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Re: What does your offseason training look like? [TJP_SBR] [ In reply to ]
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TJP_SBR wrote:
JasoninHalifax wrote:
I dunno, but dropping the bar at the top of the movement sets off all kinds of triggers for me.

This is the method described by Ryan Flaherty. He had a performance academy where nfl prospects would come and work out trying to get faster before the combine. And now he’s director of performance at Nike. He said that lifting up is what strengthens the muscle and builds explosiveness. When you de-load, that’s what tears it and promotes it to grow (and add mass). By dropping it at the top, you get the benefit, but aren’t adding additional bulk.

He was a guest on the Tim Ferris podcast a while ago talking about his methodology.

Listened to the first part of the podcast and Ryan definitely cautions that everything he says is specific to powerful movements like sprinting. He doesn't explain why it wouldn't apply to an endurance runner but I can guess that one reason may be that we need that build of muscle mass due to what we lose by training for endurance. I work at Nike and might try to get a question into him about it as I am curious though. I'd love to drop that shit, the way down is always so hard but that's what makes it beneficial, I'm sure...

808 > NYC > PDX > YVR
2024 Races: Taupo
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Re: What does your offseason training look like? [TJP_SBR] [ In reply to ]
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I'm going all-in on trying to go sub-40m in a pre-Christmas 10k.
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Re: What does your offseason training look like? [RandMart] [ In reply to ]
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RandMart wrote:
No real Off-Season for me, but I train just enough to maintain my "Minimum Daily Endorphin Requirement"

Like I've said before: Endorphin Withdrawal is a terrible thing to experience, and horrible to watch

This

https://www.strava.com/...tes/zachary_mckinney
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Re: What does your offseason training look like? [hadukla] [ In reply to ]
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hadukla wrote:
TJP_SBR wrote:
JasoninHalifax wrote:
I dunno, but dropping the bar at the top of the movement sets off all kinds of triggers for me.

This is the method described by Ryan Flaherty. He had a performance academy where nfl prospects would come and work out trying to get faster before the combine. And now he’s director of performance at Nike. He said that lifting up is what strengthens the muscle and builds explosiveness. When you de-load, that’s what tears it and promotes it to grow (and add mass). By dropping it at the top, you get the benefit, but aren’t adding additional bulk.

He was a guest on the Tim Ferris podcast a while ago talking about his methodology.

Listened to the first part of the podcast and Ryan definitely cautions that everything he says is specific to powerful movements like sprinting. He doesn't explain why it wouldn't apply to an endurance runner but I can guess that one reason may be that we need that build of muscle mass due to what we lose by training for endurance. I work at Nike and might try to get a question into him about it as I am curious though. I'd love to drop that shit, the way down is always so hard but that's what makes it beneficial, I'm sure...

He helped train Meb for his Boston Marathon win and this was part of the training. So it’s definitely not just for sprinters.
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Re: What does your offseason training look like? [TJP_SBR] [ In reply to ]
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Matt Dixon has two podcast episodes about this on The Purple Patch Podcast. I’m going to try out his recommendations which basically include: 2-3 weeks away from SBR after your last race then a post season build that is structured but not overly so. He states the biggest issue is randomness in the offseason. That sums up my last offseason perfectly, I was doing workouts but with no clear vision on why. I figured if I was moving I was ok. I’m going to check out his postseason plan and hopefully set more PRs next year.
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Re: What does your offseason training look like? [TJP_SBR] [ In reply to ]
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My off season is essentially ski season. So I focus on getting in shape for skiing with plenty of running, riding, swimming, lifting and core work. I follow no set plan other than stay in decent shape so my ramp up (@April) for the first tri of the season doesn't hurt as much. It's nice to take a break from long rides and runs for several months!

"The first virtue in a soldier is endurance of fatigue; courage is only the second virtue."
- Napoleon Bonaparte
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Re: What does your offseason training look like? [Don_W] [ In reply to ]
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I usually try to maintain the swim/bike/run, but focus harder on the strength training to rebuild what the cardio burned off. Usually a round or P90X and some dedicated strength days.
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Re: What does your offseason training look like? [TJP_SBR] [ In reply to ]
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TJP_SBR wrote:
hadukla wrote:
TJP_SBR wrote:
JasoninHalifax wrote:
I dunno, but dropping the bar at the top of the movement sets off all kinds of triggers for me.


This is the method described by Ryan Flaherty. He had a performance academy where nfl prospects would come and work out trying to get faster before the combine. And now he’s director of performance at Nike. He said that lifting up is what strengthens the muscle and builds explosiveness. When you de-load, that’s what tears it and promotes it to grow (and add mass). By dropping it at the top, you get the benefit, but aren’t adding additional bulk.

He was a guest on the Tim Ferris podcast a while ago talking about his methodology.


Listened to the first part of the podcast and Ryan definitely cautions that everything he says is specific to powerful movements like sprinting. He doesn't explain why it wouldn't apply to an endurance runner but I can guess that one reason may be that we need that build of muscle mass due to what we lose by training for endurance. I work at Nike and might try to get a question into him about it as I am curious though. I'd love to drop that shit, the way down is always so hard but that's what makes it beneficial, I'm sure...


He helped train Meb for his Boston Marathon win and this was part of the training. So it’s definitely not just for sprinters.

I stand corrected. Just got to that part and not just a part of his training but he seems to credit that process alone as the reason behind his improvement. Yay, now I get to drop weights like a meathead!

808 > NYC > PDX > YVR
2024 Races: Taupo
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Re: What does your offseason training look like? [TJP_SBR] [ In reply to ]
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Now that I'm done with that Death March called IM Chattanooga......this will be my "off year" where my wife races and I'm her Sherpa.

Training is Swimming, yoga, weight lifting to gain weight back, and FTP building.


Who am I kidding.......It will be Beer and Chips
Last edited by: Scottxs: Oct 9, 19 5:38
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Re: What does your offseason training look like? [hadukla] [ In reply to ]
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hadukla wrote:
TJP_SBR wrote:
hadukla wrote:
TJP_SBR wrote:
JasoninHalifax wrote:
I dunno, but dropping the bar at the top of the movement sets off all kinds of triggers for me.


This is the method described by Ryan Flaherty. He had a performance academy where nfl prospects would come and work out trying to get faster before the combine. And now he’s director of performance at Nike. He said that lifting up is what strengthens the muscle and builds explosiveness. When you de-load, that’s what tears it and promotes it to grow (and add mass). By dropping it at the top, you get the benefit, but aren’t adding additional bulk.

He was a guest on the Tim Ferris podcast a while ago talking about his methodology.


Listened to the first part of the podcast and Ryan definitely cautions that everything he says is specific to powerful movements like sprinting. He doesn't explain why it wouldn't apply to an endurance runner but I can guess that one reason may be that we need that build of muscle mass due to what we lose by training for endurance. I work at Nike and might try to get a question into him about it as I am curious though. I'd love to drop that shit, the way down is always so hard but that's what makes it beneficial, I'm sure...


He helped train Meb for his Boston Marathon win and this was part of the training. So it’s definitely not just for sprinters.

I stand corrected. Just got to that part and not just a part of his training but he seems to credit that process alone as the reason behind his improvement. Yay, now I get to drop weights like a meathead!

Be careful not to set off any lunk alarms 🚨
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Re: What does your offseason training look like? [TJP_SBR] [ In reply to ]
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I generally continue to train as if I'm at the peak of my season. Chasing ghosts of races that have passed months ago. Going waay to hard through the Fall until I'm finally injured in some catastrophic way that requires me to stop training. Then while I wait for my [Stress fracture | torn something | tendinitis] to heal, I call it my off season.
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Re: What does your offseason training look like? [TJP_SBR] [ In reply to ]
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The past 3 winters I’ve done a big run block (putting S&B to the side) and made major gains on my run.

I should probably do that again as my run is still my relative weakness, but I’m thinking I’m going to do a big bike block this winter instead. Not necessarily a ton of hours but hitting 2-3 high intensity workouts a week (while super fresh from not as much S&R) to really try and raise my ceiling.

Cycling has always come pretty easily for me and I’ve never focused on it, so excited to see what happens. Also the Texas road race season is in the spring so it would be fun to have really good cycling fitness and do a bunch of races. There’s also several stage races that have TTs as part of them too.
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Re: What does your offseason training look like? [TJP_SBR] [ In reply to ]
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I can speak to the elevated trapbar deadlift a little bit. A little background I was saddled with both achilles acting up which kept me from running for roughly 2.5 years. I started doing trapbar when I got back to jogging and continued it through the winter. I did stop strength training when the summer hit and will start again here in a couple weeks. Here is what I noticed.

1. Elevated trapbar deadlift is freaking fun! First off you can lift so much more since you are in the power phase and not at the total bottom of your hip mobility so be prepared to feel like a total stud.
2. It is a safe lift. Yes, you really need to focus on form but the weight is right in lint with your arms, hips, and ankles so the weight is not out in front of you. I also drop at the top for reasons explained in this post earlier ALSO FORM IS HARD TO KEEP WHEN LOWERING AND MORE LIKELY TO GET INJURED IF YOU DON'T KEEP PERFECT FORM.
3. I got stronger. I weighed low 150s and I went from TBDL(trapbar deadlift) 358lbs to 392lbs. I also went from 158 to 152 during that time. I had a video when I did my last max lift and 400lbs was there(or so I was told, didn't feel like it)
4. Can I attribute running gains to this, not directly, but there isn't just one thing that makes an improvement.

Prior to my achilles I was doing Oly, 70.3 and one Full. I was running good mileage and my fastest Oly race was 6:41 pace. Fastest Sprint up to that was 6:12 pace. Fastest 70.3 was 7:15 pace. Only Full was 3:58 whatever that translates to into pace.

This is my first year back racing. I only ran at most 3 days a week. Pretty standard mod effort run 5-7 miles. Tempo run 10 build to 25 minutes. Then occasionally an easy run or easy run but no long run. I think I topped out at 12-14 miles a week. I raced 2 Oly and 1 sprint this year. MUCH MUCH less running was around 20 miles prior to injury

Oly paces were 6:42 and 6:40 . Sprint Pace was 6:08(finally broke 19 minutes!!!, albiet by 2 seconds, lol)

My strength coach I use actually trains rock climbers You know those guys want to be big and heavy! Here is the gym's philosophy. Strength training will not make you a better climber, runner, biker, or anything. Specificity can only do that. Strength training will activate more muscle fibers, it will also make you more durable so you can withstand great training stresses. MOST IMPORTANTLY it is like a savings account. Your tissues will be stronger and when you are 75 you will be able to squat to take a shit. So put into the savings account now so you can make withdrawls at a later time.

If you have any questions let me know I will do my best to answer.
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Re: What does your offseason training look like? [TJP_SBR] [ In reply to ]
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TJP_SBR wrote:
hadukla wrote:
TJP_SBR wrote:
hadukla wrote:
TJP_SBR wrote:
JasoninHalifax wrote:
I dunno, but dropping the bar at the top of the movement sets off all kinds of triggers for me.


This is the method described by Ryan Flaherty. He had a performance academy where nfl prospects would come and work out trying to get faster before the combine. And now he’s director of performance at Nike. He said that lifting up is what strengthens the muscle and builds explosiveness. When you de-load, that’s what tears it and promotes it to grow (and add mass). By dropping it at the top, you get the benefit, but aren’t adding additional bulk.

He was a guest on the Tim Ferris podcast a while ago talking about his methodology.


Listened to the first part of the podcast and Ryan definitely cautions that everything he says is specific to powerful movements like sprinting. He doesn't explain why it wouldn't apply to an endurance runner but I can guess that one reason may be that we need that build of muscle mass due to what we lose by training for endurance. I work at Nike and might try to get a question into him about it as I am curious though. I'd love to drop that shit, the way down is always so hard but that's what makes it beneficial, I'm sure...


He helped train Meb for his Boston Marathon win and this was part of the training. So it’s definitely not just for sprinters.


I stand corrected. Just got to that part and not just a part of his training but he seems to credit that process alone as the reason behind his improvement. Yay, now I get to drop weights like a meathead!


Be careful not to set off any lunk alarms 🚨


I know that I've mentioned this before, but I have found that - in the weight room - a tech race shirt is a pretty effective Invisibility Cloak

However, a loud, crashing sound is bound to attract attention

"What's your claim?" - Ben Gravy
"Your best work is the work you're excited about" - Rick Rubin
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Re: What does your offseason training look like? [RandMart] [ In reply to ]
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RandMart wrote:
TJP_SBR wrote:
hadukla wrote:
TJP_SBR wrote:
hadukla wrote:
TJP_SBR wrote:
JasoninHalifax wrote:
I dunno, but dropping the bar at the top of the movement sets off all kinds of triggers for me.


This is the method described by Ryan Flaherty. He had a performance academy where nfl prospects would come and work out trying to get faster before the combine. And now he’s director of performance at Nike. He said that lifting up is what strengthens the muscle and builds explosiveness. When you de-load, that’s what tears it and promotes it to grow (and add mass). By dropping it at the top, you get the benefit, but aren’t adding additional bulk.

He was a guest on the Tim Ferris podcast a while ago talking about his methodology.


Listened to the first part of the podcast and Ryan definitely cautions that everything he says is specific to powerful movements like sprinting. He doesn't explain why it wouldn't apply to an endurance runner but I can guess that one reason may be that we need that build of muscle mass due to what we lose by training for endurance. I work at Nike and might try to get a question into him about it as I am curious though. I'd love to drop that shit, the way down is always so hard but that's what makes it beneficial, I'm sure...


He helped train Meb for his Boston Marathon win and this was part of the training. So it’s definitely not just for sprinters.


I stand corrected. Just got to that part and not just a part of his training but he seems to credit that process alone as the reason behind his improvement. Yay, now I get to drop weights like a meathead!


Be careful not to set off any lunk alarms 🚨


I know that I've mentioned this before, but I have found that - in the weight room - a tech race shirt is a pretty effective Invisibility Cloak

However, a loud, crashing sound is bound to attract attention


Considering most gyms I've been to have a "no dropping weights" policy, this is a quick way to lose your membership. I guess if you are going to a crossfit box it would be more acceptable but then if you aren't doing said wod would be strange. I don't know of many others that have bumpers on hand.
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Re: What does your offseason training look like? [TJP_SBR] [ In reply to ]
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You need a coach if you want to get faster - if you just do it for fun and getting better doesn't matter so much - then carry on.

Ruble Triathlon Coaching Average of 30 coached PR's per year
Florida Triathlon Camps Train in North Americas winter training destination
Ruble Racing Events Midwest Triathlon Racing
Ruble Timing Midwest Event Timing
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Re: What does your offseason training look like? [Zach Ruble] [ In reply to ]
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Zach Ruble wrote:
You need a coach if you want to get faster - if you just do it for fun and getting better doesn't matter so much - then carry on.

So just curious...how is it that you come to that conclusion without knowing my background, training or race history, long term goals, or 2020 race plan?
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Re: What does your offseason training look like? [Zach Ruble] [ In reply to ]
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Zach Ruble wrote:
You need a coach if you want to get faster - if you just do it for fun and getting better doesn't matter so much - then carry on.
I've gotten faster every year for the last 3 years. I've never hired a coach.
Why does one NEED a coach? Do you suggest it's not possible to train effectively without one?
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Re: What does your offseason training look like? [TJP_SBR] [ In reply to ]
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TJP_SBR wrote:
JasoninHalifax wrote:
I dunno, but dropping the bar at the top of the movement sets off all kinds of triggers for me.


. When you de-load, that’s what tears it and promotes it to grow (and add mass). By dropping it at the top, you get the benefit, but aren’t adding additional bulk.

Its a lot harder to add mass than simply dropping a bar at the end of a list. You won't add mass in a calorie deficit.
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Re: What does your offseason training look like? [Zach Ruble] [ In reply to ]
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Zach Ruble wrote:
You need a coach if you want to get faster - if you just do it for fun and getting better doesn't matter so much - then carry on.

This statement is true because one can self coach.
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Re: What does your offseason training look like? [NordicSkier] [ In reply to ]
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NordicSkier wrote:
Zach Ruble wrote:
You need a coach if you want to get faster - if you just do it for fun and getting better doesn't matter so much - then carry on.


This statement is true because one can self coach.
Smart ass!
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Re: What does your offseason training look like? [TJP_SBR] [ In reply to ]
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so far a mixture of West Coast IPA's, Saisons, and Hazy Pale Ale's
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Re: What does your offseason training look like? [TJP_SBR] [ In reply to ]
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TJP_SBR wrote:
Zach Ruble wrote:
You need a coach if you want to get faster - if you just do it for fun and getting better doesn't matter so much - then carry on.

So just curious...how is it that you come to that conclusion without knowing my background, training or race history, long term goals, or 2020 race plan?

Lol job security
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Re: What does your offseason training look like? [y_nigel] [ In reply to ]
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y_nigel wrote:
so far a mixture of West Coast IPA's, Saisons, and Hazy Pale Ale's

Are you accepting new clients to coach, or is there a waiting list I can get on?
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Re: What does your offseason training look like? [TJP_SBR] [ In reply to ]
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"No more races for me this year. Not sure yet what I will be doing next year, but I’d like to h e a productive offseason."

I guess it depends what you mean by productive but I wouldn't expect to get much faster with what you described. You shouldn't be trying to fit in bike and especially run workouts, those should be the framework and if you have time for the other stuff then great.


I made some big gains by significantly increasing my run volume from ~20 mpw in year 1 to 40 mpw in year 2 and 55 mpw in year 3 (took 5k time from 23 mins to 18 mins over that stretch) and by using a power meter to structure my bike workouts and making them much harder than they had been.


As far as swimming, the technique work and underwater camera can be great if someone who knows what they are doing is looking at it and giving you stroke corrections, but you still need to swim a lot. Finding a good group to swim with can help a lot.
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