For me AG has it's place, and it's nice to win or podium in it, but overall results are the measure i use.

It's still a good system for the sport though, and doesn't hurt anyone racing for the overall....i don't see why people are annoyed by it. Run your race.

This was the 5th year of the No Excuses 5K run in Sacramento. They use an "age-graded" system to determine the overall winner based on a formula that takes into account age and gender: http://www.noexcuses5k.com/htmls/agegraded.html

It's a pretty cool system. The overall winner today was a 69-year old woman who ran a 23:36 (age-graded as 13:44). A 64-year old man ran 19:51 (age-graded as 15:24) and got 6th: http://www.capitalroadrace.com/results/09NEAGAll.htm

Rik

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Why do you need AGs to have fun at triathlon?
Does a third place in AG25 make one better than a 12th OA (say the faster 11 players were all in AG 18-50)? And if so, why?

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[/reply]
Which is exactly why agegroups are a farce. It is the stupid "everyone is a winner" concept that only exists in triathlon.[/reply]
No, it is a concept that only exists in the USA, because the change to win a fake award (kona qualification) makes it easier to get people paying the high entrance fee.

The training is the sport
The race just a fancy training day for most
And very fun to

Not sure if you've noticed, but most all sports at all levels break down competitors into divisions or peer groups. It's the nature of sport. It adds enjoyment for most.

For example, regional conferences in college sports in addition to division based on school size, AL and NL in pro baseball (not to mention the countless # of developmental leagues), multiple tours in golf including one for 50+ years old, a multitude of car classes in auto racing. Others I've already mentioned.

Why is that?

To give more the chance to compete with an appropriate peer group?

In our sport, take away AG's and what do you have? Not sure. Probably less overall enthusiasm and interest among multiple ages of people. Certainly no one would care as much about Cuddeback vs. Boness - rivalry and anticipation are much more intriguing when one of these guys are likely to have a "1" by their name at the end of the day.

Though our sport involves competing against one's age peers, it has a way of bringing together people from different age ranges in training and at races. Recently camped at Memphis in May with a group that included ages of 52, 47, 31, and 21.

How old are you uli?

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Coach at KonaCoach Multisport

Athletes who like to compete against all the others instead of only against folks of the same age?

Athletes who don't like to compete and do triathlons for fun?

1. Isn't that sick?

2. Well, then merge 18-50 in one age group and do 10yr steps for the oldies.

3. On the fast declining side of things, 34. Not sure why that would matter. Get back to me in 15 years and I will tell you the same.

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That's pretty bogus. AG are universal around the world in triathlon all distances and in IM, both MDot and non-Mdot. I don't thik you can "blame" it on WTC or greed.

I think I figured out what might bother some people. The whole recreational/amateur race is not an OA race. If you are FAST, you belong in the Pro division, that is the only OA that means anything. Winning an OA in amateur/AG is meaningless. Joe has won OA AG several times at IM races and there really is no recognition for it. (not that he cares about recognition). Maybe you get a mention on the podium, maybe not. Perhaps this is why the animosity. If you are fast, you need to race Pro if you want OA recognition, not sandbag it in the AG division like the rest of the posers.

Uli: The Greeks didn't have triathlons, nor recreational athletes. I don't think they had bicycles either. The idea of triathlon was started by recreational triathletes. The idea of a Pro division came later.

Support Crew

It is very nice to win your AG or even place within your AG and if you race a lot in your local area you know exactly who you are racing against and you start in the same wave and it lets you have a race within a race.

While there is only one winner, the pros are more often than not going to be that winner, (although not always) and it is nice to have the chance to race against others instead of just looking at the overall time, which is subject to other factors, environment for example.

The few times I have placed or won my AG I have been very happy and I raced as hard as I could to catch that one guy in front of me with the same number on his calf.

Is the AG the best way to classify the non-pros, maybe maybe not, but its a lot easier than maintaining a category based on performance system ala cycling. Are there issues with the AG system yes, but are they a problem. No, if the guy 45-49 beats the 25-29 guys OA he'll no it and get bragging rights at the pub. If you put them into a catergory system based on talent, does he still beat them, maybe, probably. If not then these guys would downgrade themselves as it may not be as much fun for them getting beaten on by young guys.

The current system is not perfect but it gives something to everybody and it is not easy to win your AG or even place in your AG.

We don't need to race pro here in Europe. There is only division. That is overall. Sometimes awards for age groups are there, but then everyone of a certain age is included. So also the guys winning overall (you call them pro). If an amateur athlete wins overall in a race, he/she takes the price money as well. The overall price is for everyone who joins the race, not just for the athletes that call themself PRO. And the age group awards (if they are there) are for everyone of a certain age group, so not just for the athletes who do not have a pro card. Official IM races have different rules, but only because the WTC uses american rules.

I don't blame WTC for it. Triathlon is much bigger then WTC and mdot. Everyone can choose a race he/she likes. And I don't need to go to a race with artificial categories as age group/pro. Neither do I have to pay double the price of a normal full distance to race a WTC event just to do an official IM.

1. Why is that? If you are younger than 50 (or maybe 45), you are cheating yourself. Just race and be happy. I, for one, don't want to race against singles/unemployed/students/genefreaks. It's so unfair!

2. Another reason to get rid of all categories, Pro including.

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I sorta agree with part of what you and others are saying in a philosophical way. In reality, Age Grouping allows:

1) getting to know other local racers in same stage of life as yourself
2) provide some form of "race-within-a-race" so everyone gets a chance to feel a sense of competition, the real reason we compete, no?
3) one logical way to break-up a race into manageable waves, makes swim at least a bit safer
4) chance for non-front runners to earn some recognition, therefore get more satisfaction from racing
5) greater participation due to 1-2-3-4 above, makes for more races on the calender, and lower entrance fees

Having said this, I'd like to see some races where seeding is based on projected time so the "race-within-a-race" experience is enhanced since you're actually going to finish at about the same time as those around you at the start.

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some days you're the windshield some days the bug

provide some form of "race-within-a-race" so everyone gets a chance to feel a sense of competition, the real reason we compete, no?

why not race everyone on a cervelo? everyone in blue outfit? same result.

chance for non-front runners to earn some recognition, therefore get more satisfaction from racing

sad! Stop cheating yourself. And no one else cares!

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lol, seems like you're on a crusade, good luck with that.

actually I don't pay that much attention to AG placing, I look at overall myself, my comments were for your edification, not self justification

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some days you're the windshield some days the bug

Its fun a race within a race, there is a big difference between racing other people and just going out trying to race the thing purely against the clock. Fun we are allowd to have it, plus it s a challenge , it is not that easy to win your age group

are you having fun yet. Look most people are happy with the system and don't feel like they are cheating themselves, why do you even do races just go out one a month a do a tri on your own and see if you got faster

So ... it's your 1st tri. You state it's hard to swim 300 m without difficulty. You will probably finish(I think June 7 is an OLY),feel great,as you should. Then the real fun starts.You begin checking everyone's left calf,mentally calculating how many in your AG got you. Next is the Q&A with anyone you saw on the course.... All this takes place as you cram in close as possible to the " wailing wall" where the results are posted.This is where you will immediately start your preparation for your next race...and become a hopelessly addicted age grouper.
>
>

Uli, take a deep breath. Now try to accept that there are people out there in the world who don't share the same goals as you, are motivated by different things, and perhaps derive satisfaction from things that you do not.

are motivated by different things, and perhaps derive satisfaction from things that you do not.[/reply]
Good point!
May I still make fun of 33 year old AG "winners"? :)

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By all means! Sports isn't any fun unless you can rob someone else of whatever joy it might give them. :=)

No, no, just mocking big heads.

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And have completely different life circumstances that you just cannot possibly know or understand, just by looking at them on the podium.

So no, you cannot make fun of the 33 year-old AG winners either ;-P. A 33 year-old can have a heck of a lot on his/her plate in a addition to racing, that perhaps YOU could not handle in addition to training.