TrainerRoad, KICKR and annoying power spikes

Feb 8, 14 8:08

Post #1 of 64 (15129 views)

Have any of you using this combo found a fix for this...

Usually once per ride or so... the power on the KICKR in ERG mode using TR shoots up for a few seconds. It then settles back down... but those few seconds can be super annoying especially if you are aren't ready for it. Feels like you are riding into a wall... and can hurt your knees.

I Emailed back and forth with the TR people... and they say it is on the KICKR side not theirs.

I have 3 other friends who use the KICKR and TR as well... 2 using BT and 2 using ANT+... we all have the spikes.

Here is an example... see the end of the second interval... spiked to nearly 400W during a 15 minute interval at 218W... totally caught me off guard. I had my eyes down at the time.

Last edited by: Donzo98: Feb 8, 14 8:09

Re: TrainerRoad, KICKR and annoying power spikes [Donzo98] [ In reply to ]

Feb 8, 14 8:13

Post #2 of 64 (15117 views)

I've never seen it, I'm using a Kickr with TrainerRoad via ANT+ and riding in erg mode, I've ridden maybe 30 rides so far without any unintentional spikes whatsoever. I do get power drops but that has more to do with placement of my laptop.

Re: TrainerRoad, KICKR and annoying power spikes [Donzo98] [ In reply to ]

Feb 8, 14 8:20

Post #3 of 64 (15108 views)

I have it happen every five rides or so. I agree with TR that it's a Wahoo issue as it has happened using the Wahoo app.

Favorite Gear: Dimond | Cadex | Desoto Sport | Hoka One One

Re: TrainerRoad, KICKR and annoying power spikes [Donzo98] [ In reply to ]

Feb 8, 14 8:36

Post #4 of 64 (15093 views)

I get this as well - maybe once every 3-4 rides. Very similar spike - just for a second or two it goes up a couple hundred watts and then back to normal. I assumed it was some interference in the signal but maybe it's a Wahoo firmware issue (potentially handling signal drops, etc.).

Re: TrainerRoad, KICKR and annoying power spikes [Sub11Hours] [ In reply to ]

Feb 8, 14 8:45

Post #5 of 64 (15086 views)

Sub11Hours wrote:

I've never seen it, I'm using a Kickr with TrainerRoad via ANT+ and riding in erg mode, I've ridden maybe 30 rides so far without any unintentional spikes whatsoever. I do get power drops but that has more to do with placement of my laptop.

Funny... I never get dropouts... just the spikes.

Re: TrainerRoad, KICKR and annoying power spikes [Donzo98] [ In reply to ]

Feb 8, 14 12:04

Post #6 of 64 (15034 views)

I've got about 6 rides on the Kickr so far and no spikes or dropouts.

My challenge is aligning power levels with my Quarq. First few rides were all over the place but its settled to the Quarq reading about 10w higher at 250w although its about the same at 100w, once I calibrate the Quarg several times over the first 20 mins or so. The Quarq is still so variable with power numbers jumping around all over the place while the Kickr is a rock solid number never changing by more than +/- 1w in ERG mode.

Re: TrainerRoad, KICKR and annoying power spikes [Bigpikle] [ In reply to ]

Feb 8, 14 13:03

Post #7 of 64 (15018 views)

Bigpikle wrote:

I've got about 6 rides on the Kickr so far and no spikes or dropouts.

My challenge is aligning power levels with my Quarq. First few rides were all over the place but its settled to the Quarq reading about 10w higher at 250w although its about the same at 100w, once I calibrate the Quarg several times over the first 20 mins or so. The Quarq is still so variable with power numbers jumping around all over the place while the Kickr is a rock solid number never changing by more than +/- 1w in ERG mode.

Makes me wonder if the KICKR is really that precise or accurate; I would more likely believe the Quarq than the Kickr power.

Re: TrainerRoad, KICKR and annoying power spikes [lightheir] [ In reply to ]

Feb 8, 14 13:20

Post #8 of 64 (15011 views)

I suspect it is simply different methods of measuring power. Strain gauges in cranks vs however the Kickr does it. I had a PT hub before and it was far more steady than the Quarq.

I train in a very cold garage so once I've warmed everything up for about 20 mins it settles down. The offset of the Quarq changes 10-15 points through the warm up as the ambient temp is about 3-5 degrees ao it certainly physically warms up when I'm training. The temp measure on the Kickr can change 20 degrees across the hour!

Re: TrainerRoad, KICKR and annoying power spikes [lightheir] [ In reply to ]

Feb 8, 14 13:39

Post #9 of 64 (15001 views)

I agree but I have found that when both are calibrated and warmed up and stable, the two are within 2-3%. The spike is certainly a Wahoo thing and I suspect it is a feedback response to a low power measurement or a dropped power reading that settles down after it gets the power readings again, but I can't prove that.

Shut up legs.

Re: TrainerRoad, KICKR and annoying power spikes [Bigpikle] [ In reply to ]

Feb 8, 14 13:44

Post #10 of 64 (14997 views)

Bigpikle wrote:

I suspect it is simply different methods of measuring power. Strain gauges in cranks vs however the Kickr does it. I had a PT hub before and it was far more steady than the Quarq.

I train in a very cold garage so once I've warmed everything up for about 20 mins it settles down. The offset of the Quarq changes 10-15 points through the warm up as the ambient temp is about 3-5 degrees ao it certainly physically warms up when I'm training. The temp measure on the Kickr can change 20 degrees across the hour!

Does the KICKR actually have a strain gauge in it? I was wondering if it was just ANT transmitting the programmed power it's supposed to put out, but not actually measuring real power. Seems like such a flat power profile - I know with my powermeter, even with 3sec smoothing, there's no way it would ever look that smooth.

Re: TrainerRoad, KICKR and annoying power spikes [lightheir] [ In reply to ]

Feb 8, 14 13:55

Post #11 of 64 (14988 views)

It certainly measures power - just switch to Level mode and watch the power number on the Wahoo app or TR for example.

I dont see any surprise that the power number is flat when in ERG mode as thats exactly what its designed to do - keep the power constant at the programmed level.

Re: TrainerRoad, KICKR and annoying power spikes [GMAN19030] [ In reply to ]

Feb 8, 14 13:58

Post #12 of 64 (14985 views)

It's a known issue in the kickr firmware. I believe they are beta testing a fix right now.

It's hard to fix because it's not very reproducible.

CEO at TrainerRoad
Co-host of the Ask a Cycling Coach Podcast

Re: TrainerRoad, KICKR and annoying power spikes [Donzo98] [ In reply to ]

Feb 8, 14 15:50

Post #13 of 64 (14954 views)

This happens to me on every ride. The power spikes and drop outs. I did a 2 hour ride today and had no less than 30 power drops on TR and a couple spikes. It is effing annoying.

I run TR through a dedicated desktop. I also run the wahoo fitness app as well on my iPad to compare the two. The funny thing is the wahoo app never shows the spike or drop in power which leads me to believe the drops/spikes are coming from the TR side.

Re: TrainerRoad, KICKR and annoying power spikes [Donzo98] [ In reply to ]

Feb 8, 14 16:30

Post #14 of 64 (14940 views)

I also experience this once every few rides.

Re: TrainerRoad, KICKR and annoying power spikes [Nate Pearson] [ In reply to ]

Feb 8, 14 18:03

Post #15 of 64 (14919 views)

Nate Pearson wrote:

It's a known issue in the kickr firmware. I believe they are beta testing a fix right now.

It's hard to fix because it's not very reproducible.

Yes... very true... it happens intermittently... not every ride. Sometimes I can go 3 or 4 rides without it happening.

Do they have any idea what is causing it??

I'm glad to hear they are working on a fix... it is insanely annoying :)

Re: TrainerRoad, KICKR and annoying power spikes [gnewton] [ In reply to ]

Feb 8, 14 18:07

Post #16 of 64 (14915 views)

gnewton wrote:

This happens to me on every ride. The power spikes and drop outs. I did a 2 hour ride today and had no less than 30 power drops on TR and a couple spikes. It is effing annoying.

I run TR through a dedicated desktop. I also run the wahoo fitness app as well on my iPad to compare the two. The funny thing is the wahoo app never shows the spike or drop in power which leads me to believe the drops/spikes are coming from the TR side.

send it back and get a new one. Sounds like a warrantee issue if its not fixed with firmware and hit or miss whether or not a particular Kickr is going to produce them.

Re: TrainerRoad, KICKR and annoying power spikes [Donzo98] [ In reply to ]

Mar 26, 14 14:17

Post #17 of 64 (14594 views)

I have the same thing happen with PeriPedal, though usually once every other ride or so. Glad they're working on a fix. I love it otherwise.

The point is, ladies and gentleman, that speed, for lack of a better word, is good. Speed is right, Speed works. Speed clarifies, cuts through, and captures the essence of the evolutionary spirit.

Re: TrainerRoad, KICKR and annoying power spikes [Nate Pearson] [ In reply to ]

Apr 24, 14 20:56

Post #18 of 64 (14389 views)

Nate...any further updates on this issue? I have not seen any KICKR firmware updates... and still happening at least once per ride. Twice on tonight's ride.

Re: TrainerRoad, KICKR and annoying power spikes [Donzo98] [ In reply to ]

Apr 24, 14 22:23

Post #19 of 64 (14373 views)

Donzo98 wrote:

Nate...any further updates on this issue? I have not seen any KICKR firmware updates... and still happening at least once per ride. Twice on tonight's ride.

Kind of makes me want to cancel my order. Got one on backorder. You think it's still worth it with this issue?

Re: TrainerRoad, KICKR and annoying power spikes [cbump] [ In reply to ]

Apr 25, 14 0:57

Post #20 of 64 (14351 views)

cbump wrote:

Donzo98 wrote:

Nate...any further updates on this issue? I have not seen any KICKR firmware updates... and still happening at least once per ride. Twice on tonight's ride.

Kind of makes me want to cancel my order. Got one on backorder. You think it's still worth it with this issue?

Yes...100%

Re: TrainerRoad, KICKR and annoying power spikes [Donzo98] [ In reply to ]

Apr 25, 14 8:34

Post #21 of 64 (14282 views)

Yep...happens on every ride that is over 60 minutes. Typical spikes about 100%. So if you are going 200 watts, it'll spike to 400 or so. Worst ever was a short interval that was 275 and it spiked to 600 and almost made me come to a screeching halt!

Re: TrainerRoad, KICKR and annoying power spikes [Donzo98] [ In reply to ]

Apr 25, 14 9:23

Post #22 of 64 (14266 views)

Donzo98 wrote:

Nate...any further updates on this issue? I have not seen any KICKR firmware updates... and still happening at least once per ride. Twice on tonight's ride.

They are beta testing firmware to fix this. I don't have an ETA for their release though :(.

We're at their mercy. It's still a great trainer though.

CEO at TrainerRoad
Co-host of the Ask a Cycling Coach Podcast

Re: TrainerRoad, KICKR and annoying power spikes [cbump] [ In reply to ]

Apr 25, 14 9:28

Post #23 of 64 (14260 views)

cbump wrote:

Donzo98 wrote:

Nate...any further updates on this issue? I have not seen any KICKR firmware updates... and still happening at least once per ride. Twice on tonight's ride.

Kind of makes me want to cancel my order. Got one on backorder. You think it's still worth it with this issue?

Weird - I just got a Kickr and have done about 9 rides on it, from 1hr to 2:30hrs, and I haven't encountered this spike a single time.

I briefly had an issue with it engaging the brake if I stopped midway through an interval (total brick wall on restart, like 500+ watts required), but that seems to have mostly gone away, somehow.

Re: TrainerRoad, KICKR and annoying power spikes [cbump] [ In reply to ]

Apr 25, 14 11:14

Post #24 of 64 (14223 views)

I've had the Kickr since November and never experienced the power spike issue, I've had some moments where the brake has engaged, when restarting in an interval, but nothing that I can directly attribute to this issue. You won't regret having the Kickr!

Re: TrainerRoad, KICKR and annoying power spikes [Nate Pearson] [ In reply to ]

May 8, 14 6:12

Post #25 of 64 (14092 views)

Just an update to the thread I started...

I finally called Wahoo Fitness yesterday... and told them what was going on. They asked me to send some TCX files over to them to try to find out what's up.

I generally do a 10-15 warm up on the Iphone using BT, and then a 1 hr hour workout on TR using ANT+. So they have examples of spikes on both BT and ANT+.

Thery also realize that it has to be their issue and not TR since it happens on both the Wahoo Fitness App and TR.

Im sure it is a difficult problem to diagnose...since it doesn't happen every ride... but when it does, it really pisses me off :) A 400 watt spike during a 250 watt interval when you are not ready for it sucks!!

More to come...

Last edited by: Donzo98: May 8, 14 7:51

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