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The noob's first road race thoughts....
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I always see these "surviving your first road race" stickies on the forums, but usually written by the racing vets. Not the noobs.

Here's the noob's account......

Race prep:
I took more kit than necessary as it was cold and very windy. Spare wheels, spare kit, embrocation etc... This was a good idea. I got there about 1:15 before start. Enough time to get your bearings, setup the bike to the trainer, grab your number and thoughts. Spun for 10min before the start to get good and warmed up. This worked fine. Then they flubbed the start and we stood freezing for 10min not moving. Just roll with it. Chat a bit, etc.. You will forget something or have something not go as planned. Just chill and look for a solution. I listened to the sign in desk say to pin up on your right, then they changed it while I was mid warmup with 5min to go. No biggie. The morning poop was at home, homerun there. Not waiting on site for that is a plus. I woke up early to eat and wakeup nicely also, worked out well also. If I had to do something different I didn't take a gel as it was about an hour 20 min race. I just did gatorade. I was fine, but probably should have.

The race:
Like a hammer or P ride. More teamwork among team members than I thought would happen in a 4/5 race. A strong solo rider would do fine, and even win. But, it's a consideration and something to watch. They did help each other in ways a solo rider couldn't. But had to move together when a solo rider could do what they want. I chose not to blow up bridging the break. I was the last person who could. They blew over the 2min hill and I had them within 100 yards when I tried to cheat a corner powering out in a sprint too early and put a pedal down and nearly ate shit. But that was the last hope to catch the break. The break won. Don't be surprised if people pretend they forgot how to paceline if you're in the chase group (or the break). Had people all over the place. They also wouldn't tuck or put decent watts downhill for some reason. No single person could bridge, so dropping people on the 2min hill wasn't gonna work. At the end, I was a bit disheartened to die up the 2min hill for like 12th or something knowing the break finished 3 to 4 min ago. Didn't get dropped, didn't make the break. Had fun, didn't die. Only one guy got cussed and it wasn't me. A cat 4 guy in our non-break group said that if it was his first race he'd probably of never done it again. I feel like the people in the break, it was a group or team idea as it was a bit too organized for a 4/5 race.

The fitness:
IMHO, take that ftp chart thing on the internet and toss it in the trash. Forget you saw it. This 4/5 race, if you didn't have at least a 3.4 or so w/kg (20min), you were getting dropped. I've got a 4.0 and did fine in the non-break group. I probably wasted some of that ability being a noob in a road race. Especially thinking we could catch the break on lap 2 and working harder than I should have. The power intervals and under/overs got me to the point I could hang with the race. What it didn't do was I felt a gap in the "hit it, recover at steady state power, hit it again". I say that as the power intervals I'd done were "hit it, spin at 100 to 120w, hit it". But now I know. The issue? I think instead of "endurance miles or group ride" that workout should say "find a p-group ride that WILL drop you". Why? You've gotta be able to dig on minimal recovery and know what your body feels like when you do get dropped. I didn't have that. I've NEVER been dropped. From an A ride or this race. I probably left some power on the course worried I'd burn one too big a match and get shot out the back. Now I need to go find out. The local p-ride WILL drop me a few times the first go around knowing who goes to ride it. I mean, I'll get shelled. There's 2's and 3's in that group.

To give an idea of how "noobish" I was despite not getting dropped the first race, here were the power numbers:
time: 1:23:09
dist: 28.7mi
Time over 340w: 7min, not quite 10% spent over 340w
300-340: 6min
250-300: 10min
215-250: 12min
tempo: 15min

Meaning I wasn't too smart yet. Worked too hard a few times. Had to catch stuff a few times not paying attention to the guys in front of me falling off pace.

Fatal flaw: I was in front 1/3 till the hill area where since we were going slow I didn't worry about a crash (you want to be up there not just to avoid crashes, but be in position to respond). None of the online "stickies" say that. They say the crashes happen in the middle/back. That was where the break went. I was trapped. Should have gotten up there on that hill and gone with it, then skipped a turn to recover if necessary. That first big hill split the pack in thirds: break, mid, dropped. I was in the pointy end of the mid as the break went and could just watch.

Last take:
I feel like the stories of getting shelled or dropped like a rock the first race ever are HIGHLY dependent on how much and how focused a person trained. The competitive group rides will equally help, but if you're just a below average A group rider......you'll get rocked. You'll have to be able to think while handling your bike and following wheels, sure. But if you can't meet the basic fitness level, you're toast. And that's not your ability to cruise at 85% for 3 hours, it's your ability to recover at 85% and only a minute later hit it and die again. If you're not getting dropped on the group ride at first, it's too slow or easy.

That ftp chart I said to throw in the trash? It says you could have hung in this race with a 3.0w/kg. At the middle of 4's and 5's. That's cute.

The difference between a participation event and this is worlds apart. There is no participating.
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Re: The noob's first road race thoughts.... [burnthesheep] [ In reply to ]
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burnthesheep wrote:
Fatal flaw: I was in front 1/3 till the hill area where since we were going slow I didn't worry about a crash (you want to be up there not just to avoid crashes, but be in position to respond). None of the online "stickies" say that.

The stickies should say that! You always want to be near the front in any "selective" part of a race. Particularly climbs. Not just to be in position to respond, but if you're not the best climber, being near the front gives you the chance to "gracefully" drift backwards and still be in contact with people over the top.

If you start a hill in the back and get gapped it can get lonely real quick.

Great race report, though!
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Re: The noob's first road race thoughts.... [burnthesheep] [ In reply to ]
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burnthesheep wrote:

That ftp chart I said to throw in the trash? It says you could have hung in this race with a 3.0w/kg. At the middle of 4's and 5's. That's cute.

The difference between a participation event and this is worlds apart. There is no participating.

That's really not at all what the chart says. Anyone that races could and will tell you that.

Anyway, good job on finishing it up. Now go try a crit. It's another whole new ballgame, too. :D
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Re: The noob's first road race thoughts.... [rubik] [ In reply to ]
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rubik wrote:
burnthesheep wrote:

That ftp chart I said to throw in the trash? It says you could have hung in this race with a 3.0w/kg. At the middle of 4's and 5's. That's cute.

That's really not at all what the chart says.

Yup. In fact, I have repeatedly made the point that the power profiling tables should NOT be interpreted as "the noob" has done. Doesn't stop people, though...

RTFM (but ignore the date, as it is incorrect):

https://www.trainingpeaks.com/blog/power-profiling/

P.S.: Also ignore the byline. The folks at TP don't know that using both "Dr." and "Ph.D." is redundant.
Last edited by: Andrew Coggan: Mar 4, 18 17:05
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Re: The noob's first road race thoughts.... [burnthesheep] [ In reply to ]
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Great report, brings back some memories of my noob days. I have a couple questions as I have been away from this kind of racing for quite sometime. How many starters do they have in the groups? Are all the road races that short? When I began in the early 80's we would have over a 100 cat 4's in a race, and as I recall they were about 45 miles for RR. And I thought that was way too short, so I moved up quickly so I could get to the 100+ mile rides.

You description was very spot on though of what happens in reality. And I can tell you that the best way to learn is to make those little mistakes that cost you watts. If you are a true bike racer, you will figure out a way not to waste them next time, and ration your efforts when they make a difference..

And in my day we would say you were dropped, breaks more than one count, sorry... (-;

Keep the updates coming, I can tell from your writing that you understand the dynamics and should do well once seasoned, and of course racing in the 100+ mile races with the big dogs!!!
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Re: The noob's first road race thoughts.... [Andrew Coggan] [ In reply to ]
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Andrew Coggan wrote:
rubik wrote:
burnthesheep wrote:


That ftp chart I said to throw in the trash? It says you could have hung in this race with a 3.0w/kg. At the middle of 4's and 5's. That's cute.


That's really not at all what the chart says.


Yup. In fact, I have repeatedly made the point that the power profiling tables should NOT be interpreted as "the noob" has done. Doesn't stop people, though...

RTFM (but ignore the date, as it is incorrect):

https://www.trainingpeaks.com/blog/power-profiling/


Rather than hunting down noobs one by one on the Internet, you might amend your blog post from 10 years ago , since that's likely one of the primary sources of the chart. And the post doesn't really explicitly mention that meeting a power profile implies you'll be able to race effectively at that level. You might also amend it that you now consider the chart to be outdated and replaced by features of WKO4.

Any further advice can be provided at a consulting rate of $150/hour.
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Re: The noob's first road race thoughts.... [trail] [ In reply to ]
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Here is some free advice for you (and others): learn to read.

" Aside from satisfying people’s natural curiosity, though, such category-based values would seem to have limited practical use – after all, the best measure of a rider’s competitive ability relative to that of others is their actual race performance, not their power output. "
Last edited by: Andrew Coggan: Mar 4, 18 17:20
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Re: The noob's first road race thoughts.... [Andrew Coggan] [ In reply to ]
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Andrew Coggan wrote:
Here is some free advice for you (and others): learn to read.

" Aside from satisfying people’s natural curiosity, though, such category-based values would seem to have limited practical use – after all, the best measure of a rider’s competitive ability relative to that of others is their actual race performance, not their power output. "


Yeah, but I'd make that more explicit and up-front. When one person mis-interprets, it could be a reading comprehension issue of that person. When it's widespread, it's probably an issue with the expression itself. The way you use that phrase sure makes it sounds like your power profiling *overcomes* the limited practical use. The next sentence is, "If, however, valid standards were available for power across different durations that represented different physiological characteristics or abilities, then it would be possible..." I could easily see how someone would think that the first sentence is the problem statement, and what follows is a solution.

Or maybe you don't get tired of correcting people on the same issue on a daily basis?
Last edited by: trail: Mar 4, 18 17:30
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Re: The noob's first road race thoughts.... [trail] [ In reply to ]
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Like I said, learn to read (and quote properly):

"If, however, valid standards were available for power across different durations that represented different physiological characteristics or abilities, then it would be possible to identify a particular individual’s relative strengths and weaknesses based on their “power profile”. In such an analysis, the primary comparison would therefore be the rider against themselves, and not (directly) against others."
Last edited by: Andrew Coggan: Mar 4, 18 18:02
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Re: The noob's first road race thoughts.... [monty] [ In reply to ]
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Oh, I’m in total agreement with Andrew. There’s no denying it after seeing it in person.

On it being a drop vs a break: That’s fair to say it’s a drop given it’s not a group of 150 people. I haven’t found the official results yet, but on Strava I show crossing 12 or 13th on the analytic thingy. Two of those got me on the last hill by a tiny bit. Only 38 in 4/5 field.

The small groups are that they split college kids out to college only races. Otherwise it would have been 75 to 100 people.

Monty: Most 4/5 races I’ve found for road are 75 to 100 minute long races in the southeast. Distance ignored. It felt like it was over fast.
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Re: The noob's first road race thoughts.... [burnthesheep] [ In reply to ]
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Sounds like you learned a lot from the first race. There are going to be spots where it gets selective and bad positioning can get you into trouble. As you noticed, in a bigger field, if a group gets a gap it can be difficult to close it down. Reading a course and the field and knowing what to do and when and how to respond when it doesn't go right. . . yeah. . . all important things to know.

The charts are a good rule of thumb, but coming from a sport that focuses on FTP and doesn't care about top-end, you've jumped into a sport that is ruled by top-end and brutally hard accelerations. You've correctly pointed out that recovering and being able to repeat hard efforts is very important. That, and there are very few weak riders even in the 4/5. It's not like a 5k and triathlons where all kinds of fitness show up to race. Almost everyone that shows up to a bike race has quality fitness. It's like if only the top 15 guys/gals of a 100+ field showed up to a run race. There are a lot of guys in the 4's that will never have the talent to get to cat 3 but have a significant amount of experience and are quite strong riders.

Well done. . . good luck in your next race.
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Re: The noob's first road race thoughts.... [burnthesheep] [ In reply to ]
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Sounds like fun, lots of work (not uncommon for first race), and you got home safe, most important on top of it all! :)

I can totally relate to your experience, my first C5 road event was an eye-opener too (2 crits back to back, in my case). I hadn't been training hard yet, thought I was in decent shape, but man, I sure wasn't strong enough to feel good out on course, the pace was nuts. Plus, I really didn't have a handle on staying in an energy-conserving position yet. Big mistake. This wasn't just my first C5 event after practice races in race clinics, it was also a race for guys wanting to build upgrade points and get out of C5. I knew things weren't what I was expecting when some skinny guys with big quads and calves and lots of tats rolled up with a couple rooftops full of pro-level road racing bikes. I figured they were going to be in C1/2, but they were in my race. Great. You have to just shake your head when the C5's KOM the race course, what the...?!!

Post-race, I found out some of the hammers were C1 MTB racers and some collegiate team racers, and others I had no clue, but they were fast and looked quite a bit younger than me. A little over a year later, I poked around in the race results to see how the guy was doing who won both races. It'd stuck in my mind how fast and in shape he was, and I'd wondered where he went after crushing all of us newbies. Turned out he did 38 races the next road racing season, was on the podium in first or second in a ton of them and was already a C2 road racer in his second season. That was two years ago, and this year he's a C1. Holy cow.

My takeaways from that first event were pretty foundational. Get near the front for the start, and when fast guys go, you go hard and get on their wheels. Don't get stuck behind the second group, and if you do, don't expect anyone to work to bridge. First race, I was near the front and struggled but stayed with the lead pack through the finish. Second race, I made the huge mistake of starting three rows back, and didn't realize the fast guys drag raced off the line until there was already a hundred yard gap. Once I realized what'd happened, I came around and pulled for a few laps, but it was single file, nobody rotated. I was burying myself and couldn't keep it up, waved my elbow, moved over, looked back, got off the gas... nothing. Everyone wanted to stay behind me. Sure, we had no chance to catch the break, but it'd have been at least good to get some learning in by going through the motions and practicing chasing it down. Later in C4, I got a taste of what teamwork actually looked and felt like in a race, but it was still disorganized; so much to learn, and nobody has time to practice consistently together, everyone works in different places and times during the week, and has kids' sports on weekends with group rides squeezed in.

My power was 313W weighted avg for the race and 1073 peak, higher avg than any ride I'd done before. I needed to do some much more diligent training with power to be up to this workload. Next season, I won my first C4 race with 270W weighted avg power and 1219 peak, definitely did a much better job conserving energy, working position, sharing work, and actually had a plan for the racecourse before showing up. That pre-race planning was really helpful. I looked at the course on google maps, elevation profile, came up with some logic for what could work based on my power graph (IF I was in position within three laps, two laps, one lap to go), then made adjustments during the race based on who was attacking and collaborating, who was getting physical, erratic or dangerous, etc.
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Re: The noob's first road race thoughts.... [Super D] [ In reply to ]
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Super D wrote:
SLater in C4, I got a taste of what teamwork actually looked and felt like in a race

Were your fields big enough to separate 4's and 5's? This wasn't. It was 4's and 5's together. So you've got 4's that clearly had done at least their 10 races as a 5 plus however long they'd been stuck at 4.

Same here, looking up Strava data, the 4/5 race had people in the tippy top of the hill finish Strava segment. Our race's avg speed was the same as the Collegiate B race. WTF. I would have expected that race to be much faster.

I couldn't be disappointed in that I did what I could do. I half expected to be dead last with a DNF.

I think perhaps I may set a new "rule" for myself moving forward. You can sign up for another race once you've done X number of "race group rides".

That's a big gap in my training. I haven't had time or opportunity to drive out to the only competitive group ride in town. At least now, one is starting up on my side of town one night a week in mid-March. 30mi at 24+ mph pace. That'll have the tactics and surging I need to learn.
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Re: The noob's first road race thoughts.... [burnthesheep] [ In reply to ]
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burnthesheep wrote:
Super D wrote:
SLater in C4, I got a taste of what teamwork actually looked and felt like in a race

Were your fields big enough to separate 4's and 5's? This wasn't. It was 4's and 5's together. So you've got 4's that clearly had done at least their 10 races as a 5 plus however long they'd been stuck at 4.

Yep, just 4’s only in mine. Did they score the finishers according to respective cat 4 or 5 in yours?

Some guys in 4’s have been there forever because they don’t race or train enough to advance, 3’s same deal. Some strong, experienced A group ride people in those fields.
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Re: The noob's first road race thoughts.... [burnthesheep] [ In reply to ]
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You made it safely through your first race and learned quite a bit; that's a win in my books.

P-Ride? I guess you are from North Carolina?
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Re: The noob's first road race thoughts.... [burnthesheep] [ In reply to ]
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A race where you finish unharmed and upright is the best race. Podiums are a bonus!

Will look out for your coverage on your first crit. Your Variability index will make you do a double take đź‘Ť.... they are evil, relentless attack after attack, power out of the corners.
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Re: The noob's first road race thoughts.... [echappist] [ In reply to ]
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Yes, NC. I'm in Raleigh.

I didn't stick around to check results. I just assumed they scored the 4's and 5's together and I was the next loser. Got my cat 5 "participation" point. Lol.

I checked back on Strava and more folks added their rides. Looks like #16 of 28 right now. But two of those in the bottom got lapped. I lost two spots on the last 1/2 mile. I caught those two guys with the group on lap 3, then they sat in the last lap, and passed me back.

Also, I checked back on the flyby........I was closer than I thought to bridge. Sad face. Lessons learned.
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Re: The noob's first road race thoughts.... [burnthesheep] [ In reply to ]
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Just keep at it. I think far too many get turned off by road racing because it's just damn hard most of the time. It doesn't get easier as you progress up the ranks nor does it get easier as you advance into older cats as a master racer. But, you learn to be efficient, learn when to spend energy when to save, who to let go and who to watch, etc...

Sadly, as I've learned this year, even if you do everything as well as you can, spend a small fortune, put in the time unless you have a deep history and/or natural talent you will get your teeth kicked in. With thats said, I think racing is a blast and gives training purpose. Just because I'll never be that good doesn't stop me from trying to be better. Having fun and keeping this in perspective is the key to longevity which is a component to eventually getting a decent result.

Hang in there and get more friends into it while you're at it. It's about the journey and relationships really...it's fun to do well but, not sharing it with anyone is lonely and no fun. So surround yourself with peeps you enjoy and that positive energy will help.
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Re: The noob's first road race thoughts.... [woodys737] [ In reply to ]
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There's a club within a club locally and I ride with those guys when I can. Two said they may try next year. That would be real fun to have them do races together. We still probably wouldn't do super great, but it would be fun having buddies out.

I have to say, I read the Gaimon books recently while on work travel. It framed it really well so that I actually enjoyed my first race instead of being pissed or having some kind of stupid expectations I shouldn't. Gotta give him credit for that. Otherwise I'm a first born child of typical competitive demeanor that normally would have gotten back to the car pissed and disappointed. Instead I was happy to be alive and proud of just finishing OK.
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Re: The noob's first road race thoughts.... [Super D] [ In reply to ]
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in my experience road racing in a relatively flat region, but with sprinklings of "2 minute hills", the importance of w/kg is grossly overestimated unless the finish is at the top of the hill! I could routinely wither the pack down to a group of 8 of which I believe were the strongest riders in the race, paceline like hell along the flat section afterwards but 9 times out of 10 we would get caught. Pure watts, or watts/CdA!
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Re: The noob's first road race thoughts.... [pknight] [ In reply to ]
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For most road races, it’s w/kg of the 3-8 min range that matters. Particular emphasis on recovery from effort.

Also, since the climbs are short, speed and position at bottom of hill matters as well. Get carried along until speed drops below 15 mph, then pop off and attack. Or wait in the top few places and attack over the top. Most hate to dig deep again after having just done an effort. Do this after a few laps have gone, and the pack’s willingness to chase diminishes.

This is the most efficient way to create a gap; once formed, one has to go relatively deep for another few minutes afterwards to maintain the gap. Alas importance of 3-8 minutes power.
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Re: The noob's first road race thoughts.... [pknight] [ In reply to ]
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pknight wrote:
in my experience road racing in a relatively flat region, but with sprinklings of "2 minute hills", the importance of w/kg is grossly overestimated unless the finish is at the top of the hill!

Definitely the case here. My gps showed a little over 2300ft in 28mi. So a couple rollers and a few "2 minute hills" each lap.

I think the training plan worked, I didn't DNF as a total newbie. But......there are things I'd totally do differently. I won't debate that here, as there's lots of strong opinions in here on that one. But, given what I felt/saw in that race, I know what I'd do different.

I'm 155lb and 5' 9" tall. Not big, not small. I felt I was in the smaller third of the riders for "frame" build for sure.
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