i think it s more important to free up the traffic between vancouver and whistler first. and i m a big fan of the hard section at the end of the ride. So in my opinion, i would be desapointed if they did what you propose.

it s fun to have a hard challenge course once in awhile!

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Jonathan Caron / Professional Coach / ironman champions / age group world champions
Jonnyo Coaching
Instargram

My brother was volunteering in the info booth and he said there was much more conversation about traffic and opening up the road north of Whistler than south. Plus, 99 was open south of Whistler. We shared the road with the cars south of Whistler.

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Favorite Gear: Dimond | Cadex | Desoto Sport | Hoka One One

I've actually ridden it both ways and prefer the current course layout... Pemberton is nice and easy and smooth, so if you're riding smart you can rest and eat up before crushing (by IM standards) the last 30k home. The other way, you get to climb from Pemberton and then a short cruise through Whistler and you get to climb Callahan, drafting would be far worse on the Pemberton flats the decent would be %$#!ing scary if you are a midpack swimmer.

I 100% want the current course layout to stay. So many reason for not changing it.

1. Starting downhill would be crowded after the swim, cold and doesn't let you get into a rhythm
2. Drafting would be nuts on the PMR. Was bad enough this year after 95k of riding. Would be one massive peloton if that came at 30k after a downhill start
3. Traffic going south of whistler was closed until 12:30. Can't close southbound traffic until 5:30. Would need an entirely different road layout.
4. Current course rewards smart racing. The final climb wasn't that hard if you paced well. I saw lots of guys hammering the first climbs while I sat up and cruised below threshold. They died on the flats and limped home. I had energy to climb the ~20km and hammer the rollers after green lake.

Having not done it yet (heading over for 2014), if you reversed it, my concern is too much of a draft fest.

Right now the profile is similar to IMLP in terms of where the hills are except the IMLP flats are divided up between loops, but each loop starts with climbing, then decent, then flat, then climb (I also hear that it is tougher course than LP):

http://connect.garmin.com/activity/351163308

Also, I know people have said that it is a lot harder than Placid, St. George and Tremblant. Anyone know if it is on the same level of difficulty as IM France?

Dev

what time were you on the road?

We didnt share the road....

I guess we most have been in a different race or i m making a mistake? I was in the middle of the road both way with no car next to me but a few emergency vehicule and tech support and media. But there was absolutely no regular traffic both ways until 12:30 south of whistler.

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Jonathan Caron / Professional Coach / ironman champions / age group world champions
Jonnyo Coaching
Instargram

With either course direction I'm afraid the only thing that will reduce the drafting along Pemberton Meadows would be to use half a dozen race marshals just for this segment. This was my first full IM. I've seen blatant drafting and even pelotons from time to time in HIMs, but the groups at IM CAN were very large and had a lot of the pack riders sitting up on their bull horns. Maybe they were all resting for the climb back out of the valley?

I can only remember seeing a couple of bike course marshals all day. Before the race Riccitello emphasized that his marshals would enforce drafting penalties on climbs because drafting provides an advantage when climbing. But this course course sorts most of the drafting out by itself except for the Pemberton Meadows section.

Agree this^

However, if drafting on the PMR under the current layout were to be considered a major issue, a solution would be not to go there, and to ride to a dead turn some point on the road to Darcy instead. Trouble then is that (IIRC) the biggest descent on the road to Darcy is right at the end, so the ride to the dead turn would mainly be moderately undulating.

I'd expect more referees and more penalties on the PMR next year.

I could have sworn we had cars next to us on the way to Callaghan but apparently I was delirious or something. I was on the bike course around 8:15am.

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Favorite Gear: Dimond | Cadex | Desoto Sport | Hoka One One

The road was open for travel northbound to Whistler all day. We had one lane of traffic next to us that was only northbound traffic. 12:30 the traffic opened southbound from Whistler to Squamish.

GMAN, You're right. There was lane of traffic open headed to Whistler when I was on course too. That said, there wasn't very much traffic so I can see how jonnyo could've missed it.

They definitely had marshalls on the PMR and were giving penalties. When I passed the final tent in Whistler, it had probably 10-15 riders in that group. I was in the 100-150th place 'group' coming off the bike (1:00 swim + 5:25 bike). I rode clean through the flats and had at least 1 large group and several smaller groups pass me. I caught probably 20-30 of them on the climb.

The worst I saw all day were 2 guys from the same club, matching blue/white/red/ tops, riding a 2-man TT from the bottom of Pemberton. Passed them and yelled at them, the guy had the nerve to pretend they only bunched up through an aid station. Guess he didn't know I'd been about 50-100m back for the last 4-5km and could clearly see they were drafting on the ups and downs.

What WTC should do is make a very public list of everyone that has a penatly. Lets start shaming the riders who draft.

Other option is to do what we do in skiing, penalties are cumulative over the entire year. If you get a yellow card in one race, the next yellow card is a DQ on the spot. Would be pretty easy to implement, everything is online now. Maybe use a rolling 2-yr period.

I'm sure there was some marshal presence along PMR because I had a guy in my age group jump out of a penalty tent in front of me on my way north. At the time I just laughed to myself and wondered how the marshal(s) could only semd a single rider to the tent with what was happening along this road?

You were closer to the front of the race so maybe the marshal coverage changed through the day? I am a BOP swimmer and had to pass a lot of riders. Besides the climbs I didn't see riders grouped up going my direction. Most of my attention on the ride up through Pemberton was spent not colliding with those riding left up against the centerline:( The large packs I witnessed on PMR were headed south the other way. I was probably 50 min behind you at the turnaround and the drafting going my direction was groups of 2-4. Staying clear of these groups burned extra energy. I also had several riders work hard to come around me and then back off or even sit up and back off. I was riding with power so it wasn't like I was varying my pace and slowing them down. passed a lot of riders. Most of my attention on the ride up through Pemberton was spent not colliding with those riding left up against the centerline:(

My wife was up near you and mentioned the team kit drafters and some other fast females getting pulls along PMR. She is more vocal than me and called out some of the drafters like you did.

I agree it would help to publish penalties incurred during races with the results. It would show a pattern of behavior. And perhaps a harsher penalty for catching large groups riding in packs

No cars on the Callahan... Saw camera motos covering the Pros

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2020 National Masters Champion - M40-44 - 400m IM
Canadian Record Holder 35-39M & 40-44M - 200 m Butterfly (LCM)

Yeah, no cars there. I remember that. :-)

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Favorite Gear: Dimond | Cadex | Desoto Sport | Hoka One One