This is one that pisses me off about cyclists

Jun 24, 05 7:18

Post #1 of 56 (5388 views)

I don't care if they're tris or roadies.

It is common etiquette among experienced cyclists that if a group of guys has been pulling you around town for a few hours, you don't jump off the front with 1 or 2 miles to go - rather you finish the ride at whatever pace the leaders want. Its simple courtesy and common practice with the faster groups around here.

I've turned into (by riding with roadies, and having the fastest folks move to Boulder) one of the stronger cyclists on our Saturday long/large group rides. Twice in a row I've dragged a group of people around for 3 hours or more, only to have this one guy blow off the front at the end, when I've decided to cool down. None of these guys takes even a single pull the whole ride as my average speed is higher than theirs if they were riding alone. (I used to be in the same boat when Joanna Z. was one of our local riders. I'd hang on her wheel for hours, was the only way I could keep up and she appreciated the company.)

So this guy did it again last night. We were at the final climb and I decide to cool down. Expecting the rest of the group to do the same - they wouldn't even go ahead of my front wheel previously - this one guy takes off again. He gets about 150 yards ahead and
I decide that if he's gonna do that, he's going to hurt so I catch up to him and ride alongside. He says "you're going to sprint over the top and leave me in the dust aren't you" I say "you bet I am", and do so.

I know that some riders like to time trial for the last mile or so, but dammit, if a guy drags you all over town, show him a little respect. You want to time trial off the front, say so a few miles ahead. "Hey bud, I appreciate you pulling me for the last few hours, so I wanted to let you know in advance that I'm going to time trial to the finish." At least a nod of acknowledgement is appropriate.

He probably doesn't realize it, isn't doing it intentionally, and doesn't think there's anything wrong with it. I'll tell him about it so from now on he at least knows that I do.

I know I'll take crap for this, be called elitist, whatever, but show some courtesy is all I'm asking.

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Elivis needs boats.

Re: This is one that pisses me off about cyclists [Schwingding] [ In reply to ]

Jun 24, 05 7:22

Post #2 of 56 (5347 views)

Nope no crap here since you said you were going to talk to him. Great idea. Chances are he really doesn't understand the etiquette. Good for you to take the time to teach him.

Re: This is one that pisses me off about cyclists [Schwingding] [ In reply to ]

Jun 24, 05 7:31

Post #3 of 56 (5273 views)

That's hysterical. I feel the same way. But I'm usually the guy doing the drafting all day. But I never come around the leaders at the end of a ride because I think it's disrespectful.

I was on a ride a few months ago and one guy pulled about 20 other guys for almost 40 miles. We were just coming into town and the front guy was cooling down and about 5 of the riders had the balls to sprint out in front of him. He could have slowed down to 2 mph and I wouldn't have come around him. After we stopped, I actually told him to sit down and I would go get his lunch for him.

Jeff

Re: This is one that pisses me off about cyclists [Schwingding] [ In reply to ]

Jun 24, 05 7:33

Post #4 of 56 (5255 views)

If he thinks he's going to become a better rider by doing that, then you'll have the last laugh when it comes to race day. Smile, because you've had a much better workout, while he admires his fool's gold.

Re: This is one that pisses me off about cyclists [Schwingding] [ In reply to ]

Jun 24, 05 7:36

Post #5 of 56 (5228 views)

Get over yourself. How does this guy's actions actually effect you. You seem to be: one wound up mofo. Relax a little. If you got a good work out in pulling people around who the f- cares whether some guys sprint around you the last mile. The only thing that seems to get in your way is your damn ego.

Re: This is one that pisses me off about cyclists [Schwingding] [ In reply to ]

....

Jun 24, 05 7:43

Post #6 of 56 (5178 views)

ignore those who do this. go on with YOUR training and notice little by little how tiny the gap they open gets over the weeks...until your shape is good enough that they just don't go away anymore because after pulling around, they are too fried.

either that or don't ride in groups anymore

Re: This is one that pisses me off about cyclists [Schwingding] [ In reply to ]

Jun 24, 05 7:45

Post #7 of 56 (5160 views)

Dry your eyes. Since you don't mention it, I'm assuming that there's no money or trophy to be had for the first to finish your group ride. What does it matter? Focus on getting the most from your workout that you can and show 'em on race day. If you don't like the way the other kids play, go play somewhere else.

I'm not sayin', I'm just sayin'

Re: This is one that pisses me off about cyclists [sbr140.6] [ In reply to ]

Jun 24, 05 7:46

Post #8 of 56 (5146 views)

I agree. Group rides are a 'fight club' kind of thing. It does NOT belong to you. You are NOT special.

Now, if only people would obey the first two rules, we wouldn't be having these problems.

Re: This is one that pisses me off about cyclists [Schwingding] [ In reply to ]

Jun 24, 05 7:48

Post #9 of 56 (5128 views)

I'm with you - teach him the "etiquette". Had a similar situation on my Wed night ride after some hard pulling at 26 mph+, hit a stop sign and slow (as I'm supposed too, actually stop because I think a cop is there). The group I've been pulling BLOWS through the stop signs and carries on - I can't catch them for about 2 miles and they never slow to let me back on. I was 'kinda pissed.

Best part is (well not really, but evil justice) there was a minor accident as they were bolting up a hill right about as I was coming up to them. One of riders overlaps a wheel and 4 go down hard. Road rash and minor bike damage only thankfully.

I pull a lot the rest of the way in ...

____________________________________
Fatigue is biochemical, not biomechanical.
- Andrew Coggan, PhD

Re: This is one that pisses me off about cyclists [Schwingding] [ In reply to ]

Jun 24, 05 7:49

Post #10 of 56 (5113 views)

You know you're stronger, faster and a better cyclist than he is. Why does it bother you?

Re: This is one that pisses me off about cyclists [Schwingding] [ In reply to ]

Jun 24, 05 7:51

Post #11 of 56 (5103 views)

If there was a city limit sign on the top of the hill, I would have done the same thing......

Re: This is one that pisses me off about cyclists [MojojojoMasterG] [ In reply to ]

Jun 24, 05 7:51

Post #12 of 56 (5101 views)

Its not like I'm asking him to wave at me as he goes by or anything...

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Elivis needs boats.

Re: This is one that pisses me off about cyclists [rroof] [ In reply to ]

....

Jun 24, 05 7:52

Post #13 of 56 (5096 views)

the local group rides here often have crashes because a lot of the guys are redlining big time...

Re: This is one that pisses me off about cyclists [rroof] [ In reply to ]

Jun 24, 05 7:52

Post #14 of 56 (5094 views)

It is annoying - we had a guy who would go out of the back on all the climbs - this after telling us how many 100s of miles he was clocking in training. I'd get the group to slow down for him and let him catch up.

It's a group training ride - not too hard - just getting miles under our belts - it is Winter after all. Then the guy would attack like fury going down hill ? He just didn't get it. I have no idea what he thought he was doing, but it's very annoying. After a few weeks of that, we didn't wait for him at the top any more.

Re: This is one that pisses me off about cyclists [Schwingding] [ In reply to ]

Jun 24, 05 7:54

Post #15 of 56 (5072 views)

I've never heard a more lame and vacant complaint in my life. Respect? Are you riding in the 'hood? I like it when people ride behind me, it's either a sign that I am stronger or they want to ride easy. I could care less if they wind it up at the end and I can't or choose not to respond. Do your ride and stop complaining about what everyone else does.

Who cools down at the bottom of the final climb? I thought people knew how to do a ride in Boulder.

Re: This is one that pisses me off about cyclists [Francois] [ In reply to ]

Jun 24, 05 7:59

Post #16 of 56 (5047 views)

[reply]the local group rides here often have crashes because a lot of the guys are redlining big time...[/reply]

I thought maybe it was because of lack of skills ;)

Re: This is one that pisses me off about cyclists [Schwingding] [ In reply to ]

Jun 24, 05 8:11

Post #17 of 56 (4982 views)

For some of us that is how we are supposed to train. I ride a lot of criterium's as well as doing triathlons. When I am training for criteriums though I have to make sure that I am getting dragged around town, just like in the race and then in the last mile or so crank it up and go for the sprint. I don't think it has anything to do with respect. You may be taking it the wrong way. Just a thought

david
asc
tribemultisport.com

david
asc-arizona state cycling
tribemultisport.com

Re: This is one that pisses me off about cyclists [deetsay00] [ In reply to ]

Jun 24, 05 8:19

Post #18 of 56 (4954 views)

yeah good thought deet - but this guy wouldn't know a road race or a crit if you showed him one. He's a second season tri. i'm saying - train the way you want to train - but show some courtesy (if the word respect turns you off) or you'll find yourself uninvited from future rides. No, I won't be the one leaving.

I don't mind pulling all day - sometimes I do, sometimes I'm the one getting pulled. Last week I got away from the group with another guy WAY stronger than me and we lost the rest. He beat me up so bad - just trying to hang on to his wheel that I ASKED him to go on ahead without me, but he was being very kind and was slowing for me on the climbs.

I don't need acknowledgement either, just a bit of common courtesy.

--------------
Elivis needs boats.

Re: This is one that pisses me off about cyclists [Schwingding] [ In reply to ]

Jun 24, 05 8:20

Post #19 of 56 (4941 views)

Etiquitte? Who's etiquette? Some made up etiquette by a few riders who consider themselves stronger and more experienced and therefore cannot stand to be overtaken right?

If you think that you pull too much stop pulling. Or slip behind towards the latter part of the ride so you conserve enough energy to win the last dash. Or just cool down and let the dickhead think he wins the stage or whatever. Why get worked up just because you're not strong enough to win the final dash after pulling the ride?

Yeah I used to join a ride where there were a group of dickheads who considered themselves elitist riders because they own the same over priced Italian jobs, take part some competitions and been riding for a few years. They always had this inner circle etiquette BS that they expected everyone around them to kow-tow to. They didn't like my Cervello Tri bike, they didn't like it when other riders 'wheel sucked' too long. They got all vocal when someone broke away from the main group etc. But the funny thing is when they did the same things it was all normal like having a crap or sumpthin.

I reckon riding in a group ride just as long as you don't endanger anyone else anyone can simply ride slow, fast, pull, wheel suck break away, drop back ...so what? As long as everyone is enjoying themselves and riding as they like ..who cares. Thank goodness most of the rides around aren't like the ones I described above and I enjoy jamming it up the front with many of the fast guys in different groups I join, as and when I like. There are about 6 different regular good group rides for me to pick and choose spread over the week. Life's too short, we should enjoy it. Especially our our riding hobby, do we really need others imposing informal rules and regs for us to follow and for them to have an excuse to start throwing tantrums? My reaction when this happens..2 words ...F-off. And I'm always ready to back it up.

Re: This is one that pisses me off about cyclists [rroof] [ In reply to ]

Jun 24, 05 8:30

Post #20 of 56 (4901 views)

"I'm with you - teach him the "etiquette". Had a similar situation on my Wed night ride after some hard pulling at 26 mph+, hit a stop sign and slow (as I'm supposed too, actually stop because I think a cop is there). The group I've been pulling BLOWS through the stop signs and carries on - I can't catch them for about 2 miles and they never slow to let me back on. I was 'kinda pissed.

Best part is (well not really, but evil justice) there was a minor accident as they were bolting up a hill right about as I was coming up to them. One of riders overlaps a wheel and 4 go down hard. Road rash and minor bike damage only thankfully.

I pull a lot the rest of the way in ... "

Rroof,

You may be a nice guy ... but you sound like a dickhead! -:)

Re: This is one that pisses me off about cyclists [deetsay00] [ In reply to ]

Jun 24, 05 8:32

Post #21 of 56 (4895 views)

If you�re riding with a group, about the only way you can regulate the intensity of your workout is to vary your pulls at the front. Having a bad day? Let �em know you�re just there for the draft on that day. Riding in a draft continually during training won�t do much for you on race day. And if you�re strong enough that you�re up at the front and content with your level of output, there should be no problem. I just don�t get it when group rides become competitions and feelings get hurt. That�s why I do Tris, perhaps. On the other side, there is something to be said for ride etiquette when it comes to dropping riders of the back and leaving them in the dust. Anyone showing up is assumed to be making the choice of ridng with others as opposed to doing a solo training effort. On more than one occasion I have dropped back a quarter mile to pick up a straggler hopelessly off the back. Pulling them back to the main pack is an excellent way to better your ride and theirs.

Re: This is one that pisses me off about cyclists [Schwingding] [ In reply to ]

Jun 24, 05 8:44

Post #22 of 56 (4827 views)

you need something else to worry about.

-mike

Re: This is one that pisses me off about cyclists [Vita-man] [ In reply to ]

Jun 24, 05 8:49

Post #23 of 56 (4800 views)

"He could have slowed down to 2 mph and I wouldn't have come around him. After we stopped, I actually told him to sit down and I would go get his lunch for him. "

If that was tongue-in-cheek, it was hilaaaarious!

Re: This is one that pisses me off about cyclists [cougie] [ In reply to ]

Jun 24, 05 8:51

Post #24 of 56 (4790 views)

In Reply To:

we had a guy who would go out of the back on all the climbs...
Then the guy would attack like fury going down hill ?

This could be true, but also sounds like the difference between a 140# rider and a 200# rider (like myself) climbing a hill. I've had plenty of 100# women leave me in their dust on the way up. Yet, very few riders in general can keep up with me on the way down, even when I just soft pedal then let gravity take over...

On top of that, most riders (that I've experienced) don't push over the top of a climb, and just coast down. As a result, a little bit of pedaling and the heavy weight makes for a big speed difference on the way down.

YMMV

(Mo)Joe

Re: This is one that pisses me off about cyclists [Schwingding] [ In reply to ]

Jun 24, 05 8:51

Post #25 of 56 (4789 views)

While there is an imliation of riding "etiquette" here, you don't give enough information to determine if there was an "etiquette" violation.

Is this a regular long established ride? If not, then how did you get appointed the "leader" with authority to decide when the ride ends and the warm down begins? There is something to your point that it is rude to let someone pull you for a very long time then try to drop them but I would not see this rule as applying if the leader pulled off and stopped riding which is essentially what you did by starting your warm down.

If it is a regular ride, is there a tradition of "racing" to the top of that last hill or some other point. If so, that will always trump the supposed rights of anyone who pulled for long periods. In this situation, anyone who leads long enough to hamper their sprinting prospects is on their own and has no right to complain anymore than you would if you got passed in a sprint at the end of a race because you pulled the peleton for the last 4 laps. In such rides, positioning, tactics etc to "win" the final sprint are part of the training aspect of the ride. These are skills racers need and this is how they practice them. You can play or not but you can't stop others from playing just because you decided to take really long pulls.

If you and the other riders are playing different games, you can't insist that they play your game. If you're all playing the same game, it is going to be a pretty unusual circumstance where you unilaterally get to decide when the game ends.

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