"the truth is simple... you never have to remember what you said" unknown

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Jay

I couldn't disagree more. It may be the best, but certainly not the strongest.

Lawyers...

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"Non est ad astra mollis e terris via." - Seneca | rappstar.com | FB - Rappstar Racing | IG - @jordanrapp

Amy, coming from you and knowing what you do for a living that is a thought provoking observation. True too.

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Tom Demerly
The Tri Shop.com

'Beauty is truth, truth beauty,—that is all Ye know on earth, and all ye need to know.'

John Keats

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No sidewindin bushwackin, hornswaglin, cracker croaker is gonna rouin me bishen cutter!

If you need a lie to make a stronger argument than your truth can provide, you may need to reevaluate your truth.

It's much simpler then that. People lie every day and accomplish more than is often possible by telling the truth. I hate that and I hate liars, but that's reality.



We're going to be booted to the Lavendar Room shortly.

But a lie is, by its very nature, flawed. Even if a lie allows the argument to be won, it may ultimately be disproven. If the truth is in fact the truth, it will not be disproven and is therefore the stronger of the two.

"This guy is 20 years old and a bit of an unguided missle."

Tom D.... I am sending you a bill for a new keyboard after I sprayed tea all over this one. ;) That was too funny.


M~

Huh?

 
And is indeed truth beauty?--at the cost
Of all that we cared for, can this be?--
To see the coarse triumphant, and to see
Honour and pity ridiculed, and tossed
Upon a poked-at fire; all courage lost
Save what is whelped and fattened by decree
To move among the unsuspecting free
And trap the thoughtful, with their thoughts engrossed?
Drag yet that stream for Beauty, if you will;
And find her, if you can; finding her drowned
Will not dismay your ethics,--and you will still
To one and all insist she has been found...
And haggard men will smile your praise, until,
Some day, they stumble on her burial mound.

--Edna

I was quoting something Tom D said in an earlier post....therefore a quote of the day...well at least my day.

M~

"If you tell the truth, you don't have to remember anything."

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"What's your claim?" - Ben Gravy
"Your best work is the work you're excited about" - Rick Rubin

Moral dilemma time, then: is it possible to not lie, cheat, steal, and still be 'successful'? Do you have to be ripping folks off, and to be ruthless, in order to 'win' in our system?

Serious question.

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kiwipat

per ardua ad astra

Sure it's possible. In some professions, it might not even handicap you all that much. But in anything having to do with corporations or government, odds are you're going to get screwed.

What color is the sky in your world?

Thanx, it's always good to get it right.

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Jay

The colour of the sun is not an attribute of the sun, but of your sensory and perception visual system in responding to electromagnetic stimuli.

Using Greek philosophies (that your argument is based on) the sun changes its color during the day and therefore has various colors.

More specifically and within the context of this thread - you raised a good point – how do you know what is the truth?

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Truth is a relative word.

There is your side and my side and somewhere in the middle is the truth.

J

Very interesting question. I think the answer lies in your definition of "successful". If you mean by money and maybe power over others, then yes. I think you do need to be ruthless. The biggest reason is because the same sort of people will be trying to reach that same goal.

However, if your definition is being content with your actions, helping others, etc, then I think you have to act with high moral standards.

In the business I am in (and I don't mean necessarily strength & conditioning, and certainly not having to do with my postings) I am constantly barraged with accusations that are simply not true. I am faced with the question of if I should counteract in some way, even if it's just to prove that they are lies, or to just stand idly by and hope that my actions will eventually justify the truth. With age comes patience & wisdom (which I am always working on!) so I have chosen the latter action, or non-action. Hopefully it will all turn out well and I will be "sucessful" :)

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maylene jackson, cscs
http://www.kidsintraining.org

Chinese Proverb:

"to chop a tree quickly, spend twice the time sharpening your ax."

"either do not begin or, having begun, do not give up."

American Proverb:

"The squeaky wheel gets the grease."

Japanese Proverb:

"The proud nail gets the hammer."

There are many people who are wildly successful and who personify integrity; so the answer to your question is yes, you can be successful and honest. My problem with the quote was the notion that truth was always the strongest argument. It's not always and there are plenty of people out there who don't have any problem lying if it gets them more. That said, even after practicing law for 10 years, I still think the vast majority of people are honest. As for it being a moral "dilemma," there is no dilemma in my view as lying is never an option.

I disagree with you!

It is always the strongest argument.

However, it is not always the most adaptive strategy to voice the strongest argument. Sometimes, a different argument may provide you with a better outcome.

So the question is what does it mean strongest, or strong argument? Strength in terms of validity, consistency, coherency, logic and rational - yes the truth is stronger.

But it could be strength in terms of social, academic or commercial goals. In this context sometime the truth is not the strongest.

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