Did you go to Speedy Reedy?

IMHO Forget panache. Form follows function. Be careful with custom. Most of what Ves does is a good job of finding the stock frame geometry bike from his extensive (proven) geometry that will correctly fit the rider and provide good weight distribution for excellent handling. I've owned two custom geometry frames built to my measurements. Both fit well but handled very poorly. I don't have either anymore. Your best bet for a good fitting over the internet or by phone is probably with Ves. The P3 is also an impressive bike, but let me ask you- Do you know it fits? Is it appropriate for the events you plan to do? Maybe. Maybe not. P3s are like a beautiful woman: Easy to get excited about. Most men like beautiful women, but not all beautiful women are a good fit. She may be enamored with the appearance of the P3 (most people are, it is a very good looking bike). but the bottom line is the fit and function have to come first. Take the recommendation of a fitter you trust.

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Tom Demerly
The Tri Shop.com

Brad,

I'd recommend visiting Gateway Bicycles in Portland. Seriously. Although I was a bit concerned about Mike's "try riding a few bikes first" approach, I became VERY comfortable with his expertise when we pulled out the Computrainer, Full-Length Mirrors, multiple stems, etc. and began fitting.

Mike isn't a sales guy...He's a bit odd, but he's done 17 Ironmans (9 x IMC) and sold/fit Tri Bikes for a LONG time. In short, he KNOWS his stuff. He'll ask course questions as well to help optimize for the terrain your wife will be tackling.

It's worth the drive. Besides, he's got MANY P3s in stock if that ends up being appropriate.

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http://wattieink.com/elite-team/
Raising funds to help wounded veterans and racing RAAM 2013 with http://team4mil.org/
"If you are gonna charge... CHARGE HARD!"

Hi Brad, I'm gonna chime in here and second puskas recommendation. The person he is describing (Mike at Gateway Bicycles in Portland)is a stranger to me but sounds like he has some ingredients of reputability and a good basis for fit knowledge. Based on puskas description he seems to be in tune with fit and have tools at his disposal for fitting. That is promising. Also- (again) Beware of custom frame geometry. Getting custom geometry can be a little like surgery, bette use at a later option as opposed to a better primary option. We used to do 20 custom geo frames a year, now we do about 1-2. I think a part of this is becasue we have become more talented and knowledgable fitters.

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Tom Demerly
The Tri Shop.com

well, not to disagree with tom, but there ARE a few other valid reasons for going custom with a builder such as yaqui. getting exactly what ya want, most notably. this could include such "trivial" things as paint or where you like the cable guides to such things as what bb drop you prefer or tubing butt lengths you want. it is give and take type of deal that can be very enjoyable, and in the modern day with people like ves , actually fairly reasonble in price for the level of service that you are getting. as tom alludes it is wise to pick a REALLY experinced builder and not overdo your end of the designing iffn' ya don't really know what you doing or you could end up with a pig in a poke. again, this can be avoided with good communcation, i think. finally, as for fit issues on a frame over the phone/internet/mailed in forms. . . . .well, many can easily use these techniques to set you up just fine and have for years. companies like seven or steelman, waterford or strong make an art of it - i am sure yaqui is the same and you could be very confident of this from them.

but, a lot of things are simply more than some people want to think about - a totally reasonable point of view. if so, like it sound like your wife is saying, a custom bike maybe offers very little in what she is actually interested in. any of the custom builders above would agree they have a "stock" build geometry that would fit 90 odd percent of all people absolutely perfectly. still, i am left to wonder on that p3. . . . . .battleship grey? the woman really wants grey??? :)

that's who I was referring to about not having much inventory. I'd love to hear opinions on reed's ability to fit. But even if he's fantastic, the fact that he has almost no bikes in his shop makes it a tough sell for me to go there. I'm glad to have a tri-specific shop in the city, but it seems like you pretty much have to know what you want or go on blind-faith. Something I'm not comfortable doing on an expensive bike.

actually, I've been pushing the p2k (value combined with her ability level and the events she does) but she doesn't like the blue, and thinks that the flat silver is cool. Honestly, I though the color options on a custom frame might sway her, but it didn't seem to.

just so everyone knows, puskas and I have had offline chats about gateway.

I've been in there several times, in fact we made a trip down there (200+ miles) just for her to ride bikes. their inventory is fantastic. unfortunately, we were working with some guy who didn't really know tri (probably mtn biker, if anything, his physique did not indicate that he'd actually been on a bike in awhile), so we weren't getting any good advice. they were willing to rollout as many bikes as she wanted, but weren't really offering any suggestions. I'm afraid to get too involved because if she doesn't like it, I don't want it to be my fault, and she hasn't ridden enough to know what she likes and doesn't, or be able to tell the difference in most cases.

from the sound of his posts, Tom's approach would be perfect for her. however, I don't see us traveling to michigan just to buy a bike. this process has been going on for about 6 months now, with no progress because there doesn't seem to be a good way to actually end up with the right thing. which is what got me thinking about whether custom would be better.

My riding partner had a fit session from Reed and seems to have really benefited ( based on what he said and how often he drops me). Speedy's does lack selection, I just thought you might not know about the store. I only have the custom option since I can't buy an off-the-shelf bike big enough. Ti Cycles in Seattle does fittings and builds frames but I don't know how much they know about tri bike fitting. Personally, I would love to be a few inches shorter and have the choice of dozens of bikes instead of a handful.

If you do decide on a custom, definitly talk to Ves. I just bought a carbon fork from him. I was worried about buying the fork mail order because I had no clue how to go about installing it. Ves spent at least 45 minutes on the phone walking me through all the measurements he needed, as well as through taking off the old fork. In between instructions he gave a running history/seminar on fork design. I received the fork a couple if days ago, precut and ready to install. As far as I can tell, the fork fits perfectly.

If he is willing to spend that much time and energy on a fork, I'm sure he'll do a great job on your wife's bike. And besides, the Yaqui is SO sweet...

Interesting, I find myself in the same dilemma. I really like the P3, which seems to fit well, and really like the Yaqui DL, which should fit equally as well if not better if I go custom. The P3 has the definite aero advantage and is super stiff in the BB you can also achieve the traditional 78* seat tube angle, but it may not be as good on the hills and technical courses as the DL. The DL has a pretty aero downtube, is extremely light, and supposedly correct geometry to use both the drops and aerobars. I'm not sure about the seat tube angle, but I believe its more relaxed, read road race bike. I'll be doing local races as well as IMC next year. I also can only afford one really nice bike, if I had the money both would serve me well, but since my wife won't let me I can't decide either. Let me know what you decide to do.

I was fit at Speedy Reedy last year. Reed is a great guy, but I felt there was something missing during the fit. I was in and out of the shop in less than 25minutes, after reading about Tom D. and his hour plus fit sessions it makes me wonder.

Few remarks:

1. "Most of what Ves does is a good job of finding the stock frame geometry bike from his extensive (proven) geometry that will correctly fit the rider and provide good weight distribution for excellent handling"

1. Almost right, but ... When I get body proportions (like yours) I work on the geometry and calculate everything from scratch. Only in the case when:

a) Top Tube fit stock size

b) Head Tube length required, fit stock size

c) Seat Angle fit stock size

are all mach, only then stock size is chosen as the right one. I have to say (because of huge number of our options) only 30% of my customers need custom geometry.

2. "I've owned two custom geometry frames built to my measurements. Both fit well but handled very poorly."

2. Both of "frame builders" were not on the level to make perfect frame. Nothing strange (When fit goes wrong....???) just you should say loud the name of the "factory" so people should stay away of them.

3. "but not all beautiful women are a good fit"

3. It looks like you found beautiful women and a good fit in that little "French Conection"-houdoyasayinlaFrance: Vui,Vui my little pusssy, YOU ARE IN LOVE. MAN!!!

4. Big secret: as beautiful women deserve only beautiful bikes (and the fit is mandatory) I decided year ago to make all women bikes CUSTOM, FREE OF EXTRA CHARGE. Even there are some personalities saying that women are NOT anatomically different than man ("Gee, they have two arms, two legs, hmmm interesting , they are same like me, hm interesting") women sitting bones are on different spot than man (not necessarily wider-as many thinks, some guys have much wider butt than I saw on many girls), and that is causing huge problems on the saddle. Just ask Karen Mc Keachie. Why is SECRET, lot of guys (without sense for "beautiful creatures" will be upset "why I have to pay"

And of course girls have option to chose color as Passion Pearl, or Hot Pink Pearl (and more than 20 others) FREE OF EXTRA CHARGE. We must keep them beautiful!

Ves,

Would the hot pinks and passion pearls be available to men who are unafraid to show their feminine side? Are you going to add flowery decals to the women's bikes?

Nice to see you back on the board.

Based on my personal experience and that of my former roomate, you can't go wrong with Ves and Yaqui. Its the best bike and fit I have ever owned. Ves has the measurements he takes from his web submission form down to a science. Good luck finding a bike.



Kyle

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Kyle Handley