeping generalizations are not good. They never are. But the point remains that the accomplishment of finishing an IM is grossly overstated by most of those who have done it (IMHO). But this is human nature. Ever met a lawyer who said law school was easy? Or an accountant to said the CPA exams were simple? We all want to make our accomplishments worthwhile.

Can't be all that tough if you get all butthurt by some lady's relatively innocuous comments.

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Swimming Workout of the Day:

Favourite Swim Sets:

2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly

The first paragraph of my post said pretty much the same thing. Most people can do it physically. The race isn't the hard part. The commitment to completing the training is.

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____________________________________________
Don Larkin
Reach For More
http://www.reachformore.fit/
USAT Lvl1 Coach, NSCA-CPT, NASM-CPT, BS Exercise Science

My mother before my first IM:

mom: "What are the distances?"
me: "2.4 mile swim and a..."
mom: "ARGH! You can't do that!!!"

My boss to his wife after my first IM: "Well I hope he got that out of his system."

(Response not exactly pointed at you, just the one I grabbed to reply)

I agree that the day-in/day-out training is more tediuous than event day, but don�t agree with the �ironman isn�t (that) hard� crowd. There�s got to be a middle ground between Hard and Easy. Just because someone lives a certain lifestyle and does things routinely doesn�t necessarily make doing that thing easy. It may make it� doable? Routine? Manageable? But easy is, to me, not the right word.

My first finish, in >16.5 h, NOT EASY. Even if it was via the �leisurely pace� posited by I-don�t-recall-who. If you�re lucky enough to not know, even as a relatively healthy average American who got regular exercise prior to signing up, it�s f�ing painful to exercise for that long. (Hence why I bought and proudly wore the finishers jacket.) 5 years later and 23 lbs lighter, my most recent finish, <11.5, also not easy. There were plenty of times where I wanted to take my foot off the gas, which would have made the event less taxing and ok, �easier�. But in my opinion, these events are not easy, period, even if the lifestyle that leads to our being able to do them has become routine.

(And now that it is routine, I do feel a bit uncomfortable wearing the finisher jacket, even though I love the jacket itself.)

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To breathe, to feel, to know I'm alive.

Wearing a race shirt while registering for another race or a subsequent race is not narcissistic in my opinion as I don't hate people who wear clothing that shows they have been there and done that. On more than one occasion I have seen someone wearing a race shirt for a race that I was interested in (Savageman), which allowed me to ask about the race itself from someone who had competed in the race. Finding about a race from someone who completed the event is the best intel one can get. I have also given information on races to others when I was asked (IM Augusta), when I wore a race shirt myself.

You take on these sorts of challenges for yourself right?

If that is the case, who cares what others think.

No matter what challenge you take on, there will be a a cohort, who don't care, have no idea how hard the challenge is, or who perhaps feel a bit or a lot of jealousy about what you have done, so they'll lash out with negative comments.

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Steve Fleck @stevefleck | Blog

You're missing a key point of what I've been saying for many posts in this thread.

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Long Chile was a silly place.

The "key point" you were trying to make was a strawman though. Are there *really* people that are decked out head to toe in M-dot logo gear, with a Boston jacket on top? Even if there are, how many of them really are there? Sure if someone was obviously flaunting every piece of M-dot gear, to include his undies, at a sprint-tri packet pickup I might laugh a little too. But I have never seen this mythical creature. I have, however, seen plenty of people wearing a basic M-dot hat... or finishers shirt. And I have no reason to ever question that decision. Why would I? I don't even think I would pay much attention to anyone else unless a particular item catches my eye for some reason.

There certainly are WTC fanbois out there, but I have never actually seen someone dressed as you described in your first post on that subject.

Just stirring the pot a bit, but what about M-Dot tattoos?

Those are the worst... how dare they? Put in all that time training and think they are something special to put a tattoo on them.

Man... after these posts I am just shaking... shaking in my shoes because two years ago I loaned out my Ironman swiss army tool thing to somebody in need. I mean I was boasting... I should had let that guy wait for the next rider to come by. I know better next time.

hey, I am not bashing on memorializing your achievement in some way, I am in a live and let live camp. To each his own, wear what you want do what you want its your body. I do have to say the M-Dot tattoo specifically meaning the logo its self as a form of materialization is a bit strange to me, not the tattoo aspect, for that I say do whatever you want but simply the fact that in the end the M-Dot is a company logo no different then the Gatorade G or Nike swoosh.
But again I say to each his own, who am I to bash on someone else taste.

wow... you didn't catch my sarcasm. I was working with you not against you.

I see them the same way I would a huge football fan with an NFL tattoo.

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Long Chile was a silly place.

I have spotted the mythical creature in the wild. Walking to the car after a popular local sprint tri this year a couple came past me. Both were sporting the Ironman backpacks and sweatshirts despite it being 85 degrees. To complete the ensemble, they also had matching calf M-dot tattoos. He was also decked out in an Ironman visor and shorts. She had on an Ironman cap.They shot a scornful look our way as another "softcore" tri person and myself were discussing the weird vibe coming from the hardcore tri people around us.

Don't worry, they were either:

A) trying to figure out how to harvest the fun gene from you and your fellow competitors

B) feigning scorn at the smashfest you laid down, but secretly wondering how you did it

Either way they want you, primal style.

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Swim. Overbike. Walk.

It might be human nature for some, but these people are being deceptive. It's one thing to perhaps understate or exaggerate something, but you are misleading someone when you give the impression something is difficult when it's easy.. Anyone that asks me about IM, I tell them it's not that hard and you don't have to be particularly fit to do one. I'm embarrassed by the narcissism and egotism, prevalent in this sport, something that has been exacerbated by social media such as Facebook. I understand there are people with disabilities or people that have overcome great hardship to complete an IM, they have my utmost respect, it's the rest of the muppets that do a bit of half-arsed training and then run around declaring how legendary they are for completing an IM.

I think the comparison only holds true if they played in the NFL.

Or if they play pick up football on weekends.

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Long Chile was a silly place.

Touche :)

Dude, I got your back, but you may not want to log in for a while unless you have thin skin.l When I said the same thing, with a slightly less aggressive tone, I was called everything from a douchebag to an elitist. I was even attacked just because I was a lawyer.As I mentioned above, a lot of people here on ST fall into that "ironman is a lifestyle" crap. This seems especially true for the frequent posters. This means when you suggest ironman is not special, they feel you are attacking their lifestyle. Of course, IM is just a microcosm of our society. The prevalence of the "look at me" stickers on our cars (full disclosure, I even had MDOT sticker on my old car. Left them it when I bought my new car) celebrating such incredible accomplishments as a half marathon or a century ride. You know...a decent training day. So...good luck with making friends in the forum. Just know, a lot more probably agree with you than you thinkn.

It's not the difficulty level you are choosing to ascribe to completing an Ironman that is the issue here. It's the fact you're trying to rate it at all on behalf of others.

Do you really tell people that an Ironman "isn't that hard"?
What does that statement mean?
It's not hard compared to what?
Are you talking about the training, the event or achieving a certain standard?
What IS that hard?

You're talking about very subjective material as though it's black and white and you know the answer. It's not and you don't.

Compared to the vast majority of endurance sports events Ironman is "hard" in so far as it requires a large total energy expenditure and if untrained it will most likely hurt, a lot, for an extended period of time. That doesn't mean most reasonably fit people couldn't complete one. It does mean they will need to train if they intend to reduce the likelihood of suffering and injury on the day. Maintaining a consistent and effective training plan to prepare to do an Ironman well is surely "hard" if you're not already an athlete. If you don't prepare I think finishing is a hell of an achievement albeit a somewhat foolish one IMO.

So again, regarding my queries above. If you don't think Ironman is hard, what IS hard? Here's a list of some endurance sport events. Feel free to rate them all by hardness. However you rate them it will miss the point. What matters is who they are, how they live, why they're doing it, how they train, how they perform on the day and how they feel. What doesn't matter is how hard you think any of these events are.....

• 5k
• 10k
• Sprint Triathlon
• Half marathon
• 100km cycle
• 5km swim
• Olympic triathlon
• 160km cycle
• Marathon
• Ironman 70.3
• Ironman
• English Channel Swim
• Iditarod
• Ultra-Trail du Mont-Blanc
• Double Ultratriathlon
• Triple Ultratriatlon
• ...
• ...
• ...
• Triple Deca Ultratriathlon

At what point do you think it gets "hard" or is this just a silly meaningless question?

Perhaps my syntax is sloppy. I should not be saying it is not "hard." Perhaps it is. I guess I mean, it is not remarkable. Because the mere act of finishing one is not. And keep in mind, my point has always been about "finishing." Racing a 5k can be a remarkable accomplishment. Walking a marathon for the average healthy person, is not.

Pretty meaningless question. Everyone has their own challenges and constraints, that could make any event on that list the hardest for them. Personally, a 5k/10k are the most painful and/or hardest events on that list. I'm much more impressed by a 15 minute 5k time than I am by a 15x IM finisher. Of course, the longer events are challenging due to the mental stamina needed, so I'm not knocking those either.

Iditarod is in a class of its own.

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-Andrew

In the sense that almost any able bodied person can choose to train for an Ironman and complete, yes it's not "that hard". Anyone can do it.

The fat guy on the couch is going to say "no way" because in that state of course it is impossible. Nobody is going to be able to complete an Ironman off the couch. However it is true that simple completion is possible for any able bodied person (and some non-able-bodied people). 17 hours is a long time. I am not at all saying we should lower that time. Just that the time limits set by the sport are such that anyone can do this with appropriate training. Appropriate training doesn't even need to be all that ridiculous in terms of a time sink. Other than going out regularly for a swim, a bike and a run almost every day of the week, and some longer stuff on the weekends, it really is not that great a burden on your time to train for basic completion.

Now if you are talking about going under 12 hours? 11? 10? That will require hard training.

Why are there nothing but endurance events on this list? No high standards for a 100, high jump, broad jump, 2:10 marathon, steeplechase, benchpress, etc? That is what the people are saying. To "finish" one of these events on your list does not require outstanding or elite athletic ability. It does require an outstanding commitment to training and fitness. Well, some are saying it does not require elite fitness either. I would argue with that. Now to podium is a different story.

I have never understood the "tough mentally" argument either. Compared to other sports what makes endurance sports harder mentally other than the duration? There is no opponent blocking your path to success. They might be ahead of you, but they cannot do a single thing to impede your progress. You control your whole race. You can take breaks whenever you feel like it. There is no "400lb gorilla you are fighting." Not like a real boxing match where you are getting throttled and are just trying to survive to the next break or time out. Or the other team has just went on a run and now you are down by 20 or a couple of touchdowns and no matter what you try, nothing is working.

People always want to laugh at the obstacle runs. Take some of those obstacles, make them a little more difficult, sprinkle them around the endurance events, make them a no completion/out of the event and you will prevent a lot of competitors from finishing the race. I've seen it happen too many times. Without help, many people cannot make it over a marine hurdle or an 8ft wall. They can't even jump high enough to grab the top of the wall, particularly after 10 miles of running or 30 miles on the bike. They can't can't climb a rope and ring the bell.(I can't do that one. Put that out there and I would never get past it.) Start putting stuff out there that require some varied athletic ability and see how many people finish those.

Listen to youself, "anyone can do this with appropriate training"... so not anyone can do this... anyone with appropriate training.
Now, "...a swim, a bike and a run almost every day of the week, and some longer stuff on the weekends." ... this is not normal for 99.999% of the population. Is it due-able... ya... but a stretch to do the training for most, just like I could win a Nobel Prize... I just need to put in the time... in other words that level of commitment is ridiculous for most. And that is my point... I put in time and effort to complete this thing, I don't need some shmuck trying to degrade it because they feel threatened by it. This is my hobby, other people have wood making hobbies... do I insult them. Do you?

It is a silly meaningless question. Any race is as hard as you want to make it. People that think 5ks are easy are not running 5ks right.

Dude watch your own condescension. I didn't say it wasn't a big accomplishment. I just said that it wasn't "that hard". There is a difference. I am pointing out that anyone (with some exceptions for physical limitations) is capable of doing it. There is a commitment to training even at a minimal level, but it is a commitment anyone can make and anyone can accomplish. That doesn't mean everyone will want to, most people think it is stupid. To those of us that don't, it is important.

It is also not "that hard" to get yourself a bachelor's degree. You simply have to go to school for 4 years. That doesn't mean the school work is not hard at times, and it requires a big commitment to get it done, but in the end the actual process of getting a degree is not that hard. Same with Ironman. Anyone who is willing to put in a reasonable amount of work can finish it. Now, someone who has no idea what that really means telling you this is an idiot.

I am not trying to degrade your accomplishments at all. I, too, work my ass off for ironman races but I am also racing them (as opposed to completing) so my perspective is perhaps skewed. I still enjoy the "pre-midnight" show at an IM finish line even though I am long ago cleaned up, changed and fed by that point.

I've done two IM and they were "that hard" for me.

Completed Ironman... other people's condescending remarks

When you step outside the relatively small endurance sports community, and into the general population, it's not uncommon to encounter a general incredulity about what you/we do. Keep in mind when most average people are asked what is the #1 challenge in their day to day lives they say they don't have enough time for things. Most say this about fitness and physical activity - even in the face of deteriorating health, due to inactivity, most will say, "I don't have time for that"

So when you match that up with the dropping of the fact that you just did an Ironman, the average joe & jane, is incredulous, that you would have 5, 10 15 or more hours/week to devote to training for something like that! For some depending on their mood or state of mind, they may even be a bit hostile and angry, that a peer of theirs, can somehow manage to find the time and energy in the week to do that.

Note, I'm not agreeing with those folks, just getting a bit inside their brain.

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Steve Fleck @stevefleck | Blog

They should be. I know that kinda contradicts my post right above.

I agree with you.
That is why I compared IM to people with other hobbies. They put in the time to do their thing... I praised them. I put in the time to do mine... I get ridiculed.

Would the people ridiculing you over IM also ridicule a numismatist? I would assume they would for spending so much time fussing over "stupid coins". Some people have nothing better to do than to irritate others. Some people genuinely think that only THEIR way of life/daily routine is the appropriate one. Best you can do is ignore them.

I tend not to bring up racing or IM unless I am hanging with other people that do it. But if someone brings it up, I have never had anyone tell me the things you have heard. It does seem weird for anyone to say that about anyone's hobby.

Thank you.
I posted the thread just to vent. I don't make a big deal about it with those around me. I stay quiet about it. But it comes to me. I even change the subject. But over the holiday... it got to be too much. I need support, not belittlement. So, I would compromise and take nothing... but that is not how it works.

That is why I compared IM to people with other hobbies. They put in the time to do their thing... I praised them. I put in the time to do mine... I get ridiculed.

I keep coming back to the time-availability thing. Most have nearly zero free time( or so they say) You have to be careful what you say and where you say it. Even within my own family and circle of friends - there are people/families with 3 or 4 kids, and two demanding careers on the go. They might have a few hours here or there, but they choose to spend that on charitable pursuits and volunteering - is this the right person or place to drone on and on about 5 hour bike rides?

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Steve Fleck @stevefleck | Blog

Ironman is a solo athletic endurance event and I was attempting to compare it with other athletic endurance events. I could compare it with any physical or mental feat you like but it'll just get sillier and sillier. Is an Ironman harder than getting a Bachelors Degree in Science?, how about a PhD? - they're nonsense questions.....that was my point to start with. It's not necessarily the events themselves that are difficult. It's the people and circumstances involved. For many people just getting out of bed in the morning can be harder than you might find an ironman. And I don't mean physically. There's no need to bring other more diverse events into the mix (maybe I shouldn't have mentioned Iditarod) it adds nothing useful to the discussion IMO.

Yep, I generally agree.

Here is my personal pet peeve. I have an MBA from a decent program. I have never once really discussed it with anyone. It is no where in any of my communication with people. I see a lot of people going to 11 month online executive MBA programs, only to put MBA next to their name on their business card and email signature. A lot of MBAs are open admissions these days folks! why would you think it is a "credential?" It is not like a MD or DDS or PhD.

I needed to get that off my chest - I feel better now.

I've had the "no time" discussion with many people and my response has narrowed to simply: "it's all a matter of priorities." If by chance the discussion continues, i'll ask "how much TV do you watch"??? But generally, i just avoid these types of discussions:)

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"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."

Dirtymangos paradoxes of middle age male bragging:
1) The seriousness with which one approaches a sport is inversely related to how "great" one believes he "might have been."
A very serious and successful athlete (such as Joe Malloy) "might" have been a little better.
The fat guy in your office "would certainly have won the gold" if he had wanted to.
2) People who don't like you will not be impressed by anything you do.
3) People who like you a lot will pretend to be impressed by everything you do.
4) Acquantences who are a little better than you are best positioned to appreciate your brags. Unfortunately- "Your a great athlete" -and "I am completely awesome" is not the kind of thing you tell an acquantence. Thus - "Your ok I guess" is the most likely response.
5) Given paradoxes 1-4- bragging will never workout well. Yet the middleaged man will try to brag anyway.
6) Complaining about how bragging doesn't on slowtwitch won't help either (see paradoxes 1-4).

Hey Jackwipe!!!! Post my picture again and I'll have Dan ban your ass!!


.

Hey, I just Googled "Ironman Douchebag" and your picture came up.

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How does Danny Hart sit down with balls that big?

Are you dong Ironman for yourself or other people?

If for other people I see why you're bothered, if for yourself why do you care?

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I ride:
Cervelo - P-Series/R3
GT - Sensor Carbon Expert

Supporters - Flo Cycling, Mount Bikes

i totally get it. i don't care a whit who wears what and i will happily wear race gear before a race or race gear from a race i've never done with no problem. i don't care what people wear and i go for the "pretty". i don't like the big FINISHER signs on stuff but, eh, whatever. coming home from IMCOZ there was a guy all decked out and wearing his finisher medal. i had an inside chuckle but whatever, not my life. life is too short and fragile (as you've already encountered) to get hung up on what people wear or deserve to put on their bodies. i'm not wasting time on that. when you are made acutely aware of just how fragile and short life is/can be, it is easier to have pride for those proudly strutting their stuff. i forget sometimes your IM Swiss. you've come such a long way, Dev. right now i'm fresh off an excision for biopsy and about a million stitches holding my shoulder together and not planning any races. yet. so i'll see your crutches and send some positive energy your way. this side of 50 and life looks so much more fragile but also so much to live for. :) take care!

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