"..that's one magic loogie!"

I must admit I didn't read the whole thread, but why don't they just put a small disc guard over the discs. Seems simple enough.

Thanks for the demo, much more informative than trying to picture it in your head.

I don't agree on the point regarding the UCI's response though; they seem to move at a glacial pace in most regards, case-in-point on course vehicles. It was last year's Classics season when this topic started to gain traction, as Jesse Sergent and Sebastien Chavanel were punted off by Shimano Neutral Service vehicles to kick off a seemingly constant stream of incidents throughout the season.

Yet, we're 12 months down the line, a rider has died from being struck by an on-course moto and they're still sitting on their hands! As far as I'm aware, all they've done is announce that they're "reviewing the regulations". I'm surprised they've acted so quickly in response to this one incident, especially given the ramifications for teams and the industry; it makes me wonder if anything else has gone on behind the scenes.

Weight. UCI rules on fairings and covers. Makes wheel changes harder. Even uglier. Pick one or more.

Of the two injuries reportedly caused by disc rotors, one of the injured parties (Maes) has been shown to have "misremembered" what actually caused his injury:

http://road.cc/...led-injuries-peloton

In addition to what uo5nVEtj9 said, heat. Covering the discs reduces cooling from airflow.

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Damon Rinard
Engineering Manager,
CSG Road Engineering Department
Cannondale & GT Bicycles
(ex-Cervelo, ex-Trek, ex-Velomax, ex-Kestrel)

I see what you guys are saying, and I am not familiar with UCI rules. I just have the impression they suppress innovation. Heat can be managed with cooling louvers or something similar. You only have to keep it from cutting someone if that is what happens. If its just a question of safety, teams will just have to sacrifice wheel change time/ complexity with braking performance, or use rim brakes. But really if the guard is mounted to caliper mount it shouldn't affect wheel changes. Drag impact would likely be minimal compared to the cylindrical tubes everywhere on the road bikes, or go back to rim brakes. At least a guard would give the option of a disc brake if safety is that big of a concern.

Which pro teams use Garmin pedals? even Garmin didn't use them...

Haven't done it myself... but saw the bike of guy that was off the front of a Half I raced a few years ago. A couple missing spokes in the front wheel, a couple mangled ones and some blood spattered about. Supposedly he lost a digit or two trying to monkey with his front brake while riding.

Lots can go wrong with riding bikes fast, it isn't a "safe" sport... although what this guy did just wasn't smart.

This is the best comment from that article

"The proof Fran Ventoso cut was not made from a brake disc is in the direction of the cut. In the picture above it clearly runs horizontally across his shin. This would very difficult to achieve as the rest of the wheel is in way. This natural shield does a far better job than the exposed teeth of a chainring (which is most likely culprit for that cut). A disc brake cut is almost always going to run horizontally down a riders body. If it happened as DrJDog said the cut would be knee to ankle, not horizontal.

Riders need to be told to stop whining about it and do their jobs. Manufacturers sponsor teams to sell bikes. If the cycling public want disc brakes - which it appears they do, manufacturers will make them and pro's will be forced to ride them. If pro's refuse, the manufacturers won't bother sponsoring them and the cost of running a pro team will increase, putting many riders’ jobs at risk"

Every disc equipped bike I have ridden has been overwhelming better when it came to descending confidently on steep, windy roads, especially the ones around here that also tend to have loose gravel on the turns. Even in heavy traffic when commuting or just riding to my training grounds, I felt a lot safer on the disc bike due to the lighter feel of the levers and the greater stopping power. As soon as specialized sort out their stupid Inhouse standard and move to the same as the industry, I will be buying a disc Tarmac to add to the fleet

You are thinking about the nature of the cut in a linear fashion...i.e. he came up to it with the disc parallel to his leg. See the scenario I lined out previously.

The rider with the discs comes to a stop, but with the bike facing and leaning over to the left. Ventoso is following, sees the stoppage ahead, slams on his brakes but ends up facing and leaning to the right. So as he comes in contact with the disc, his left calf is exposed the the disc in a perpendicular fashion. This explains the triangular nature of the wound. The disc pierced his leg at an angle, and cut at an angle, going deeper (and making the wound wider) the farther it went into his leg.

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Chicago Cubs - 2016 WORLD SERIES Champions!!!!

"If ever the time should come, when vain and aspiring men shall possess the highest seats in government, our country will stand in need of its experienced patriots to prevent its ruin." - Samuel Adams

Did you kiss the part where there is an entire wheel in the way?

It's not....he is coming in underneath the wheel with the disc angled up towards his leg.

Visualize two bikes lined up side by side, with their left sides facing each other (so one is facing one direction, the other bike in the other direction). Lean them over so the "disc bike" is leaning to the left (disc side) and "Ventoso's bike" is leaning to the right (drivetrain side) and you will see what I mean.

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Chicago Cubs - 2016 WORLD SERIES Champions!!!!

"If ever the time should come, when vain and aspiring men shall possess the highest seats in government, our country will stand in need of its experienced patriots to prevent its ruin." - Samuel Adams

Disks are on the left side of the bike. Ventoso's injury is on his left leg. Ventoso did not crash, he kept riding along. 1 of these things don't add up, and that's a disk causing the injury.

That's what I was thinking; the only way he gets cut by the rotor on the left leg, is if it's a head-on encounter

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"What's your claim?" - Ben Gravy
"Your best work is the work you're excited about" - Rick Rubin

The only way I could see it happening is if the wheel had bounced out of the frame, and taco'd, leaving the disk exposed... and then I have a hard time believing the disk would cause a cut like that in those circumstances.

Yeah, no schitt....did you read my last post?

Rider with discs comes to a stop facing and leaning to the left. Ventoso comes up,brakes / skids to a stop, but facing the opposite direction. His left leg is now facing the discs...angle bikes as I described above and you can inflict the type of wound that Ventoso suffered.

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Chicago Cubs - 2016 WORLD SERIES Champions!!!!

"If ever the time should come, when vain and aspiring men shall possess the highest seats in government, our country will stand in need of its experienced patriots to prevent its ruin." - Samuel Adams

WTF are you talking about?

The bikes were not going in opposite directions.

I'll eat my bike if they are able to prove that a disc caused that injury.

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Jason
None of the secrets of success will work unless you do.

Umm...no one is talking about going in opposite directions...Ventoso says he had to break and came into contact with the rider who had stopped in front of him...they both stopped, Ventoso just didn't go down. Re-read what I wrote and apply some critical thinking.

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Chicago Cubs - 2016 WORLD SERIES Champions!!!!

"If ever the time should come, when vain and aspiring men shall possess the highest seats in government, our country will stand in need of its experienced patriots to prevent its ruin." - Samuel Adams

Yip, I really don't understand his explanation. If the first bike is leaning left, and ventoso's bike was leaning right, either a) he would have avoided hitting all together or b) his leg would have contacted the drivetrain (and caused the injury...)

Go line up two bikes with the non-drive sides facing each other. One bike will be facing left (bike with disc) and the other will be facing right (Ventoso). His left leg is now up against the disc brake side of the other bike.

Remember, they are now both perpendicular to the direction of the race...

Was this the way it happened? I dunno....but that is how he could have suffered a left leg injury and the shape of the wound supports that idea.

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Chicago Cubs - 2016 WORLD SERIES Champions!!!!

"If ever the time should come, when vain and aspiring men shall possess the highest seats in government, our country will stand in need of its experienced patriots to prevent its ruin." - Samuel Adams

I have read it at least a dozen times and cannot figure out what you are trying to describe. I tend to think that I am good at critical thinking but you may have to draw me a picture.....

If the left sides of the bikes (each bike) are facing each other, then the bikes are by definition going in opposite directions, which you say, "(so one is facing one direction, the other bike in the other direction)"....

This is not at all what is described by the injured rider in the link in the first post. As near as I can tell, neither rider went down and the injured rider has no memory of contacting the other bike. But by all means, feel free to invent a scenario where monkeys can fly.

ETA. The visual just became apparent to me. I get what you are describing. I think that there is absolutely no way that this could have happened without both riders going down (both riders facing at right angles to their actual direction of travel) but at least I now understand. I don't think it happened but, alas.

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Jason
None of the secrets of success will work unless you do.

Apparently your critical thinking skills aren't as good as you give yourself credit for.....I outlined this originally....first rider hits his brakes and comes to a stop facing the left side of the road, so dis rake side is now facing oncoming riders. Ventoso grabs his brakes to avoid the pile-up but ends up facing right....his left leg is now facing the discs of the first rider. Now angle the bikes and that allows Ventoso's calf to slide into the rotor.

Go get a plate and hold it flat against the front of your calf. Now angle it so the bottom of the plate is away from your calf and only the top is touching it. If that plate was a disc rotor and it was jammed into your calf from there, it would create the exact type of would Ventoso suffered.

That is the only way a disc could have caused that type of wound on his left leg (at least as far as I can figure out). Is it what happened? Hell if I know....but it is certainly a possible scenario.

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Chicago Cubs - 2016 WORLD SERIES Champions!!!!

"If ever the time should come, when vain and aspiring men shall possess the highest seats in government, our country will stand in need of its experienced patriots to prevent its ruin." - Samuel Adams

I read Ventoso's first hand account of the accident.

With the knowledge of what he said happened I could not visualize your scenario because it doesn't fit at all with the rider's description.

I can now understand your scenario. Again, it doesn't match what was described but I at least understand what you were trying to hypothesize.

I still offer to eat my bike if that is what happened :-)

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Jason
None of the secrets of success will work unless you do.

I THINK I GOT IT!!!

The rider in front, locks up & slides across the peloton from the right to the left, exposing his rotors to the oncoming traffic

Ventoso sees this obstacle and, as you said "grabs his brakes to avoid the pile-up but ends up facing right" ... maybe he thought or saw more room to move on that side, or perhaps, RIGHT is his natural instinct, just as LEFT was the first rider's ... however, he slid out and hit Ventoso this way === while moving this way llll

So, the collision wasn't head-on, but a sideways slide ... like a hockey player checking someone into the boards

If it's PERFECTLY perpendicular there's no issue, but even the slightest /// or \\\ and someone could get sliced

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"What's your claim?" - Ben Gravy
"Your best work is the work you're excited about" - Rick Rubin